I want a new set up but am torn between the two. I heard that Orvis has started making all of their stuff in China and the quality has plummeted. Is that true or just people hating on Orvis?

sounds like hating to me. I'd definitely look into it for yourself and not take someone else's word.

Orvis Helios, Hydros, Access, and Superfin rods are made in Vermont. Orvis Clearwater and Streamline rods are made in Korea.

No Chinese made rods.

And as far as quality plumiting, that would be news to most people since the current line up is considerd the best rods Orvis has ever offered.

That is what I thought, I didn't think Orvis had lost its touch just because a few rods were outsourced to foreign countries. I am still wondering about peoples opinion on each company though I don't really have the money to buy one of each and decide and where I live there aren't a lot of other fishermen so I don't even know anybody with a sage rod.

I believe all Sages are made in Bainbridge, Washington. While Orvis is good, I have fished it and they do stand behind all of their products...I still believe they are over priced...maybe not at the high end, but in the lower and middle segments. The other two comprable high end brands are Winston and Scott. The lower end (2) Winston models are made over seas, with the rest being made in Twin Bridges, Mt. They have the life time warranty that Sage has. Orvis has a 25 yr warranty. All have a shipping and handling fee from $40 to $50. I am not familiar with Scott...you will need to talk with Tailwaters in Dallas about them.

You can find deals on the Internet on Orvis items...just know about what they cost new or in close out before bidding. I bought a lot of my former Orvis items on eBay...and in turn just sold out of Orvis on eBay.

David, you're really should try the new Access ($350) and Clearwater 2 ($189). They are far from being overpriced for the performance they give. The high end is in the same ballpark as evryone else and even a little less when you start looking at how the rods are constructed and what materials are used.

The Access puts the other rods in that price point to shame. It's hard to find an American made rod that casts well for less then $400. Orvis has a sleeper in that rod and it's gonna suprise alot people when they casts them.

Orvis has a flat $30 repair fee. Scott's was $45, even it was a flawed guide that busted the first time it was used.

Cabela's used to sell Scott, but pulled out a few years ago when they decided to support the small shops and drop the big box stores.

I have lots of fly rods, and more Sages and Winstons than anything else, but two of the last three graphite rods I bought are Orvis rods. I love their Helios line. The 8.5 ft five wt 4 pc mid flex Helios is a great trout rod and the nine ft 8 wt tip flex is my go- to striper rod.

I have to chime in and agree with Crackerbait. A lot of people say Orvis is over-priced, but the quality of their rods and the warranty can't be beat. For all the TFO fans here, I really like some of their rods. The 8' 4wt Lefty Kreh Signature is a GREAT rod. I would not take for my 9' 6wt 'mid flex' Orvis Helios or my 9' 8wt Orvis TLS. They're both extremely good-casting rods.

Then, what does a split cane rod builder know???

JR

I come from point of view that the most valuable rod you is the one in your hands, the market doesnt let quality slip far before the brand is gone particularly in something as small as fishing rods. Its harder to buy a bad rod than it is to buy a good one.

Winston boron rod are amazing check em out

I've never heard of Winston Boron, where are they from?

Its the R. L. Winston rod co, There boron series rods are great I have a 5wt BII-MX and a 3wt BIIt. there pricey but I cant imagine fishing without them now. I looking at getting on of there 8wts to replace my TFO. There in Twin Bridges MT I picked up my 3wt from the factory last summer, missed the tour but got a rod lol

http://web.winstonrods.com/flyrods/

$ 750 rods

maybe just a bit, but it gives me one less thing to blame my bad cast on

I have the Orvis Hydros 9' 4 wt that I absolutely love.

Over Christmas they were doing a sale where they threw in one of their Battenkill Large Arbor reels with the rod. So for under $500 I got the rod and reel and it's worked perfectly for me.

Can't say if it's better than a comparable Sage, but it would be hard to beat.