Sorry about the triple post, computer malfunction. Catfishd, what did that big fish weigh???

Could be those one in a million hybrids, all I know is I never caught a hybrid at Texoma. I've caught some with broken lines towards the stomach of the fish, but the length and width (longer and slimmer) really determines that its a striper.

Ditto: Texas Law of 5 fish, over 18" Ranger R that is what I thought when I used to hear about the limits.

Guiding has become somewhat comercialized, I still say the state should impose an additional 1,500.00 per year fee on fishing guides. No offense to guides, but if you are making a living off a state resource, the state needs to be compensated. In other states guides pay fees why not here.

Guides do pay an increased fee to be guides. $125 vs the $12 license. $1500 wow you really opened a can of worms. Let's see that would be about 8 trips to break even taking out expenses and wear and tear. That's a major penalty. Plus most of the guides aren't full time. And in Texas I even think that goes into the general fund not the fishery. That's why six old geezers donates to OK not TX. OK matches the funds and puts in back into the resource.

And, Texoma is 10 fish per angler and only two can be over 20". There is no minimum length.

Interesting article I found:

Characteristics of Anglers and Guides at Lake Texoma, Their Fishing Participation Patterns, and Attitudes towards Management of the Recreational Fishery

http://lutra.tamu.edu/hdlab/Projects/P44.htm

That is a good article. Thanks

Yes J it is trifle but they will still make money and the money would go to the fisheries. I am on a legislative lobby committee and we stressed the money would go the the designated lakes. I have been fortunate to have guided in Alaska, New Mexico, Colorado, Mexico, and Africa and I have paid to be able to do so not to mention state mandatory liability fees. You are right it is a can of worms and I have been called un-American for suggesting this but there are guides who support this in order to weed the smaller wanna-be guides out that hurt image and credibility of the guide micro-industry. So many will get more people if guides are made to register and pay additional fees. if all the guides were like Mark-1, Hal Dodd, JD, and other TFF guides we would have a pretty solid and dignified micro-industry, it is a few who ruin it for everyone. The fee would also include a state park permit, fishing liecense, and other state park benefits.

Ranger-R let me know the next time you guys head out to Texoma.

XYZ,from your post above, you sound very traveled and experienced. Don't know what legislative lobby committee you are on but it must be important....In respose to your post, I have to respectively disagree with you. How did you come up with the $1500 guide licenses fee number? What is wrong with a retired soldier who knows how to fish and buys a $40K boat and pays insurance, boat slip fees, $200 for gas each week, fishing lures/equipment and all the other ancillary cost that pays state sales taxes.....from fishing to make a living. Currently, Texas Guide only pay $125 but $1500 is a bit high....I hope you do not have to much influence on your committee position....joebear

Well actually most if not all legislative lobby groups are made up of independent people selected at random people who know people on committees. I am actually on two, one for higher education and the fishing one. I was chosen for the fishing one when I met people on the fishing one about a year ago. We meet and make suggestions based on submissions made by the public at large when they are asked to fill out questionnaires. After an issue is brought up a number of times on the questionnaire then it is passed on to us then it has to go through two more lobby groups. However, out of all the responses I have received about this on TFF, yours is the first one that outlines the charges you incur and I wholeheartedly agree with you. The minimum amount suggested has been 500.00 and the max has been 1,500.00 I think 500.00 would be a fair amount and there have been discussions on discount to retirees and retired members of the military. With your permission I would like to use your post and forward it to members of the group, or maybe I can get you to join us in the next session it will be in Dallas later this month. That I (we) know of there is not a guides association for area freshwater lakes in Texas. There is a group for the gulf area. Something like Six Old Geezers would work really well.

As for being important, well I am not I was just at the wrong place at the right time, and someone thought I had something important to say, maybe it was my glasses or the way I held my fork at the dinner table. I do not get paid or get anything free I just do it because I like it and I have seen a few our group suggestions in action. I am grew up on a South Texas ranch and helped my father guide on our property in Mexico while growing up, guided out of Illimana, Alaska, worked in the halibut and crab industry in Alaska, and later worked a concession out of Arusha, Tanzania with my pops and a few half crazed New Caledonians. Now I just teach, fish, and hassle my half dozen passel of half-breeds.

Hope to meet you sometime Joe�

If I am not mistaken, all the money we pay for our licenses and stamps does not go right back into our lakes and wildlife, only a percentage of it goes. Maybe I am wrong but a while back, I read something on that. All the revenue that was created did not go back into our lakes and land. If wrong, correct me. Maybe someone else knows more than I do. 1500, is crazy and way too much and if it is not all going back to TXPW,why the raise? We dont need the government bending us over any more than they already do. Guides do pay a special licensing fee and it is more than the regular license. I agree with brett and joe on this one. Unreal that you would even think of backing something like this. Think about how many trips it would take to break even and put money twords the sorry 1500 fee.

I might be missing something in this post, but if people want to take the smaller stripers, let them, I strongly encourage it. The smaller fish are the better eating, and to most people a bag of small fillets is easier to prepare and pan fry than the larger fillets. Texoma is one of the few LAKES in the World, where Striper can reproduce, so there are many, many small stripers and that many stripers may be stunting the growth of the fish compared to other lakes where Stripers can not reproduce, but are stocked (i.e. Whitney and Tawakoni). I am not indicating there are no big Stripers, just not as many (and SOME guides certainly know how to target the bigger fish if that is what the clients desire). However, there are some monster size striper caught every year down below the dam on Texoma (and I assume those started from the same introduced stripers originally stocked in the lake).

Last year I called and spoke to both Oklahoma (Oklahoma biological Survey) and Texas biologists that "over-see" the striped bass industry on Texoma . They indicated that the broken lined fish are indeed stripers. The only real way to confirm the difference between a hybrid and a sandbass is the patch on the tongue. There is the possability, but it is not confirmed, that the broken lines are due to the limited genetic diversity resulting from no new stocked Stripers being added to Texoma in a long while.

I disagree with increasing the guide license fees (these will only be passed on to the consumer). In the case of Texoma, it is an Oklahoma Lake, and Oklahoma doesn't require guides on that side of the lake to have a guide license.

I don't think you will find that White Bass and Stripers will inter-bred naturally. Anyone that has grown up in Oklahoma, knows about the Sand Bass run in Hickory creek below Lake Murray (the creek doesn't run into Lake Murray). At one time, you could legally catch and keep sand bass caught in a cast net, I don't know if this is still the case. However, I have waded into the nice white sandy bottom in shallow water, under the tall oaks and pecans and have thrown my net and caught many (over 30 in a single throw) Monster sized female Sand Bass and the much smaller males, that were 'releasing' (all fish were released as I was actually throwing for Big shad, which were also running up in there at the same time).

I was amazed that you could NOT see these 100's of Sandbass, despite the clear water that was only 6" deep, but you could barely see some dark streaks of the Gizzards shad as they ran in the deeper troughs up against the bank. Never, did I catch a striper in there, and I had been in Hickory creek from where it crosses under I-35, all the way to the Red River (West of where it forms Lake Texoma) and even down to Texoma.

First of all, the hybrid looking or broken line fish I caught last saturday, was a STRIPER! Pic will be posted soon. Waiting for film to convert to Digital pic.

OTHER:
When I started this post, I was just commenting on the difference of the striper laws, versus any other Texas lake. I was impressed with the large number of striper in this lake. I was not aware that these fish reproduce in Lake Texoma. Now, I know this and understand the reasoning for keeping the smaller striper. I just thought that all fishermen were catching limits of 5 over 18". This is an incredible fishing lake. Just wish I lived closer than 550 miles, round trip. I would love to take my kids and grandkids fishing.

LOL $1500 is insane. Anyone who would propose such a drastic increase is not an outdoorsman. We pay enough with Federal Excise tax on tackle which is suppose to go back into the wildlife preservation funds. Then your license. And like Pie stated only a portion of that goes back into the lakes. Then your looking at your expenses to just go out everyday. Fuel (boat/tow vehicle)/ insurance and to guide you have to cover your clients as well as your boat. Tackle/ boat slip or parking fees.

And XYZ if you were a guide in the past you would know its not cheap. Hell if you own your own boat and fish on a regular basis you know the cost starts to add up. To say that guides should pay a higher fee and weed out the mom and pop guide services is being prejudice. And if that is your reasoning for proposing the fees then your no better then some of these major corporations who jack up the gas prices or energy costs. Most guides dont guide for the money they guide because they enjoy sharing experiences with others. They make a living doing what they love and thats fishing or hunting. It puts food on the table but most wont make a fortune doing it.

Well I agree with all of you to an extent, however, I think some of you have missed the point of my post. Costs will increase regardless, I remember when I was paying 10.00 for a hunting and fishing license and when I got my lifetime hunting and fishing tag it was 500.00, so fees will increase regardless. I will pass these concerns on and believe me these committees are made up of outdoorsmen and not all of us think alike. Cat and others I think you guys should sit down and start an organization of maybe North Texas fisher-folk or a group like Old Geezers. My commission ends this December and I am resigning my post as I am taking over my deceased father's hunting operation since he was booked for the next two years and then I will close the operation.

Now when I was still living in South Texas, 3 friends and I started this small guide coop, like the ones they have in Alaska. We were 3 guides that fished 4 lakes and the Rio Grande. We referred trips to each other and fished in groups at times. We all had small boats 17 foot Trackers and placed a percentage of the guide fees in a �Kitty� or as we called it account B for bail out. When a boat had problems we borrowed from the account, however, the funds did not have to be paid back since we had all placed money into the account. We did not charge a great deal of money and only allowed two people on the boat at a time, and usually took one person only. I would like to start a similar operation up here, however, I am not yet familiar with the lakes (I have only been fishing 3 years up here) and do not know enough people yet. However, a friend and I are considering to try some trial runs.

Here is my late father�s web page and it will give you an idea of the operation we have. The website is under construction so please be patient. Also while the fish photos are not impressive, the game photos are decent.

http://www.mandosent.com/