You can't have a sport that is fair if some poeple are playing by the rules and others are not.

Since it is almost impossible to police it, then let everyone be able to get info how they want.

I am sure BIG sponsors want their Anglers to do well, but do it the right way.

Do any of you enjoy watching basetball, football, golf, or any other sport. What do they do? Steal signs. Pay scouts. Watch games. Watch video. Hire scouts to steal signs. Hire camera men to watch and report. Now if any of this is different then you should stop watching any of it. Even before you guys go fish tournament most of you are online looking at fishing reports. Asking at local fishing shops. Calling your home boys while their pre-fishing too. Each and every one of these pro's get out there during their pre-fishing time before it gets light and most of them get off the water when its starting to get dark. Just like every football, basketball, hockey, soccer, and every other sport they still have to get out there and catch these fish.

"Do any of you enjoy watching basetball, football, golf, or any other sport. What do they do? Steal signs. Pay scouts. Watch games. Watch video. Hire scouts to steal signs. Hire camera men to watch and report. Now if any of this is different then you should stop watching any of it. Even before you guys go fish tournament most of you are online looking at fishing reports. Asking at local fishing shops. Calling your home boys while their pre-fishing too. Each and every one of these pro's get out there during their pre-fishing time before it gets light and most of them get off the water when its starting to get dark. Just like every football, basketball, hockey, soccer, and every other sport they still have to get out there and catch these fish. "


THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Before i could get done reading all of these posts this is what was on my mind to be written.

Just fish. If you dont want to compete against these guys then fish alone, in a stock tank where noone else is at.
I tournament fish ALOT and get information from ALOT of different people. I still have to go out there and make it work,and most of the times i dont do to expectations because i had too much information and not enough time to sit down and put it into a working game plan. They still have to have the mind for this stuff. its not a given when you show up to a lake position your boat over said brush pile, and jiggle your red shad worm 3 foot to the left 3 times and set the hook. The fish still have to be there, and if hurricane Katrina moves over your lake the night before you still have to know how to adjust. Unless your guide or redezvous \gave you that much information, and hints to if it rains, or if it snows, or if the sun comes out, or if the sky falls down you should go here in stead. then we all should find him for information next time.

I understand about people getting help but trust me 90% of the tournaments won are by the angler not the spot. I've been given spots, everyone has been given spots and guess what those spots are usually not that good. I never try and get info and most of the guys I travel with and fish with don't either because it usually messes everything up. I fish FAST real fast and different no one usually fishes the same stuff the same way, I'm not old school I don't hang out on a spot all day throwing a worm, and thats usually what someone tries to give me. I'll try it for 5 minutes then I'm out there cause I can't fish that way.

If you have never seen some of these guys on the water its hard to say that they don't find the honey holes. You know why they are called honey holes cause there is something different and they usually have fish, pretty simple to find when you put 100 guys on the water that long 1 will find it. Most of them fish fast as well there batterys are done everyday when they get off the water, they are trying to locate fish.

I would put my money on KVD against someone that was given spots any day of the week. I'm not saying he dosen't get help but how many of ya'll fish like he does. How many guys will abandon what they know and fish totally different the last day with 100,000 on the line cause they know thats the thing to do and not because they THINK it will work.

I might get reamed for this but if you think that its all about spots you need to rethink how you approach fishing. I know someone will get on here and tell me about this one tour and this one spot and all this other stuff, but I talked to an Elite today who called me up to BS and he just laughed and laughed about this he said he could care less, and I know how he is and he could care less.

Thank you Todd

And for those of you that want to read the rules of the Elite Trail.

http://assets.espn.go.com/winnercomm/out..._2010_final.pdf

I haver read them myself many times.

And for your info...the cut off date for the 09 Classic for outside contact was December the 15th 2009 at 12:00AM


Thank you!

I'm going to have to disagree with you Cable. I'd be willing to bet that KVD could go to your home lake with no info, compete against you for 6 days and beat you at least 4 of those days. These guys really are that good.

They all get info. It's the level of info that is in question. I know a couple of these guys. First off, they cannot stand for co-anglers, local sticks and such to offer them info. I have personally witnessed Elite folks turn and walk away before a stranger attempting to "help" has a chance to offer anything. They have a 30 day cut-off, remember? The guys I know do their research, just like anyone, and do it within the rules. And I do not believe that one spot will win the majority of the Elite tournaments over four days. Some can and have won it for a pro. But as has been noted, those guys still have to adjust to changing conditions and 85% of the field trying to get on those same "spots". They must make the right decisions and execute for four days in a row. One bad day and they're out of any chance to make the Top 12, aside from a rare exception where they smoke 'em the next day and the leaders stumble. Also, most of the guys really don't want pre-conceived ideas about what they're going to do during competition. The fish and conditions change not just every day, but every hour. The long-standing top guys have a lot of experience on most of the water bodies where the events are held. Bottom line, the top guys are the toughest mentally and physically and have a God given ability to adapt, change and make the right decisions a majority of the time. Yes, the perenial winners have good financial deals through sponsors relations and check-cashing consistency. But I'll guarantee you that on their way there, almost every single one of them was about to starve and one cut/check away from seeing their dreams of the "big leagues" evaporate. These guys are the best fishermen on the planet not just because they can catch fish but because of all the aforemetioned variables. If anyone thinks the guys at the top stay there because of "secret" help, I personally think you are kidding yourself. JMO which is worth about as much as you paid for it.

Interesting thread...........but finally CFRYE put something on here that is not rumors, conjecture or opinions...........the rules seem pretty cut and dry to me about the gathering of information.............27 to 30 days in advance................most everything will change on most every lake...........water temp, water level, water clarity, let alone weather conditions during the tournament...........and as has been said on here several times, fishing conditions change almost every day......let alone change from 27 days prior. Unless someone knows with certainty, by name, who is breaking these rules.........I see nothing wrong with Pros gathering information within these rules.

Nobody said they were breaking rules. Just that they have help to find the fish. The fish may move some but they don't always go far.

I almost feel like were spinning in circles on this one!

I'll sum it up....

A. It's in the rules they can get info up to a certain point.

B. They can do what they want during that time. No one has a problem if it's within the rules.

C. They are the best anglers of the world. They have proven it over the years. We all agree.

D. I think some of us would like to see a "unbiased" tournament every once in awhile. I think a Lake "X" would be a great bonus to the season. Let's make it exciting!!


Summary Complete!

I must be fishing for a different type of largemouth bass than you.

They move like Nomads...where im from!

I have to agree with 'The Todd' and Fouz.

Ok...........but when I read the Peter T article, quoted below, and he says "why not just make it all legal", it led me to believe he's saying some of them are doing things illegally.........i.e. breaking the rules. I guess we can all read the same thing and interpret it differently.


No Rules, No Worries
If Thliveros had his druthers, the Elite Series would have no rules pertaining to off-limits periods or garnering information from locals. His reasoning for that is he says some competitors are acquiring specific details � including waypoints � from guides and top local sticks and it's almost impossible to stop the practice.

Therefore, why not just make it all legal and keep everything above board.

Some very good reads on here, very interesting.

I have a question that pertains to this, I'm using knowledge from someone i highly respect, We was sitting around eating breakfast one day at Lake Fork and was talking about tournament fishing, (His son won a big event the month before) and he told me about one guy in Lousiana.

I fish because i love to fish, not because of tournaments, and yes i will ask for any information i can get, the info is pretty much a means of getting in a comfort zone for myself before going to any particular lake.

So im gonna throw this out there and see where it goes,

A professional angler , one of very high popularity and a history of dominating, (In case no one knows, most of the Elite have people on stand by with a complete set up waiting with its own driver to be on the spot when needed-boat-truck etc..) So lets say this angler has one of his Boats shipped to a "Friend" in the area of an upcoming BIG event,"Take it and do what you want with it" and the "friend" does just that, for the next two weeks he's out there fishing all over the place every day solid. well 4 days before the event..ring ring.."SO and SO is coming by to pick up the boat to have it wrapped/cleaned stocked and ready for the upcoming tourney, thanks for taking care of it"
All way points stay with the boat, but not one word of info has been exchanged......

I found the story very interesting and it made alot of sense to me because i do know a gentleman who's job is specifically to drive the backup truck and keep the back up boat completely stocked (not for the story above)

So i do know that info is exchanged to the anglers, how much and to what extent is different per angler, info and actually fishing are two different things. If i was at the top of my game and i had that info going in, i would definately call it an edge on the competition.


"Here have a lollipop!"

Good summary, BBT.

quote from JDB
(In case no one knows, most of the Elite have people on stand by with a complete set up waiting with its own driver to be on the spot when needed-boat-truck etc..)

JDB, to clarify...are you saying that most of the Elite Series competitors, all ~100 of them, have this?

Some of them-

I wouldnt expect all of them to be able to have the luxury of doing this. And to be honest i do not follow it enough to even know what everyone has. I was more less wanting to relay an interesting story that i thought was very intreging to this topic. But i know of one, the husband of a lady i work with , thats his sole job, to keep the boat and truck ready and stocked and on stand by if needed.