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Dec 30th, 2023
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 Re: Elite Question
[Re: Joefishin]
#9863822
03/28/14 11:04 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,529
Big C
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,529 |
You have to qualify through the Opens. It's not like these guys are scrubs that show up with a pocket book. Lot's of really accomplished anglers in our area fish these opens without success. Some of you make is sound like the talent pool is somehow diminished because some guys don't fare well at that level year after year? I still say they'd whoop your butts in the opens because they do all the time.
A dose of reality needs to be injected in this thread. They don't have a cutoff because they don't have a ton of guys lining up to donate 50 grand a year through the opens. It's a huge difference coming up with your entry fees for 3 Opens or 6 if you fish more than one Open circuit than it is to pay for the Elites. What good would it do to cut the bottom 15 or 20 when you don't have people to fill their shoes?
And yes, this last year they let more in than normal. But I know for a FACT that they cut people. I fished with Mark Tucker in the Lewisville Open because he had to re-qualify for the Elites that year. He wasn't real happy with it either since he had been fishing them for years and years. Your post seems contradictory. On the one hand you talk about skill level but yet another you talk about a circuit not having enough participants able/willing to pay. Or, am I misunderstanding what you're saying?
BIG C
"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing ever happened.
Sir Winston Churchill
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Re: Elite Question
[Re: Joefishin]
#9863972
03/29/14 12:15 AM
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Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 2,156
fishnfireman
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 2,156 |
You have to qualify through the Opens. It's not like these guys are scrubs that show up with a pocket book. Lot's of really accomplished anglers in our area fish these opens without success. Some of you make is sound like the talent pool is somehow diminished because some guys don't fare well at that level year after year? I still say they'd whoop your butts in the opens because they do all the time.
A dose of reality needs to be injected in this thread. They don't have a cutoff because they don't have a ton of guys lining up to donate 50 grand a year through the opens. It's a huge difference coming up with your entry fees for 3 Opens or 6 if you fish more than one Open circuit than it is to pay for the Elites. What good would it do to cut the bottom 15 or 20 when you don't have people to fill their shoes?
And yes, this last year they let more in than normal. But I know for a FACT that they cut people. I fished with Mark Tucker in the Lewisville Open because he had to re-qualify for the Elites that year. He wasn't real happy with it either since he had been fishing them for years and years. I beg to differ with your opening line.. The first year of the Elite series--there was NO qualifying. Bring the MONEY and have a wrapped boat. Which at the time kept some darn good fishermen out. As for the talent pool of some who started that first year... the jury is still out.. we all have good and bad years but some have yet to have what I would call good year. Not to pat my own back.. But I have fished against open contenders.. Have even fished against a past open winner MANY times. They/we can all be beat on any given day. Just for the record--what year did Tucker get cut ???
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Re: Elite Question
[Re: trogge]
#9864012
03/29/14 12:27 AM
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 323
Mark Knuckols
Angler
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Angler
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 323 |
Once you're there...you're there for as long as you continue to fish every year and pay those HUGE entry fees every year! The exception would be if you stop fishing. Then you may have to re-qualify through the opens again...but it depends on the individual circumstances. I figure those who do well, love the donation from those who just show up and fish. But you know; If I had the MONEY to just show up and fish. I'd be right there donating also...  Fishing is an interesting sport. Even if you take the 100 or so "elite" anglers and put em out on a given lake. Their results are pretty much the same as your typical working class weekend anglers in Champs, or Bud Light, etc. There is still a certain percentage of participants that do well and a percentage of those that do really bad regardless of experience/skill on a given day. Fishing is a humbling sport for all at some point even KVD. I bet the best like KVD, Skeet, Edwin, Aaron would actually like to see the lesser skilled culled out, bring in new blood and keep raising the bar. I would think the true competitors crave better competition. I hear people make this comparison often. All of the trails u mentioned are 2 man team formats. There is a huge difference between what 2 guys can combine to catch versus 1 man
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Re: Elite Question
[Re: Mark Knuckols]
#9869033
03/31/14 02:17 PM
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Joined: May 2011
Posts: 239
trogge
Outdoorsman
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Outdoorsman
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 239 |
Once you're there...you're there for as long as you continue to fish every year and pay those HUGE entry fees every year! The exception would be if you stop fishing. Then you may have to re-qualify through the opens again...but it depends on the individual circumstances. I figure those who do well, love the donation from those who just show up and fish. But you know; If I had the MONEY to just show up and fish. I'd be right there donating also... Fishing is an interesting sport. Even if you take the 100 or so "elite" anglers and put em out on a given lake. Their results are pretty much the same as your typical working class weekend anglers in Champs, or Bud Light, etc. There is still a certain percentage of participants that do well and a percentage of those that do really bad regardless of experience/skill on a given day. Fishing is a humbling sport for all at some point even KVD. I bet the best like KVD, Skeet, Edwin, Aaron would actually like to see the lesser skilled culled out, bring in new blood and keep raising the bar. I would think the true competitors crave better competition. I hear people make this comparison often. All of the trails u mentioned are 2 man team formats. There is a huge difference between what 2 guys can combine to catch versus 1 man I only mention the 2 man team formats because that is primarily what is out there to fish out there other than BASS and FLW. You can even look at the lowest club level and you get some good weights and low weights. Doesnt matter how good a fisherman you are, some days you catch them and some days you don't. Statistically the better fisherman either cash a check more often or finish in the top more often. You can't deny that at least 25% of the top "elite"/"pro" level tournament fishermen just don't have what it takes to compete off their home waters clearly which is where many of them "qualify". Take a guy out of his element where he has hundreds of rock piles and brush piles waypointed, and you'll find out what they're made of. When Pros fish minor leagues such as Opens, etc., there are always a couple that finish near the top as well as some who finish near the bottom that hardly catch a fish.
Last edited by trogge; 03/31/14 02:31 PM.
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Re: Elite Question
[Re: Joefishin]
#9869079
03/31/14 02:29 PM
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Joined: May 2011
Posts: 239
trogge
Outdoorsman
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Outdoorsman
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 239 |
You have to qualify through the Opens. It's not like these guys are scrubs that show up with a pocket book. Lot's of really accomplished anglers in our area fish these opens without success. Some of you make is sound like the talent pool is somehow diminished because some guys don't fare well at that level year after year? I still say they'd whoop your butts in the opens because they do all the time.
A dose of reality needs to be injected in this thread. They don't have a cutoff because they don't have a ton of guys lining up to donate 50 grand a year through the opens. It's a huge difference coming up with your entry fees for 3 Opens or 6 if you fish more than one Open circuit than it is to pay for the Elites. What good would it do to cut the bottom 15 or 20 when you don't have people to fill their shoes?
And yes, this last year they let more in than normal. But I know for a FACT that they cut people. I fished with Mark Tucker in the Lewisville Open because he had to re-qualify for the Elites that year. He wasn't real happy with it either since he had been fishing them for years and years. I'm not saying qualifying through the opens is easy. But when all you have to string together 3 solid finishes, luck plays a larger factor for some. There are tons of sticks that have one bad tournament out of the 3 and they're out. Also, most guys have the advantage of 1-2 of the 3 qualifying opens being on their home waters that they are familiar. As I mentioned on previous post, take a lot of guys out of their element and they can't catch fish. And if you can't locate and catch fish on unfamilar water, that's the kiss of death fishing against Elites. 3 practice days and thats it. Also rumor has it there is "a lot" of information exchange and I don't blame them. If Mark Tucker was cut it was because he quit and had to requalify. They didnt kick anyone out. And I guarantee there are "tons" of guys in line on the Opens AOY standings that would gladly step up and pay but finished just outside top 5. The problem is that instead of calling down the Opens AOY list, they just let the bottom elite finishers linger.
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Re: Elite Question
[Re: trogge]
#9873638
04/01/14 09:02 PM
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 666
Pat Cella
Pro Angler
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Pro Angler
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 666 |
Everybody gets to stay if they can pay the entry fee. Super nice guy, but Dave Smith obviously struggles at that level of competition. Look at his record below and he is still fishing the Elites.
2010 91st
2011 95th
2012 92nd
2013 99th
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Re: Elite Question
[Re: Pat Cella]
#9873656
04/01/14 09:08 PM
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Joined: May 2011
Posts: 239
trogge
Outdoorsman
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Outdoorsman
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 239 |
Everybody gets to stay if they can pay the entry fee. Super nice guy, but Dave Smith obviously struggles at that level of competition. Look at his record below and he is still fishing the Elites.
2010 91st
2011 95th
2012 92nd
2013 99th They could switch to single elimination. If Dave Smith finishes higher than you in a tournament you're out and have to requalify. He is the cut line. Fill the spots by calling down AOY Opens lists. I just think they should call down each OPENS AOY until they have 5 new Elite qualifiers signed up. If they run into an existing Elite guy, go to the next one.
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