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Re: TFF Lawn Care Thread
[Re: Derek 🐝]
#13835118
01/07/21 01:10 AM
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 68,439
Derek 🐝
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Queen of Bees
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Great to hear! That's Henbit in your pic. Any 24D product will kill it. Pick up a bottle and spot spray it. Both Prodimine and Isoxaben are labeled for Henbit. Don't be scared to get a rotary spreader and fling either into your flower beds. Obviously if you're throwing out wildflower seeds in there you wouldn't want to use either. But if it's a well established bed of shrubs and perennials you're good to go. I'd go back over the granular flower bed app with a blower to blow off any that are sitting on the shrub leaves and then water in. You'll be golden.
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Re: TFF Lawn Care Thread
[Re: Derek 🐝]
#13835802
01/07/21 03:08 PM
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Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 9,460
Oldrabbit
TFF Celebrity
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I have several different herbicides and will probably use the one that has 2,4-D, dicamba, and mecoprop in it as I am trying to kill the Burweed and it should take care of the Henbit too. I also have a rotary spreader but use the drop spreader to get close to the edges without putting to much on the concrete, I guess I just need to get the blower out. I am really thinking of going to a liquid as I have a 60 gallon 3-point hitch sprayer and tractor and we keep about 3 acres mowed like a lawn. What would you recommend for Centipede grass? Thanks.
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Re: TFF Lawn Care Thread
[Re: Derek 🐝]
#13835984
01/07/21 05:00 PM
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 68,439
Derek 🐝
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Queen of Bees
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Man you don't hear Centipede grass in TX very often. I don't know a lot about it except that it requires a really low soil Ph and low fertilizer needs. When in doubt I defer to NC State and Clemson. https://content.ces.ncsu.edu/centipedegrass-lawn-maintenance-calendarhttps://hgic.clemson.edu/factsheet/lawn-burweed/I'm a 99% spray guy. I typically talk granular products here since nobody sprays. Cost per 1000 or Acre is so much cheaper to spray. But you must read your label and do your math correctly or you can screw stuff up in a hurry. You also must consider wind drift. Does your product require a surfactant? On an on. Just to use Prodiamine as an example. Barricade granular would cost me about $45.00 to apply a 6 month app rate. Spraying Prodiamine 6 month app rate cost me $2.00 - You want to make sure you're using the correct tips. I like TeeJet. Make sure your sprayer is calibrated and you're using enough carrier(water) for the product you're spraying. I shoot for 1gal of water per 1000sq feet. With my teejet tip and walking speed I am just a tad under 1 gallon per 1000. I probably sprayed 50 gallons of just water through it just testing my tips, walk speed, height I held my wand off the ground before I ever mixed any chemicals. I pretty much had it down pat and now feel very comfortable spraying anything and having an accurate application.
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Re: TFF Lawn Care Thread
[Re: Derek 🐝]
#13836483
01/07/21 08:52 PM
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Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 9,460
Oldrabbit
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Thanks Derek, I will do some more reading and research on it, I have just about enough granular product to do one more treatment. I have about 2 acres of Centipede (didn't treat all of it) and it is still spreading, I am east of Longview TX and have on average 14" of sandy soil. I spray MSM Turf to kill the Bahia Grass in the yard and pasture and use GPS for speed and have a calibration and mixing procedure I use. I am using 10 gallons of water per acre with 0.3 ounce of (dry) chemical along with surfactant. I have been spraying since the 80's and for some reason I let my private applicators card expire. Need to attend another class as I am sure there have been lots of changes since I got it.
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Re: TFF Lawn Care Thread
[Re: Derek 🐝]
#13836980
01/08/21 02:05 AM
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 68,439
Derek 🐝
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Queen of Bees
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I want to stress that my post below is to be read and no products are recommended to be used on your residential lawn unless you 100% know what you're doing. And if you think you know what you're doing use extreme caution.
That's awesome Oldrabbit. Nowadays you don't need private applicators card for the most part. You can damn near buy anything online that you want. Which is unfortunate. Specially for guys like TurfDawg who applies to the law. I can buy MSMA on line all day long and blanket spray my yard if I wanted. He's a pro and knows his stuff and that is a tool that he can't put in his tool box for residential apps. He could be heavily fined and/or lose his license. But I can do whatever the hell I want. Doesn't make a lot of sense.
You mentioned MSM Turf. I have it. It's very powerful. I use it to spot spray. At 0.3grams per 1000 you are literally dropping a few pellets on a scale until you get there. Granted your soil Ph is low. But applying MSM in N. TX in high Ph soils can be a disaster. You're not going to smoke your turf, but a little over spray and you can wipe out a row of shrubs and high Ph soil retention will smoke oak trees easily. Or could happen. I sometimes lower the Ph of my water prior to adding any chemicals to it. Well I typically add one iron product then add my other chems. I'm going to do some citric acid to water ph test this weekend to let me know when I want to spray XYZ product on it's own.
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Re: TFF Lawn Care Thread
[Re: Derek 🐝]
#13839225
01/09/21 04:19 PM
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Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 9,460
Oldrabbit
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Derek, thanks for the information on the PH, we have a water softener that helps lower it some. I will do some reading on the effects of PH on the chemical I plan on spraying. When I spot treat I measure it on my reloading powder scale, (it is just a few grains) before it goes into a dedicated mixing container, it is then added to a 1 gallon dedicated pump up sprayer, mixed with water then the surfactant. Many years ago I killed a water oak by spraying under the drip line of the tree, it was already in decline but I sure did finish it off. I cover my shrubs with plastic when I spray around them and play the wind when I spray. I try to have the wind between 3 to 7 MPH when I spray as that is what I was taught is the best to minimize wind drift. What iron product do you use and what do you use to test your PH. Thanks OR.
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Re: TFF Lawn Care Thread
[Re: Derek 🐝]
#13841746
01/11/21 03:53 PM
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 68,439
Derek 🐝
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I used iron in my spray mix to lower my Ph. It's all I had on hand since it has Sulphur in it. I mostly use the iron to foliar spray on my lawn since my soil Ph is so high that iron is bound up in the soil but up taken by the leaves. Doubt you would need it in ETX. Like you I typically use a dedicated 1 gallon pump up and spot spray. I added just a touch of iron and it dropped from a 7 to a 5.8 - So went with that. I did citric acid test this weekend. Did a 1/2 teaspoon to a gallon of water and it dropped the Ph to 3.8 - This year I'll be spraying ammonium sulfate as my nitrogen source for my fertilizer. For my herbicides adding 2-2.5oz to one gallon of water should get me to high 5's to low 6. I still need to test that. I use a digital Ph meter I got on amazon for $12.00 - Works good. The only herbicide I blanket sprayed so far is for Sedges. Other than that my pre-emergent does a really good job and I only need to spot spray.
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Re: TFF Lawn Care Thread
[Re: Derek 🐝]
#13845085
01/13/21 08:55 PM
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 68,439
Derek 🐝
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Queen of Bees
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Prodiamine trade names. Barricade and Sta-Green Crab Ex. On the Sta Green you want the brown label. The one without fertilizer. https://www.solutionsstores.com/bar...ZDOVhNgtcZUA1qXnhaBoCewgQAvD_BwE#156=928https://www.lowes.com/pd/Sta-Green-...gV5Yw6YhtRoC6e4QAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.dsI like Prodiamine for grassy weed control. Now you're going to see a big price difference between the Barricade and the Sta Green. They are basically the same product. The difference is Barricade has a higher percentage of active ingredient than the Sta-Green. Barricade is 0.58% and the Sta Green is 0.37% - So you will need to use more of the Sta Green per 1000 sq feet to get the same protection. At the end of the day the Sta Green might end up being a little cheaper per 1000sq feet. I'm not going to do the math. I made a mistake I need to correct. Sta Green brown bag is Dithiopyr, not Prodiamine. It's the Sta Green blue bag that is Prodiamine. I wouldn't use the Sta Green blue bag for the February app because it has Fertilizer mixed in it and no use applying fertilizer in February. It would be fine to use for your late August app. Stick with Barricade from Solutions Store or the one from Do My Own. https://www.domyown.com/048-barricade-on-dg-pro-sgn150-50-lb-p-21470.html
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Re: TFF Lawn Care Thread
[Re: Derek 🐝]
#13888393
02/15/21 02:03 PM
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 68,439
Derek 🐝
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Queen of Bees
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Been talking to some Pros lately. They recommend NTX and probably the swath of 35 south get your soil test using the Ammonium Acetate/Olson/ extraction method instead of just the M3, because of our high Ph. Sending mine back to WayPoint. Hi Derek,
Can you elaborate on what the differences are, and benefits of, in getting the $53 soil test ( Standard + Ammonium Acetate) done by Logan Labs in comparison to the $19 soil test (Routine + Micronutrients) by A&M?Hey MAK. I edited my post to take out the Logan link. I wasn't paying attention that it was an extra $28.00 That's not needed. But to touch base on the differences I will use Waypoint. Their SW1 or SW3 uses 3 different extraction methods when doing their test depending on which nutrient they are testing for. They use AA and Olsen and M3. It's a very good combo test that will give you a more accurate reading if your soil is over a 7Ph. A&M only uses the M3 extraction which is fine if you're out in ETX and the below 7ph's they typically have. I looked at my Waypoint and A&M test from 2019 and their are some big differences in the two different test results. Waypoint will also test your organic matter at no extra charge. The SW1 is like $27.00 total.
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Re: TFF Lawn Care Thread
[Re: Derek 🐝]
#13889715
02/16/21 04:48 PM
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 1,027
MAK747
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
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Been talking to some Pros lately. They recommend NTX and probably the swath of 35 south get your soil test using the Ammonium Acetate/Olson/ extraction method instead of just the M3, because of our high Ph. Sending mine back to WayPoint. Hi Derek,
Can you elaborate on what the differences are, and benefits of, in getting the $53 soil test ( Standard + Ammonium Acetate) done by Logan Labs in comparison to the $19 soil test (Routine + Micronutrients) by A&M?Hey MAK. I edited my post to take out the Logan link. I wasn't paying attention that it was an extra $28.00 That's not needed. But to touch base on the differences I will use Waypoint. Their SW1 or SW3 uses 3 different extraction methods when doing their test depending on which nutrient they are testing for. They use AA and Olsen and M3. It's a very good combo test that will give you a more accurate reading if your soil is over a 7Ph. A&M only uses the M3 extraction which is fine if you're out in ETX and the below 7ph's they typically have. I looked at my Waypoint and A&M test from 2019 and their are some big differences in the two different test results. Waypoint will also test your organic matter at no extra charge. The SW1 is like $27.00 total. Thanks Derek, I think I'll stick with the A&M analysis this first go-around. Where do you obtain a price list for the different Waypoint soil analysis options, call? Also do you know of a reason they list the analysis as being specific to particular states, is this just where they have local offices, or is there some other reason?
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Re: TFF Lawn Care Thread
[Re: Derek 🐝]
#13889833
02/16/21 06:17 PM
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 68,439
Derek 🐝
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Posts: 68,439 |
I would call. Greenen just got his done so he can let us know what it cost. I paid $26.50 in 2019. The other states are geared towards Ag. Memphis is their main turf lab. A few things I like about Waypoint. Very quick turn around. 24-48 hours after receiving samples. They have an app(not the easiest to navigate) that you can upload your results to and keep a good record of future samples. They also list the person who does your test. You can call and go over your test with them if you want.
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Re: TFF Lawn Care Thread
[Re: Derek 🐝]
#13889847
02/16/21 06:37 PM
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Joined: May 2008
Posts: 1,803
greenen
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
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Yep. I would definitely call them and talk to them and then download the form you want to mail your samples in. Waypoint was quick. Mailed the samples to their Tenn. office and had results in 7 days and 5 of those were due to the USPS. About $17 just for the nutrients test. Did not pay for the pest/disease tests.
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Re: TFF Lawn Care Thread
[Re: Derek 🐝]
#13910206
03/04/21 03:54 AM
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 68,439
Derek 🐝
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Queen of Bees
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This boys and girls is why you get a soil test. Just got mine back. Not knocking Neil Sperry and the likes by an means, he's great and love him. But this is why you don't run just a nitrogen only fert program like he typically suggest(our soils have plenty of Phos and Potass, as they say. They don't. You have to get your N/P/K in order. My Ph is through the roof. 2 apps of elemental Sulphur at 5lbs per 1000sq feet will be in order. Even though it won't move the needle that much if any. Anyway. A granular 1-1-1 is my best route this year. I'm going with American Plant Food Corp triple 13 at 2lbs per 1000 every 2 weeks. It's go time. Get your chit in order.
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Re: TFF Lawn Care Thread
[Re: Derek 🐝]
#13916257
03/09/21 03:20 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,632
30ft jon boat
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,632 |
why do you have phos 2 times
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Re: TFF Lawn Care Thread
[Re: Derek 🐝]
#13916463
03/09/21 05:00 PM
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 68,439
Derek 🐝
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Queen of Bees
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Two extraction(test) methods. The top one is done using Olsen. Then they run P, B, S, Fe, Mn, Cu, Zn using M3. M3 is known for overstating P amounts in high Ph soils. So the Olsen is a better reading. Either way Olsen or M3 I am low and it needs to be addressed. Basing off MLSN (Minimum Levels for Sustainable Nutrition) numbers I need to be at a minimum of 21ppm. https://www.paceturf.org/PTRI/Documents/1202_ref.pdf
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