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Re: Need help with hooks and live shrimp
[Re: Flippin84]
#10092652
06/26/14 05:02 PM
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 2,945
TOO
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 2,945 |
Flip, most every post has had good suggestions, so you can decide what to try. However, (and I usually don't offer suggestions this way) on this upcoming suggestion you can take it to the bank. The most effective way to fish live shrimp is with a thin wire Kahle hook. Eagle claw Lazer Sharp L144F' or L141F's, (if you can find the L 144 in stores) and the red Mustad's are the best of those two brands using live shrimp. The EC stainless/nickel looking Kahles for croaker are too thick, as are the other Mustad styles. VMC and Owner make Kahle hooks that are good, super sharp but again just a bit too thick on most of their offerings, and are usually very expensive compared to EC and Mustad. Time to time, you can come across VMC's, Owners, or other brands of Kahle hooks that are good for live shrimp, but it's a lot easier on life to buy a box of 50 L144/L141's and be done for the year(s). Looking for a thin barb on the thin wire hook so you don't damage the horn area and kill the shrimp faster plus the thinner wire, less weight allows a live shrimp to move a bit easier. Another suggestion, when the shrimps shell is soft and it doesn't stay on hook well, hook the shrimp at the last section above the tail from underneath through the shell ridge. Usually try to have the hook come out just below the last segment at the top of this section. Shrimp will stay alive and not get thrown off easily. Some folks feel it effects how the shrimp swims but it beats the hell out of throwing off your shrimp due to a soft shell. I've used hook sizes from #4 and #2 when free lining shrimp to 2/0 when rigged with a popping cork, targeting reds, etc. Generally stay with a #1 to 1/0 -2/0 for most live shrimp fishing. Now here's why I like Kahle hooks...... you can set the hook like with a J hook, or you can let the fish set the hook itself like a circle hook. Best to reel down 'til you feel the fish on and then set the hook when using live shrimp under a cork or free lining. Same goes for bottom rig with live shrimp, but usually the fish will set the hook themselves if passive fishing that way. The number of fish I've seen and have caught using Kahle's is in the thousands and I can remember only gut/gill hooking maybe 10-20 total. Gut/gill hooking with Kahles does happen and probably slightly more than circles, but the percentage is so low, it's insignificant. I've seen circles used, mostly offshore and seen only couple times where it didn't hook in the corner of the jaw. Circle hooks are a good choice, I just like being able to set the hook to make sure. When fishing for tuna offshore, especially behind shrimp boats standard procedure is circle hooks. Been around long enough that first tuna fishing was done with J hooks, and had plenty of missed fish, as well as missed fish with circles until they learned to not set the hook. Found some heavy wire black Kahles same size as the circles used for tuna and next time we find the blackfin I'm going to try the Kahles and see if setting the hook works on tuna. Bottom line, trebles, circles, Kahles all work with live shrimp. You'll never see me, children, etc not use Kahles when fishing with shrimp. Decide what works best for you, and go with it. I definitely like having a single hook to remove from the lips/jaws, instead of three down a throat. Would definitely stay away from J hook when using live shrimp. Good luck on what you decide to use. Hello everyone, I am a freshwater enthusiast until recently when I started taking interest in inshore fishing. The wife and I have taking 3 trips this last month to Galveston fishing the sea wall, Seawolf park, and then the Texas City dike. We have been catching fish but our hook up ratio is terrible. We are using live shrimp under a cork and on the bottom with a fish finder rig. I have currently been using a 3/0-2/0 straight shank hook. Any advise about hooks and size, along with the best way to hook a shrimp would be greatly appreciated. We are going back in a few weeks because saltwater is highly addictive!
Last edited by TOO; 06/26/14 05:04 PM.
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Re: Need help with hooks and live shrimp
[Re: Flippin84]
#10101270
06/30/14 12:52 PM
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Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,153
Grinder55
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,153 |
My hook preferance is a red #4 treble hook. Eagle Claw makes some good ones.
1) The larger treble leads to more jaw and lip hooksets instead of gut hooks and therefore it saves undersize trout from stress when removing the hook as well as being easier to remove from keepr trout.
2) Red is one of the 1st colors to fade in saltwater as it sinks deeper in the water. Different colors are no longer visible due to the absorption and scattering of different wavelengths of light at different depths as they sink below the surface.
The color red fades quicker than other colors in the first 0 - 15 ft of water and as a consequence the red hooks visibilty fades as it sinks and this gives your live shrimp the most natural presentation that can be achieved.
Last edited by Grinder55; 06/30/14 12:54 PM.
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Re: Need help with hooks and live shrimp
[Re: Flippin84]
#10101306
06/30/14 01:07 PM
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Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,153
Grinder55
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,153 |
I published this article back in 2005 regarding using a cork that rattles and live shrimp - it still holds value today !
THE ALAMEDA RATTLER: Tips to rig it and use it By Capt. Rex Harrison Hoyt
The Alameda Rattler, reddish orange top/green bottom (and even the reddish orange top/black bottom in the real cold of winter) has proven itself to be a very effective cork/float. Whatever you choose to call it - cork or float, it is very effective for catching trout, redfish, flounder, drum, shark, etc. It has some advantages that other corks dont have. Rigged and used properly it can be used year round with live shrimp, recently alive shrimp, fin fish or soft plastic lures. So here are some tips on how to rig it and how to use it.
Using a SPRO #8 barrel swivel 50 lb. test. from the bottom of the swivel with leader attached slip the leader through the top clasp and pull it tight. The SPRO#8 swivel has less play or give to it, thus giving you a quicker feel when the fish bites. If its a trout when they feel that hook they can spit the bait quick, so you better set that hook quick, this is where the SPRO #8 swivel helps in that regard as it gives you a quicker feel on the bite.
After you tie your knot on the swivel, hold your line tight against the swivel at the top of the Alameda Rattler and pull your leader through the top clasp on the top stem. Wrap your leader 3 times around the top stem, up to five if you can, and pull your leader through the long slit on the side of it down to the bottom of the slit. Hold your thumb in the bottom of the slit just above the bottom stem preventing your leader from coming out the slit, and wrap it 3 times around the bottom stem, slip your leader through the bottom clasp and your set to set the length of your leader.
I use at least five wraps on the top stem and 3 wraps around the bottom stem of the 3 1/2" Alameda Rattlers. Using five wraps or more takes some skill. However, youll have extra line to lower your depth and/or cut off an inch or so of leader above your hook because of line fray from so many game fish bites. Thus, you will be able to maintain the proper length of your leader when clipping the frayed area next to your hook from trout and red bites. Just retie your hook and cut off an inch of leader due to teeth abrasions from game fish on bites on the leader near the hook. You can unwrap a bit on either the top or bottom stem of the Al. Rattler to keep the length the same after you clip the frayed leader when you retie your the hook.
Length of leader: as a rule of thumb, 20 -22" of leader is sufficient to work 2 - 6 ft. of water. However, I make some for the real skinny water I fish, with only 16- 18 inches of leader to switch to on an as needed basis when fishing 1 2 ft of SaltH20 for reds and flounder.
Having the skill to use this wrap method also will allow you to change from the 3 1/2 Al. Rattler in 2 6 ft. depths, to the 4 or 4 A. Rattler when working shell depths over 6 ft. plus quick. When using the Alameda Rattling Cork I fish 98% of the time with the 3 Al. Rattler because its sound is just right and it is not to big and wont spook a fish when it lands on top of the water in shallow water. However, the difference in size does matter for deeper water 6 ft. or over that you are fishing.
I also like to take off the Al. Rattler and free line for reds and flounder underneath the trout or when fishing passes with good current. Consequently, if you can use the wrap method, just take youre Alameda Rattler off and free lineor just wrap it back on and go up top for trout. In the event you are wade fishing, the wrap method is important as it will allow you to free line guts with good current or use the Alameda Rattler to work the grasslines next to the gut and work your bait/lure as you see fit against the shoreline.
The bbs in the A. Rattler imitates the sound of shrimp migrating in the water. Pop it often, keep the slack out of your line and don't be afraid to make some NOISE with it. That's what the concave top is for. It is to help this cork/float to make a sound like a trout hitting the top of the water feeding when you "pop" it. So you have two things attracting the fish, the sound of shrimp from the bbs and the sound of trout feeding by making a whoosh noise on top of the SaltH20 with the concave top it. It will attract the fish!
In fact, when I first throw it out, I pop it three times in a row to try and imitate a mullet skipping across the water likes its being chased by a big fish. If a mullet is being chased by game fish, you can usually count on at least three skips out of the water by the mullet, so I try and duplicate that nature scene with my initial cast.Then after your initial three pops, pop it at regular or irregular intervals, depending on the clarity of the water. Muddy water youll find that it needs a steady pop. Trout green water, its a variable pop,..let it sitjiggle..popsit them BAMMM!!! Or it could be 5 seconds pop, 10 seconds pop, 5 pop 15 seconds pop 8 seconds pop and so onand then, pay attention to what rhythm the trout are attracted to at that locationand stick with whats working. If your in shallow water or see a fish working close to your Al. Rattler, just jiggle it a bit, instead of popping it and tease the game fish, thats another effective use of the Alameda Rattler. All it takes is confidence and knowing where the fish are!!
As far as leader there are two types. An inexpensive leader I use is 30 lb. Stren clear mono for leader. When you pop your Alameda Rattler it makes your shrimp come to the surface and then drop down. The 30 lb. mono gives you more buoyancy and the shrimp falls at a slower rate than with 20 lb. leader, thus giving the trout a better shot at your bait. A bit more expensive, but more durable against fray from gamefish teeth and less visible in the water that I am also using is Seaguar 20 lb. Fluorocarbon leader. I am using it with good success and it doesnt fray as quick from trout and reds teeth. When the bite is on strong and steady for most of the day, especially during the fall and spring; and, your catching lots of fish, most leader will get frayed quick. In the event you hook into the trout or red of your lifetime during steady action for the better part of a days fishing, then during the latter part of your days fishing you may need or wish you had that extra durability and strength of the 30 lb. Stren clear mono or at least 20# Seaguar Fluorocarbon leader.
The Alameda Rattler is effective with live shrimp or recently alive shrimp over grass and shell. The A. Rattler is also effective with live pin or piggy perch rigged using single/circle hooks underneath it in deep shell or around deep shell pads around wells.
Using the D.O.A. or Berkley Power Bait shrimp tail lures, Tidal Surge split tail soft plastics, touts or even using the SW Assassins underneath the Al. Rattler is effective in the fall and winter if youre a lures only type of angler.
The Alameda Rattler has a patent number on top, so make sure that this patent number is present when you make your purchase. Some Academys may put other brands of imitation "rattlers" in the bin with the Alameda Rattlers, so watch out for that. Wal-Mart carries the Alameda Rattlers and keeps them in a separate bin, to the best of my knowledge. The other brands of rattlers will take on water quick, and youll have to replace it due to its sinking and not making the right noise since the bbs inside will be floating in water. If your rattler has water in it the bbs in it wont have the right rattling sound needed to attract the fish like the patented Alameda Rattler so change it. Believe me, little things do make a difference, especially when the catching is tough or slow. Thats why I like the Alameda Rattler.
Just think of the Alameda Rattler as a top water lure with a shrimp/soft plastic trailing it. Both rattling top waters and rattling corks or jigs with shrimp/lures underneath are effective for attracting trout, and big ones at that. Thats because trout and reds can hear. But, thats another article.
With the Alameda Rattler making noise up top and with a live shrimp or pinfish, or a slow sinking soft plastic, then you have the best of both worlds and your fishing will be catching..year round!
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Re: Need help with hooks and live shrimp
[Re: Flippin84]
#10107954
07/02/14 09:42 PM
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 415
Lindsey
Angler
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Angler
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 415 |
I too recommend the 2/0 red kahle by Eagle Claw. Personally, I've seen too many little specks killed and released on trebles when using live shrimp, so it's my own personal ethical choice not to use them. Kahles will do just fine...it will make you a better fisherman and it's honestly more fun to have to pay close attention and set the hook rather than to just drag fish in.
I'm not a chick.
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Re: Need help with hooks and live shrimp
[Re: Flippin84]
#10115865
07/07/14 12:42 AM
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Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 43
Flippin84
OP
Outdoorsman
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OP
Outdoorsman
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 43 |
Thanks for the great info everyone. I can't wait to get down to Galveston to try out some new hooks and hopefully increase my hook up ratio.
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