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Re: Big Brown demolition (Lake Fairfield) [Re: Rube G.] #13967075 04/20/21 04:51 PM
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Slide_R Offline
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Good location for a new more modern Power Plant. Great memories of bass fishing and wildlife from down there.


Robert Oleson
aka Slide_R

Moritz Chevrolet - 9101 Camp Bowie W Blvd, Fort Worth, TX - Monte Coon (817) 696-2003
Re: Big Brown demolition (Lake Fairfield) [Re: Rube G.] #13967976 04/21/21 07:45 AM
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M. Massoletti Offline
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Maybe I'm being bone headed about this, and I am certainly no Einstein, but I am sure that to construct a completely new power plant has got to be awfully expensive. I would think,(and I could be wrong) is it so expensive to retrofit winterize and turn existing coal plants into natural gas plants with the winterization to withstand very cold temperatures that expensive of an option that it's better to just build a new one. If not there are 3 just in the East Texas area, Monticello, Welsh, Perky, that could be remodeled and continue to supply the power grid. Then if you need more, then by all means build you some new ones. Just doesn't make good sense to me to get rid of something that could be used, just to build something new. I'm sure the millions of people who where out of power in the February cold snap wouldn't have really cared if an old or new plant supplied them with electricity as long as they where able to keep the heat on.

Re: Big Brown demolition (Lake Fairfield) [Re: Rube G.] #13968318 04/21/21 03:00 PM
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machinist Online Sleepy
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Of the hundreds of thousands parts that there are in the lignite boilers versus just the thousands of parts in a natural gas boiler probably no more than a couple of dozen if that many would interchange. The 2 boilers are different animals. The turbines and generators will work on either but not the boilers


I fish on the edge and stay out of the middle

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Retired TXU Outage Manager
Re: Big Brown demolition (Lake Fairfield) [Re: M. Massoletti] #13968403 04/21/21 04:08 PM
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Slide_R Offline
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Originally Posted by M. Massoletti
Maybe I'm being bone headed about this, and I am certainly no Einstein, but I am sure that to construct a completely new power plant has got to be awfully expensive. I would think,(and I could be wrong) is it so expensive to retrofit winterize and turn existing coal plants into natural gas plants with the winterization to withstand very cold temperatures that expensive of an option that it's better to just build a new one. If not there are 3 just in the East Texas area, Monticello, Welsh, Perky, that could be remodeled and continue to supply the power grid. Then if you need more, then by all means build you some new ones. Just doesn't make good sense to me to get rid of something that could be used, just to build something new. I'm sure the millions of people who where out of power in the February cold snap wouldn't have really cared if an old or new plant supplied them with electricity as long as they where able to keep the heat on.

The problem with the older lignite plants is the emissions.


Robert Oleson
aka Slide_R

Re: Big Brown demolition (Lake Fairfield) [Re: Slide_R] #13969201 04/22/21 12:52 AM
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Greg W Offline
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Originally Posted by Slide_R
Originally Posted by M. Massoletti
Maybe I'm being bone headed about this, and I am certainly no Einstein, but I am sure that to construct a completely new power plant has got to be awfully expensive. I would think,(and I could be wrong) is it so expensive to retrofit winterize and turn existing coal plants into natural gas plants with the winterization to withstand very cold temperatures that expensive of an option that it's better to just build a new one. If not there are 3 just in the East Texas area, Monticello, Welsh, Perky, that could be remodeled and continue to supply the power grid. Then if you need more, then by all means build you some new ones. Just doesn't make good sense to me to get rid of something that could be used, just to build something new. I'm sure the millions of people who where out of power in the February cold snap wouldn't have really cared if an old or new plant supplied them with electricity as long as they where able to keep the heat on.

The problem with the older lignite plants is the emissions.


I think it's more than just emissions for coal. To my knowledge the price of gas and wind has just come down to a level that coal is not economical. Emissions is part of the equation but not the total. The price just to move coal has to be way higher than gas and wind. Boone Pickens was no idiot when he built those wind farms out by Sweetwater. Once those turbins are up you have maintenance and that's it. They just sit there and spin. Assume they have some lifespan just like a plant but still if you can manage the law suites from the bird people wind is going to be the long term cheapest option. Lots of cheap land to build them on and you don't even have to buy it. Just lease it from the farmer/rancher. Course it would be nice if they were winterized properly. They use wind up in North Dakota so it's certainly possible.

Re: Big Brown demolition (Lake Fairfield) [Re: Rube G.] #13969247 04/22/21 01:26 AM
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Rayzor Offline
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Nobody builds anything in the USA out of their own pocket. If that were true, no one would even build a snow cone shack. It comes out of the consumer's pocket.


Be safe,
Rayzor
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Re: Big Brown demolition (Lake Fairfield) [Re: Rube G.] #13969365 04/22/21 02:22 AM
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Has anyone ever looked up the output of a wind mill farm. The one in sweetwater only puts out 700 mw. while most power plants put out 1800 to 2500 kw. I wouldn't be surprised if we had rolling black outs in texas within a summer or two.

Re: Big Brown demolition (Lake Fairfield) [Re: Rube G.] #13970307 04/22/21 08:57 PM
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Bill Durham Offline
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This whole situation is such a stupid thing. Its hard to imagine that a state like Texas would have an energy generation problem. When has any business torn down a plant before they had its replacement online? Shutting down a coal plant not only takes away a generating source of power for the grid, it takes away revenue from West Virginia and all the other coal producing states. Just like Obama, Biden is hell bent on killing jobs in those states.. Coal can generate power 24/7.. not so much for wind and solar. I have read that the issue with older coal plants is you can't do anything to them to modernize without basically starting from scratch because of regulations. We have already cut off our nose.. now its really hard to breathe.

Re: Big Brown demolition (Lake Fairfield) [Re: Bill Durham] #13970356 04/22/21 10:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Bill Durham
This whole situation is such a stupid thing. Its hard to imagine that a state like Texas would have an energy generation problem. When has any business torn down a plant before they had its replacement online? Shutting down a coal plant not only takes away a generating source of power for the grid, it takes away revenue from West Virginia and all the other coal producing states. Just like Obama, Biden is hell bent on killing jobs in those states.. Coal can generate power 24/7.. not so much for wind and solar. I have read that the issue with older coal plants is you can't do anything to them to modernize without basically starting from scratch because of regulations. We have already cut off our nose.. now its really hard to breathe.



I have said this many, many times. Biden is just continuing what his idol, Resident Obama started.

Last edited by Rayzor; 04/22/21 10:05 PM.

Be safe,
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Re: Big Brown demolition (Lake Fairfield) [Re: Slide_R] #13970510 04/23/21 01:02 AM
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Frank the Tank Online Content
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Originally Posted by Slide_R
Originally Posted by M. Massoletti
Maybe I'm being bone headed about this, and I am certainly no Einstein, but I am sure that to construct a completely new power plant has got to be awfully expensive. I would think,(and I could be wrong) is it so expensive to retrofit winterize and turn existing coal plants into natural gas plants with the winterization to withstand very cold temperatures that expensive of an option that it's better to just build a new one. If not there are 3 just in the East Texas area, Monticello, Welsh, Perky, that could be remodeled and continue to supply the power grid. Then if you need more, then by all means build you some new ones. Just doesn't make good sense to me to get rid of something that could be used, just to build something new. I'm sure the millions of people who where out of power in the February cold snap wouldn't have really cared if an old or new plant supplied them with electricity as long as they where able to keep the heat on.

The problem with the older lignite plants is the emissions.


Only for the libtards


Jesus loves all of us
Re: Big Brown demolition (Lake Fairfield) [Re: buda13] #13970675 04/23/21 03:16 AM
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Originally Posted by buda13
Enjoy Welsh for a couple more winters... it’s on the decommission list too, and I hear there’s a date set but have not been able to locate it online. Squaw May end up being the only one left.

Originally Posted by buda13
Enjoy Welsh for a couple more winters... it’s on the decommission list too, and I hear there’s a date set but have not been able to locate it online. Squaw May end up being the only one left.


Welsh has 8 more years of generation scheduled.

Re: Big Brown demolition (Lake Fairfield) [Re: BigDozer66] #13970682 04/23/21 03:23 AM
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Originally Posted by BigDozer66
Originally Posted by Finesse Master/ Dropshot king
Originally Posted by Rayzor
No loss here, right!?!? We have plenty of emergency energy suppliers in Texas, right!?!?



My exact thoughts they were issuing warnings to conserve power when it was 75 outside.... I can only imagine what this summer will be like without power in 105 degree heat lol


It will be similar to that dark state of California! hammer


You forgot Martin Lake. Which is right next to Pirkey.

Pirkey to shut down in 2 years.

Re: Big Brown demolition (Lake Fairfield) [Re: Greg W] #13970690 04/23/21 03:36 AM
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Lone_Wolf Offline
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Originally Posted by Greg W
Originally Posted by Slide_R
Originally Posted by M. Massoletti
Maybe I'm being bone headed about this, and I am certainly no Einstein, but I am sure that to construct a completely new power plant has got to be awfully expensive. I would think,(and I could be wrong) is it so expensive to retrofit winterize and turn existing coal plants into natural gas plants with the winterization to withstand very cold temperatures that expensive of an option that it's better to just build a new one. If not there are 3 just in the East Texas area, Monticello, Welsh, Perky, that could be remodeled and continue to supply the power grid. Then if you need more, then by all means build you some new ones. Just doesn't make good sense to me to get rid of something that could be used, just to build something new. I'm sure the millions of people who where out of power in the February cold snap wouldn't have really cared if an old or new plant supplied them with electricity as long as they where able to keep the heat on.

The problem with the older lignite plants is the emissions.


I think it's more than just emissions for coal. To my knowledge the price of gas and wind has just come down to a level that coal is not economical. Emissions is part of the equation but not the total. The price just to move coal has to be way higher than gas and wind. Boone Pickens was no idiot when he built those wind farms out by Sweetwater. Once those turbins are up you have maintenance and that's it. They just sit there and spin. Assume they have some lifespan just like a plant but still if you can manage the law suites from the bird people wind is going to be the long term cheapest option. Lots of cheap land to build them on and you don't even have to buy it. Just lease it from the farmer/rancher. Course it would be nice if they were winterized properly. They use wind up in North Dakota so it's certainly possible.


There is a coal mine literally on the fairfield property. Pickens has already said the wind farms are a bust because breakdown and maintanence is making electricity profits a wash. Did you know they have to replace the blades every so many years, yes they go bad. That a huge expense and storage issue for the old blades, windmills are not the answer and the industry wouldn't exist without federal govt subsidies.

Last edited by Lone_Wolf; 04/23/21 03:39 AM.
Re: Big Brown demolition (Lake Fairfield) [Re: captain-kilroy] #13970692 04/23/21 03:41 AM
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Originally Posted by captain-kilroy
Has anyone ever looked up the output of a wind mill farm. The one in sweetwater only puts out 700 mw. while most power plants put out 1800 to 2500 kw. I wouldn't be surprised if we had rolling black outs in texas within a summer or two.

They are already saying to expect them this summer.

Re: Big Brown demolition (Lake Fairfield) [Re: Lone_Wolf] #13970725 04/23/21 07:19 AM
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basscaster46 Offline
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Originally Posted by Lone_Wolf
Originally Posted by Greg W
Originally Posted by Slide_R
Originally Posted by M. Massoletti
Maybe I'm being bone headed about this, and I am certainly no Einstein, but I am sure that to construct a completely new power plant has got to be awfully expensive. I would think,(and I could be wrong) is it so expensive to retrofit winterize and turn existing coal plants into natural gas plants with the winterization to withstand very cold temperatures that expensive of an option that it's better to just build a new one. If not there are 3 just in the East Texas area, Monticello, Welsh, Perky, that could be remodeled and continue to supply the power grid. Then if you need more, then by all means build you some new ones. Just doesn't make good sense to me to get rid of something that could be used, just to build something new. I'm sure the millions of people who where out of power in the February cold snap wouldn't have really cared if an old or new plant supplied them with electricity as long as they where able to keep the heat on.

The problem with the older lignite plants is the emissions.


I think it's more than just emissions for coal. To my knowledge the price of gas and wind has just come down to a level that coal is not economical. Emissions is part of the equation but not the total. The price just to move coal has to be way higher than gas and wind. Boone Pickens was no idiot when he built those wind farms out by Sweetwater. Once those turbins are up you have maintenance and that's it. They just sit there and spin. Assume they have some lifespan just like a plant but still if you can manage the law suites from the bird people wind is going to be the long term cheapest option. Lots of cheap land to build them on and you don't even have to buy it. Just lease it from the farmer/rancher. Course it would be nice if they were winterized properly. They use wind up in North Dakota so it's certainly possible.


There is a coal mine literally on the fairfield property. Pickens has already said the wind farms are a bust because breakdown and maintanence is making electricity profits a wash. Did you know they have to replace the blades every so many years, yes they go bad. That a huge expense and storage issue for the old blades, windmills are not the answer and the industry wouldn't exist without federal govt subsidies.


Agree


I got all day I’m retired
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