Part of the problem I see with the SL program for Falcon is the proximity of the hatchery in Athens, to our lake. It is a 8-9 hour drive from Athens to Falcon, while the bass sits in a bait tank. Then the bass is in the SL tank truck for another 8-9 hours (or more due to stopping to check on the fish). So, the wait time and the transport time are just too long. If the hatchery was in San Antonio or Austin (i.e. somewhere more centrally located in the state), then picking up SL's from Falcon would be an option, but the wait and ride is just too long for these old grandma's they're trying to transport in less than ideal conditions (i.e. ideal conditions are in their home lake).
The other problem is we have such warm water temps down here compared with everything north of us. Bass of this size just don't do well in the hot water in the live wells while they're being transported from the fishing spot to the ramp, and then from the ramp to the drop off location while no new fresh water is being added to the livewell (i.e. huge ammonia buildup which kills the fish, which aeration can not help).
If you look at the Share-a-Lunker that was caught during the BASS Elite tournament a couple of years ago by Campbell from Missouri, you can see in the photos of the fish and the video, that this bass was just short of dead on the stage. Her eyes were fixed and dilated. No color in the fish. And while Campbell was holding her up, shaking it on stage as he was showing it to everyone, the fish was a limp dishrag. No movement of any fins. Nothing. Why were the guys from Athens even notified about this fish? She probably wouldn't have survived if she had been released right then into Falcon (i.e. ideal conditions for her), right along with a bunch of the other big bass that had been overstuffed into hot livewells, and later died at release.
So, to me, proximity and water temps are the main factors which should keep Falcon off the list of eligible lakes (including Choke Canyon) for the guys from Athens to come to pick up, because it's just too far and too hot, and makes survival of the fish unlikely. My two cents...

I have a couple of questions relevant to the success or failure of the SAL program that I genuinely want to know the answers to.

Has there ever been any peer reviewed research to prove that size is a heritable genetic trait?

If so, is it passed from the female, male, or both?

The bottom line all opinions aside, is that the individual who catches a fish of 13+ has the right to do whatever he wants with it as the law allows. Someone on an earlier post said the same thing. Be it: filet that big hawg (not recommended), kill and skin mount it (also not recommended). Or: Catch and release after a few photos and the pay $500 to get a replica (i've done this), or donate to SAL (I would do this, a free replica would be nice). Some people aren't as loaded as others, to pay for a replica of possibly a once in a lifetime fish. The genetics are in the fish we have in the lake, they are not leaving unless every fish in the lake is killed. I think we have bigger problems than 1-5 Fish a year being donated to SAL from our S.Tex. lakes. Tournament fish care, and people eating 7-10 lb fish should scare you more. I released a nice 11 lb fish yesterday from Falcon after a few photos, so its genetics will still be in the lake (no worries).

James, you and I need to make a road trip. And then I will show you first hand and you can listen to the experts instead of me.
Brood fish WERE the holy grail. Once they crossed with texas strain fish in our lakes they don't grow as fast as a pure florida, even with ideal conditions. Those brooders are what started the entire scenario we have today.
Yes, it should have happened with the #'s of anglers coming down there. They are not that easy to catch, especially florida's. Sure the big one's are from particular year classes, but those big fish have been there all along. It took the elite series on tv to tell the world. You know that. Look at all the club tournaments where we caught big fish......13,14 lb. fish and nobody told anybody other than local in-town talking. Nobody knew about it, yet your lake has been for YEARS the only lake in the world where you can pop a ten pound in 1 ft. of water at ANYTIME of year. Maybe it will happen, you can't predict that. Maybe we should be smarter as anglers. Or maybe we can all get lucky and not break one off. I would debate the record has been broken off already in that chainsaw environment you have right now.

We might have gotten 500,000 or we might not. They look at a lot more things than just shocking surveys, of which I am well aware with my research and working with TP+W and the knowledge I have obtained from them over the years what a shocking survey is for. Spend the time I have with them and research of your own and you will know what I am talking about.

LMAO I do like your analogy LMAO However, I do think the SAL program has done much better than the cowgirls LMAO

Give the fish a break ? That is ONE fish James. If your floridas are so hot and heavy, your lake should be full of them. And unless you drain it and look, that may just be what you have. Catching these fish is pure D luck with a measure of experience an angler has that helps, otherwise it would happen everyday.

Show you the facts ? Let's go. I believe I can get permission for a visit to the INSIDE of Athens where you can see for yourself what is happening. (I hear there is a good steakhouse there too).

Nobody is confusing florida bass stocking with SAL. SAL IS about florida bass. And my roadtrip will prove it from the INSIDE.

I am waiting............

Lance, the travel time is no big deal SAL truck wise. The tank is oxygenated with pure oxygen, water temps are ideal, water quality is excellent.
The SAL you speak of during the ELITE series was the ANGLERS and the ELITE SERIES staff's fault. They were warned of the conditions they would face. They were EDUCATED by SureLife's staff on procedures of livewell care management. They didn't do it or ignored it. And that fish died that night because of it. Just like all the floaters everybody threw a fit about. They were warned of the size and quantity of big fish that would come in. They ignored it and said and I quote "We have enough staff to handle anything". Well, you saw the result.

If they have followed their instructions, cared enough about the fish to learn fizzing and livewell care management, a lot of that would not have happened. As a supposed professional, I think it is their JOB to learn everything they can to help the sport and the lakes they travel to. I had to with MY job as a paramedic/firefighter. What's the difference in my opinion.

Anyway, James , the only way I know of is for you and I to go up there. You and I are both hard heads and like me the only way to get something is to go see it for myself. So..............

Texan Til I die, I will ask your questions to the experts. Would like to know those myself.

BassSlayer that was smooth getting that picture in there.

Excellent fish Dario ! When we going ? !!!!!! I need to prefish anyway. Interested ?

Sure, Carl! Give me a ring. HunterBass-that was smooth wasn't it! LOL

ya sure was!!!, Good fish dario!!!!

Just to let some of y'all know, Cabelas is partnered with the SAL program, and they will come get your fish too. I know Tim Hubner, the resident biologist @ Cabelas Ft. Worth, and he will come get it. He has all the right transport equip. He used to be with the Ft. Worth Zoo......I think People like Bass Pro and Cabelas ought to have an incentive program, that if you catch a SAL, they will display it in the store, and give you like a $1000.00 gift certificate. TP&W Pays for the replica, in order to "study" the fish, and Bass Pro or Cabelas gives you the gift certificate since they get to display the bass to bring in customers wanting to see it. Wouldn't that be cool. LOL

There is one inherent challenge that nobody mentions.....its not possible to grow truly monster fish AND have tons of average size fish TO CATCH at the same time.

Truly monster fish require less competition, more forage, and pure Florida genetics.

If you want to CATCH a bunch of average size fish you don't want them to be pure Floridas...its proven they are more finicky. In addition, they become easier to catch if there are more fish and less forage creating more competition....makes for lots of lean and mean fish but fewer PIGS.

The catch and release craze has created its own problems.....some lakes have too many bass.

You can please all the people some of the time and some of the people all the time but you can't please all the people all the time.

This is getting funny.. Carl.. If you and I take a road trip I am afraid only one of us would come back.. :-) Two men enter... One Man leaves.. (Mad Max)

Now Splain to me this.. SL won't take a fish that is not 100% Florida.. I hear it is the first thing they check.. So what difference is that fish from the 100% Florida Brood Fish?? So if all their babies are 100% Floridas, and we have been putting them in Texas lakes for years and years.. Where's all the 18 pounders?? Splain me that..

And if you put them in Falcon with our growth rates and food supply and warm temps and lots of cover and light fishing pressure and how close it is to Wal-Mart (everyone wants to live close to a Wal-Mart). Why the hell don't we have a new state record with Falcon's name on it??

The truth is that you need a fish with a magic bullet.. The Perfect Storm has to come together to produce a 13 plus fish in Texas.. I don't need to tell you the ingredients.. And when it happens I hate to see it and it's fry moved to a lake that will never produce what that fish and her babies might produce at Falcon. Flat out, you cannot put that fish or her babies in a better environment than Falcon. Period. And with that your Honor.. I rest My Case! (Barney Fife.. Mayberry deputy)(Or Joe Peschi.. My Cousin Vinny)

I am sure if I went to Athens with you they would hook up those wires to my head like they did you and I am not not sure what would happen to me then.. I might be like Schwartzaneger in Total Recall.. But odds are that I would short circuit the machine..

I love you guys.. even if we disagree.. Keep fightin' for Texas fishin' and preach Catch and Release!

See you on the water!

Question. I researched the Lake the guy in Japan caught the bass that tied the world record. Over the last several years they have been catching 16 pluses on that lake, the year before the same guy caught an 18 plus (that he also kept). They have a program to rid the lake of largemouth and non-native species (don't know the details just that they are actively removing them), they have no catch and release program, it is basically what we would precieve as the worst possible program to create a monster bass, yet they are catching giants out of the lake! Why is that? Would love to hear that one explained away and compared to why one fish donated to SAL makes such a huge impact on a lakes fishery, when it clearly doesn't in Japan based on the articles I have read and researched. It is Lake Biwa if you care to research it as well. And yes I know they are all Florida Strain Bass in that lake!

I have my thoughts on why they have a giant factory, would love to hear other thoughts on that subject as well.

Obviously there are several lakes in Texas that are capable of producing 13 plus bass, Falcon doesn't hold the patent on big fish and the only perfect environment, I have caught several 12 plus on Lake Buchanan an unlikey source some would say. In my mind if you don't think there is a 19 or better swimming in a Texas lake, heck on several Texas lakes, I would say you are sorely mistaken. I agree it takes the near perfect storm to make her that big, but it certainly takes the perfect storm to get a hook in her lip. They didn't get that big by making stupid mistakes!

I know people want to see those Florida Strain Bass returned to the lake to produce off spring, assuming she mates with the male that has the genes to grow big bass as well. Let's just be thankful those boys in Florida weren't stingy when someone asked them to share the genes out of their lakes with other states. If they had acted half as Bass Greedy as some of the folks I have seen writing articles, blogs and threads we wouldn't be blessed enough to have this conversation right now!
Just my $0.02

Ok, here are some facts.

�Data collected by the program (SAL) shows that it takes 8 to 10 years for a bass to grow to 13-pound size.� (TPWD)

According to the stocking records that have been referenced many times already, 2006 was the first year pure SAL fingerlings were stocked in public lakes. Fork, Conroe, and Alan Henry, for example were some of the first to be stocked. Research takes years to accomplish and let�s face it, the SAL program is a Huge experiment with a public friendly name.

�TPWD fisheries biologists are monitoring the growth rate of stocked Budweiser ShareLunker offspring as compared to resident �wild� fish in the reservoirs. The average ShareLunker offspring was 7.1 inches long and weighed 2.7 ounces. The average wild fish averaged 5.3 inches long and weighed 1.2 ounces.� (*Link to full text provided below)

The comment about high stocking rates having a negative effect on population quality is a sound argument in my opinion. Though, what looks to be overstocking may not be the case. Here�s some data I put together about Fork using information found on TPWD�s website.

Since its impoundment, Fork has been stocked 19 times totaling 9,796,952 largemouth bass. Fork covers 27,264 acres. That equals 18.91 fish per acre per year. I�ve done the same calculation for Alan Henry, second on the SAL list, and it�s been stocked at a rate of about 9 fish per acre per year. Despite what might seem like overstocking, Fork has produced 243 of the 400 or so SAL�s and continues to be at the top of the list each year in number of fish submitted. Alan Henry hasn't submitted a SAL since April of 07.

The stocking of SAL fingerlings has only just begun folks; the data looks good, and after working at the facility in Athens and having serious conversations with the biologists in charge, and the technicians doing the work of the program I am very confident that new records are on their way.

* http://www.tpwd.state.tx.us/newsmedia/releases/?req=20060508f

You know guys.. I'm not talking about other lakes. I'm talking about Falcon.. And you explain to me how taking a 13 plus fish out of the lake can make it better.. Will it make your lake better? Who Knows?? But it is not going to make Falcon better..

First Sharelunker fry in 2006? What's the program been stocking and growing for 20 years?

Sure.. we could see a new state record any day.. And when it happens I am sure it will all be due to the SL program.. Or at least that is what the Papers will say. But the truth is that a monster fish, that was caught and released, broke a few lines, along with a few hearts, and was caught and released again, gained a few more pounds, and made the mistake of getting caught in some open water when she had topped 18 pounds..

And along the way she had all the groceries she could eat..

Thanks for sharing your opinions, and thanks for putting up with mine..

I'm done with this topic.. Again..

Thanks for your input James. I agree with you 100%.