GAME CHANGER FROM BERKLEY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x4MLekqKT5U

I’m working to get noodling outlawed in Texas. Pulling big fish off the spawning nest thrashes the eggs and destroys the nest. Even if they are returned immediately, the damage is already done done.

Yep, there are YouTubers in Alabama that build nests and sink them during the spawn just so they can noodle them.

I think they should have bubble gum flavored gloves, or even cheddar flavored!

Stinky gloves tm

Outlaw noodling? The number of fisherman noodling catfish in Texas is .10 percent. I would like to see some scientific evidence showing a decline in catfish numbers since it was made legal in 2011.

Lol. I knew that would ruffle some feathers. The evidence in big Flathead decline is easy to see on my home lake of Lewisville. It went from the world record holding lake chuck full of world class fish and 70 and 80 lbrs coming out of it frequently to what it is now which is terrible. Back then snag lines we’re legal means and guys ran strings of snag lines all over the lake. Eventually they were outlawed but the damage was already done. The monster genetics were removed out of the lake and Lewisville never recovered. Add on top of that nest thrashing noodles these days and it’s easy for me to see why they should be protected more. Just like snag lines, someday noodling will be outlawed. I see that very few people care much about protecting flatheads and i hear guys say the bigger the better to eat and I think it’s sad but it is what it is. I think all big fish should be respected and protected and we teach that to every angler and kid that comes on our boat.

https://thinkingafield.org/2020/10/...odling-can-hurt-catfish-populations.html

Besides the fact that Berkley smoked a lot of people on April Fool's day, I will stand behind my boy Gato. The only time of the year that noodling is effective is during the spawn. Regardless of what your opinion is about noodling, protecting trophy class fish isn't just about protecting the female. It's also about protecting her offspring. If you pull a 70 pound female out of her nesting hole, the damage is done. If she hasn't dropped her eggs, she might get stressed and not even drop them, or she may have just laid them and then you've trashed the nest and destroyed that years spawn. It's a known fact that the bigger and more experienced the animal or fish is, the better the genetics of that individual's offspring are. hopefully, one of these days, people will recognize that protecting trophies is good for everyone's future.

thanks for sharing

I'm still waiting on someone to tell me that the Catfish Sumo Gollywhopper rod was an April fool. Lots of hype leading up to it, how it was a product that was going to change fishing, and help you catch more fish. Then, it ends up being a rod you can lengthen the handle on.

I’m with you on noodling. I don’t like the thought of ripping a big catfish out of their spawning hole. I’ll admit, flatheads are fantastic eating, but for a rod and reel angler, I might catch 3-4 in a year that I keep. It’s a whole lot different than the massive hauls people bring in from noodling and set lines. If I had my way I’d have both outlawed, I’m sick of having to cut illegal trot lines because I snag them in my trolling motor while crappie fishing.

Way more rod and reel, jugline and trotline guys out there catching and keeping trophy flatheads during the spawn than noodlers. You are singling out one group of fisherman.

Flathead become increasingly more difficult to target during the spawn as well as Blues. All the Flathead anglers I know don’t even fish for them during spawn and nether do trophy Bluecatrs. I’m sure your going to say you hammer them during the spawn but for most other anglers that isn’t the case. I’m in a large community of high level anglers and 100% of us don’t agree with Noodeling. A certain percent of juggers and noodlers just seem to have a different mindset than trophy anglers. Trophy anglers respect big fish and want to protect that resource for our future generations. Fortunately more and more people are respecting the big fish these days and the paradigm is rapidly shifting. I’m hosting a Jr Angler event this weekend and we’ll be teaching the kids the importance of big fish conservation and responsible harvest. Older guys seem to resist change but through educating the youth, change is coming.

I have been on the CPR band wagon, especially big blues for over 25 years. It was once a big problem with some of the ones who said if they don't fit in your box get a bigger box. Thankfully the ones like Albert King are no longer active on this forum. After a long enough time maybe the older catch and keep all the fish folks, will fade away and the more conservatives will become the norm. Hopefully.

Easy to catch them during the spawn you just hit spots like low water dams on the brazos where they cant get any further up river. In places most boats cant reach.
Plenty of study's out there say noodling has little or no effect. Trotlines and juglines are the real problem.
Evaluation of the Flathead Catfish ...with Emphasis on the Effects of Noodling

I am a huge proponent for Big Fish conservation regardless of which means you use to catch them. All big fish should be respected and protected in my opinion. My issue with noodeling is pulling the biggest fish off their nests which destroys that fish’s genes being passed on for that year. They don’t make more eggs instantly and re-spawn. Doesn’t matter if it’s a blue or a Flathead, when you pull a big fish off it’s nest then the nest is destroyed and that fish’s genetics are erased for that year. A study done over 3 yrs isn’t going to have any value for understanding long term effects of destroying a big fish’s nest. To me this is very easy to understand but for a certain number of folks like yourself I don’t think you care much about the resource and look for reasons to justify harvesting big fish. I’m against harvesting big fish by any and all means and I’m 1000% against pulling a big fish off its nest and destroying its ability to pass on it genetics that year. It’s your right to keep taking big fish and defending the harvest of them and it’s my right to try and change that mentality especially for new guys coming into our sport. I was brought up to defend what I love and I’m going to continue to educate our youth about big fish conservation and responsible harvest even if it drawn criticize by folks with your mindset. I believe I am having a positive impact on the catfish world and the next generation of catfish anglers coming up.

I don't noodle but do run juglines on Lewisville a few times a year respectfully. All are tagged and legally built and collected when I'm done. That being said my goal is to put some fish in the freezer and I only keep the smaller ones. All bigger blues go back in the lake to make babies as well as every single flathead. Flatheads are scarce to come by and no matter how I'm fishing be it rod and reel or what I don't keep them. My fishing buddies get mad at me when they catch a flathead and throw it in the livewell then when their not looking I take it out and put it back in the lake. That being said the idea of pulling a big flathead off the nest in my personal opinion is just wrong....

Guys, I gotta say, I am pretty skeptical about studies. If I learned anything in college, it was that you can spin whatever idea or opinion you want with a study, poll, paper, thesis, etc, etc. After reading some of the info that sapalmer linked in his response, I'm even more skeptical. In the noodling study done at Ross-Barnett reservoir in the two years studied(2007 and 2008), the author claims there were an average of 3,000 flatheads caught with a retention rate of approximately 90%. That would be well over FIVE THOUSAND fish harvested in a two year span. Five thousand LARGE flatheads. The study explains that most of the fisherman didn't "appear to be size-selective" in their harvest but I have never met or heard of a noodler that wasn't "size-selective" in the fish they were trying to catch. Come on, let's get real. You couldn't convince me that data is anywhere close to accurate if you hit me on the head with sledge hammer. Most of that harvest and catch data was gathered doing a "roving creel survey" method in which parties of fisherman were "interviewed" about their catches. Ya think there was a little, uh, exaggeration going on with a few guys?!

I'm with Chris and, I believe, the majority of guys on here. The long term effects of noodling aren't being properly studied, although there have been people doing it for a long time. If you'll take a minute and think about it, how often do you see pics of giant flatheads lately? I mean, when I was kid, those pics were a dime a dozen and you saw them all the time. And you'll still see them occasionally but, it seems to me that there are a lot less of them nowadays. Lucky for us, I think noodling is a pretty small demographic in these parts.

You know, I don't have a problem with someone catching a fish with their hands. Just do it in September or October, and keep smaller fish! You would prove to me and everyone else what a real expert noodler could really be-a highly accomplished, conservation-minded, expert in his field. And he/she would be highly respected by us rod and reel guys. Come on noodlers, show us what you've got!!

My family has been trotlining Tawakoni since it opened and yes we
kept the big ones back then and as another post stated about fishing
to eat that's what we did and the big ones were our trophies. We have boxes
of pics with lots of big fish but now I don't keep anything over 10-15 lbs.
No need for it as we catch plenty of 2-5 lbers . That being said as much
as we fish during April and May I have never had to worry catching over
the slot limit at Tawakoni on bigger fish ..even with the limit changing
this yr to 5 we won't have a problem. I think there is some exaggeration on
lots of people keeping above slot size limit that is Law just to push a agenda.
Can't see anyone that catches more fish than us during April and May and
and having that many big fish in boat at 1 time. Now that may happen in
later months but I haven't seen it.

I’ve seen numerous big fish kept out of Twok and cleaned at the cleaning station at Anchor Inn first hand. Not exaggerating at the slightest. I’m a friendly person so I stop to talk to every catfisherman I see on the lake or at the ramp and ask how the fishing is and what they caught so I see it going on at every fishery we go to throughout the year. If I wasn’t witnessing these things and think it wasn’t an issue I wouldn’t waste my time standing up for big fish and drawing criticize from guys. I certainly don’t enjoy being attacked by those types but I’m not afraid to stand up for what i think is right. Go on Catfish America group on Facebook and you’ll see countless big fish being kept and comment after comment cheering them on and defending and encouraging what they are doing. You can ask most any guide on Twok how their big fish season went this year and their big fish numbers were way down. And yes I do have an agenda which is to promote big fish conservation as well as responsible harvest.

I think y'all missed the point of this thread.

It was a very well done April fools joke.

I have to admit it got me, hook line and sinker!

I didn’t get the joke because I didn’t watch the video. As soon as I saw it was for wet noodles I was out.

You won't get the laws changed. It was done through the legislature and there is nothing TPWD can do about it. The only way to get it changed is to go back through the lege and I've been told firsthand by TPWD and high-level politicians there's a 0.0% chance of changing it.

State Legislation changes all the time. New politicians come and go and new bills are introduced and old bills are repealed. Close to 700 pieces of new legislation are introduced every single year here in Texas. What was passed 10 yrs ago can be repealed today. Writing state legislators and Senators is the first step and educating anglers is another. I have done both. While our current Representative Michelle Beckley is pretty much worthless in my opinion, she won’t hold that office for long. Senator Jane Nelson on the other hand was much more responsive when I wrote her which I thought was encouraging. Saying that it’s never going to change is just not right in my opinion. I’ve taken enough Government courses in college to learn that there are a number of steps you can take to get legislation changed. The first being getting to know your local legislators and State Senators that represent your district. I’ve gotten to know Michelle Beckley enough to know she is only worried about getting voting laws changed so Democrats can win more Texas elections. The next Representative might just be related to a catfish angler who is into big fish conservation. Who knows, maybe they will be related to one of the Jr Anglers at one of my events and decide those fish need to be protected. Number 2 is to increase your political awareness. Something that most folks don’t spent the time to do. Number 3 is to offer your opinion. I’ve offered mine to both my State Legislator and my State Senator regardless of what it’s worth. Number 4 is to oppose or support the legislation in question which I have done. Number 5 is to get new legislation introduced which isn’t easy with someone like Michelle. Even if you think it’s pointless I think It’s important to share your experience with Legislators and Senators and change can and does happen. Is it easy? No, but it does happen. Sticking your head in the sand certainly won’t implement change. Laws are constantly changing like bow hunting for catfish, hunting for hogs from helicopters, or medical marijuana legalization. Change is the one thing in life that is constant.

"Michelle Beckley enough to know she is only worried about getting voting laws changed so Democrats can win more Texas elections."
and republicans are only interested in getting laws changed so they can win more elections. Same things that make you laugh make you cry.
I opposed the bowhunting for catfish and was on board with TPWD to protect big blue cat about 20 years ago, little good did it do until plenty of folks got involved, so the more the merrier.

This is my point exactly. Educate the youth and change happens. As far as the 2 politicians I’m speaking of, when I wrote to Michelle Beckley I got a generic letter back that didn’t have any real concern for one of the people she was supposedly representing. It was typed and her signature was a stamp. When I wrote Senator Jane Nelson I got a hand written letter signed by her and she said she was considerate of my concerns. Far better response in my personal experience and it felt like she actually cared while I’m fairly certain Michelle Beckley never even read my letter. .

The last big fish I kept was May 1, 1989 Jacky so I have been on Big Fish conservation just about as long as anyone.

You fight the good fight. You have a long road ahead of you.

I've spent a lot of time on both the TPWD and Lege side of this issue and it's a hot mess all the way around. The state has had zero credible data to support that it harms populations. Anybody can see that pulling a spawning fish off a bed is not good but there's no data to support that (and they are monitoring it). Even in the presence of credible data, the only way the law can be changed is through the lege and TPWD won't touch it.

Noodling was legalized because of $$$. One of the wealthiest oil men in Texas wanted it legalized so it happened. You can rest assured every politician both new and future will have their hands in his pockets and it will remain legal as long as he and his kids want it to be legal.

Change sometimes happens slowly but it is inevitable. When I was a kid close to 100% of big fish were kept for diner. Bass, catfish, it didn’t matter. Slowly over time the paradigm has shifted to where the majority are now returned. This paradigm wasn’t shifted in the halls of the State Capital. It was fought in the hearts and minds of the youth such as myself by anglers like Jimmy Houston and Bill Dance who put forth the effort to educated my generation on the importance of big fish conservation. Those guys had a huge impact on my life and I know the big reason conservation is where it is today is because those guys were willing to stick their necks out. Sure there are still lots of folks who don’t care about conserving they big fish for the future generations but I have confidence that conservation will continue to grow and will someday spread to the Flathead just like it has for Blues. The old rich oil man will be dead and gone some day and it might just be his sons who decide that enough is enough and throw their weight behind conservation. To say it can never change is not the way I am wired. It can and it will change but it takes time.

The law was changed with Daddy's money for the sons. Best of luck!

I think you do a good job El Gato Azul..i have learned more about fishing
reading your posts as a few others on here. I appreciate what you do.
It's changing the mind set on big fish so more people can catch big
fish. As long as people follow the Law we have no problem. That's the
problem. Implementing stricter laws on trotlines I'm not in favor. Is there
waste yes. Any fishing you will lose some to death. From being on trotline to
long the wrong way or swallowing a hook and breaking a line from rod and
real. Not everyone can afford to have a big nice boat,down scan, side scan,
livescope and be on the water 3 times a week. I'm lucky i can take off
for 2 weeks and set lines a few weeks before and take them out 2 weeks after
as I can fish a couple times before and after vacation and if i can't get
back within a couple days I cradle my hooks in the swivel. Even though
I know im hated by rod and reel fisherman I feel like I have as much right
to fish as anyone as long as I follow the Law. The 1 law I do not like is
the flotation on the line. Only if it's in the middle of lake do I agree with that
one. I don't trust other Trotliners or rod and reel fisherman to see where my
line is. Don't care if they get the fish. Just don't cut it or steal it.

Sounds like the stuff of legends. So what is the oil man’s name?

Thanks Zebcoomega. I don’t have any problem with guys that catch fish by trotline or Jug as long as it is done responsibly. I’m for big fish conservation and responsible harvest regardless of which way they are caught. I don’t think it matters how often you go or or how good you are at catching big fish, they should be protected and respected even if you only catch one per year. Only being able to catch 1 or 2 is all the more reason to protect them. I’m happy to say that all the kids at my Jr Angler event we’re on board with turning the big fish loose. I will continue to educate the youth that come on my boat and every kid that attends my events. I love seeing the joy in their eyes from catching big fish and how excited they get when we turn them loose. That is pure gold.

Zebcoomega1, I wouldn't say you are hated. Most rod and reelers just see more of the effects of irresponsible jugliners and trotliners simply because we spend more time on the water and we cover a lot of water. It sucks when a small percentage of bad anglers gives the rest a bad name. I can go out on any lake today and load my boat with old trotlines and abandoned or lost jugs. It's just a matter of a few lazy, uncaring individuals who go out and overharvest and generally just don't care about the future of our sport/hobby. I know a bunch of rod and reelers that harvest plenty of fish. I don't understand the mentality of keeping really big cats. I've eaten meat from a 50 lb plus yellow cat when I was young and it wasn't good.

I totally agree with you on some of the new regs especially on trotlines. When I used to run them, I would tie them well below the water line just so they couldn't be easily found by other fisherman. Now you have to advertise them. And you're right, others will cut the lines just out of spite.

At the end of the day, we should all be on the same page because we pretty much all want the same thing-more and better fishing both in quality and quantity. It seems so simple yet we're so far away sometimes in opinion and mindset.

Chris, you won't have to worry about Michelle much longer. She's not re-running for her seat. Unfortunely she's hoping to make a run for Lieutenant Governor. She'll first have to win a primary run-off against Mike Collier but I doubt that either one of them will unseat Dan Patrick.

I normally stay far away from such conversations; I rocked the boat enough in a former life. But will weigh in here for what it's worth. I think El Gato is on to something and it is something that is worth much time and effort. That being said I'm not a fan of government getting involved in anything, it tends to revolve around dollars, votes, power, and who can romance the masses at the moment with little to no regard for facts or merit.

The best thing going is educating the youth. Raise em right and you'll see them doing the right thing at the right time even when no one is looking. There, I think, lies the key to big fish conservation. The joy of the experience El Gato described will live far longer in a young person's mind than any law ever written. It hasbeen the change of minds and practices that has made many "simple" laws, that are now taken without second thought effective, such as DUI and seatbelts. The "old timers" resisted, at least in my experience, but the younger generations grafted on to the new ways after being taught; not so much through legislation or government psa but by the actions of the adults and more familiar authority figures around them.

One other thing I will mention is that I had drilled into me was to never kill anything I was not going to eat with the rare exception of protecting something of greater value. (ie killing coyotes to protect calfs). How much goes to waste on one of those big old toad catfish. I might be more inclined to think better of it if the whole of the resource is going to feed many people and not be a freezer burnt pile of **** in the end.

How do you know the trotlines are illegal? I am sick of jerks cutting my trotlines because they are not watching what they are doing and Bass fisherman that make it a habit. A good trotline costs money to make. There is a set limit on the number of Flatheads you can take, if you don't like it take it up with TPWD.

The real problem which is? I have never seen higher populations of catfish on RC or Cedar Creek and have been fishing those lakes for decades. And both juglines and trotlines have been used a lot on those lakes.

The heck with Michelle and I am happy the last big fish you kept was in 1989. I don't keep large fish anymore unless they are deeply hooked because I have already taken more than a few. I want the young to have the satisfaction of taking a big one home. I see nothing wrong with this. On the other hand allowing say the Blue cat population to have a overly large population of huge fish is not going to be good for the lake. Great for the guides who have one thing in mind, money in their pockets and happy clients done easy. Letting a large predator fish increase it's population past the ability of the forage base to support it is irresponsible. As for noodling during the spawn I agree it can affect Flathead catfish populations, same for any fishing method. That is why there are limits.

Thanks Rick. I agree there has to be a balance but looking at our current top fisheries for big Blues like Twok and Lavon, both loaded with huge fish for many years and both have great populations of other species. My home fishery of Lewisville can handle double, possibly triple the biomass of big fish and at one point it did. It is loaded with baitfish and huge numbers of rough fish like Carp and Buffalo which are overpopulated in many of our fisheries due to lower numbers of large apex predators which is the only thing that can feed on them. I have not heard of a lake in Texas or anywhere in the country that has been over populated with big fish. There are areas that they are considered invasive like the James River but that is a different discussion.

Then there is no reason to limit the catch of big fish. I prefer to keep fish under 10 pounds and the big ones are both fun to catch and more work to get in and throw back. I have noticed a lot more big fish on my lines and they use up the bait I catch for eater fish and time on the water fooling with them. Might end up keeping more of the big ones to give the smaller fish a chance.

That is the exact reason to limit the catch of big fish. They are the ones producing the biomass of eaters for harvest. Remove the big reproducers and your going to have a dramatic decrease in the numbers of eaters for harvest. Twok has lots of big fish and it produces enough eaters for all those guide boats to harvest boatloads of eater sized fish day after day year after year. Remove those monsters and the eaters don’t get produced. Put the monsters back and there are plenty of eaters for the meat haulers and plenty of big fish for sports anglers. There isn’t a single lake in the entire country that is overpopulated with big fish.

Big fish conservation is here to stay. The youth are on board and that’s all that really matters. Arguing about it amongst us old guys is pointless. You either want to protect the resource or you don’t. I’m just glad there are more and more guys getting on board and educating the next generation of anglers and the old way of keeping big fish is rapidly going away.

A couple quotes from TPW, last two from a paper published by TAMU.edu titled Guidelines for Culture of Blue and Channel Catfish.

Life History
The spawning behavior of blue catfish appears to be similar to that of channel catfish. However, most blue catfish are not sexually mature until they reach about 24 inches in length. Like channel catfish, the blue catfish pursues a varied diet, but it tends to eat fish earlier in life. Although invertebrates still comprise the major portion of the diet, blue catfish as small as four inches in length have been known to consume fish. Individuals larger than eight inches eat fish and large invertebrates. Blue catfish commonly attain weights of 20 to 40 pounds, and may reach weights well in excess of 100 pounds. It is reported that fish exceeding 350 pounds were landed from the Mississippi River during the late 1800's.

The Jasper State Fish Hatchery (JSFH) located near Jasper, Texas uses blue catfish brood
fish that are 4-5 years old and weigh 7-18 kg each for fry production. The JSFH produces all
the blue catfish for TPWD and began a monitoring program involving PIT-tagging of brood
fish in April 2005. This program will enable the staff to collect spawning data on individual
brood fish and cull or replace those that do not spawn consistently or get too old. This tagging
program also allows documentation and management of the genetics of these fish

Size.–Broodfish pairs may be of similar size, but it is preferable for the male to be slightly
larger than the female. The weights of males and females should be recorded for each pen
along with the pen identification number. The JSFH uses 7-18-kg (15.4-40-lb) blue catfish for
pen spawning in a pond. The ISCCF are spawned primarily in pens in raceways at the AEW.
A female catfish will typically deposit 6,000-8,000 eggs/kg (2,700-3,600 eggs/lb) of body
weight.

7-18 Kg is 15-40 lbs as noted. Note that blues need to reach approx 24 inches to be sexually mature, 4-5 yrs old.

Let's just hope that enough of those eaters survive to sexual maturity. And that all the big fish released survive.

Sources of info if you'd like to read:
https://tpwd.texas.gov/huntwild/wild/species/blc/

http://fisheries.tamu.edu/files/2013/09/Guidelines-for-the-Culture-of-Blue-and-Channel-Catfish.pdf

Good to know.. I could swear that we catch lots of smaller ones with
eggs. I could be wrong.