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Re: Waypoints - Graph Set up? [Re: Minner Bucket] #13382890 12/25/19 11:25 PM
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JBranham Offline
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In this video Paul covers dual point one antennas but also discusses how to do the local selection so your weigh point marking is coming from the correct unit location.

https://youtu.be/xhEVgb4ziJw

Last edited by JBranham; 12/25/19 11:28 PM.
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Re: Waypoints - Graph Set up? [Re: Minner Bucket] #13382939 12/26/19 12:49 AM
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RandyD Offline
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my point 1 is mounted at back of the boat, above the transducer... I use this for my Lowrance at the console..


Require a whole lot of luck...


Re: Waypoints - Graph Set up? [Re: Minner Bucket] #13383013 12/26/19 03:05 AM
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No purpose in having dual point1โ€™s and most people will end up screwing up the settings, which will end up in neither working properly. The point of a point1 is for its heading sensor ability and being able to set it over your transom transducer, itโ€™s useless having one at the trolling motor since your graphs internal antenna is already over the transducer.

Re: Waypoints - Graph Set up? [Re: grout-scout] #13383029 12/26/19 03:33 AM
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Grout-scout,

I agree, I only run one as well but I believe, and maybe I posted the wrong video, he goes over the local settings of the console and bow units to be able to mark weigh points individually and accurately per each unit. Meaning that when I see something on my bow unit and mark it, itโ€™s marking from my bow and not from the point-one from a global setting.

Sorry, Iโ€™m not trying to confuse.

Re: Waypoints - Graph Set up? [Re: JBranham] #13383040 12/26/19 03:56 AM
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Originally Posted by JBranham
Grout-scout,

I agree, I only run one as well but I believe, and maybe I posted the wrong video, he goes over the local settings of the console and bow units to be able to mark weigh points individually and accurately per each unit. Meaning that when I see something on my bow unit and mark it, itโ€™s marking from my bow and not from the point-one from a global setting.

Sorry, Iโ€™m not trying to confuse.



Nah youโ€™re good, I didnโ€™t watch the video, Iโ€™m just trying to help steer someone away from dual point1โ€™s. It sounds like a great idea in theory, but in reality there is nothing to gain. (Just hoping for point that out to anyone considering it). cheers

Re: Waypoints - Graph Set up? [Re: Minner Bucket] #13383256 12/26/19 03:13 PM
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RandyD Offline
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In the video you're referring to JB: Paul talks about no value of having dual Point 1's; also describes how to configure the console unit and bow unit separately... It's a long video but very informative...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oh1YJUQeOxQ


Require a whole lot of luck...


Re: Waypoints - Graph Set up? [Re: RandyD] #13384490 12/27/19 10:18 PM
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Mike2718 Offline
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Hopefully I can clarify what is happening when the transducer is in a different location from the GPS antenna. I have included a couple of photos that should help. They were drawn in CAD so they are to scale. Example info: Boat = 20โ€™ long and 90โ€ width, Distance from rear transducer to console GPS antenna =5โ€™ so distance from console antenna to bow is 15โ€™.
Green Circle with dot = 3โ€™ Diameter bush
Blue Dot = GPS spot marked when seeing the bush on the graph
Red Dots = Bow and console GPS Antennas
Orange Dot = Console Transducer
Distance from Bush to Marked Waypoint = 5โ€™
Assuming Console graph uses GPS antenna next to it & Bow graph uses antenna at the bow.
For sake of simplicity: Assuming no GPS position error
The dimensions used are just to illustrate what is happening when marking spots. In the 1st โ€œConsoleโ€ photo, the 1st boat, while traveling NORTH, as you go over the bush you see it on your (Console) graph and mark it, the marked GPS waypoint is actually 5โ€™ North of the actual bush. 2nd Boat shows approaching the same waypoint/bush traveling SOUTH. 3rd Boat shows approaching the same waypoint/bush traveling EAST. 4th Boat shows approaching the same waypoint/bush traveling WEST. As you can see, the waypoint is ALWAYS 5โ€™ from the actual bush no matter which way you approach the waypoint, HOWEVER, the location of the bush in relation to the boat changes depending on the direction of travel. REMEMBER: The actual bush is always SOUTH of the waypoint if you were traveling North when creating the waypoint. The location in relation to the waypoint will change if you were traveling in a different direction when you marked the spot. These examples are assuming the console antenna is mounted on the edge of the boat and the bow antenna is mounted at the tip of the boat. I had to offset the Blue and Red dots just a little so you could see the two.
The 2nd โ€œBowโ€ photo shows the relation of the waypoint and bush if you are approaching it using the BOW antenna. The boats again show traveling, North, South, East then West. Again the waypoint is always 5โ€™ from the actual bush. Only the location in relation to boat changes.
IF you marked a waypoint with the BOW unit, the waypoint and bush will be in the same spot. If you approach it using the bow unit, there will be no offset. If you approach it using the console unit, there will be a 15โ€™ difference since that is the distance from the console antenna and the bow. When your unit shows 15โ€™ from the waypoint, the TIP of your boat will be even with and 45โ€ to the left the bush/waypoint. Remember the Bow antenna is centered on the boat and the console antenna is 45โ€ from the centerline of the boat, which is 90โ€ wide in this example. Since the console antenna is offset, the path using that antenna is a straight line PARALLEL to the center-line of the boat.
This is why it is important to have the transducer and antenna located in the same position.

Iโ€™m not sure about Point 1, since I own Humminbird Solix units and use antennas with a Heading sensor, but I am assuming you can share heading and/or location with Point 1.

Looks like the images come out a little small when I posted them and it's a little hard to see some of the dots. You can right click on the images and save them, then you can open them in a Photo viewer and zoom in.

[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]

Last edited by Mike2718; 12/27/19 10:22 PM.

Have a Blessed Day,
Mike
Re: Waypoints - Graph Set up? [Re: Minner Bucket] #13384539 12/27/19 11:22 PM
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JIM SR. Offline
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huh ? loco

Re: Waypoints - Graph Set up? [Re: Minner Bucket] #13384660 12/28/19 01:36 AM
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David Burton Online Content
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Unless you move your Point1 directly over your transducer, you can't fix this. It may appear that you are "right on" your brush pile when you are at your console, but you are not. You are still a distance away. Here is at least one tip to help reduce the distance...

Make sure you are using the trolling motor transducer when fishing up front, and not the transom transducer. Get within range and troll back to find it. For regularly fished brush piles, you may want to set two waypoints and use one for boat positioning...


David Burton
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Re: Waypoints - Graph Set up? [Re: JIM SR.] #13384805 12/28/19 03:26 AM
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Mike2718 Offline
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Originally Posted by JIM SR.
huh ? loco

I will take another shot at it since I made it clear as mud. David above is right on with what I am trying to say. Grout-Scout, I don't know why you deleted your work of art, that's what I was expanding on. Since my artistic skills are not as good as yours, I decided to use CAD to illustrate my point.
Many people put their gps antenna next to their steering wheel and not above the transducer. The transducer is on the transom so its usually several feet from the gps antenna. Let's just say there is 5' from the gps antenna to the transducer. Imagine you are driving North and a bush(represented by the green circle with a dot) comes up on your graph. You are seeing on your graph what your transducer is seeing, BUT your gps antenna is actually 5 feet in front of the bush. You decide to "mark" the spot. You hit the "Mark" button and let's say you drop a marker buoy directly under the antenna. What you have just marked is a location that is exactly 5' in front or north of the actual bush, like in my 1st boat illustration. The waypoint and marker buoy are NOT on top of the bush but 5' north of the bush. The 2nd boat illustration is showing if you turn around and approach the same waypoint traveling South. When your gps antenna is DIRECTLY over your marked waypoint and marker buoy, the bush is now 5' in front of the antenna which is represented by the Red dot in the illustration. The waypoint is in line the the edge of the boat because the gps antenna is mounted on the edge of the boat. The 3rd boat illustration shows if you are approaching the waypoint traveling East. When the antenna is directly over the waypoint and marker buoy, the bush is exactly 5' to the right of your antenna. The 4th illustration shows if you are approaching the waypoint and marker buoy traveling West. When the antenna is directly over the waypoint and marker buoy, the bush will be to your left 5', which on most boats will be under the seats somewhere. No matter which way you are traveling, the bush will always be 5' from your gps antenna. the only thing that changes is where it is located in relation to the gps antenna.
The second group of illustrations are showing the relationship if you are approaching a waypoint using the gps antenna that is located at the bow, for example using your trolling motor to approach the waypoint. Again, the distance will always be a 5' difference, but the location in relation to the boat will change. This is due to the antenna being installed at the very front of the boat and along the center-line of the boat. The 1st boat illustration shows when the antenna is directly over the waypoint, the bush is 5' behind the waypoint which puts it under your feet somewhere. The 2nd boat illustration shows when the antenna is directly over your waypoint, the bush will be exactly 5' in front of you. The 3rd and 4th illustration show the relationship while traveling East and West. The difference will always be the distance from the gps antenna to the transducer when the waypoint was created. If a waypoint is created using the bow unit, the waypoint and actual bush will be in the same location. If you approach a waypoint created by the bow unit, using your trolling motor, the distance to the waypoint/bush will be whatever your unit says. In the example I used, the distance from console antenna to the front line of the boat is 15'. If you use your console antenna and approach a waypoint created by the bow unit, the distance will be from the console antenna to the actual waypoint/bush. I did not include illustrations for this scenario. No matter what, if your antenna is not located over your transducer, you will have a distance discrepancy and that doesn't include position error distances. It's complicates things even more because most people don't remember which direction they were traveling when they created the waypoint so you don't know if the bush is in front of you, behind you or to the left or right of you when going back to the bush. I hope this makes more sense.


Have a Blessed Day,
Mike
Re: Waypoints - Graph Set up? [Re: Minner Bucket] #13384990 12/28/19 03:06 PM
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My 3 second to draw work of art canโ€™t compete with a CAD program roflmao

But my pic was more for Minner, I know how his boat is rigged up. The pic would only work for his specific situation, everyone has their boats setup differently.

Re: Waypoints - Graph Set up? [Re: Minner Bucket] #13385048 12/28/19 04:09 PM
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Its really pretty easy for me...

I always try to approach a way point into the wind because thats the way the spotloc will orient the boat when I'm ready to fish.
Using my console fish-finder I approach the waypoint splitting the middle of the waypoint with my boat and with side image on to see where the pile is,....the pile can be seen left, right, or in the middle of the boat on SI, I'll throw a buoy left, right, or in middle of the boat over my head, LOL.
Now I circle back and use my trolling motor to get into the wind and toward the bouy. The front graph shows me on traditional sonar the pile.
Actually its simple....I'll throw another bouy about 20 feet directly in front of the boat for reference, and pick up the first buoy...easy peasy... fish

Last edited by JIM SR.; 12/28/19 04:11 PM.
Re: Waypoints - Graph Set up? [Re: Minner Bucket] #13385575 12/29/19 01:17 AM
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I think I understand, gps puck over transducer and need 2 waypoints, 1 from console and 1 from bow . I was trying to only have 1 waypoint and be dead on from bow and console but apparently thatโ€™s not possible, thanks for all the explanations! Oh and Grouts an Artist! roflmao

Re: Waypoints - Graph Set up? [Re: Minner Bucket] #13385728 12/29/19 02:50 AM
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You almost have it. You are correct that your gps antenna needs to be over the transducer for your console unit. The bow antenna for all intense purposes is over the transducer. You only need 1 waypoint if both of the antennas are over the transducer because the structure will be in the same location as the waypoint. If you approach the waypoint with the trolling motor, then the distance to the structure/waypoint will be whatever bow unit says. If you approach while driving, the distance on the graph is the distance from the console antenna to the structure/waypoint. In my previous example, it is 15โ€™ from console antenna to front of boat. If your console unit says you are 20โ€™ from the waypoint, that means the console antenna is 20โ€™ from structure/waypoint, BUT the front antenna is only 5โ€™ from the structure/waypoint. 20โ€™ to structure to console antenna minus 15โ€™(distance from console antenna to front antenna) equals 5โ€™ from front of boat. If console unit says 20โ€™ from waypoint, you can go up and look at the bow unit it will say 5โ€™ from waypoint since it is 15โ€™ closer.
That does change if you end up mounting the console antenna over the transom transducer. The distance to the waypoint becomes the distance to the antenna mounted on the transom. On a 20โ€™ boat there will be a 20โ€™ difference between the front antenna and the rear antenna. If your console says 20โ€™ to waypoint then that means the front of the boat is on top of the waypoint and the rear antenna is 20โ€™(length of boat) from the waypoint. You just have to remember if you want to be 30โ€™ away from structure when casting you have to add the length of the boat(20โ€™) to the distance you want to be. So in this case, when driving to the spot you need to stop when console says 50โ€™. The unit will always give you the distance to that antenna.

Last edited by Mike2718; 12/29/19 03:00 AM.

Have a Blessed Day,
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Re: Waypoints - Graph Set up? [Re: Minner Bucket] #13385812 12/29/19 03:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Minner Bucket

Oh and Grouts an Artist! roflmao



Iโ€™m not going to quit my day job! roflmao Apparently Iโ€™m also illiterate, I try to read those paragraphs that MIke2718 wrote and my eyes glaze over and I go into a trance. Kind of like this eeks

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