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Dec 30th, 2023
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 Lithium questions
#15096554
06/09/24 03:30 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,176
Blue Blazer 2400
OP
Extreme Angler
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OP
Extreme Angler
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,176 |
I have read a lot about lithium and everyone seems to really like them. I have 1 of my 12v lead acids going bad and considering moving over to lithium.
Weight and space is not an issue for my boat. The weight of lithium would be nice when having to install them though vs the lead acid.
Right now I have 3 group 27 deep cycle Interstate batteries for my 36v trolling motor.
My Minnkota MK330D battery charger is not rated to charge lithium so I would have to change that also. What brand charger is everybody using on their lithiums?
It seems like everyone likes the Ionic Batteries but what’s everyone’s opinions?
Also do I need to change out the battery trays from my current group 27 size or just put the lithiums in the same trays and strap them down tight?
I really don’t want to spend a ton of money to upgrade everything but I am tired of buying new leaf acids every 3-4 years. And the ionic have an 11 years warranty
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Re: Lithium questions
[Re: Blue Blazer 2400]
#15096602
06/09/24 04:21 PM
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 16,900
grout-scout
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 16,900 |
The MK PCL has been good for guys and it’ll let you charge any of the three battery types at the same time. You could also go with the MK PC and use the AGM setting for the lithium, but I’d say go with the newer technology if you have the money.
As far as the TM batteries go, any of the lithiums are fine, even the cheap ones. I’d say go with 100ah and they are pretty close to your battery size now, you could trim some of the packaging foam to fit the bottom tray if they are too loose for you. Epoch batteries are really reasonable for their added features. If you want Ionic, I wouldn’t try to talk you out of them though. If you want more budget friendly, LiTime are good.
Installing them sure is a lot nicer than SLA batteries.
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Re: Lithium questions
[Re: Blue Blazer 2400]
#15096609
06/09/24 04:37 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,176
Blue Blazer 2400
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Extreme Angler
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OP
Extreme Angler
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,176 |
Thank you sir. I was looking at the 50 amp because of the price and from what people say they have at least the same amount of power as a 27 flooded battery? The 100 amp would be great but I’m not sure if I want to spend the extra money.
I’m not sold on lithium yet because by the time I buy everything needed even if I get the full 11 years out of the lithium batteries I would be at a break even point vs staying with lead acid.
I really like the idea of lithium but if I get 3-4 years out of lead acids it’s a hard pull to swallow for the price.
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Re: Lithium questions
[Re: Blue Blazer 2400]
#15096612
06/09/24 04:53 PM
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Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 13,263
tmd11111
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 13,263 |
If you're looking at lithium's solely from a financial standpoint over lead acids then their probably not for you. The advantages of lithium are no need to check water levels every few weeks, worrying about charging them right after use, longer run time, less space needed and less weight in the boat.
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Re: Lithium questions
[Re: Blue Blazer 2400]
#15096629
06/09/24 05:19 PM
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 167
MCIPinkie
Outdoorsman
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Outdoorsman
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 167 |
Even though I run an a 4 - Ionic lithium system in my Skeeter, I don't see them as a good financial decision. Buying lead acids every 3 - 4 years is more cost effective. I bought mine because I wanted the best and could afford it. Note also that the lithium warranties (most of them) offer declining coverage. You don't get new batteries after 10 years if yours quit.
Right now, lithium is the top of the line system, but like everything, top of the line just costs more. All the advantages you read about are real, but expensive. In the end, it's just 12, 24, or 36 VDC power. Lead acids work. Trolling motor runs, OB starts, electronics work. If you take care of them, and weight is not an issue, you can fish just fine with lead acids.
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Re: Lithium questions
[Re: Blue Blazer 2400]
#15096660
06/09/24 06:21 PM
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 16,900
grout-scout
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 16,900 |
3 - 50’s might be fine for you on a 36v system and you can definitely do it for a lot cheaper than Ionics cost. I just prefer to not have to charge for several trips. Another advantage to lithium, ZERO acid and corrosion to ever deal with. Financial advantage? I’d saw it’s a wash, not like lead acids are getting any cheaper, they’ll keep going up in price. Not much more than the everstarts. https://www.litime.com/products/litime-12v-50ah-lifepo4-lithium-ion-batteryEdit: I’m going back to my original answer, no go on the 50’s. I’ve been reading about a few guys being over the amp draw with their TM’s and the BMS shutting down.
Last edited by grout-scout; 06/09/24 06:26 PM.
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Re: Lithium questions
[Re: Blue Blazer 2400]
#15096931
06/10/24 12:12 AM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,176
Blue Blazer 2400
OP
Extreme Angler
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OP
Extreme Angler
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,176 |
Grout what brand are you running? The LiTime are a lot more budget friendly but I dont’t know any first hand knowledge of people running them in boats for any length of time.
I have watched several YouTube videos of some guy who dissects a bunch of different brand lithiums and then gives his input of what he thinks about them. He said good things about several brands and I believe LiTime was one of them, but I will have to go back and look
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Re: Lithium questions
[Re: Blue Blazer 2400]
#15096970
06/10/24 12:54 AM
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 16,900
grout-scout
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 16,900 |
I’m running these for my TM because at the time they were the cheapest that had Bluetooth for an app. I paid something like $400 ea, two years ago. I want an app to see what my batteries are at, never had it with lead acids; but it’s nice to have. I think this brand only came with a 5 year warranty, but they claim it’s supposed to be a certain number of cycles in their lifespan. https://powerurus.com/products/powerurus-12v-100ah-lifepo4-deep-cycle-rechargeable-batteryI’m using an ionic 125 for my cranking battery and graphs. You’re probably talking about Will Prowse on YT, he has some pretty good videos. The price on lithiums will continue to drop, if you’re not ready to buy them now, wait until you need them next time. I’ve read something about some kind of salt battery replacing lithium in the future. If I was buying right now, I’d think hard about the Epoch brand. I believe the ones above are actually made by them, they share several links and features.
Last edited by grout-scout; 06/10/24 01:06 AM.
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Re: Lithium questions
[Re: Blue Blazer 2400]
#15097103
06/10/24 09:39 AM
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 15,132
Bandit 200 XP
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 15,132 |
I bought a Sefepoder on Amazon 12v 50ah for $150.00 , so far it works fine , ever thing else is Ionic , even the charger
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Re: Lithium questions
[Re: Blue Blazer 2400]
#15097193
06/10/24 12:54 PM
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Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 24,918
SteezMacQueen
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 24,918 |
50Ah Ionics will be fine. I run two of them on my 80lb Ultrex. I ran it on 9 and 10 for 6 hours yesterday. It never shuts down the BMS and after 6 hours of fishing, they were at 81%. The 24 volt trolling motors are harder on the two Ionics than the 36v are on three. The amp draw on the 24 system is higher.
Eat. Sleep. Fish.
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Re: Lithium questions
[Re: SteezMacQueen]
#15097349
06/10/24 04:19 PM
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Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 13,263
tmd11111
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 13,263 |
50Ah Ionics will be fine. I run two of them on my 80lb Ultrex. I ran it on 9 and 10 for 6 hours yesterday. It never shuts down the BMS and after 6 hours of fishing, they were at 81%. The 24 volt trolling motors are harder on the two Ionics than the 36v are on three. The amp draw on the 24 system is higher.
Same here. Been running a 36v with 3 50’s for almost 3 years now without any problems. Was originally with an Ultrex and now a Quest. The few problems I have read with the 50’s seem to lean more towards wiring problems and inadequate circuit breakers.
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Re: Lithium questions
[Re: tmd11111]
#15097384
06/10/24 04:55 PM
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 16,900
grout-scout
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 16,900 |
50Ah Ionics will be fine. I run two of them on my 80lb Ultrex. I ran it on 9 and 10 for 6 hours yesterday. It never shuts down the BMS and after 6 hours of fishing, they were at 81%. The 24 volt trolling motors are harder on the two Ionics than the 36v are on three. The amp draw on the 24 system is higher.
Same here. Been running a 36v with 3 50’s for almost 3 years now without any problems. Was originally with an Ultrex and now a Quest. The few problems I have read with the 50’s seem to lean more towards wiring problems and inadequate circuit breakers. That is a possibility, I’m sure you read the same threads on BBC as I have. (About the BMS shutting down)
Last edited by grout-scout; 06/10/24 04:55 PM.
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Re: Lithium questions
[Re: grout-scout]
#15097538
06/10/24 07:33 PM
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Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 13,263
tmd11111
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 13,263 |
50Ah Ionics will be fine. I run two of them on my 80lb Ultrex. I ran it on 9 and 10 for 6 hours yesterday. It never shuts down the BMS and after 6 hours of fishing, they were at 81%. The 24 volt trolling motors are harder on the two Ionics than the 36v are on three. The amp draw on the 24 system is higher.
Same here. Been running a 36v with 3 50’s for almost 3 years now without any problems. Was originally with an Ultrex and now a Quest. The few problems I have read with the 50’s seem to lean more towards wiring problems and inadequate circuit breakers. That is a possibility, I’m sure you read the same threads on BBC as I have. (About the BMS shutting down) Yup, and another possibility is I think some people like to run their tm on max power just a little too long
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Re: Lithium questions
[Re: Blue Blazer 2400]
#15097652
06/10/24 10:01 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,176
Blue Blazer 2400
OP
Extreme Angler
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OP
Extreme Angler
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,176 |
I very seldom run my motor on 9-10 and when I do it’s usually on about 30 seconds. Most of the time it is on spot lock.
Probably the hardest is runs is when I go to the coast and spot lock at the jetties in current for 4-5 hours sometimes. My lead acids have still been plenty strong even after a jetties trip.
As said before the weight and space are not a big deal to me but they are under my console so they are a pain to take out to check fluid levels every month in the summers and lead acids only last about 3 years.
Lithiums are just a hard pill to swallow because of the price and I would need a new charger also. But lithiums are maintenance free
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Re: Lithium questions
[Re: Blue Blazer 2400]
#15097696
06/10/24 11:02 PM
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Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 13,263
tmd11111
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 13,263 |
I very seldom run my motor on 9-10 and when I do it’s usually on about 30 seconds. Most of the time it is on spot lock.
Probably the hardest is runs is when I go to the coast and spot lock at the jetties in current for 4-5 hours sometimes. My lead acids have still been plenty strong even after a jetties trip.
As said before the weight and space are not a big deal to me but they are under my console so they are a pain to take out to check fluid levels every month in the summers and lead acids only last about 3 years.
Lithiums are just a hard pill to swallow because of the price and I would need a new charger also. But lithiums are maintenance free If you ever pull the trigger you’ll wonder why you waited so long after using them a few times. Have to say, after almost 3 years they still blow my mind
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Re: Lithium questions
[Re: Blue Blazer 2400]
#15099623
06/12/24 05:31 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,176
Blue Blazer 2400
OP
Extreme Angler
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OP
Extreme Angler
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,176 |
1 more question about lithium. Lets say 1 of my lithium fails can I substitute a lead acid in its place on a 36v systems? Only reason I ask is because not many store fronts handle lithium and if I am on a trip somewhere and the lithium fails I don't want to be stuck not being able to use my boat.
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Re: Lithium questions
[Re: Blue Blazer 2400]
#15099714
06/12/24 06:48 PM
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,861
big10
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,861 |
If one of your 12v lithium's goes down, you can substitute it with a lead acid battery. Its not the ideal situation but it will get you by.
Jerry Dillard
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Re: Lithium questions
[Re: big10]
#15100706
06/13/24 02:31 PM
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 15,132
Bandit 200 XP
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 15,132 |
If one of your 12v lithium's goes down, you can substitute it with a lead acid battery. Its not the ideal situation but it will get you by. I would think about that , could kill your other lithium in the long run , what do i know
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Re: Lithium questions
[Re: Blue Blazer 2400]
#15140389
07/24/24 09:35 PM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 15,331
bloo_rainger
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 15,331 |
I have read a lot about lithium and everyone seems to really like them. I have 1 of my 12v lead acids going bad and considering moving over to lithium.
Weight and space is not an issue for my boat. The weight of lithium would be nice when having to install them though vs the lead acid.
Right now I have 3 group 27 deep cycle Interstate batteries for my 36v trolling motor.
My Minnkota MK330D battery charger is not rated to charge lithium so I would have to change that also. What brand charger is everybody using on their lithiums?
It seems like everyone likes the Ionic Batteries but what’s everyone’s opinions?
Also do I need to change out the battery trays from my current group 27 size or just put the lithiums in the same trays and strap them down tight?
I really don’t want to spend a ton of money to upgrade everything but I am tired of buying new leaf acids every 3-4 years. And the ionic have an 11 years warranty Curious if you ever pulled the trigger on the batteries? I’m in the exact same boat as to the batteries. Would love to hear your results. Thanks.
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Re: Lithium questions
[Re: Blue Blazer 2400]
#15140436
07/24/24 10:15 PM
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,923
bronco71
TFF Team Angler
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TFF Team Angler
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,923 |
I use a Noco on board charger...works great.
check out goodman_fishing on here, he does you tube lithium battery comparisons....
1987 Nitro MX185/Mercury Black Max 150 (needs lots of work, put motor on nephew's boat)
1994 XSC-2200 "Jaguar" AKA Shadow 22 Magnum (restoring w/Mercury 200 XRI)
1994 Pantera II (restoring w/Mercury 200 EFI)
1999 Triton TX21/225 Mercury Optimax
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