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Re: High School fish tournament fraud
[Re: buda13]
#13154010
05/14/19 04:07 PM
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 7,033
SC-001
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I want to give THSBA props for finally catching this guy!! He has a long history of incidents in tournaments on Texoma but other than an FLW withdrawal nobody could ever make anything stick. Way to go THSBA!!!! I want to give THSBA props for finally catching this guy!! He has a long history of incidents in tournaments on Texoma but other than an FLW withdrawal nobody could ever make anything stick. Way to go THSBA!!!! This guy has been caught before, it was just 3 years ago he was DQ'd from winning a ABA event because of his previous cheating https://texasfishingforum.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/11489607/Re:_Ram_series_Richland_chambe Does THSBA not have a rule if you've been caught cheating before you can't enter?, I'm surprised no one protested him being involved in the first place, guys reputation was well known in the regional tourney scene.
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Re: High School fish tournament fraud
[Re: bassfinder78155]
#13154011
05/14/19 04:07 PM
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Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,409
RedEar12
Extreme Angler
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Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,409 |
Shallow water, my point about TTZ, champs, and media is that it was only interesting to see if the kids who are learning to cheat in these high school events try the same thing at the larger events as they get older. I'm not saying every high school fisherman is a cheater either.
I am saying that there seems to be a lot of cheating talk and already several disqualifications in a very short time and high school tournaments
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Re: High School fish tournament fraud
[Re: Shallow Waters]
#13154017
05/14/19 04:10 PM
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Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 6,885
04champ
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The link posted on the first page of the confirmed story with charges being pursued is not a rumor. Nor are the teams that were disqualified from Lewisville. So that is two events that have documented proof, not just hearsay. I'm not sure what else you are looking for. Mug shots maybe?
So the linked story has soemthing to do with how the kids are going to make Media, champs, and TTZ interesting? I guess I am not following this far enough down the rabbit hole. Also, are you saying that this cheating is somehow limited to hgih school fishing events only, because I beleive this thread has also confirmed that this same guy has been caught cheating in other tournaments. Can we assume that it will be "interesting" when the participants of these other tournaments "move up to bass champs and media and TTZ"? No, what he's saying is that there are a ton of kids being introduced to competitive fishing the wrong way due to this HS fishing stuff. And they're going to carry a range of bad habits varying from slightly irresponsible to downright malicious into competition in their adult life - and its going to be at an unprecedented level, due to the sheer number of these kids. The kids whose parents fish and are teaching them to fish and are capable of operating a boat on their own and behaving responsibly are not the kids he's referring to.
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Re: High School fish tournament fraud
[Re: bassfinder78155]
#13154028
05/14/19 04:21 PM
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Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 1,166
Shallow Waters
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 1,166 |
The thing being missed in your point is that the kids learning bad habits and cheating are learning from guys who are already competing and cheating in tournaments. This Lovelace guy certainly isnt new to tournament fishing or cheating. These cheating high schoolers are not going to introduce something new. Just like the current adult cheaters learned from their adult cheater mentors or parents before them. This is not a result, and wont be a continued result, of high school fishing tournaments being introduced.
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Re: High School fish tournament fraud
[Re: Tiltman]
#13154034
05/14/19 04:26 PM
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 6,966
Sinkey
Tidy Scoop
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Tidy Scoop
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 6,966 |
Always been lots of suspicion swirling around this person, it’ll be interesting how this plays out. This!
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Re: High School fish tournament fraud
[Re: bassfinder78155]
#13154044
05/14/19 04:34 PM
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 2,973
Txduckhunter
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 2,973 |
1500+ teams in THSBA and all you want to do is point out the few negative ones and all the negative aspects you can. Sad way to live a life...
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Re: High School fish tournament fraud
[Re: bassfinder78155]
#13154045
05/14/19 04:35 PM
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 7,033
SC-001
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how are people like him and Jason May allowed to captain these HS teams? In defense of these organizations alot of the teams, clubs, what have you are run by people who aren't involved in the "fishing community" for lack of a better word. They aren't on here, the name Robby Rose doesnt jump out to them, when I was captaining I had to have a background check done thru the school that the district I'm in does on every volunteer, I'm sure it's for felonies, etc. Beyond that nothing else. Hell these people still get entry into tournies now run by people who know ..... Yes THSBA staff should have caught his name at time of entry but your right about them being new or not involved in the "fishing community". Did he captain more than one event?, if so just can't believe one of the other teams captains wouldn't have protested based on his past record, surely one of them knew about his history.
Last edited by Legend LE-195; 05/14/19 08:24 PM.
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Re: High School fish tournament fraud
[Re: SC-001]
#13154055
05/14/19 04:39 PM
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 20,746
Douglas J
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
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I want to give THSBA props for finally catching this guy!! He has a long history of incidents in tournaments on Texoma but other than an FLW withdrawal nobody could ever make anything stick. Way to go THSBA!!!! I want to give THSBA props for finally catching this guy!! He has a long history of incidents in tournaments on Texoma but other than an FLW withdrawal nobody could ever make anything stick. Way to go THSBA!!!! This guy has been caught before, it was just 3 years ago he was DQ'd from winning a ABA event because of his previous cheating https://texasfishingforum.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/11489607/Re:_Ram_series_Richland_chambe Does THSBA not have a rule if you've been caught cheating before you can't enter?, I'm surprised no one protested him being involved in the first place, guys reputation was well known in the regional tourney scene. Scroll down towards the bottom of the post and there is a post about another tournament he was DQ'ed from. Apparently he has been doing this for a while. HERE I am not sure the THSBA is to "blame" because an obvious con artist tried and scam their event. One thing that is for sure, if a person cheats long enough he will eventually get caught. The shame is the punishment usually isn't severe enough to deter that person or others from attempting to cheat in the future.
#MFGA
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Re: High School fish tournament fraud
[Re: Bass Buster1]
#13154056
05/14/19 04:39 PM
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 7,033
SC-001
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So my Son was a part of a "HS" shotgun shooting team a few years back. IMO the thing that makes these "HS teams" ripe for cheating is they really have nothing to do with the school and do not fall under the UIL umbrella as far as I know. They often meet at a school and have a sponsoring teacher so they can call it the "whichever HS fishing or shooting team" but in the end they are not really a school sport. In the shooting thing teams would even recruit good shooters from other areas to come shoot on X team even if they did not go to the school the team was "sponsored" by. You have a 501C3 company running a club and calling it a HS sport. No rules other than the ones the company creates, no real sanctioning body. The shotgun thing definitely was that way and we found ourselves paying and enriching the company and their employees but that was it. With scholarship money and prizes on the line, adults are going to cheat to get their baby a scholarship and also so they can brag on their kid. If you want to have a youth tournament trail, awesome but I wish they would stop calling them HS teams because in my mind, and I may be totally off base here but they are not. The other thing that might help would be for UIL to recognize a couple of these popular outdoor sports and have a little oversight. I am not a proponent of Govt., they mess up almost anything they touch but in this case some oversight from someone other than a 501C3 company and whatever rules they create would probably be good.
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Re: High School fish tournament fraud
[Re: Douglas J]
#13154060
05/14/19 04:42 PM
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 7,033
SC-001
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Scroll down towards the bottom of the post and there is a post about another tournament he was DQ'ed from. Apparently he has been doing this for a while. HERE I am not sure the THSBA is to "blame" because an obvious con artist tried and scam their event. One thing that is for sure, if a person cheats long enough he will eventually get caught. The shame is the punishment usually isn't severe enough to deter that person or others from attempting to cheat in the future. Well good point but he obviously wasn't using an alias or something since he worked for the high school at Gainesville.
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Re: High School fish tournament fraud
[Re: SC-001]
#13154097
05/14/19 04:59 PM
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 20,746
Douglas J
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Scroll down towards the bottom of the post and there is a post about another tournament he was DQ'ed from. Apparently he has been doing this for a while. HERE I am not sure the THSBA is to "blame" because an obvious con artist tried and scam their event. One thing that is for sure, if a person cheats long enough he will eventually get caught. The shame is the punishment usually isn't severe enough to deter that person or others from attempting to cheat in the future. Well good point but he obviously wasn't using an alias or something since he worked for the high school at Gainesville. Not sure if he has ever been convicted or not, but I think a conviction would be a red flag for anyone who was employed as a teacher. Although for what they pay teachers and the BS they have to endure, they probably don't want to disqualify too many that will take the job...
#MFGA
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Re: High School fish tournament fraud
[Re: RedEar12]
#13154110
05/14/19 05:14 PM
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Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,802
Tx Tree Grower
Extreme Angler
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Shallow water, my point about TTZ, champs, and media is that it was only interesting to see if the kids who are learning to cheat in these high school events try the same thing at the larger events as they get older. I'm not saying every high school fisherman is a cheater either.
I am saying that there seems to be a lot of cheating talk and already several disqualifications in a very short time and high school tournaments Alot of that talk is simply uninformed rumor. The post yesterday about Caddo Mills is a great example of that. There have been some cases of people being caught cheating and they were all handled in accordance with the rules. That is a good thing in my opinion. Enforce the rules, make an example out of the few cheaters, the organizations will benefit from that long term. Most of the high school fishing organizations are still in their infancy. I don't think you will see this wave of cheating emerge in the adult trails. Hold off on the panic button. What you will see is a wave of unprecedented competition. These kids are light years ahead of where most of us were as anglers in high school. Big numbers are about to be infused into the adult trails. I think that is the reason many of you guys really hate this high school fishing deal. I'm not sure if it's the added pressure on area lakes or just the fact that things are changing fast. Most of us hate change. It's human nature, but change is here and its to late to stop it now.
Last edited by Tx Tree Grower; 05/14/19 05:15 PM.
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Re: High School fish tournament fraud
[Re: 04champ]
#13154113
05/14/19 05:17 PM
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,822
tricky
Extreme Angler
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,822 |
I like how teams win or get a top 10 and they’ve never been on the lake before, zero pre fishing, first time on the lake. Some of these teams need to go straight to the pro rank, just ask their parents. Lots of teams are doing it the right way, too many are buying their way in. I’ve been told numerous times, “why would I be their boat captain when I can get someone else to do it and possibly win”. One dad was just posting how his son had “put in the hard work” then the post right before stated he’d never been on the lake prior to the tournament. Same dad that isn’t the boat captain but fishes all the time. Nothing like teaching them the right way. And this is exactly why ONLY parents/legal guardians of one of the team members should be allowed to be a boat captain. Too many parents out there willing to coddle their child to the top by paying for the best boat captain. It really is pathetic. those same parents will have no problem throwing a fish in the box to help the kid either I really cant see this. Possible yes, but most fathers would never do this.
Last edited by tricky; 05/14/19 05:18 PM.
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Re: High School fish tournament fraud
[Re: tricky]
#13154125
05/14/19 05:27 PM
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 2,973
Txduckhunter
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 2,973 |
I like how teams win or get a top 10 and they’ve never been on the lake before, zero pre fishing, first time on the lake. Some of these teams need to go straight to the pro rank, just ask their parents. Lots of teams are doing it the right way, too many are buying their way in. I’ve been told numerous times, “why would I be their boat captain when I can get someone else to do it and possibly win”. One dad was just posting how his son had “put in the hard work” then the post right before stated he’d never been on the lake prior to the tournament. Same dad that isn’t the boat captain but fishes all the time. Nothing like teaching them the right way. And this is exactly why ONLY parents/legal guardians of one of the team members should be allowed to be a boat captain. Too many parents out there willing to coddle their child to the top by paying for the best boat captain. It really is pathetic. those same parents will have no problem throwing a fish in the box to help the kid either I really cant see this. Possible yes, but most fathers would never do this. most father wouldn't do this??? That's a piss poor argument. MOST captains wouldn't either.
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Re: High School fish tournament fraud
[Re: bassfinder78155]
#13154130
05/14/19 05:31 PM
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,822
tricky
Extreme Angler
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,822 |
Your right most Captains wouldn't, but I would bet you that way more would let things slide than a young mans father trying to install some integrity in his son. Also this would limit the number of boats that these have. And lets face it, that's what is mainly driving all the HS hate.
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