OK, I think I am losing what little mind I have left.

Yesterday I got started cleaning my fly lines and I got one leader built and tied on. It was a B****, doing that nail knot but I got it done.

I then decided I was going back up to Cabela's and talked to Sean again in the fly department. I got the nail knot tool, wow, that thing is wonderful. Then Sean and I discussed some of the other knots and my concern about as I screw up leaders, which I know I will do, I didn't want to keep cutting into my fly line doing these nail knots.

So he told me about the Perfection loop and I like this idea because then I tie my leader to it instead of the fly line. OK, so I am redoing the leader I built yesterday and I have attached the first Perfection loop he built me to the fly line with the nail knot, looks good. Now for the life of me I don't remember what knot he told me to attach the leader to the loop with.

I am looking these pictures of how to do these knots and I am not seeing how any of them can attach to a loop, what am I missing here? All I want to do is figure out how to attach leader to the loop so I can get some of these made up.

I guess this must be one of those blonde moments, since I have a little blond in my hair, anyway can I use that for my excuse?!

Well I figured something out, whether it is right or not I don't know. I made a double surgeons loop and attached the 2 loops together and now I can start building my leader.

iluvfishing,

Everybody does it differently, but here is what I do..

I use the nail knot to attach the heavy section of mono to the fly line. Yes, it is a pain, but you do not tie it very often...in my case once a season. Then I use double surgeons to assemble the remainder of the leader and tippet. It's a very simple and effective knot. Loops work well alos, especially if you change leaders often. With a loop you can change quickly.

Loop to loop is the only way to go

Meadowlark,
You may not change leaders very often but you have to remember I am coming back to fly fishing after 3 years away. For the most part I will be bank fishing and I don't know a lot of fancy casts.

I can usually get my casts to where I want them to go but I am friends with the trees too and the birds love the bits of line I leave in them to help build their nests!

My casting is going to be real rusty and I really don't want to be cutting into my fly line. Maybe someday I will be able to change leader once a year, but I don't think it will be this year.

For now I think I better stick with the loop to loop.

Thanks for your help.

I prefer to use the perfection loop both for the heavy mono attached to the fly line and for the thick end of the leader. You could use the double surgeons in both places, but I prefer the perfection loop because it works better with stiff mono and doesn't waste as much.

I also probably tied 2000 of them when setting up reels and lines at the various fly shops I worked at, so I'll never forget it.

I haven't gotten that perfection loop figured out yet. For now I can do the double surgeons and will keep practicing the perfection until I get it.

Here is a good knot site, has the key knots and simple instructions
http://www.killroys.com/knots/knots.htm

Wow, all I can say is I hope these leaders stay put for a long time. I have 2 reels for sure to get done yet with the leaders and I swear even with this tool these nail knots are going to drive me nuts! What I am trying to do at the moment is attach a loop I made to the fly line with the nail knot so I can do a loop to loop connection.

I am sure this will get easier the more I do these but right now all I can say is HELP!

J I dont understand where your useing the nail knot in a loop to loop? if you tie a perfection loop on your flyline and one on your leader then you have it. alot of the store bought leaders come with a loop already tied in. the link boom gave is a great one to see this. jb

I am not using the nail knot in the loop to loop, I am trying to use the nail knot to tie the loop piece to my fly line to then make another loop and tie a loop to loop.

I did this once after I visited with Sean at Cabela's. He tied me a couple perfection knots and told me to attach them to my fly line with the nail knot, using this nifty tool. It looked so easy when he did it and I have done it once.

I do have those links to the knots and have printed them out. It is just that sometimes the instructions and illustrations on these tools and knots could be a little better and I just haven't done enough of them yet.

Remember I am female and do have some blond in my hair, maybe that explains it, but damn I am trying to learn this and keep a little humor while I try.

You guys are all doing it wrong!! Just kidding, I prefer to use a knotless connection. You do need a few tools however, but you can usually find the kit in flyshops. You need a pin vise, sewing needle (can't remember which number), Zap-A-Gap, and a piece of sandpaper.

1. Stick needle into pin vise with the end you thread sticking out.

2. Stick needle into fly line about 1/2" or so and push it through the side, exposing the needle's head.

3. Thread the leader (non-butt end) through the needle and pull back out of fly line. Continue pulling until you have an inch or two left of butt section sticking out of the whole. Caution: Thread only an inch or so through the needle and then pull back out. If you thread say a foot through the needle, you will end up with a crimp in your line once you pull it through with the pin vise.

4. Using the sandpaper, sand a little spot just below the fly line on the leader, this allows the glue to seat properly.

5. Drop a bit of Zap-A-Gap onto the sanded part and pull the leader up into the fly line using the two or so inches you left sticking out. I use my forceps to pull. Be quick here as the glue dries almost instantly. Take your nippers and cut off the butt section flush with the fly line and drop a small drop of glue on the hole if you want.

You now have yourself a knotless connection, no knots to get stuck in the guides, etc. Try it out, it is by far the best line to leader connection in my opinion. I believe Joe Robinson here in Austin created it, and I think Whitlock sells the kits with the tools.

iluvfishing,

Ask a question and you will get several different answers...all of them probably work for the person that gives the answers.

Fly fishing can get technical, if you let it, very technical. Some folks really get into the technical side...myself, I prefer the fishing side....technical is only a means to an end.

If you like technical, then have at it....but if you like to fish and see the "technical" as a means to an end, rather than an end itself, then simply go with what works for you. Improve it with time, and trial and error, but the main thing is go fishing! Get out there and make mistakes like the rest of us, but GO FISHING!

Nope, I don't need technical. I have my knots all figured out now I think. I will be using the nail knot, the double surgeons, loop to loop, and one other knot that I don't know the name for but I have used it for years tying on flies. It works great and even though I had not used it for 3+ years, it came right back to me.

I will be out somewhere in a couple of days. I decided I am going to get the 2 mos freshwater July 1st. and then get the new one in Sept. and be on the right cycle then year to year. I am so excited to be going fishing. Now just to decide where and when to go, decisions, decisions......