uuuugh! I think my eyes are gonna bleed.

Well, Bowfin47, please just relax a little....and maybe listen to "the rest of the story".

Tilapia stocking in ponds in Texas is very common. There is an entire industry devoted to it....and it is a growing industry. It is perfectly legal. They all die every winter. You can buy them at local feed stores all across East Texas.

Would you rather folks put cancer causing chemicals in their ponds or Tilapia? I believe most thinking people would agree Tilapia are a far better choice for cleaning up ponds than continuing polluting our environment with chemicals, and more chemicals, and more chemicals.

My ponds are large distances from open streams. Completely isolated. Nearest neighbor is miles away. Absolutely no danger of unintended release. None. Relax. There are much more significant things to worry about out there than Tilapia...need I mention chemicals again?

Have you ever checked to see what chemicals can be bought by pond owners? Talk about unintended consequences. Those chemicals end up in the water system and we drink them, or least those unfortunate to have to rely on city water. Now, that is something to worry about, big time worry. The use of chemicals in ponds is out of control....but not in my ponds. Never use them. I use natural solutions, of which Tilapia are a big part. Do you believe ponds owners should use natural solutions...or do you support the chemical industry? Personally, I'd like to see chemicals much more restricted...and Tilapia much more widely used.

I never was able to find any Texas Rios, unfortunately, in spite of trying to do so. Relax....but thank you for pointing out your concerns about them. They are no longer in my plans.

Pacu, the experiment didn't work out. They are not a grass carp replacement. They die far quicker in winter than even Tilapia. They are sold in stores as an aquarium fish and they quickly outgrow any container they are placed in. I took on some from someone who had an aquarium that couldn't hold them. They were purchased at Pet Smart...your local pet store. I put them in an old hot tub, then moved them to a very small completely isolated pond or puddle of water. They all died on the first cold front....except a couple which I was able to carry over again in the hot tub...and they died the next fall. Relax. Absolutely no danger, zero, of them escaping....dead fish can't escape. I accounted for every single one of them....all dead. Would I accept another aquarium owner's pet Pacu to give it a home until fall? I don't know, but probably not. They just didn't do what I needed.

Again, I was looking for a way to completely eliminate the need for ever using any chemicals in my ponds. There are certain vegetation types that grass carp do not eat....turns out neither do Pacu. Hence, they are not part of my program.....but I will continue to look for natural solutions rather than use cancer causing, water polluting chemicals. If you find that wrong, then I'm sorry we disagree. I do not want to put any chemicals in myself, my family, or any other human being.

I'm totally sympathetic to some of your concerns. Salvina is a very legitimate concern. Multiple species of carp, a legitimate concern, Rios, perhaps a legitimate concern, but they are native to Texas and further are no longer in any of my plans, Pacu, don't get all upset about them....they die at the first cold breeze in the wild... and Tilapia, I simply disagree with you on this one. No risk, no harm, no foul....and an economic boom for many people in our fine State, not to mention their huge environmental contributions in reducing chemical dependency in our private ponds.

Thank you for reading my side of the story and I hope you will seriously consider my points. Thanks.

I am not qualified to debate this subject but I would like to point out one thing from my experience. I live near lake Conroe. When it had Hydrilla the Tilapia population exploded. Now that we don't have anything that resembles grass the population has tapered off but they definitely don't all die here in the winter. I have been seeing them since the late 90's and I do see some die in the winter. I saw a substantial kill a couple of winters ago when the water was in the high 40's for an extended period. But they did not all die.

RC

RC,

Any idea of what type Tilapia you are seeing?

The Mozambique, which is the only Tilapia legal in private waters in Texas, is highly cold water intolerant...death at 55 degrees. It would be a rare winter in which Conroe didn't get below 55 degrees. If you saw temps in the high 40's, the Mozambique would have been dead long, long before that.

Other varieties, which are completely illegal in private waters, are not as sensitive.

Most of the power plant lakes have Blue Tilapia in them...source not known but many theories as to their origin. Blue Tilapia are more cold tolerant than Mozambique. Regardless, they didn't come from us farm pond owners who can only buy and possess Mozambique, which again is very cold intolerant.

If you can get a picture, maybe we could ID it...but it is very unlikely that it is Mozambique or from any pond owner. Appreciate your reasonable post.

I did not know there were any talapia in Lake Conroe, never saw one or heard of them there. No one is talking about any environmental damage from a talapia population, so is there any danger from them? The grass carp ate all the vegatation, and were supposed to die off with nothing left to eat. They are still there, but are not posing any great danger to the fishery that I have heard about (some bass fishermen will take exception to this statement). We get dire predictions ever so often that never materialize. Remember Y2K, change away from freon, adding ethanol to gasoline? Disaster predicted each time.

IBTL

Oh and dont forget that the world is going to end in 2012... We REALLY wont have to worry about tilapia then!!

That's why I asked for a picture...but of course, a picture could be taken anywhere. Trying to give the benefit of the doubt to RC, but suspect you are totally right. Tilapia have been accused of most of the world's problems at one time or another and when the truth gets out, it is never Tilapia's fault.

Well hold on now that ethanol is a disaster, a disaster to outboards. I'm tired of having to clean my carbs every 3 months to get my performance back.

The tilapia that I saw looked like blue tilapia and was told by a friend that they were blue tilapia. They may have come from Lewis Creek Power plant which has a discharge going into Lake Conroe. I am just guessing on them coming from Lewis Creek Power Plant. I know at one time they had grass carp and do not know for sure if they had tilapia. I do not have any scientific proof but the next time I will get a picture of one. It will have a hole in it but you will be able to identify it as a blue or whatever. I do know the tilapia have been in Lake Conroe for several years now.

If there is a power plant discharge into Conroe, then there probably are Tilapia and they probably live in the warm water discharge if there is one, in the winter.

That would explain some things. And yes, you can bet they are blue Tilapia...illegal to all pond owners in Texas. So, if you have a beef, talk to the power plant, find out who put the Blue Tilapia in there, but don't throw the baby out with the bath water!!!

I let a lot of this [censored] just slide along but even in my mellow state, I just can't let this stuff stand. It is simply ridiculous. I never, ever said what he quoted about Pacu. I said it about Tilapia, which are filter feeders meaning they clean things up off pond bottoms including fish sh*t, yes that's right. They are not vegetable eaters, they are plankton eaters.

As to the chances of Pacu "destroying ecosystems in East Texas" how about we look at just a couple of facts. First, unless global warming or other unknown terror happens, Pacu simply can not survive. They die at about 62 degrees...even power plant lakes on occasion get to 60 degrees. Come on, destroy entire ecosystems.

It takes three years, that's 3 years, for a Pacu to reach sexual maturity....3 years of never getting below 60 degrees...come on, let's at least consider a few facts before we jump off a bridge.

Like I said, there are things out there one should be really worried about... a few Pacu that died on my place two years ago at the age of about 2 isn't one of them. Come on, how about a little common sense?

Meadowlark I should have been more clear on the discharge. They only allow water out if their lake if it is too full. They do not discharge warm water directly into Lake Conroe. I called a friend of mine and he will see if he has a good picture I can email. When Lewis Creek power Plant has to release some water this could be where they came from but I do know they have been in Lake Conroe for several years and have lived thru the winters.

You forgot honey bees, horses, and smallmouth bass.