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Re: Hooksets & Fluorocarbon [Re: Jake Shannon(Skeet4Life)] #10905546 06/09/15 04:42 PM
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Originally Posted By: Jake Shannon(Skeet4Life)
If ur snapping 20lb floro on hook sets its probabaly ur knot breaking. 20lb invisix tied with a double uni or double Sam Diego jam will be so hard to break u will need to wrap it around ur trolling motor


Agree, maybe I don't set the hook hard enough, but I have never broken off on a hookset anywhere besides a knot or a spot I suspected was frayed already and was just too lazy to retie it. There have been hangups that I wanted to break off and ended up pulling up a limb, small tree, or bending a hook out. Had to really get on it to break it off, and when I did it sounded like someone fired a .22


"If worms carried pistols, birds wouldn't eat 'em."
- Darrell Royal
Moritz Chevrolet - 9101 Camp Bowie W Blvd, Fort Worth, TX - Monte Coon (817) 696-2003
Re: Hooksets & Fluorocarbon [Re: jwatts77] #10905587 06/09/15 04:57 PM
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I think people not adjusting their drag has a lot to do with it. If you crank it down tight something ahs to give.

Re: Hooksets & Fluorocarbon [Re: Reel N Fish] #10905595 06/09/15 05:01 PM
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Originally Posted By: Reel N Fish
Look up Mark Pack's video on the double San Diego jam knot. Using it will eliminate the problem of breaking off on the hook-set.


No, it won't. Not to start an argument but the man knows how to tie a knot and so do I.

Fluoro is not very forgiving when you are up close to a good fish when it bites. This same thing used to happen to me on a regular basis. I was always of the opinion that I had to try to turn the fish inside out when I set the hook. When I dropped down in power on my rods, it fixed my line breakage issues.

Watch the videos of guys that do it for a living every day. When they get bit flipping or pitching up close, they pretty much lift the rod sharply and start reeling. When you get bit out at the end of a long cast it is different. You have a much greater amount of line out to absorb the shock of a hard hookset.


Last edited by Ken A.; 06/09/15 05:04 PM.


Re: Hooksets & Fluorocarbon [Re: GeoFisher] #10905604 06/09/15 05:06 PM
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Originally Posted By: GeoFisher
John,

I feel your pain. I believe everyone has had some "growing pains" with Fluoro at one time or another. For me, I have found that my rod MUST have a little "tip" at the end for fluoro to work its best. I repeatedly snapped 15-20 lb fluoro on hook sets when I first started using it. Its not the line, it is the rod you are using. For me, I will not use anything less than 20 lb fluoro with a HEAVY ACTION ROD, and that is pushing it, especially when flipping and in close quarters. For 12-17 lb Fluoro, to me, there must be some forgiveness in the tip or heartbreak is imminent. I use either the San Diego Jam or Fishin Fool knot and have never had issues with knot failure. I do not recommend using the Palomar knot for fluoro. These are just my experiences over the past 3 to 4 years and line failure has become non existent (at least for now!)


This ^^^



Re: Hooksets & Fluorocarbon [Re: jwatts77] #10905738 06/09/15 05:58 PM
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I agree with Ken and Geofisher there above. My only conclusion reading this thread and similar ones is that there is NO one right answer. I suppose people should just experiment with what works best with their own fishing style and goals. Nice to hear different opinions though. If somebody is using barbed wire and catching more big ones than me because of that, then I will be using barbed wire - I guarantee that. I'll change my opinion pretty quick- lol!

Re: Hooksets & Fluorocarbon [Re: Reel N Fish] #10905996 06/09/15 07:33 PM
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Originally Posted By: Reel N Fish
Look up Mark Pack's video on the double San Diego jam knot. Using it will eliminate the problem of breaking off on the hook-set.
This here will solve your problem if I dont tie this not which is rare its the only time that I do break on hook set.

Re: Hooksets & Fluorocarbon [Re: 90 5.0] #10906181 06/09/15 08:39 PM
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Originally Posted By: 90 5.0
It's not because of your hook set its your knots or lack of retying when necessary

I bend trokar flipping hooks with flouro and don't break on hooks set.



Wrong, I know the difference in knot breaks and line breaks!

Re: Hooksets & Fluorocarbon [Re: J.H.S.] #10906191 06/09/15 08:43 PM
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Originally Posted By: Josh Seale
Do you tie the Palomar? If so it is your knot. I used to have the same issue. Fluorocarbon weakens when it tightens itself to much. Youtube Shaw Grigsby fluorocarbon knot. I don't remember what the knot is called (if anything), but I can tell you I do not break my knot anymore. it keeps the fluorocarbon from cinching down on itself to much.


I tie a great double san diego jam knot! It's NOT the knot!!

As I said initially if the line has any defect (even one you can't see or feel) it will break on a hard hookset.

I agree with what Don Harper said, it is superstrong, as long as the line is 100%.

Re: Hooksets & Fluorocarbon [Re: mcdil] #10906201 06/09/15 08:46 PM
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Originally Posted By: Bass Hog
Fluorocarbon is a PTFE (Teflon) material. The misconception is that it doesn't stretch as much as monofilament. This is only partially true.

1. It sees plastic strain (permanent stretch) far before its ultimate break strength. So, after it stretches once, it kind of stays that way afterwards. This helps make it feel like it has less stretch, because after it has yielded, it doesn't move very much when loaded up again.
2. It is more dense and rigid than mono, transmitting vibrations much better. Braid is not dense or rigid, thus slack braid makes bites almost imperceptible. The line must be tight to really feel anything with braid.

Having said that, PTFE is not nearly as flexible as mono. When you set the hook on a weightless worm rig, where you might create a small loop in the loose spool and where the line was pulled tight, casting that rig again might create a mild bird's nest that clears, but slaps the loop against the spool as it rotates. This heats that section up, and it is now compromised. That section will fail, and typically on a hook set, or even a cast. Bird's nests that kink the line will also create a similar situation where a sharp bend compromises the line's integrity. It will fail there as well. In either case, it really only takes one event to create the problem. This is the reason I don't use fluorocarbon at all anymore. Loved the sensitivity and sometimes the sinking as well, but mono for me on all but a couple specific applications where I will use braid.


This angler understands Fluoro!!!!

Re: Hooksets & Fluorocarbon [Re: jwatts77] #10906660 06/10/15 12:22 AM
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+1 on rod power.

I no longer use anything less than 20lb fluoro on a H action rod.
15-20lb on MH.
Less than 15 is M.
Works for me with a Double San Diego Jam. I've also toned down my hooksets on short line.

Last edited by T54; 06/10/15 12:22 AM.
Re: Hooksets & Fluorocarbon [Re: jwatts77] #10907251 06/10/15 03:34 AM
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Apparently I don't set the hook as hard as some. This is good because then I don't have to mess around with the San Diego Jam Knot.

Re: Hooksets & Fluorocarbon [Re: jwatts77] #10907448 06/10/15 05:03 AM
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Originally Posted By: C.A.S.T.
Originally Posted By: 90 5.0
It's not because of your hook set its your knots or lack of retying when necessary

I bend trokar flipping hooks with flouro and don't break on hooks set.



Wrong, I know the difference in knot breaks and line breaks!


Like i said, it's EITHER the knots you tie, an how you tie them(tying wrong can burn the line away from the knot), OR not retying when you should.

When i first started with flouro i broke off on hooksets all the time, even with 15lb on a medium action with a s head.

Now i never break on hookset with h and xhy rods, with the drag locked down.

I broke the frame on a lews t-pro setting the hook, i broke the real seat off an Nrx setting the hook, but i don't break my flouro doing it.

I got the broken parts and a stack of bent trokars if you want them.

Flouro's not for everyone, but don't blame it,it's something you are doing to cause it.

Re: Hooksets & Fluorocarbon [Re: jwatts77] #10907500 06/10/15 08:09 AM
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I agree 100% ! Even when I've retied after every fish fluorocarbon still breaks off a lot while flipping/pitching worms... I've also lost fish due to break at hook set on every type of fluorocarbon .....I've broke off at hook set with fluorocarbon more in a yr than 35+ with Monofilament ! Fluorocarbon is hard to break if your hung up for sure because the line is tight when you start pulling.. It's the sudden hard hookset with possibly some minimal slack in line when I've broke it often..Monofilament can take the sudden impact better for me...
I've never broke off on hookset with fluorocarbon while throwing moving baits like crankbaits and spinnerbaits...So it has its place for me..just only with moving baits .


Robert
Re: Hooksets & Fluorocarbon [Re: jwatts77] #10911839 06/11/15 11:52 PM
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They were reviewing a high quality fluorocarbon brand over on TackleTour.Com and one of the reviewers stated he wouldn't throw a particular high dollar lure he had on the lighter lines. He had seen another sail off into the lake, so he had no confidence in it . . . unless it was a heavier test. So, that is what he tested.

If not the knot, again I take CAST's word for it, I think it might simply be that it breaks down with the slinging of it around the rod tip on casts. And, I suppose if someone leaves the line taut at the end of the day with the terminal tackle pulled down on the hook keeper, it might set up for a bad second day of fishing.

Brad

Re: Hooksets & Fluorocarbon [Re: jwatts77] #10911854 06/12/15 12:05 AM
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maybe those that break FC more often have their drags set to tight relative to their hookset

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