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Jan 23rd, 2013
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Apology #13051761 02/04/19 04:29 AM
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daddyflea Offline OP
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I was running my 18ft Extra heavy Stumpjumper with a 40hp Surface Drive up the Navasota today. I had not seen a boat or person all day and it was drizzling rain. My Dog got up in my Lap and I was hammered down. I was miles from any River access. I looked ahead and was just Lucky to catch movement. There was a Kayaker ahead right on the bank. He was wearing all dark clothes up against a dark back ground with a dark colored Kayak. I was torn between shutting it down or staying on plane to create less waves. I chose to shut it down simply because I thought it was more respectful. Be careful out there by yourself. If you were the guy in the Kayak I am very sorry, I just did not see you in time to slow down and idle by like I should have.

Re: Apology [Re: daddyflea] #13051808 02/04/19 09:08 AM
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Fooshman Online Content
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You have to be careful on Waco too. Some kayaks/canoes seem to think they are where boats can't go. Especially fun at night when they don't have any lights.

Re: Apology [Re: Fooshman] #13052028 02/04/19 03:30 PM
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daddyflea Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Fooshman
You have to be careful on Waco too. Some kayaks/canoes seem to think they are where boats can't go. Especially fun at night when they don't have any lights.


I think they are supposed to have Lights at night but I would sure hate running over one. Fooshman is correct please don't think you are where a normal boat can't go. In my Stumpjumper, if I hammer down, I draw less water and I can run wide open 26 to 30mph in about 8" of water. If I stop I am there to stay.

Re: Apology [Re: daddyflea] #13052060 02/04/19 03:50 PM
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Clay34 Offline
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DF, wasn't me but I just wanted to thank you for the good thought process. While I run a power boat too, I've almost exclusively kayaked the past few seasons. A new kayak will arrive this month and it is camo colored. I don't wear bright clothing, I typically am in a khaki or sage colored fly fishing type shirts. I sight fish spookie critters and like the subtle approach.

On my current kayak I run a VisiCarbon Pro (blaze flag during the day / white light at night) and wear a 950 Lumen headlight. There is also an airhorn, close to hand and a whistle on my vest. It's always an interesting balance between tying to be visible enough for other boaters and subtle enough for the fish that I chase.

Us kayakers have to have our heads on a swivel and we appreciate everyone that tries to share the water. We also have to take a great deal of the responsibility in this sharing of the water and make it easier on boaters. There is enough water for everyone.


Many go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not the fish that they are after. Henry David Thoreau
Re: Apology [Re: daddyflea] #13052067 02/04/19 03:56 PM
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Clay34 Offline
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Originally Posted by daddyflea
Originally Posted by Fooshman
You have to be careful on Waco too. Some kayaks/canoes seem to think they are where boats can't go. Especially fun at night when they don't have any lights.


I think they are supposed to have Lights at night but I would sure hate running over one. Fooshman is correct please don't think you are where a normal boat can't go. In my Stumpjumper, if I hammer down, I draw less water and I can run wide open 26 to 30mph in about 8" of water. If I stop I am there to stay.


"Lights Required

All vessels including motorboats, sailboats, canoes, kayaks, punts, rowboats, rubber rafts, or other vessels when not at dock must have and exhibit at least one bright light, lantern or flashlight visible all around the horizon from sunset to sunrise in all weather and during restricted visibility."

The above was a cut and paste from this link: TX Safety Requirements


Many go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not the fish that they are after. Henry David Thoreau
Re: Apology [Re: daddyflea] #13052076 02/04/19 04:05 PM
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Kayaks are more and more popular, and incidents will only increase. I've had a couple of close calls due to people in PB just not paying attention.
I'm not casting blame on the PB'ers but a kayak cannot get out of the way very fast of a PB on plane or idling for that matter, it's just a fact. A kayaker needs to keep his head on a swivel and listen!
My kayak is bright orange and I always deploy a flag when on the water, but even a bright colored kayak can be invisible on a bright day when some cloud cover moves in.
I fish a local lake and usually not far from the shore where I will often anchor. I've had people trolling run up on me where more than two people were in the boat, and nobody was paying attention to the direction the boats bow was pointing, and I had to yell to get their attention.
An air horn is a must have if you fish around power boats.


Just one more cast!

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Re: Apology [Re: daddyflea] #13052253 02/04/19 06:44 PM
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Originally Posted by daddyflea
Fooshman is correct please don't think you are where a normal boat can't go. In my Stumpjumper, if I hammer down, I draw less water and I can run wide open 26 to 30mph in about 8" of water. If I stop I am there to stay.


I agree that kayakers, canoers and power boaters all need to be careful. Kayakers always need to keep an eye and ear peeled for boats and need to stay out of boating lanes as much as possible. However, going 30MPH in 8" of water is not a "normal boat" and is inherently dangerous. If you are running that fast in 8" of water or within 20 to 30 feet of any bank, you have the greater burden to watch out for other boats, waders, swimmers, deer, rocks, trees and anything else that may be in shallow water.

It sounds like the existence of a kayak had little bearing on what happened to the OP. It sounds like the same would have happened if it was a jon boat or dark-colored bass boat. The OP simply let his guard down and was messing with a dog while running wide open. If we are driving down a country road all lone with a dog on our lap... do we have less of a duty to watch for other vehicles, motorcycles, joggers, bikers, etc? Nope.

Im not throwing stones at powerboaters nor am I defending kayakers. Until very recently, I've owned a power boat my entire adult life. I love the water and consider myself to be a very safe operator. However, a few times over the years I have accidentally ran too close to other boats... each time it was my fault. They were minding their own business fishing and I ran into a cove or around a point too hot. I didn't do it on purpose (nor did the OP) but it was my fault. Period.

I greatly appreciate the OP reaching out to say sorry and I think this dialog is very helpful. We all need to watch out for each other. When PB's operate in shallow water, near the bank or around a blind bend, they need to go slow. At the same time, kayakers need to be mindful that we are hard to see and need to make ourselves as visible as possible. We all have the burden to watch out for each other.

Safe boating!

Re: Apology [Re: Mike@972] #13052962 02/05/19 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Mike@972
Originally Posted by daddyflea
Fooshman is correct please don't think you are where a normal boat can't go. In my Stumpjumper, if I hammer down, I draw less water and I can run wide open 26 to 30mph in about 8" of water. If I stop I am there to stay.


I agree that kayakers, canoers and power boaters all need to be careful. Kayakers always need to keep an eye and ear peeled for boats and need to stay out of boating lanes as much as possible. However, going 30MPH in 8" of water is not a "normal boat" and is inherently dangerous. If you are running that fast in 8" of water or within 20 to 30 feet of any bank, you have the greater burden to watch out for other boats, waders, swimmers, deer, rocks, trees and anything else that may be in shallow water.

It sounds like the existence of a kayak had little bearing on what happened to the OP. It sounds like the same would have happened if it was a jon boat or dark-colored bass boat. The OP simply let his guard down and was messing with a dog while running wide open. If we are driving down a country road all lone with a dog on our lap... do we have less of a duty to watch for other vehicles, motorcycles, joggers, bikers, etc? Nope.

Im not throwing stones at powerboaters nor am I defending kayakers. Until very recently, I've owned a power boat my entire adult life. I love the water and consider myself to be a very safe operator. However, a few times over the years I have accidentally ran too close to other boats... each time it was my fault. They were minding their own business fishing and I ran into a cove or around a point too hot. I didn't do it on purpose (nor did the OP) but it was my fault. Period.

I greatly appreciate the OP reaching out to say sorry and I think this dialog is very helpful. We all need to watch out for each other. When PB's operate in shallow water, near the bank or around a blind bend, they need to go slow. At the same time, kayakers need to be mindful that we are hard to see and need to make ourselves as visible as possible. We all have the burden to watch out for each other.

Safe boating!


Well said! thumb


Just one more cast!

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Re: Apology [Re: daddyflea] #13053631 02/05/19 11:04 PM
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I had a close encounter with a woman in a bass boat that was about to un right over me………..while using just the trolling motor. It was broad daylight and I was right in front of her. Go figure.

Re: Apology [Re: daddyflea] #13054109 02/06/19 12:49 PM
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This is a great discussion and I have one more observation to add. Mike@972 mentioned that kayaks (and I assume all boats) need to stay out of "boating lanes" as much as possible. As anyone that fishes the North, Middle and South Bosque knows, the channel weaves all over the place and in most cases the river is far less than 50 yards wide. As a result, there is NO place a kayak can get out of danger from a PB that is hauling it on these rivers. Also, from strictly a fishing standpoint, as you all know, some of the very best fishing spots are at the edge of the channel where the depth changes quickly. I'll admit to not being a very good black bass fisherman but every fishing video I have watched, and a lot of observation of other fisherman, suggests it is best to position yourself out from the bank and throw your lure toward the shore. I think some folks feel that kayak fisherman should confine themselves to the edges of the river and stay out of the "lanes".

My point in all of this is that when you fish a small, very popular river, there are very few real "lanes" and high speeds are dangerous.

Last edited by jfcmoore; 02/06/19 12:50 PM.
Re: Apology [Re: jfcmoore] #13054140 02/06/19 01:50 PM
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Originally Posted by jfcmoore
This is a great discussion and I have one more observation to add. Mike@972 mentioned that kayaks (and I assume all boats) need to stay out of "boating lanes" as much as possible. As anyone that fishes the North, Middle and South Bosque knows, the channel weaves all over the place and in most cases the river is far less than 50 yards wide. As a result, there is NO place a kayak can get out of danger from a PB that is hauling it on these rivers. Also, from strictly a fishing standpoint, as you all know, some of the very best fishing spots are at the edge of the channel where the depth changes quickly. I'll admit to not being a very good black bass fisherman but every fishing video I have watched, and a lot of observation of other fisherman, suggests it is best to position yourself out from the bank and throw your lure toward the shore. I think some folks feel that kayak fisherman should confine themselves to the edges of the river and stay out of the "lanes".

My point in all of this is that when you fish a small, very popular river, there are very few real "lanes" and high speeds are dangerous.


There is a very narrow river that I fish for white bass and it gets hammered hard by both kayakers and power boaters during the run.
It has twists and turns, and has many blind corners, and I fear with the speed that some folks in the PB's are running, it's just a matter of time before there is a tragedy.
We can all be safe if people, both kayakers and PB'ers, would just use some common sense and respect others using the river and launch.
If you have to race to your fishing spot, and it's more important to cast safety to the side just to catch a fish, then you really need to examine your priorities, and think about the consequences.


Just one more cast!

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Re: Apology [Re: daddyflea] #13054164 02/06/19 02:17 PM
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Keep your ears open and listen if you are in a kayak. Don’t get settled in when you are in a tight spot and put on some loud music or ear plugs. I’ve been way back in some small shallow, oyster filled marsh drains and think there’s no way a power boat is going to be in here. That’s usually about the time one comes blasting on by. Just by staying out of the minuscule channel as a habit and listening for motors has saved me more than once.

You can be right in the kayak in terms of your right to be in the channel, but you can end up dead wrong if a boat comes up on you on a plane and doesn’t have time to react. No brakes in boats.

Re: Apology [Re: Clay34] #13055192 02/07/19 11:08 AM
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Fooshman Online Content
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Originally Posted by Clay34
Originally Posted by daddyflea
Originally Posted by Fooshman
You have to be careful on Waco too. Some kayaks/canoes seem to think they are where boats can't go. Especially fun at night when they don't have any lights.


I think they are supposed to have Lights at night but I would sure hate running over one. Fooshman is correct please don't think you are where a normal boat can't go. In my Stumpjumper, if I hammer down, I draw less water and I can run wide open 26 to 30mph in about 8" of water. If I stop I am there to stay.


"Lights Required

All vessels including motorboats, sailboats, canoes, kayaks, punts, rowboats, rubber rafts, or other vessels when not at dock must have and exhibit at least one bright light, lantern or flashlight visible all around the horizon from sunset to sunrise in all weather and during restricted visibility."

The above was a cut and paste from this link: TX Safety Requirements



That is where I am getting confused.

At the bottom of that link it states: "Paddling at night: Remember that you must carry one bright white light that can be exhibited in time to prevent a collision. It is recommended that you carry a lantern, flashlight, or other attached white light that will be visible from 360 degrees. Regulations state that canoes, kayaks, and all other manually driven vessels shall exhibit sidelights and a sternlight, and shall exhibit at least one bright light, lantern, or flashlight from sunset to sunrise when not at dock."

So is a 360 light required or is a suffen blast from a flashlight kosher?

Re: Apology [Re: daddyflea] #13055209 02/07/19 12:09 PM
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It's not a suffen blast from a flashlight,......It's a constant white light that can be seen continuously in the dark from 360 degrees, which is usually on a 3' pole that extends high enough over your head to be seen from any direction while you are on the water.
It's a single white light that should be on the entire time you are on the water after dark.
Not confusing at all!
https://www.austinkayak.com/products/14717/4-Foot-Kayak-Safety-Flag-with-LED-Light.html


Just one more cast!

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Re: Apology [Re: daddyflea] #13056264 02/08/19 07:03 AM
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"Exhibited in time to prevent an accident" doesn't read as constant to me.

Then it says a 360° light is recommended.

Then goes on to state you "shall exhibit sidelights and a sternlight, and shall exhibit at least one bright light, lantern, or flashlight from sunset to sunrise..."

hmmm

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