TPWD Taking Public Comment on Proposed Regulation Changes for Trotlines and Other Related Gears

Has anybody seen this? I just saw something about it in the "News & Announcements" forum here. This also includes perch traps, jug lines, minnow traps, hand lines, and other fishing devices.

https://tpwd.texas.gov/newsmedia/releases/?req=20190927b


Voice your opinions and concerns.

https://tpwd.texas.gov/business/feedback/public_comment/

Great!....Just what we need, in more regulations.
If people aren't removing their lines after 10 days, why will they remove them in 4?
Enforcing the old rule as well as any new rule is the problem, and not limiting the days.

Having public meetings is a dog and pony show, as they have already made up their minds

I would rather see a three day gear tag renewal or removal of the lines. Four day won't get the weekend city slickers to take up their Walmart trot lines.

We ran jugs when I was a kid. Dad told us to always keep an eye on em, Jugs have a habit of swimming off he’d say. I don’t jug fish anymore but I wish guys followed Dad’s rule. I’ve seen jugs moving at a high rate of speed over a mile from where the other jugs were lined. By the time the bass fisherman got back to run his lines that big fish was long gone. Can’t hardly find a cove that doesn’t have at least 1 or 2 abandoned jugs. I will remove an old one cuz I don’t like looking at the same piece of floating trash every week. They rarely have a tag.

Same here. I don't know how effective it will/would be, but it is a step. Lakes like Arrowhead are full of those abandoned lines, I always seem to get hung up on one or two each time I go there.

some of my best fishing days are going to the lake on Tuesday after a holiday and collecting all the abandoned jugs left from the long weekend

You do not need to also put a gear tag with info, on a jug (such as a bleach jug). You are allowed to put that info on the jug itself. Also, since my "Planter" trotlines use fender floats on each end out in the big water, the gear tag info can be put on the floats as well.

I will be proposing another option, at least for trotlines, as to the renewal time. And I make note of a serious problem with the extra identifying float (s).

That is accurate, currently. But I don't see that they retained that wording in the new version. The way I read it a gear tag and a separate marker buoy will be required for jugs and trot line floats. I made a comment requesting adding wording allowing marking of the jug/floats to suffice as a gear tag. Also that adding a marker buoy to a colored floating device adds no value and shouldn't be included.

I agree that passive fishing gear should not be left out so long. I always stay close to my Noodle Sticks and don't leave them out overnight. My regular sticks, which I think are quite visible, only have a two inch diameter foam and would thus become illegal. My Monster Noodle Sticks use the larger three inch diameter pool noodles, though.

Looks like most all buoys with floats less than 6" in length and 3" in width will be illegal. Includes jug lines. No more 2-1/2" diameter pool noodles. Make sure they are 3" or larger. Think I'd rather have larger diameters anyway. Like above, I made some jugs monster noodles a few years ago. But also have a bunch of the smaller noodle jugs. And "spool type" jugs that may no longer be legal if this proposal holds.

Sorry I did not define my response (notes) better. "Gato" was making comment, on what I thought he was referencing-- current guidelines. Yes, it does seem they want a separate marker float with the extra info. Sort of redundant.

On my SW (Shallow Water) trotlines, I do not use floats to mark the ends, I utilize tags (from white vinyl of cut-up punctured fender floats) tied to the main line according specs (as to placement). The idea I was taught was to get them low in the water from the item tied to, to prevent the main line from being cut by props, as well as becoming entangled.

Family has been trotlining more yrs than most on this site has been alive. 10 days
Is good time on changing tags. 4 days makes it to tough to change out especially if you live
50 miles from lake and weather is to bad to get on lake. Out of 50 yrs of trotlining never caught
a black bass . few crappie per yr but mostly drum and carp.buffalo. besides catfish. Against
using floats also to mark trotline it just invites people to run your lines and steal them.
Noodles need to be picked up in 48hrs imo but trotline rules are good where there at.

I agree with you "zebcoomega1". I am in the process of writing up my essay. And as to trotlines, those points (notations) are included. In the event of extremely bad weather, are we to risk ours, as well as other lives in trying to make a 4 day deadline, which would also put those who might try to risk their lives. My proposal will include taking off the leaders & hooks, or hanging them in the "saddle" (meaning to put the hook in the swivel). It is easy to pull jugs fast. But trotlines, if done properly, take time to set out & time to retrieve. Especially my "Planter" trotlines, which use a 60 to 72# anchor (concrete in a 3.5 gallon bucket) on each end. Planting them is easy. But pulling them in 4 days will simply kill you by hoisting them back up into the boat from a 35 to 40 foot depth.

And yes, the floats only open some more problems, such as others running your lines, as well as those who think they are the new "sheriff" in town & start snipping your lines. I recall one game warden back in the 1980s on the Trinity River between TX Hwy 21 & Bedias Creek, who would write you up or run you in, if he caught you touching other people's lines or property. If a set line was illegal, he would pull it. Every few months, they would run the river dragging for illegal lines. And that includes abandoned lines.

Why not just enforce the laws already in place? There’s lines all over that are “abandoned”. If it’s not tagged properly, just cut it and pull it.

Noted ... with my comments:

Why not just enforce the laws already in place?
... Very true.


There’s lines all over that are “abandoned”. If it’s not tagged properly, just cut it and pull it.
... again Very True. Except for one thing. It needs to be the Law Enforcement (the proper authority who has been authorized to do so) only to cut & pull (confiscate) the line. Then from there, the Law Enforcement authorized agent has several options, such as tracking down the owner, to find out why it was abandoned, among many options. But for anybody else to just cut the lines & discard them, it then becomes a serious problem. This is how lawlessness begins, very subtle at first. Best thing to do, is call an agency to advise them where the line is located & let them do their job.

Back in the 1980s, as I mentioned one Game Warden who ran the area I camped & fished on the Trinity River, whenever we crossed paths, we would stop & chat. At that time they had just started the one tag on one side of a trotline law. He shared a situation to where he was checking a line from one side, but no tag. He said the line was hung before coming to the other side. He tried to find where it might be located, but failed in that attempt. So, since he could not find the one tag, his job was top cut & pull (retrieve or confiscate) the trotline. As he cut the side he could access, as he was pulling the line, it became untangled on the opposite side. Sure enough, it did have the tag on that side. So, he cut that side & very neatly piled the line on that side of the bank, so hopefully the owner could retrieve it later (if someone else did not steal it first).

He told me that because of this, it was best to put tags on both sides of a trotline. He also suggested on throwlines, that I might tag them too, even though it was not required at that time. He explained that if he came across someone who was not the person on the tag, he would either write them up, or haul them in, depending on the situation.

So I was probably one of the very first ones who tagged everything, and tagged each side of a trotline.

Why not just enforce the laws already in place?

Because the state wants the revenue generated by the citations written because of the confusion over new and obscure laws. Not hard to connect the dots. Just about everything TPW comes up with is a money grab of some type.

I replied to the Tp&W website yesterday..i think we have until Nov 4 to
voice a opinion. I do think with the popularity of the noodles and they tend
to get away from fisherman has made harder on the trotlines. I just got
into noodles and got to admit I lost 3 on a windy day and I searched and
searched but could not find. Im in on more rules for noodles and jugs since
there are a lot more and looks trashier with it floating but leave trotlines
the way they are..like you said lot harder to put out and adding floats to
a trotline just adds more trash. Enforce the rules that we have as mentioned
above and we will be fine.

They did pass proposed changes, but due to comments & input, they adjusted (alterred) a few items.

Instead of changing from 10 days to 4 days, it passed as 6 days.

The bit about the floats to identify the lines, sadly passed, but you can only put your ID # instead of full info. That way only the Game Warden or TP&W can only ascertain exactly who you are. They still did not comprehend that some think they are judge, jury & executioner, not being an authorized agent (such as a Game Warden), and simply cut or pull the device, legal or not.

The floats also must be a certain size- "must be at least 6 inches in length and not less than 3 inches in width".

Almost forgot. It seems this will go into effect on 2-1-2020 instead of making the regular annual 2020-2021 yearbook regulations.

If I understand the new regulations correctly, as of 02/01/2020 any jug line (milk jug/ old motor oil bottle) etc that is not 6" long and 3" in diameter we can legally remover from the brush around our waterfronts and in our coves without any legal reproductions? Is that correct?

NO! Only a game warden can remove them. It is thieft of property if you do it yourself.

Thanks for updating this page Lynn! I read about it yesterday. But was so depressed about it, I didn't want to spread it to others.

Once again, TP&W Game Wardens are properly authorized to remove anything illegal, or expired, as to property. It is not your property. Regardless of expiration or legality, one who is not authorized to do such, is in certain terms, a thief or one who has deemed themselves as an authority with no actual authorization. This leads to vigilantism, to where there is no respect for the laws in place. Eventually, it always does not evolve in a good manner.

It is best to report, either to a Game Warden (or other authorized personnel) directly on the water (the fastest method) of the believed infraction, so they can do the proper removal, if in direct violation of current laws for that water body. If this cannot be done, then there is a hotline for TP&W to report to possible infractions.

Over the years, laws & the dispensation of such, have & has changed. In the 1960s/1970s, I recall my Dad telling me of one guy who used to run everybody's lines. Even when they knew he had their property. However, they were not Game Wardens, so they would have to somehow present proof. Another guy was having his lines being run by this fellow as well. He parked his boat on the river out of sight & awaited on the other side of the bank, for the guy who would steal not only fish, but some of the trotline components. As the fellow had a mess of fish & property, the guy raised up & confronted him. He told him that he had better stop, return the fish & property, to which the fellow replied that it was his lines & his fish, and his property (of which it was not). The guy gave him his last offer - either return his items & fish or he would sink the fellow's boat. The fellow refused. So the guy raised his 22 rifle & proceeded to shoot safely in the front floor of the fellow's boat. He left the fellow in shallow water with a sunken boat, along with his stolen fish & components.

While this may have been OK back then, it probably is not lawful in today's time. I will twell you this, that the guy who used the rifle became a lawman, as he was checking me out on the rver in the 1980s, I mentioned this story. He admitted he was that guy who sank the fellow's boat. In other words, due to the fellow who would steal, this guy became a lawman to stop such actions (perhaps not in the same manner though).

Is this what you would wish for? Exchange of gunfire or possible violence? The owner of the property, is still the owner of the property, until lawfully taken away by a certified law person. So regardless of being illegal or expired, they (the owner) have (has) the right to protect their property. Do not escalate the problem. Call or contact the proper authorities. Let them deal with it legally. It may take a little more time, but much safer for you.

I'll comment more on the alternate 6 day that they settled on, later. I was hoping fopr a 7 day, or putting hooks in the "saddle" or pulling leaders off. 6 days is tight, but can be managed with more awareness. I don't like the idea of adding the extra float due to the many threats I have received over the years after getting on the Forum. There are those who just promote vigilantism period, thinking they are the authorized avenging angels to do such, even if the line or device is legal or not.

Thanks for update..i hate to hear this. Especially on marking trotline. Lines
will be empty if not stolen unless your there everyday with a marker advertising.
I also understand from post above that he has them floating in his cove
and i wouldn't be to happy about that if there was quite a few and would a game
warden come right away to remove it if you called? Probably not. I think all
the reckless noodle rage setting out so many that covers a large area and it's
Legal to have 100 ruined it for the trotliner. My 2 cents.