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Difference between Palmetto and Sunshine Bass
#3815706
08/14/09 12:11 PM
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Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 44
TawakoniSpecial
OP
Outdoorsman
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OP
Outdoorsman
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 44 |
Noticed that Tawakoni has been stocked with both hybrid species, the palmetto being one with striper eggs, and the sunshine being the one with white bass eggs (source=TPWD 2006 lake survey).
I was wondering if these subspecies are discernable, and if one has a better growth rate, mortality, etc.?
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Re: Difference between Palmetto and Sunshine Bass
[Re: TawakoniSpecial]
#3815793
08/14/09 12:45 PM
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,634
slabnshad
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,634 |
Wichita Falls biologist tells me they are basicly the same, the only thing they are not sure of is catchability, but it would be hard to compare if both types stocked at same time. Reason for this type of cross, White bass eggs more availability earlier.
Dennis
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Re: Difference between Palmetto and Sunshine Bass
[Re: TawakoniSpecial]
#3815895
08/14/09 01:22 PM
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 4,175
"Da" NITRO
TFF Team Angler
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TFF Team Angler
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 4,175 |
The Palmetto Bass is known as the original cross and was first performed sometime in the 60's. Later they created the Sunshine bass, by using the resiprocal of the Palmetto. I've never read or heard of anything that says one cross is better than the other, but I have to think that the Sunshine is the better of the two, otherwise they would have just kept on with the Palmetto cross. If someone knows, I would be interested in hearing it.
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Re: Difference between Palmetto and Sunshine Bass
[Re: "Da" NITRO]
#3819127
08/14/09 10:22 PM
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,336
BigDad
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,336 |
I beleive the Palmeto gets bigger than the Sunshine. Not sure if that makes it better though.
Joe
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Re: Difference between Palmetto and Sunshine Bass
[Re: BigDad]
#3820665
08/15/09 06:36 AM
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Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 44
TawakoniSpecial
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OP
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Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 44 |
Thanks for the info, guys! Short of asking a staff biologist at TPWD, TFF is one of the best resources I can think of.
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Re: Difference between Palmetto and Sunshine Bass
[Re: TawakoniSpecial]
#11729733
07/19/16 03:02 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,175
hook-line&sinker
TFF Guru
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Posts: 10,175 |
>)));> Wishin' I was Fishin' <;(((<
“Personnel is the most vital and important aspect of any industry. If you’re just going to grind them up, it’s not going to end well for anybody.” SCOTT REINARDY
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Re: Difference between Palmetto and Sunshine Bass
[Re: TawakoniSpecial]
#11729778
07/19/16 03:38 AM
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Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,889
Tx Tree Grower
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,889 |
I was told that TP&W purchased the sunshine bass from an independent hatchery to make up for a shortage from the state hatchery. Seems like most of the major lakes have all received a few. Some more than others.
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Re: Difference between Palmetto and Sunshine Bass
[Re: TawakoniSpecial]
#11729839
07/19/16 05:00 AM
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Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 179
texashelms
Outdoorsman
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Outdoorsman
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 179 |
Name come from which eggs and sperm they cross.
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Re: Difference between Palmetto and Sunshine Bass
[Re: TawakoniSpecial]
#11729861
07/19/16 08:25 AM
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 263
CypertJ
Angler
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Angler
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 263 |
Pretty interesting article. Thanks for sharing.
You can kill a fly with a sledgehammer, But do you really need to son???
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Re: Difference between Palmetto and Sunshine Bass
[Re: TawakoniSpecial]
#11730339
07/19/16 03:41 PM
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 253
big D
Angler
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Angler
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 253 |
One of our home lakes was stocked with both types a few years ago and I can tell a big difference... See cooler of what I believe to be palmetto hybrids with a sunshine hybrid on top. The sunshine color pattern is more of a greenish blue like a striper with more distinct stripes. The palmetto hybrid color pattern is similar to a white bass and has less distinct stripes and more broken. What are your thoughts?
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Re: Difference between Palmetto and Sunshine Bass
[Re: hook-line&sinker]
#11732244
07/20/16 01:20 PM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,385
Fishbreeder
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,385 |
Great article. Two of my good friends and cohorts did a lot to make these two combinations of hybrid-striped bass available for Texans. Both are gone now, but their legacy remains in our rivers, lakes, reservoirs, public hatcheries, private fisheries, on dinner plates and fishing lines around the world. The Palmetto Bass is the "Original" cross of female striped bass with male white bass. Others crosses have been tried including with yellow bass. This fish and technique was brought here by TPWD biologist, Ed Bonn, whom I worked with when I was a lot younger in E. Texas. I learned then that the "original" cross is the superior one in most respects. This is still the most sought after of the two crosses by public fishery managers. TPWD Hatchery manager, biologist Rob Schmid, quoted in the above article. closer to my age and a long time friend did a lot to make the AE Wood Hatchery the best it could be in difficult times. He died on the job there, one of the good guys and sorely missed by all. Along with a lot of others, those two guys did as much as anybody for this fish in Texas. More common in the marketplace is the "reciprocal" cross or "sunshine" bass. Female white bass crossed with male striped bass. This is what you see stocked in most private waters and being raised on farms as a food fish. While this is the lesser of the two crosses for many reasons, it is the more common because of the better availability of ripe white bass females for breeding. Capturing mature, ripe, female striped bass is very difficult and most of the good "spots" are closed to fishing (except of course to the state). So almost all originals are from public hatcheries with the support of an entire network of biologists and technicians to help acquire breeding stock from public waters. When it comes to raising the things, right from the getgo the originals are a lot easier. The eggs are bigger, the fry are bigger and they are a lot stronger and able to thrive in the typical hatchery scenario. Still the reciprocals are so much easier to get breeding stock, that is the one raised on almost all commercial farms. The eggs are tiny, the fry can only eat the tiniest of specialized, live grown plankton diets and conditions must be perfect to get them to live and grow to a fingerling. From that point, a fingerling, both are pretty easy to grow and raise. They readily feed on pellets and grow fast to stocker size. You may find the reciprocals in private lakes and ponds, on your plate at the local Chinese eatery, and in some public waters. But you will only find the originals in public fisheries open to the public for fishing. As to telling the apart once grown, I think there may be a difference in their tongues.
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Re: Difference between Palmetto and Sunshine Bass
[Re: Fishbreeder]
#11732848
07/20/16 06:20 PM
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Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 7,413
BrandoA
TFF Celebrity
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TFF Celebrity
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 7,413 |
Great article. Two of my good friends and cohorts did a lot to make these two combinations of hybrid-striped bass available for Texans. Both are gone now, but their legacy remains in our rivers, lakes, reservoirs, public hatcheries, private fisheries, on dinner plates and fishing lines around the world. The Palmetto Bass is the "Original" cross of female striped bass with male white bass. Others crosses have been tried including with yellow bass. This fish and technique was brought here by TPWD biologist, Ed Bonn, whom I worked with when I was a lot younger in E. Texas. I learned then that the "original" cross is the superior one in most respects. This is still the most sought after of the two crosses by public fishery managers. TPWD Hatchery manager, biologist Rob Schmid, quoted in the above article. closer to my age and a long time friend did a lot to make the AE Wood Hatchery the best it could be in difficult times. He died on the job there, one of the good guys and sorely missed by all. Along with a lot of others, those two guys did as much as anybody for this fish in Texas. More common in the marketplace is the "reciprocal" cross or "sunshine" bass. Female white bass crossed with male striped bass. This is what you see stocked in most private waters and being raised on farms as a food fish. While this is the lesser of the two crosses for many reasons, it is the more common because of the better availability of ripe white bass females for breeding. Capturing mature, ripe, female striped bass is very difficult and most of the good "spots" are closed to fishing (except of course to the state). So almost all originals are from public hatcheries with the support of an entire network of biologists and technicians to help acquire breeding stock from public waters. When it comes to raising the things, right from the getgo the originals are a lot easier. The eggs are bigger, the fry are bigger and they are a lot stronger and able to thrive in the typical hatchery scenario. Still the reciprocals are so much easier to get breeding stock, that is the one raised on almost all commercial farms. The eggs are tiny, the fry can only eat the tiniest of specialized, live grown plankton diets and conditions must be perfect to get them to live and grow to a fingerling. From that point, a fingerling, both are pretty easy to grow and raise. They readily feed on pellets and grow fast to stocker size. You may find the reciprocals in private lakes and ponds, on your plate at the local Chinese eatery, and in some public waters. But you will only find the originals in public fisheries open to the public for fishing. As to telling the apart once grown, I think there may be a difference in their tongues. Thank You sir.
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Re: Difference between Palmetto and Sunshine Bass
[Re: big D]
#11733067
07/20/16 09:00 PM
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Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 5,441
don the angler
TFF Celebrity
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TFF Celebrity
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 5,441 |
One of our home lakes was stocked with both types a few years ago and I can tell a big difference... See cooler of what I believe to be palmetto hybrids with a sunshine hybrid on top. The sunshine color pattern is more of a greenish blue like a striper with more distinct stripes. The palmetto hybrid color pattern is similar to a white bass and has less distinct stripes and more broken. What are your thoughts? Talk about an old topic. Anyone notice this conversation started in 2009? My boat landed an exact replica of the fish on top in the photo today. It had two tooth patches & was about 15 inches, so we released it. They show up at times, but the normal hybrids are more common on LL.
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Re: Difference between Palmetto and Sunshine Bass
[Re: TawakoniSpecial]
#11734056
07/21/16 01:17 PM
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Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 56
yakkityyak
Outdoorsman
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Outdoorsman
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 56 |
I thought one was stuffed with peppers. learn something new every day
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Re: Difference between Palmetto and Sunshine Bass
[Re: TawakoniSpecial]
#11736123
07/22/16 01:53 PM
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Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 1
ictalurus29
Green Horn
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Green Horn
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 1 |
You can't visually tell the difference between a Palmetto and a Sunshine. Differences in growth between the hybrid types is poorly understood.
Last edited by ictalurus29; 07/22/16 01:54 PM.
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