I picked up a book at half priced books called "Tying Better Flies" by Art Scheck. He has a technique for tying "Bulletproof Buggers". I spent a couple of hours last year tying up a couple dozen buggers using this technique. Over the past year I"ve realized that every one of these flies makes my leader twist so bad that it becomes unusable after 3-4 casts. None of my other flies do this, so I"ve determined it must be from the construction of this fly. I just destroyed all of them to retie.

The method calls for a piece of wire to be tied in at the bend, wrap chenille forward and tie off at eye. Tie in hackle at eye and wrap back to bend, use wire to secure hackle as the wire is wrapped to the eye. Here's a video I found using this technique.



I don't know why, but for me, this creates a wooly bugger that is virtually unusable due to line twist.

The wire thing can probably be left out, one could counterwrap thread instead. Lot less bulky and even if less durable, the extra gains in the leader area could balance that out.

Just my thoughts is all.

I can't imagine why your fly would twist the leader.....I have been tying them like this for over 40 years with no problem. Use the finest wire you can find...or as Robin suggested use tying thread. Counter wrapping helps keep the palmered hackle from breaking and unwinding and really makes a much more durable fly. If you want to send me one of yours and let me take a look at it, I will fish it and see what happens. PM me if you want.

If you pick up a pack of bugger hackle from Whiting they give instructions like that on the package. When counter wrapping I use thread as I don't break it as often as I do the wire. I keep losing the battle of the voices inside my head of which way is counter wrapping....kind of like no your other left where you can never figure out which way is correct so I just keep going in a circle. Back before there was an interstate thru Denver Dad would always go around the circle for about 45 minutes before we culd get out of town. Like you needed anything to make the trip from East Texas to Yellowstone take any longer.

For summer use don't forget to put on enough wraps of lead behind the cone head before you tie the fly.

Big Dale

If you pick up a pack of bugger hackle from Whiting they give instructions like that on the package. When counter wrapping I use thread as I don't break it as often as I do the wire. I keep losing the battle of the voices inside my head of which way is counter wrapping....kind of like no your other left where you can never figure out which way is correct so I just keep going in a circle. Back before there was an interstate thru Denver Dad would always go around the circle for about 45 minutes before we culd get out of town. Like you needed anything to make the trip from East Texas to Yellowstone take any longer.

For summer use don't forget to put on enough wraps of lead behind the cone head before you tie the fly.

Big Dale

Soprry about that double entry. You might try a bit heavier tippit to help with the line twist.

Big Dale

I have used the method described (wire in back, hackle tied in in front, wire brought forward over hackle) for years with no problems, including about seven or eight dozen I tied a few weeks ago. Never a problem with a twisted leader. Is your leader bulky enough to handle the buggers?

Tying the fly to the leader with a loop instead of a clinch Knot may help....but I still can't see anything that would make them spin....

I always use a loop on my flies, I have very poor luck with a clinch knot. The twisting has happened frequently enough, on different set ups, that it always comes back to those flies.

If I can find any left I'll send them to you for field testing. They looked perfect, no idea why they behaved like they did.

What are you using in the way of a leader?

I use tapered mono for about 4-5 feet then a section of 3x, then a section of 4x or 5x.

it isn't the technique. i tie all of mine that way, too.

It must have just been my style then. I threw a bunch today that I tied a couple nights ago with no problems. I'll stick to the old fashion way.

And just a reminder to everyone, don't forget about the poor wooly worm, it's still a great fly.

what lb leader/tippit are you using?

i have had the line twist up bad when i am trout fishing with 4x-6x tippits while throwing buggers. imho its a combination of them rolling down stream while on a dead drift and just a spinning motion while being stripped in.

you shouldn't be having a problem if using 8+ lb line.

Brush, your not using snell hooks for tying are you? Most people don't care as much but you really need to be using specified streamer hooks for buggers because the bottom shank is weighted for upright presentation.
Also use larger tippet sizes. Some times the torsion resistance to smaller Mono tippets is feeble when they're towing large flies behind. Try using 2x-1x flouro, if not stock flouro at 8-10lb test. I've noticed this problem sometimes when using buggers; it also tends to happen with muddlers as well.
In case anyone was pondering, the purpose of this tying method is to keep from tying in the "hump" from 3 materials tied in at one spot on the shank and also to keep marabou in line with the hookshank. It's really just a personalized method of tying, I can't stand humps on wooly buggers.