So, I got the itch last summer and decided to pull the trigger on an Old Town Predator 13. I purchased it back in August of last year and have used and abused it since then.

It's been a great boat, but I've noticed an increasing amount of water incursion into the hull over my last few trips. I tried to find the cause but couldn't seem to locate the source of the water, and assumed it was a leaking hatch loosing seal over months of hard use.

On the 4th of July, the girlfriend and I loaded up the boats and headed for Grapevine to spend the day paddling around and watch some fireworks. On the lake I happened to find the problem. I noticed stress cracks in the deck of my yak inches from the top of my scupper holes. They are nearly impossible to see when I am not sitting in the boat and my weight isn't spreading them out when the deck flexes. I beached the boat and checked them out, then took the boat out of the water shortly thereafter not wanting to risk further damage or worse, sinking on a very busy lake. The boat has a lifetime hull warranty, so I was eager to get in touch with Johnson Outdoors and discuss the problem with them.

Johnson Outdoors was closed for the holiday weekend, so I got in touch with them on Monday morning. I immediately spoke with a customer service rep who was very professional and on point. He gave me his e-mail address and asked me to take some detailed photos of the cracks and to send them to him. He informed me that they would be passed along to the quality department for review. He also informed me that when given the go ahead for a warranty replacement I would need to cut a 10" by 10" section out of the hull including the serial number. I got home from work at 6pm on Monday, took the pics and sent them off. I received a reply from Johnson on Tuesday morning that my e-mail had been received and my photos had been forwarded to quality for review. By Tuesday afternoon, I had a second e-mail confirming that it was a warranty issue, apologizing for the problems and giving me instructions on where to send the hull portion. All in all, very prompt and excellent customer service on the part of Johnson Outdoors. So I should have a new boat in a few weeks.

Here are some shots of the cracks.

Good to hear they are taking care of you. That is where I would expect an upper deck failure to take place - esp if someone is heavy and standing a lot. Does OT put any foam under the front deck?

Sounds like pretty good customer service. I stood in one at ACK and was surprised how much deck flex it had. I guess if they are seeing this frequently they will redesign the deck supports or may have already done so from the earlier models.

I kind of have to agree with this. Since the stress fractures both formed between the scupper and nearest contoured deck (ie where anglers are going to be standing) this may be a design flaw and continuing problem. It is reassuring that Old Town is standing behind their problem, but I would be cautious and vigilant with the hull around the same area on the deck.

what are you doing with the old one your cutting

Hummm....I was seriously thinking of making the Predator my next kayak, but now I may have to rethink that. I know good customer service is comforting, but what are they going to do about it for the near future, and for the one's that are out there now?
If they sent me a new boat, I don't think I would put it into the water without first shoring up the deck area with some closed cell foam blocks.

http://www.austinkayak.com/search/closed%20cell%20foam

Looks like a inherent design issue to me. All those small radi create stress risers that will eventually fail. To many sharp corners.

Yep, I would have to rate it as a serious design issue!

Just curious FishinMark, are you a big guy?

I wouldn't even consider that an excuse on a year old kayak? Maybe if a 400 pound guy used it as a trampoline then yeah maybe. Kind of makes a person wonder if they did much research and development?

After some experimentation, I have come to the conclusion that I am most likely to blame for the deck failure and the stress cracks. I transport the boat upside down on my Grand Cherokee on my factory roof rack. The seat risers on the sides of the hull are much taller than the rest of the boat, and when in transport on my SUV they actually contact the roof and take up all the weight of the kayak at the rear. I tested the boat last night and tried pulling and standing and pushing and shifting my weight all different directions to try and find out what was causing the issue. While I am a large guy, I am large in the built like a tank way at 6' and 240lbs. I spent seven years toting a rifle around the world in service to our country, and my physique still somewhat reflects those years of hard training and lean living. Some of you may recognize me from the Fall G2G at Grapevine last year. It amazes me how much cleaner the yak is in this shot, by Dean (District Paddle).


When the boat is upside down and sitting on the seat risers on the roof and I tighten my tie down straps, I am placing a lot of vertical compression on the hull. That is forcing the seat risers to spread apart and focusing stress right on those points on the deck. The twisting stress combined with the fact that sometimes I leave the boat on the truck for weeks at a time bouncing up and down at 70mph on my hour long drive to and from work and to and from fishing locations is what I believe has caused the damage. There are times where I am fishing 3 or 4 times a week for weeks at a time and it is a pain in the butt to unload and reload all the time. When I grab the seat risers and force them apart gently, the cracks in the deck open up dramatically. When standing on the deck the cracks are actually forced closed as the deck deflects downwards, and the leading edge of the deck ridges where the failure occurred flexes uniformly with the deck below it. If standing was the issue, then the failure would have been on the other side of the deck blocks along the leading side, as that is where the pivot point is.

It is difficult to explain, but trust me when I say that I am 99% sure the failure was my fault, caused by the stresses I've been placing on the boat during transport. So in the future I will find a new method of transport to ensure that this does not happen again. I've been kicking around the idea of getting a trailer anyway, as loading and unloading a 90lb yak onto and off of the roof of an SUV is not exactly fun by yourself, trust me.

I guess I need to take back my critical responses!

I don't know the answer, just know that when I've seen folks post cracked scupper areas in the past that they areusually guys that are much bigger than me...160 soaking wet. I carry my kayak upside down on Grand Cherokee factory racks as well...padded with pool noodles. Am not familiar with the Predator other than the great reports on it by those that own them. I always assume on all kayaks its either caused by raised seat frame or bigger guy and raised seat frame from sitting down or heel pressure when standing up.

PS..Awesome color, would look great with SuperNovaFishingLights inside hull.