Night and Day

Don’t show this to the BPT guys, because it will make them jealous. They get to talk to the one lonely camera man or marshal at end of the day, contrast that with what the BASS guys get to come home to... and the sponsors are just loving it; notice all the people walking around with sponsor branded bags of goodies in their hand... that’s sponsorship gold!

Don’t miss the Gerald Swindle interview about half way through, he says it like it is. Brandon P. also talks about how he was a lemming. At least he’s not to proud to admit it and is ready to move on in the right direction.

Too bad the BPT guys didn’t take into consideration how important the in-person appreciation that’s being shown by fans is to the sport and sponsors. It’s like Night and Day to compare the interest between the two.

Where were all those giant bags you talked about this morning. And i think the sponsors are happy with BPT's tv coverage. So keep it up Warren

Of course you seem confused as always, how could I be referring to bag size of today when today had only just started?

i guess not only are you confused, but you aren’t that good at figuring out averages either. The bags referred to this morning were referring to the past 2 days; get someone to help you, perhaps you have a elementary school kid nearby, and get averages of group A & B on BPT fishing their proclaimed lunker capital of the world for their 2 days each respectively (over 4 days), and then calculate it down to get average bag size for 5 fish. You can get total weights off of the results page on MLF. Then compare those averaged bag sizes to what the BASS bag sizes for the last 2 days has been for them. Do top 10... maybe you’ll then see the difference.

Yes, I am sure the sponsors are getting their bang for their buck on those lonely interviews after the fishing is done, not understanding most people have already clicked the x on their video stream window.

Hey genius, you posted this morning. Final day and big bags being caught. If you can't post what you mean to say. That's on you. I posted the averages this morning from group A top 10 1st 2 day's. And top10 of BASS top 10 2 day's. Are your earmuffs to tight. Your sister's hot.

Wow, the crowds for this event have been amazing, and it was delayed for 2 days to boot. Sponsorship gold!

This type of events are an MLF’rs wet dream. But they listened to B. Duckett who promised them they would become a TV star! LoL

went to watch BASS today and looks like it’s already over. I guess it’s now just a two day club tournament. The other one is still going on.

Lets see. A few people walking around at weigh in. Or more tv time in a year then Bass has in 10yrs. And shows on network tv. I think i know who most smart companies would pick to sponsor

They didn't fish today. Weather shortened and only fishing 3 days. Saturday, Sunday & Monday.

A few people walking around?... you must have mistaken one of those MLF feeds you’re watching for the BASS videos I posted. By the looks of those reports I posted, both day 1 and 2 at the BASS event showed many hundreds of people gathered. Kids, families, all mixes of people. That is sponsor gold, and those in person eyeballs who made effort to come see what the the vendors brought to the show are far more valuable and likely a product buying customer than someone who has a TV remote in hand that’s channel surfing and stumbles across some random fishing show in middle of day or night that holds their attention for a few seconds.

Go back and listen to the Gerald and Brandon’s Day 1 interviews in whole. Those tell the whole story. While you’re at it, stop video at points where it shows the sea of people wandering about the event and do a count. Use your fingers to help you count past 3

I'll answer this here for you so it doesn't get lost out in the comment you made in the bass section.

#1 Crowds aren't "sponsor gold" by themselves and most, if not all, of the people in those crowds aren't current prospects for anything. They're there to watch a weigh in. I've been to all of those events and activations and watch them walk right by the sponsors & vendor booths and go sit in the chairs and watch the weigh in and walk right by those sponsor & vendor booths on the way out. 90% of them don't stop and engage.

#2 what makes someone a prospect or valuable for a sponsor is if they're IN MARKET or IN FUNNEL for that particular product or service and that can happen both online or offline. To be clear, watching Live or a TV show doesn't make them a prospect either, so your definition of sponsor "gold" couldn't be farther from the truth. I've sat in many meetings with brands complaining about onsite activations and how hard they are to activate and make ROI positive. The are a necessary evil at best. They are certainly not classified as "gold" by the vast majority of us.

#3 I'm glad Gerald and Brandon are where they want to be and happy. Every angler needs to make the best decision possible for their business, their brand, their sponsors and their career.

Oh and PS, your comment about KVD and Pete Rose was simply ridiculous and if you had a single shred of credibility before that, it was lost when you made that comparison.

Carry on...

And brands will adapt (and already have been across 99% of categories and industries) as they always have. Cord cutting, online retail, podcasting, vlogging, etc are all forcing companies to adapt. It’s true in every sports league. It’s true in every industry.

It’s no secret that people are leaving the house less often, or are busier with other things going on. Brands will adapt to get KPIs and conversions in other ways as technology continues to evolve and consumers continue to evolve with it.

I'll wade into "this" briefly........The BASS vs BPT vs FLW doesn't really involve me, and my guess is it doesn't involve most casual to avid tournament bass fishermen. Although there will be some who just have to pick a side. It really involves a few with ties to their own aligned allegiances, paychecks, sponsorships etc. I've been an avid B.A.S.S. fan since the late 70's. I was star struck a number of years ago when I met Ray Scott. I idolized the Hemphill gang as a kid. And yes it was very tough to see the "Elite" at the time move to BPT. But to me, its all tournament fishing. The Eufala tournament has been great. More interesting to me than BASS fishing St. Johns. I will absolutely watch BASS at Fork. Its all an avenue to watch what I enjoy. The "market" itself dictated the BPT. Right, wrong or indifferent, BASS just didn't move the needle enough. It has had years and years and years to do so. But when 99% of the best leave there is an issue. But if you take away the history and all the names, and allegiances of growing up with a certain organization, the new BPT is a better format, with better fishermen, and better content in my humble opinion. If some of the powers at be don't mess it up, it will go to the next level. So I wish we could get away from the nit-picking, oh look what he said, or look what happened here etc. Its tournament bass fishing at the highest level on all accounts. And before I get lit up for the if you don't like it, don't read it....I read it because it is bass fishing content shared by my fellow fishermen....Hence the reason I am actually looking at the message board.

Well said

I think Big O stands for Big Orgasm because I’ve never seen some one get off to MLF, Bass Champs, TTT or whatever the hell he rambles on about like this cat does.

It stands for Big -0-

Where are the people? I had a minute to check in and watched the start of the MLF broadcast where they showed the anglers fishing today at launch. I saw a couple walking their dog on one of the docks... no spectators at all. That’s got to be a lonely deal for those anglers. I wonder how long it will be before Thrift starts missing the fanfare? Big name, big fish, and nothing but a lonely camera man and marshal to help him celebrate his kicking butt and taking all their money.

Thrift doesn't fish for the fanfare. He fishes to pay the bills and because he simply loves to catch bass. He's one of the few people who can actually live on his tournament winnings. He will flourish in any format that he decides to fish.

Thrift loved the fanfare he received at FLW and deserved every bit of attention he got. I was surprised he accepted the invitation to fish BPT after turning them down a year earlier. I personally believe he would have been way better suited for BASS and would have been an instant crowd favorite. Dudley, I understand why he went, it would have been extremely awkward for him to go back to BASS considering his past history, but Thrift, he would have easily thrived and qualified via the opens.

I hope the dude takes all their money... he’s going to school them all. It’s just a matter of time before he tires of only hearing the frogs and birds after his wins.

Just curious, why don't you like MLF? Don't give me the format stuff, that's not a reason to dislike them, like you do. Did they cause you some kind of loss or something?

There's been a lot of talk in pro sports about the gradual decline of fans attending events, instead preferring to watch on tv. Google it, easy to find.

BASS and MLF both know this...neither is banking on fans at weigh ins. The "gold" as some call it is streaming and tv time. There is absolutely no doubt about that.

I don't disagree with the sponsorship angle of crowds at most weigh ins. They are basically meaningless to the sponsors and represent a very very small minority of the actual fans keeping up with the event. In regular season events the crowd is nice but I don't think it is critical to the success of the event. However, for a championship event I think the crowd is critical, and their is an opportunity for much more fan interaction with sponsors. The classic wouldn't be the classic without that final weigh in with an arena full of fans. I've been to several and it is a great event. I think the redcrest will struggle to ever be an event you can compare to the classic. Their format just doesn't lend itself to ever hosting a major fan friendly event. That doesn't mean that MLF can't be a success. I just don't think their championship will ever be considered a major event like the classic unless they modify it's format.

The Classic is awesome and currently the crown jewel for BASS 100% but to make any forward statements that MLF can't or won't create a meaningful or even better Championship event is simply not something anyone knows, it's just an opinion and time/patience can always solve for that. In the meantime we can all enjoy both formats and their respective Championships.

LMFAO - you’ve been at the B. Duckett kool-aid station for too long. Sober up!

I like this. Until there comes a time where fans lose perspective on what the Classic is MLF will never have a single event that will rival it. Good news here is they don’t have to. They just need to do what they do and everything will work out fine. There is no reason to try and compete with a single tournament. I said in a previous thread that I would like to see all 3 tours come together and have a set of *majors* much the same as golf so that each tour has a qualification process for anglers from each tour. Follow the rules of the hosting tour. It would be in the best interest of the industry to never let the Classic die or become just another tournament along with building up Redcrest or whatever name they want to give another tournament. All things can be made better than they are. They just have to want to do it and work together.

Is there even a Redcrest anymore? Did I miss the press release that they’ve reinstated it after cancelling the event and snatching the 2020 purse away from the angler? If you listen to some, the frogs and birds chirping at the empty boat ramps at launch and end of tournament days is the new “sponsorship gold”; that’s what draws in the customers! MLF is just ahead of their time, but that’s where they and their marketing sales geniuses are predicting, where every sport is moving towards; fanless events are the future!

It was started and is being run by a group of shysters that tried to conspire and take down the organization that gave them their fame and fortune. When that didn’t work, they destroyed the other trail that was being legitimately run and then to show their true colors ripped off a bunch of anglers in the process.

I don’t like crooks and exposing them is something more people should do. There would be less of them in the world if people stood up and shined a light on them and their agendas and tactics.

Is that clear enough?

Speaking of shining a light on agendas and tactics. How about you get in the spotlight? You may even gain some traction.

I know you think Duckett is the devil and MLF stinks, but for anyone else who might take what you type here as truth:

https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...orts-teams-running-out-of-fans/39667999/



https://nymag.com/intelligencer/201...-in-person-and-no-one-seems-to-care.html



The facts are, people are staying at home more frequently, and at an increasing rate, than ever before. There are a lot of reasons for that, but, as much as you think fan attendance at a bass tournament matters, the key is reaching customers (fans). Fans are glued to devices, including TVs. You grow the sport by increasing access to your product. I’m not driving from Texas to Alabama to watch a weigh in at a tournament. And if that tournament is close to where I live, I’m still going to fish, or do something else with my time. But I know more about the guys fishing MLF after six days of watching because they’ve got a camera in their boat speaking directly to me about what they’re doing. That’s more intriguing to me than sitting in a plastic chair in the sun 100 yards away from a stage and a weigh in. I watch the weigh in in real time with MLF.

What are the numbers at BASS weigh ins now compared to 30 years ago? Any change in numbers?

Show us the proof MLF “snatched” the purse for the Redcrest, please.

Oh my.

You’re comparing free to attend family friendly fishing events to professional sports franchise owners and the greed they’ve displayed that has hurt the live attendance? I can see how that’s possible, the majority owner of MLF is one of those greedy team owners that’s known to do just that.

That’s okay - Wheeler will be able to cruise back to the boat dock and be congratulated by his 9 peers and few MLF staff people who are still at the event. Maybe he can sign their hats!

Go look at the videos I posted at beginning of this thread... The MLF and Kroenke vision is night and day between what BASS does and believes in, and the results show.

You compared XFL and NFL to MLF and BASS, as if Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers and Pat Maholmes jumped ship for the XFL. And the above was in response to your continued insistence that spectators at a weigh in is the end-all, be-all metric in success at a tournament. Attendance is down at pretty much every sporting event.

But, tell me how attendance at BASS events compares to 20 years ago. You never answered that question.

It's clear enough, I figured there was some personal pain from MLF. As you take constant shots at MLF and sound like bias news anchor just twisting anything you can into your narrative. BASS is going to be okay, don't let MLF get you fired up.

Interesting that MLF has this on the webpage for the Eufaula event for fans who want to attend and interact with the pros.

Attend
The Bass Pro Tour B&W Trailer Hitches Stage One Presented by Power-Pole takes place on Lake Eufaula in Eufaula, Alabama on Feb. 7-12, 2020.

Launch
Takeoffs will begin daily at 7:30 a.m. CST from the Lakepoint State Marina, Main Ramp (104 Old Hwy 165, Eufaula, AL). Time subject to change.

General Tire Takeout
Watch as your favorite pros return from a day of competition. Takeout will begin daily at approximately 4 p.m. CST at the Lakepoint State Marina, Main Ramp. On February 12, join us for the Stage One Champion presentation. Time subject to change.

Meet & Greets/Fan Events
Angler Meet & Greets at River City Grill

Feb. 7 from 4-6 p.m.: Meet MLF pros Justin Lucas, Edwin Evers, Casey Ashley and Wesley Strader
Feb. 8 from 1-3 p.m.: Meet MLF pros Randy Howell, Marty Robinson, Chris Lane and Mark Daniels, Jr.
Location: River City Grill, 209 E. Broad St, Eufaula, AL 36027 (Directions)
Dothan – HS Angler Clinic at Action Marine (Dothan, AL)

Feb. 8 from 2-4 p.m.
Meet MLF pros Jordan Lee, Josh Bertrand, Timmy Horton and Brent Chapman
Location: Action Marine, 2481 Reeves St, Dothan, AL 36303 (Directions)
Bassin’ & Barbeque at Parkview Baptist Church

Feb. 8 from 5-7 p.m.
Featuring speaker Mark Rose and Q&A session with MLF pros Andy Montgomery, Alton Jones, Alton Jones, Jr. and Mark Rose
Location: Parkview Baptist Church, 608 S. Eufaula Ave, Eufaula, AL 36027 (Directions)
Military/First Responder Appreciation at Lakepoint Resort Lodge

Feb. 9 from 1-3 p.m.
Meet MLF pros and former first responders/military veterans James Watson, Gerald Spohrer, Randall Tharp and Cliff Crochet
Location: Lakepoint Resort Lodge, 104 Old Hwy 165, Eufaula, AL, 36027 (Directions)
Eufaula – HS Angler Clinic at Eufaula Chamber of Commerce

Feb. 11 from 6 – 8 p.m.
Q&A with MLF pros (TBD)
Location: Eufaula Chamber of Commerce, 333 E. Broad St, Eufaula, AL 36027 (Directions)

If those QB’s moved to the XFL that would be the end of their careers. Sure, a few people might follow them on the other side but it would be nothing in comparison to what the NFL brought to them. Same can be applied to MLF - the anglers who have moved over there aren’t nearly as popular now as they were with BASS or FLW - their popularity has been replaced by new faces and names. KVD who? Thrift best not spend much time there or he will quickly fade too.

The spectators at the tournaments is a vital and critical component to the events put on by BASS and always have been. It’s what has brought in and kept the fans interested. They aren’t just there for the weigh in’s that each day of the event, it also brings with it a trade show of sorts and it’s family friendly activities and they’re free to attend. Some would argue that sponsors don’t see value in that type of thing, yet they flock to each one of them.

Who knows what attendance figures were 20 years ago for BASS - didn’t they use to have a big fish fry after the fishing serving up the BASS that were caught that day? It really doesn’t matter if the crowds have diminished a little bit, they are still healthy crowds. Look at videos for event #1, which was also delayed by 2 days. The numbers speak for themselves - meanwhile, the MLF guys have the frogs and birds chirping.

Funny how Warren(big o) keeps talking about the BPT anglers fading away. I see 10-15 threads about BPT for every one about BASS. On here and BBC. I also see them alot more on tv.

No kidding, that’s why it’s a horrible comparison on your part. And people are watching MLF quite a bit. That’s another reason why the XFL-NFL comparison is terrible. You keep saying things like, “they’re not as popular now that they’re with MLF,” not showing how that’s being quantified. You’re not, because you can’t. Saying KVD is unpopular is ridiculous. The XFL is a startup league with castoffs, guys trying to make it to the NFL and guys just hanging on. It will be used as a minor league. It is what the Korn Ferry Tour is to the PGA Tour. In contrast, MLF has some of the biggest names in the sport in it. That’s why it’s a terrible analogy.

You keep repeating that spectators at BASS are vital and critical for BASS and that may be true (it also is apparently disputable, and hard to quantify, despite your continued push to say it matters, when it might not matter, and the fact remains that in-person attendance in major sporting events is down, but revenues are up). This isn’t BASS. It’s MLF. It might matter to BASS and it might not matter to MLF. Additionally, I posted the attendance schedule for this week at MLF. They had stuff every day, including Q&As, meet and greets, etc.

It 100% matters if attendance has fallen at BASS events. My entire point is, a bass tour might not need them at all, yet you keep saying not having one is going to kill MLF, which is disputable.

Measuring the success of a trail based on attendance doesn’t necessarily matter at all. That’s not the only metric, and, in fact, it might not matter at all, as multiple people have tried to show you by pointing out that attendance for pro sports is down, but TV revenue and viewership is up.

They’re two different styles of tournament. You’re not even comparing apples to oranges. You just keep repeating the same things without context or showing your work.

Yes, I read that event schedule and it listed times at the boat ramp where the event was held. That’s the point - no one visibly showed up. Unless you count the couple I seen yesterday doing what appeared their evening walk with their dog. I didn’t watch the “take out” portion today, but have no reason to think it was any different than the past. I can imagine the local population thought MLF what? if they seen any advertisements. i commend the guys who went to the high school and spoke to those kids... Thrift seemed to enjoy that.

As to the rest of your assertions, you may want to check with your guy B Duckett and see what his grandiose plans and expectations are, or were. There was a bassfan.com article posted here not long ago where he talked about the now nonexistent 2020 Redcrest tournament where it was going to make the Bassmaster Classic look like a community church pot luck dinner event... so, either he’s on the wrong page with KSE or you are. Which is it?

No one shows up because no one knows of or thinks MLF is anything of substance that deserves their time, and that unfortunately includes the anglers who are part of that clown show. KVD who?

So that’s a “NO”?

It was a Wednesday in February, man. You expect huge crowds in Alabama? But again, the MLF model is not banking on live attendance, just like Amazon doesn’t use brick and mortar stores.

A few things about me:

I fish from a kayak.
I barely knew who Boyd Duckett was until you showed up two months ago making him out to be Lucifer. He isn’t my guy at all.
I definitely don’t know what KSE is.
I watched BASS on ESPN as a teenager and haven’t much since. I watched a limited amount of MLF the last couple of years.
I watched MLF everyday this event mostly because of your crusade against it, otherwise I might’ve caught parts of the replay when it airs on TV.

Search out “Stan Kroenke” - look at what he and his organization has done to teams and the fans in other sport franchise communities and you will see the future of MLF. His track record is indisputable.

Ok, I do know who Stan Kroenke is. If you’re talking about moving the Rams back to LA and charging Arsenal fans higher ticket prices, that’s weak. Extremely weak.

There is a reason why MLB won’t allow him to own a team. And it’s not because he doesn’t have the disposable capital.

MLB wasn’t the issue. The NFL was.

Major League Baseball approved unanimously by the rest of the owners as a finalist for the Dodgers. The NFL said team owners couldn’t own teams in other major sports leagues in NFL markets, which, at the time, it considered LA, even though Kroenke had yet to move the Rams there.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles...d-by-mlb-as-bidding-finalist-for-dodgers

“According to a report from Ronald Blum of the Associated Press as shared by foxsportsarizona.com, St. Louis Rams owner Stan Kroenke has been unanimously approved by Major League Baseball owners as a finalist for the upcoming auction of the Los Angeles Dodgers.”

You misunderstood - MLB has shot him down to be an owner of a team. They have seen how he and KSE run the other sports franchises and want no part of it. He’s got his ownership tentacles in all mainstream pro sports.... NBA, NHL, NFL, FFA, and many minor league franchise too, not to leave without mention owning the properties they play in. He got burned in court a while back and had to turn over ownership control to his son in some of it to get regulators off his back, which is basically just changing a name on some legal docs - Stan Kroenke (using surrogates) runs the show in everything he’s involved with, including the MLF. If he doesn’t get his way, he removes those who stand in the way. When BASS wouldn’t bend to his liking, you think long time sponsor of FLW Walmart leaving was a coincidence? That was done to significantly weaken FLW and make them ripe for take over. You’re not peeling the onion back enough to see the big picture.

Wow you are a crazy person

I think the pc term is mentally challenged

Admirable as it is, you are fighting a losing battle. Just let it go or you will begin using that head banging emoji before long. His hatred for all things MLF is blinding and he will never see beyond that hatred. He may even turn out to be right as time goes by who knows, but damn.

The part about MLB/NFL is wrong. KSE is the wealthiest sports ownership group in the world. The NFL stopped him from buying the Dodgers, not MLB.

The MLB owners approved him for the final stage of bidding on the Dodgers. Magin Johnson and his team eventually won the rights to purchase the Dodgers.

The NFL, which Kroenke is an owner of, had a rule until 2018 that allowed the league to prevent NFL team owners from owning a team in another major sports league (such as MLB) in a different city than the one you own your NFL team in. Since Kroenke owned the St. Luis Rams, the NFL said you can buy the Dodgers, because the NFL considers Los Angeles a football market, even though there was no NFL team in LA at the time.

Maybe I’ll see the big picture if you start backing up what you say with links to articles. Or, you could finally unmask and reveal who you are and how you know all of this, because this is either all made up, or you are involved somehow, and it would go a long way, if that’s true, if you stopped being anonymous.

That’s what is crazy - he may end up being right.