That makes sense but I wouldn't want a truck for fuel mileage, I want a truck for hauling things and driving in the mud and rough terrain as I'm sure a lot of truck owners would like

I don't get 4WD because I don't have a need for it. Getting my 2016 Ram with limited-slip differential was a big upgrade from the non-LSD 2WD trucks I've had in the past. I don't go out in snow and ice. If it's that bad, my wife and kids are off and I'm staying home with them.

redchevy, do the 4x4 models sit a lot lower than 4x2? My Ram sits really high. I could just barely fit under my old 2004 Silverado without jacking it up, but I feel like there is tons of room under my 2016 Ram.

That's easy to say at $2/gallon. At $4/gallon, mpg makes a big difference in monthly expenses. My dad drives a Tundra and for every 2 gallons of gas he buys, I'm only buying 1-1.2 gallons of diesel. The savings are pretty unreal. If gas goes back up to $4/gallon, I'll save $10k in 100,000 miles of driving.

Even at $2/gallon, it's $100/month back in my pocket compared to a 16 mpg Tundra.

and how much of those savings does the higher monthly payment offset. Payback period on a diesel has always been at least 5-7 years when I put a pen to it.

Depends on how much gas costs, how much you assume for repairs on the older truck I was driving, how much the vehicle itself costs versus what it will be worth whenever you're looking to sell it, how much interest you could have made on the money you saved up front, etc.

I don't disagree with the 5-7 year payback period. My numbers were more like 3-7. Closer to 3 if gas is $4 a gallon, my old truck starts breaking down, the eco diesel value is high because gas is expensive, and I got a good deal on the truck. Closer to 7 if I didn't get that good of a deal on it, gas stays at $2 a gallon, the value of the diesel stays low because gas is cheap, and my old truck doesn't break down.

Either way, there's always a trade-off with a more expensive truck. But you've got to be willing to keep the truck til that point if you want to break even. Lots of factors that play into it.

I just can't get over how ugly the new F-150 is, they must have got the guy from GM that designed the new Tahoe's and Yukon and had him design them. I mean really, let's put a big frown on the front grill and copy Tundra's tailgate. I see a lot of grill guards in their future much like the Ram pick-up's.

Funny that a Ford dealer would change to GMC because of issues with the aluminum content of the F150. It has been widely reported that GMC has invested nearly a billion dollars to retool for a high aluminum content pickup to roll out in 2018. Aluminum is going to be a part of every auto maker in order to hit fuel use regulations. Might as well get ready.

No way would I even try to compare used to new. When I calculated payback it was new to new. A lot of the payback calculation for diesel versus gas is dependent on fuel cost and we all know what they do. The higher the spread between the fuels then the longer the payback. I stick with if you really need a diesel for hauling then buy one. Of course that could change as diesels improve as long as the improvements are not offset by improvements in gas engines.

Hope you weren't planning to get a lot of agreement on this thread....lol

Allegedly GM is going to keep steel in the bed and other critical areas. I could see Ford going backwards and putting steel in certain areas as well.

I agree. Payback on new to new is almost immediate since a diesel already holds its value better than a gasser. Even payback on new vs used looks pretty good if gas goes up much at all. Because when gas gets expensive, usually diesel is either the same price or cheaper, and the gas-sipping diesels will come out way ahead on monthly expenses.

As for only getting a diesel if you need it for hauling, I think that's what the Ecodiesel and the F-150 diesel that Ford is releasing in 2017 are looking to change. They want to make diesel an alternative for gas even for truck buyers who don't need to tow heavy loads. Ram has done exactly that IMHO. I would expect that Chevy is looking for a way to stick a diesel in the Silverado 1500 and Toyota has to be looking for a diesel option for the Tundra. The gas mileage gains just make too much sense to ignore it.

I could see Ford going backwards and putting steel in certain areas as well.

How do you figure payback is almost immediate? With a $5k higher purchase price it is several years out and the resale value only comes in to play when you sell.

I could see Ford offering a basic bedliner as standard equipment.