About black buffalo;

From reading literature it seems like it a little difficult to tell the difference between black and smallmouth buffalos. It's my understanding that they are slightly "thicker with a more angled head" when compared to a smallmouth buffalo.

Then I came across this picture; http://www.wildlifedepartment.com/recordfish/bbuffalo2.jpg

One other time I had seen pics of buffs with heads like this one and it was when Donny, Kevin, and Scott were fishing Emma. This is also the same time that Scott caught his 50.

I think it would be a good idea for one of our resident fish ID experts, hence Brett, Justin, Krista, to revisit these photos for a look. Also is there a better, more definitive way, to ID a black buffalo?

I think at least Donny's 37 might be a black if not all of them; http://texasfishingforum.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/1653042#Post1653042

hi jason , i was thinking ,about 3 years ago i caught a buff that had a real strange protruding mouth it was angled toward the belly and stuck out more than anyting i have seen before ..i havent seen another one like that lately, also the mouth was real soft . any ideas ? i have yet to catch another one like that . i caught it at w/r/lake

There is a difference in the location of the mouth.

http://www.outdoorsalabama.org/fishing/freshwater/fish/other/sucker/buffalo/black/

http://www.outdoorsalabama.org/fishing/freshwater/fish/other/sucker/buffalo/smallmouth/

http://www.outdoorsalabama.org/fishing/freshwater/fish/other/sucker/buffalo/bigmouth/

I've caught buffalo that are all shapes, sizes, and mouth pointed all types of ways.....still can't tell 'em apart.

there is a huge buffalo of some kind in the tank at cabela's in Buda.

I used to be a fan of Buda......random testing and a family kinda killed that past time.

In general, Black Buffalo tend to be smaller, skinner, and longer then Smallmouth Buffalo. Black Buffalo have a mouth very similiar to that of Smallmouth Buffalo.

The only Buffalo where you can use the mouth to definitively tell the difference is the Bigmouth Buffalo.

Black Buffs tend to be smaller.

The state record Black Buffalo is only in the mid-30's.

They are most commonly found in the Red River, though they are also found in a few isolated other areas.

All of the fish in that Emma Thread are almost definitely Smallmouth Buffalo.

Personally, that picture of a so-called Black Buffalo above does NOT look like a black buffalo to me. The body shape is right, but I've seen smallmouth buffs that shape, too.

Plus...Black buffalo tend to be...black! Lol. Now, that fish may have been dead or on a stringer a while, and lost it's color, but it may have also be a mis-identified Smallmouth Buffalo.

I don't know Justin. I think this is one of the rare times that I am going to have to disagree. That 37 doesn't look like a normal smallmouth to me. In fact, the mouth, head, and hump behind the head, look very different. I think Donny may have had a state record and didn't know it. Plus TPWD clearly states that the species exists in the Colorado. I think that a lot of folks have been catching blacks and didn't know it.

I'm going to have to enlist the help of a biologist on this one. The curiousity is killing me.

Alright, let us know what you find out!

In my own defense...I have caught smallmouth buffalo out of Grapevine that look exactly like Donny's 37, mouth and all, only much smaller. And there are definitely no black buffalo in there lol.

Fairly typical Black Buffalo shape, mouth orientation, and coloration:



From here:

http://www.biosurvey.ou.edu/okwild/misc/blkbuff.html

Ok but...I came across some lit that said that the coloration is different when young but harder to tell when old.

also

Justin, look closely at the head of Donny's 37 in the thread. From it's forhead to it's upper jaw it takes a turn of about 20 degrees just even with its eyes. All the other fish in the thread are straight from forhead to upper jaw bone.

Look at, what I want to call nostrils but somehow I know they arent, and notice the bend. The others don't have this bend.

if yall look the middle belly fin on the black buff is strait, where the middle belly fin on the Smallmouth buff is rounded.

Just my observation...
GG

It still looks like a smallmouth to me, lol. I don't think those features are really enough to make it a definitive black buffalo.

Could it be? Sure, I guess so lol.

Keep in mind, though, Jenna Jameson and Danny Devito are both human...Lol.

Just cause some of it's features are different doesn't mean it's not a Smallmouth Buffalo.

If nothing else, it is much more likely that it IS a Smallmouth Buffalo then not.

But, as you said, there are a few of them in the Colorado. I believe Lake Travis has a record for them, but I think it's the only Highland Lakes chain lake that does, and they are not at all common.

Smallmouth buffalo, however, are very common.

Since they are such a hard fish to tell apart, and that fish looks like many other smallmouth buffalo I've personally caught, and it's much larger then Black Buffalo usually get too, and Smallmouth Buffalo are much more common, that is why I am inclined to say Smallmouth.

But you may be right!

Krista, we're at a Stalemate. What do you think?

Bret, did they teach you only Black Buff tricks in that Fish ID course?

Only to an extent, Justin.

However, Occam's razor comes into play here.

Chances are, this is just a slightly odd looking smallmouth buffalo, much like the dozens of other slightly odd looking smallmouth buffalo we've seen, and not one of the largest species ever recorded in this state of a fish that is very rare (if present at all) in these waters.

The black buffalo I've seen (always preserves specimens, I will grant) simply look completely different when viewed. The first one was an "oh" moment, not a "could that be" moment.

All this said, I'm not a biologist. I am, however, quite versed and skilled at identifying our Texas species.


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