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Re: Another Rayburn question
[Re: Douglas J]
#11238435
11/22/15 08:26 PM
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 9,502
Jake Shannon(Skeet4Life)
TFF Celebrity
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TFF Celebrity
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 9,502 |
Heard of several several WILD stories of people doing what they should not have done and gone where they should not have gone with Young People in those conditions. They even had to call out the Jasper Sheriff Dept. for one boat. But hopefully there will be a lesson learned since nobody got hurt.
I have seen and heard of a lot of really dumb things happening in these high school tournaments. I think the organizers are so desperate to run it as a "no child left behind" event that they are accepting anyone that can pass a background check and owns a boat as a captain. You want to see why there seems to be so many stupid people on the water these days, put a bunch of teenagers in boats with idiots and you have your future crop of moron mariners in training... I wanna trademark that term 'moron mariners" hahaha I have had a very positive experience at all the high school events being a boat captain.
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Re: Another Rayburn question
[Re: J.M.S]
#11238470
11/22/15 08:41 PM
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,390
Andrew Y'Barbo
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,390 |
Remember 90% of your field is scared of big weather. 5% are experienced anglers with a respect. And 5% are just idiots. You can not and will not screen out all of the idiots.
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Re: Another Rayburn question
[Re: J.M.S]
#11241371
11/24/15 05:13 AM
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,293
Bigron119
TFF Team Angler
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TFF Team Angler
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,293 |
I would question the sanity of ANY angler this past Saturday to trailer/launch at HARVEY with a NORTH WIND and THEN run the boat down the lake past the MOUTH OF VEACH/CANEY (one of the most treacherous parts of the lake!) AND THEN ALSO HAVE YOUNG PEOPLE in the boat. Poor decision and planning. Easier to just stay in Harvey somewhat protected as mentioned above. OR put in at Monterrey or Caney Creek. That run down south is tough and bad for a seasoned and experienced Rayburn boat driver!! The impression is that ALL the good fishing is at Veach or Five Fingers or Coleman and that is the ONLY spot to go fish. Too much stereotyping of Rayburn. The need for Boat Captains is often so dire that anybody with a boat will be recruited and often times the parents just ASSUME if you have a boat that you know what you are doing. I am not knocking the program. It it is a wonderful program but I am concerned about Parents that do not recognize the limitations and judgement of some of the captains just so that their kids can go fish. Ultimately it is the parents decision BUT I would encourage the Club Advisor/Coach to try and influence some of the weaker boat captains for some prudent decisions.
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Re: Another Rayburn question
[Re: J.M.S]
#11241780
11/24/15 03:14 PM
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Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,174
txmark1959
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,174 |
Andrew and BigRon are exactly right on this subject. These young fishermen need to learn proper decision making under those conditions. There's fish to be caught and won with up and down that lake. Many of us had to learn the hard way and some of us had proper mentors to show us the way. Sorry....I'll get off the soap box.
Mark Cooper Onalaska Texas
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Re: Another Rayburn question
[Re: J.M.S]
#11241786
11/24/15 03:21 PM
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Joined: May 2013
Posts: 129
hunterfishes
Outdoorsman
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Outdoorsman
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 129 |
Big Ron that's exactly what I did I stayed in the back of Harvey and the boys got 5th place. There was no way we were going to Veach. I made it clear to the boys we might take a 0 but I would rather 0 than sink.
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Re: Another Rayburn question
[Re: J.M.S]
#11241804
11/24/15 03:30 PM
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,293
Neches
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,293 |
True story. A co worker in another town told me about this. His son comes home from school excited and tells Dad that he signed up for the HS fishing team and the meeting is that night. Dad said but we don't fish son. Son said that's OK they are gonna help us. So dad and son go to the meeting. The TD meets them and Dad says we don't know how to fish and only have an old 14ft flat bottom that we use a little to duck hunt in on a pond. The TD said we all started in small boats it would be fine, and that there is another kid that needs a boat to go in that he would put with them.
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Re: Another Rayburn question
[Re: J.M.S]
#11242128
11/24/15 06:09 PM
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Joined: May 2013
Posts: 129
hunterfishes
Outdoorsman
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Outdoorsman
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 129 |
Sad but true, but while not defending the incident I will say you hear horror stories in just about every sport or activity out there today. Not sure why. Have we just given up telling our kids no anymore. I know my dad in the seventies had no trouble if he felt it was not in my best interest. I hardly ever got to go Rayburn until I was a teenager we only had a 14 foot flat bottom with 9.8 merc Dad and his friends fished it but did not feel it was adequate to take the kids on the big water. We grew up fishing dam B and the Angelina river. Finally when I was 15 my dad got a 16 foot alum. bass boat and we got to go on rayburn, but not if there was even a small chance of wind or rain LOL. I have to agree with Mr. Y'barbo there is the 5% rule in anything.
I notice you say tournament director was this truly a tournament director or the team advisor for the high school team?
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Re: Another Rayburn question
[Re: Neches]
#11242174
11/24/15 06:44 PM
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 951
Hunter's Dad
Pro Angler
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Pro Angler
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 951 |
True story. A co worker in another town told me about this. His son comes home from school excited and tells Dad that he signed up for the HS fishing team and the meeting is that night. Dad said but we don't fish son. Son said that's OK they are gonna help us. So dad and son go to the meeting. The TD meets them and Dad says we don't know how to fish and only have an old 14ft flat bottom that we use a little to duck hunt in on a pond. The TD said we all started in small boats it would be fine, and that there is another kid that needs a boat to go in that he would put with them. That boat is illegal according to just about every high school tournament we have fished and we have fished a bunch. My son has fished high school and youth tournaments for the past 8 years. He fished 16 high school events this past year (BASS, TBF, SETX, Deep East Texas. My experience is that the tournament directors enforce the rules and regard safety at a higher rate than adult tournament organizations. I notice most negative comments on these high school threads come from people who have not served as captains or organized the events but know someone who saw this or said this. Are they perfect and are there people who don't make good decisions? Of course there are. I could come on here and give a few instances where I thought someone was wrong but in the grand scheme of things the high school organizations are doing a excellent job providing opportunity and also maintaining safety. The idea that one bad outcome caused by someone's carelessness could cause the whole thing to be shut down is rediculous. There are plenty of inexperienced anglers, kids included, in the McDonald's tournaments where there have been some bad incidents and there isn't an outcry for them to be shut down nor should there be. Pull up some of the bigger high school fishing organizations websites and read their rules before you start casting stones.
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Re: Another Rayburn question
[Re: Hunter's Dad]
#11242184
11/24/15 06:57 PM
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 21,699
Douglas J
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 21,699 |
True story. A co worker in another town told me about this. His son comes home from school excited and tells Dad that he signed up for the HS fishing team and the meeting is that night. Dad said but we don't fish son. Son said that's OK they are gonna help us. So dad and son go to the meeting. The TD meets them and Dad says we don't know how to fish and only have an old 14ft flat bottom that we use a little to duck hunt in on a pond. The TD said we all started in small boats it would be fine, and that there is another kid that needs a boat to go in that he would put with them. That boat is illegal according to just about every high school tournament we have fished and we have fished a bunch. My son has fished high school and youth tournaments for the past 8 years. He fished 16 high school events this past year (BASS, TBF, SETX, Deep East Texas. My experience is that the tournament directors enforce the rules and regard safety at a higher rate than adult tournament organizations. I notice most negative comments on these high school threads come from people who have not served as captains or organized the events but know someone who saw this or said this. Are they perfect and are there people who don't make good decisions? Of course there are. I could come on here and give a few instances where I thought someone was wrong but in the grand scheme of things the high school organizations are doing a excellent job providing opportunity and also maintaining safety. The idea that one bad outcome caused by someone's carelessness could cause the whole thing to be shut down is rediculous. There are plenty of inexperienced anglers, kids included, in the McDonald's tournaments where there have been some bad incidents and there isn't an outcry for them to be shut down nor should there be. Pull up some of the bigger high school fishing organizations websites and read their rules before you start casting stones. My "negative comments" come from being a first responder on a lake that the high schoolers have fished several times. And from witnessing things with my own eyes that were stupid and shouldn't happen. I guess my perspective is a little different. Sorry to have struck any nerves. Someone's kid(s) will get hurt or killed eventually if the kind of unsafe boating I witnessed is the norm in all of the events statewide, the law of averages seems to always prevail. Large fields with a percentage of fools is a recipe for something bad to happen...
![[Linked Image]](https://texasfishingforum.com/forums/pics/userpics/2024/11/full-72311-248284-f6b1190b_bbab_49d4_a1b2_6e9a1ce426f7.jpeg) #MFGA
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Re: Another Rayburn question
[Re: J.M.S]
#11242225
11/24/15 07:19 PM
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Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 547
WillieKetchum
Pro Angler
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Pro Angler
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 547 |
I think the biggest difference here that causes a several of you (Hunter fishes, Hunter's Dad and Doug) to disagree is simply the locale of the lakes you guys are talking about. Both Hunter's are talking about Rayburn. There are way more experienced boaters per capita down here than in the metroplex. In the metroplex you will find more city come to country type people that don't have the experience that a lot of us East Texas boys have by the age of 10.
So I don't think you guys are comparing apples to apples here. You're comparing wild [censored] city indians to good ol' boys of East Texas.
By no means am I saying we don't have idiots in East Texas...I promise we do...I'm just saying we have experienced idiots! LOL
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Re: Another Rayburn question
[Re: J.M.S]
#11242331
11/24/15 08:04 PM
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,390
Andrew Y'Barbo
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,390 |
Majority of the fathers in Deep East are experienced. P.S. Setx organization has enough rules that a man must have a doctorate to understand.
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Re: Another Rayburn question
[Re: WillieKetchum]
#11242351
11/24/15 08:14 PM
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 4,584
lamoon78
TFF Team Angler
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TFF Team Angler
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 4,584 |
I think the biggest difference here that causes a several of you (Hunter fishes, Hunter's Dad and Doug) to disagree is simply the locale of the lakes you guys are talking about. Both Hunter's are talking about Rayburn. There are way more experienced boaters per capita down here than in the metroplex. In the metroplex you will find more city come to country type people that don't have the experience that a lot of us East Texas boys have by the age of 10.
So I don't think you guys are comparing apples to apples here. You're comparing wild [censored] city indians to good ol' boys of East Texas.
By no means am I saying we don't have idiots in East Texas...I promise we do...I'm just saying we have experienced idiots! LOL I will second that.
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Re: Another Rayburn question
[Re: J.M.S]
#11242553
11/24/15 09:51 PM
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Joined: May 2013
Posts: 129
hunterfishes
Outdoorsman
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Outdoorsman
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 129 |
I agree too with both comments boaters and the organizations. We fish the SETX,Deep East Tex, & the YFL all have very comprehensive rules to prevent an incident. SETX has worked with the Jasper County Emergency Corps to have a rescue boat on the lake during the tournaments, and my wife as a school advisor has to report which of her teams are on the water in the morning and then cannot leave the event weigh in until she signs that all her teams have reported in. . I think that blaming the tournament directors or high school fishing as the problem is not the solution.
Just think if we could eliminate irresponsible behavior in others areas like driving how many rules (laws) could be taken off the books. I agree with you Doug we need to do all we can to keep the events safe and fun for all participants and strive to never have a serious incident, and I think that at least in the events we fish the tournament directors are doing just that. I do believe if you asked them though they would all agree that they worry if they have done enough. I encourage you get involved with these organizations and see what goes into having these events. volunteer as a boat captain and provide the example of a responsible adult, because if we don't do that that then as you said we are training the next generation of idiots, only we can prevent that. Andrew to your point I go back and read the SETX rules before each tournament to make sure I haven't missed anything LOL.
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Re: Another Rayburn question
[Re: hunterfishes]
#11242620
11/24/15 10:20 PM
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 21,699
Douglas J
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 21,699 |
I agree too with both comments boaters and the organizations. We fish the SETX,Deep East Tex, & the YFL all have very comprehensive rules to prevent an incident. SETX has worked with the Jasper County Emergency Corps to have a rescue boat on the lake during the tournaments, and my wife as a school advisor has to report which of her teams are on the water in the morning and then cannot leave the event weigh in until she signs that all her teams have reported in. . I think that blaming the tournament directors or high school fishing as the problem is not the solution.
Just think if we could eliminate irresponsible behavior in others areas like driving how many rules (laws) could be taken off the books. I agree with you Doug we need to do all we can to keep the events safe and fun for all participants and strive to never have a serious incident, and I think that at least in the events we fish the tournament directors are doing just that. I do believe if you asked them though they would all agree that they worry if they have done enough. I encourage you get involved with these organizations and see what goes into having these events. volunteer as a boat captain and provide the example of a responsible adult, because if we don't do that that then as you said we are training the next generation of idiots, only we can prevent that. Andrew to your point I go back and read the SETX rules before each tournament to make sure I haven't missed anything LOL. I didn't say you were doing anything wrong personally. I can only speak for what I've seen personally. And I would say 5-10% of the "captains" I've seen were setting a very poor example. Those people who operate on the wreckless side don't need to be setting those examples for the young men and women involved in HS fishing. This is my opinion and I hope something is done in the vetting process for captains going forward. It's not only safety issues, but it's also poor etiquette. Hopefully somebody involved will try and make sure 100% of the captains operate like you said you do. I have nothing against any of it, I just have a problem with wreckless people. Your comparison of "laws" and high school fishing rules isn't a good one. People place the safety of their most prized possessions in the hands of someone on the water. Completely different deal all together IMO. I like the concept of getting kids involved and props to those volunteering their time to help. I just think it needs some refining. Good luck and Happy Thanksgiving
![[Linked Image]](https://texasfishingforum.com/forums/pics/userpics/2024/11/full-72311-248284-f6b1190b_bbab_49d4_a1b2_6e9a1ce426f7.jpeg) #MFGA
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Re: Another Rayburn question
[Re: J.M.S]
#11242816
11/25/15 12:13 AM
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Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 1,818
Curtbass
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 1,818 |
It seems to me it mainly falls on TD as having the final say when conditions are extreme,the ultimate responsibility is of parents to make that call ,as far as their child participating in extreme conditions. I also have been contacted by numerous persons(Total Strangers) to Captain High School teams. With that being said, I look at other HIGH SCHOOL sports(rodeo,football,soccer) that can have deadly conditions involved . I may venture onto a lake in extreme conditions but the entire scope changes when another person is aboard. A LOT of responsibility is assumed when taking on these tasks. I encourage the participants, but personally won't participate because of the risks & responsibility of other people's minor children.
Last edited by Curtbass; 11/25/15 12:15 AM. Reason: Added content
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