Sometimes it's not how many you catch but the experience info and knowledge you come away with!!! Only used a guide on a lake once. Didn't catch much but gained knowledge and techniques I still use today. Charter offshore boats often and found one who treats me like an old friend, treats my kids like his own and makes it feel like your out in your boat with an old friend. That makes the trips fun and special. I have always picked up something new that I have used on my own. I have found if you expect to crush em then you get let down.......its those trips that either just kinda happen or you are just looking to get away when it always seems it's on and when it happens its magical.

I booked a guide last year on fork. In March and he still charged me the full fee minus $50. I basically paid 350 for a full day fishing and caught one really small keeper. We probably hit 10 spots and not a another bite. First time booking a trip myself and was very disappointed.

I agree with this.
I wanted my guides to fish. Especially, when I was not getting a bite, to prove the fish were there and willing to bite if I did it right.
Which at that time, I probably wasn't.
I hardly fished until my kids were grown, trying to put food on the table for them. So I didn't know a lot.
I think my first problem was the way he positioned the boat so we had no where to cast except the shallow water. But the worst part was the continual put downs all day long.
I can banter with the best of them, but I can usually tell if someone is mad about something, so I know to shut up and/or apologize for any offense.
I want my clients to have a good time, catching or not.
I still firmly believe a guide must be a teacher. Although as you said, there are some students who can not be taught.

Richard, thanks for your comments and candor here. I realize fishing is not an exact science, and fishing guides are not magicians. Also, the skill sets of the anglers (loosely used term!) are wide and varied, from guys that get it and don't need a lot of coaching or hand holding, to novices that don't know how to throw a baitcaster without creating a birdnest that's going to require respooling! LOL!!
My experiences with guides have for the most part been pleasurable in terms of they were all "nice guys" that I enjoyed talking fishing with and trying to learn from. As in many things in life, expectation and disappointment go hand in hand. High expection + poor results = great disappointment. With Lake Fork being a world class fishery, expectations are normally quite high. It has always been for me, with the hopes of hooking a "good one".....not necessarily a DD, but something more than a 2 or 3 pounder that I can catch in most DFW neighborhood ponds in my area. When a guide client is spending $400-$500 (or half if they're splitting with someone), it is still a good bit of money for most average joes for a day's entertainment. Therein lies part of the problem, with the outlay of money and expecting results of some sort for the money paid. If someone goes to a professional music concert, the expectation is that they will enjoy several hours of high level music that satisifes the money spent for the experience they had. In those terms, if I showed up for the concert and the band never played a note, I would be disappointed.

You guides work hard, spend many, many days on the water (many in adverse and miserable conditions), but it's the profession that you've chosen to make a "living". Some would not call it a true living, but we'll call it that for the sake of this discussion. While fishing 250-300 days a year would sound exciting to most of us, I'm sure it becomes a grind at some point and just like most jobs, there are probably days where some guides go through the motions just to get through it and earn a paycheck.

I have no issues with any of the guides I have gone out with. While I would have hoped for better results, it was "what is was" and I moved on. Someday I'll have a banner day on the water with a guide.....just hasn't happened for me yet. As with most things, timing is everything and fishing is definitely a timing thing along with fishing the right spots with the right baits at the right time of the month and weather....it's not complicated!! LOL!!

Again, thanks for your post and for weighing in here.

Jim, of the guide trips you've been on, has the guide caught a bunch of fish?

As I said earlier.

I have no problem with the guide fishing, sometimes i just watch the way the work their retrieve and ask questions about what they are doing and why. I have picked up subtleties that i never knew about. A couple years ago i went out with a Lake Fork guide and we were primarily throwing C-rig, i had caught fish before on a c-rig but would never consider being proficient with it. That day i paid a lot of attention to the way the guide worked his lure and tried to mimic it the best i could and ask questions when i was un sure. suffice to say, at the end of the day i felt 100% more confident throwing that rig, not to mention we caught 15-20 fish with a couple 5-6lbs mixed in.

Ken, that's a great question. In MOST cases of the trips I've been on, they have caught a lot more than me or whoever I was with. All of them fished....can't recall a guide trip where the guide didn't fish. I realize their skill sets are way beyond mine, and if they're fishing I would typically expect they're going to boat more.

I've had different experiences with 2 different guides.

first the bad; this occurred on Fairfield. booked the guide for a morning trip and only caught one small fish. it was during the summer, and all we did was fish a bank with reeds. after 5 hours his watch beeped and back to the ramp we went.

now the good, on lake fork; been out with him 3 different times. 1st time was a spring trip where he taught me and a friend all about sight fishing. the only time he fished was on the first fish. my buddy spent about 5 minutes trying to get it, and then I spent about 5 minutes, with no luck. so, we went to the back of the boat and started throwing out into the cove. immediately, the guide set the hook on a solid 6 that we couldn't catch. we asked him how he got her to bite so quickly, and he explained that we had done the hard part of getting her mad. the rest of the day he did not fish, just spent time searching for spawning fish and holding the boat with a big pole while we caught fish after fish.

the second time out was in early June to prep for the skeeter tournament. we fished a lot of different patterns, but only had 2 fish by lunch time. he told us we could either go eat lunch and fish the rest of the day, or we could quit now and he would give us another day for free. since it was obvious the fish were not biting, we opted for the later day. we rebooked in October and ended up catching 80 that day on Carolina rigs.

if I ever go out with another guide, it will be this guy.

Well Stated!

I've rented several guide trips with Fork guides. I take my customers along. Every time has been a very positive and memorable experience except one. It was on Fork about 12-13 years ago. I will not name the guide, either. This dude front-ended us while bedfishing and caught one about 7 pounder right in front of my customer. Pizzed me off and he knew it. Yes, my customer could barely cast a baitcaster. Instead of teaching him how to cast, flip, pitch to beds..the guide would cast for him and then hand him the rod. He actually set the hook a couple of times and handed him the rod to reel the fish in. It was a joke. I finally told the guide to get off the beds and let's fish in the wild and please teach my customer how to cast. He did. Fishing was tough, but by the end of the day, the guide went back up on the bank for spawners just to increase his numbers for the day. I sat in back and watched him and my customer try for a 6 lber for over 45 minutes. Finally, the guide said let's just move on and find another bed, this one just will not bite. As we pulled up and started moving off, I threw one time in that bed and she bit the first flip. I've never been more proud of a fish in all my life! The guide never said a word. Then, at the end of the day, the guide suggested that we give him a tip. I told him that I would catch up with him next time. Most guides I have the utmost respect for and will tip no matter if I catch fish or not. I screwed up and got the wrong guide on this particular outing. Oh, well.....

Good guiding, Okie

I have only had one guide trip. It was on Fork back in the early 90s. We talked to the guide before the trip and he told us to bring red traps. We only went to one spot that morning. About the only thing I remimber him talking about was his fishing experiences. He never suggested changing lures or checking out other spots. After we had lunch, wefished within sight of the ramp. Again, he didn't suggest anything, he just fished until time was up. We caught one fish all day and didn't learn anything. Sadly to say, it was such a bad experience, I have not used a guide since

Yes i have, and it can be rather disappointing when you don't even get a bite. I know which guides to cull at Lake Fork and a few other lakes.

To be clear I've been on a bunch of guide trips and most of them have been extremely positive. I have had several trips of a lifetime that came while fishing with guides. You are going to get the occasional tough day or joker for a guide, but if you do your homework you increase your odds dramatically. I would not write off guide fishing. On a dollar per hour basis it's actually one of the cheapest and most effective ways to learn a lake.

Never would expect a refund for not catching fish. Maybe if he had boat problems and we couldn't get out , maybe. Ive fished with some and only caught a fish or two and had guys that fished with me that zeroed with a guide. Ive always learned something from every guide even without big fish numbers. Still costs the guide to go and as long as the effort from the guide is there it shouldnt even be a question for him to get paid..