Murder or Not?

I’m here for the screen shot

Probably

I'll get a rope.

Please make this man well and make it stop.

Lol, I'll play. Not murder. When you and the little miss have been fighting and the cops are on the way it's probably not the best idea to be standing in the kitchen with a gun when they come through the door. And probably equally bad idea to tell them dont come in here boss...... if your goal is to get shot by police I would think that would usually get it done.

suicide by cop !

hmm having a gun in ones own house standing in the kitchen by himself should be shot by a cop. BS The women we outside no one was in danger till the cop went in and killed him. I doubt the cop gets in trouble but I don't understand how anyone thinks he should have been shot for owning a gun in his house

what happen to castle laws, the cop went into his house and everyone was out of there but him

I doubt murder will get any traction. Maybe some lesser manslaughter charges might be filed. I didn’t really see any thing the guy did to instigate the shooting he got. Maybe I missed some aggressive move, but it seems the cop could have backed off and de escalated the situation. Just another reason being a cop was never an option for me.

It's just common sense, try and put the odds in your favor and this guy clearly did not. First off why in the middle of a domestic dispute do you go get the gun? Is it your wubby, your safety blanket? The police show up to a frantic caller, she comes running out of house like it's on fire, LEO enters and there is a DA standing in the kitchen with a gun and threatens him.....sometimes stupid gets what it gets and that's just how it goes.

I understand your reasoning here….but, at the point where a cop is in your house with his gun drawn, it would be a pretty good idea to put yours down or risk the consequences. You can have your “I have the right to be in my house with a gun” argument better if you are still alive.

I agree with WAWI it was incredibly stupid of the guy to have a gun in that situation. That said, I slowed the video down as much as possible, I did not see the man raise the weapon. Hard to tell though. Nobody seems erratic. The man responded to the cop calmly. In my opinion the cop should have issued a command to drop the weapon and only fired if the man raised the weapon. Agree with Hasben de-escalation would have been a better path. Tough to Monday morning quarterback.

I knew I could make a proper person out of you at some point

I also didn't see anything in the video that the man raised his gun and why did the police go in if the lady was outside saying he has a gun. Why didn't they just order him outside without the gun. I don't see any reason for the cops to go in period at that point. The people are upset, the police are in charge and why didn't they deescalate the situation and or shoot a gas can in to force him out or just let him settle down and walk out on his own. The guy went in with gun pulled for what reason no one was in there but the man with a gun in his own house.
yes should he have put his gun down yes but it was his house and probably expected the police to protect him also not come in with guns a blazing
There was simply no reason for this shooting at this point when the police had other options that may save lives

Play stupid games win stupid prizes

your right the police should be able to just go kill anyone they want.

I wonder if they start first in restaurants if you have the same attitude in your home or business. There is no proof the guy even threaten the officer before he shot the man

the wife is outside so why in your great wisdom did they need to shoot the man? did they shoot him so he wouldn't shoot himself, he wasn't at that point threatening anyone the gun was pointed toward the floor

I wish I worked in the simplistic world you envision. Imagine going to a domestic where a woman just got her [censored] beat. Everything she owns and values is inside the residence along with all the evidence of the assault. Then you tell her you are going to leave him in the house and deal with it another time. Her phone, clothes, car keys etc are in there. But no, ma’am you have to leave. We are escorting you off the property for the night. I’m not saying they made the right decision but it’s just not as easy as you envision.

really it's done all the time/ are you serious kidding me. I never said they needed to leave one time did I, you made that up in your faux BS. I said everyone is on the outside why not back off and let everyone calm down and order the guy outside or shoot a smoke canister in there. they had lots of options. good gosh the police are supposed to be the adults

It's really easy to not get shot by police, generally you have to really make an effort for it to happen.

and as far as it's not done. I was in /arkansas working in 2022 and my wife filed for divorce and the court order me not to go back in the house and I have not gotten any of my stuff back yet. I am still fighting to get my stuff and I have never been charged with any assault whether domestic or any other so your BS rant is total BS [censored]. A 911 call doesn't mean the guy is guilt I guess you didn't know in this country a man is innocent to proven guilty. I had a EX Wife accuse me one night back in 1991 the police came out when they were through the apologized to me and gave me my kids she went to jail so men are no always guilty. There are two sides and women don't always tell the truth in these calls. So you agree just go should the man because his wife call 911 BS

The ol’’kill a dude in his house because his wife’s phone is left inside defense. 🤣🤣

really he did nothing but stand in his house with a gun he own what else did he do to deserve to be shot? Do you have proof he beat his wife prior to the 911 call do you have proof he threaten the officer who came into his house.

yep this seems to be the thought around here today LOL just kill em all let the good lord sort it out today defense

I never implied he deserved to be shot. But the fact remains he did and it was avoidable….both by his own actions and the police’s actions. It like I have told my son….just because you have “rights” doesn’t mean you should exercise them whenever you want without discretion.

Again, I’m just trying to give you perspective, not start a fight. Yes, I agree nothing has been proven, but in your scenario you gas him and risk burning his house down. All I’m saying is it’s never as easy as it seems from the outside after the fact.

Play it again from the 50 second mark. Turn the sound off so you don't get distracted. When you first see him in the frame, the dude has his right arm behind his back hiding the gun. At the 52 mark he begins to turn, brandishing the gun and swinging it around to the front. Was he intending to bring it up, who knows, but that was definitely enough of a movement to be considered a threat to the LEO in my mind.

I hope this video is shown to cops all over the country in training sessions for de-escalation techniques. I hope this particular cop is spends some time reflecting on the incident and applying what he learned to future incidents. Criminal charges or even disciplinary actions... absolutely not.

Bottom line is the guy was arguing with the wife to the point the kid felt the need to call 911. The wife runs out of the house like a cat trapped in the trunk of a car. Then the cop shows up and finds a dude swinging a gun around... This isn't the movies. Shouting "drop it" at that point only puts the LEO's life in danger.

This is pretty simple, don’t act like a worthless wife beating idiot and you want get shot. End of discussion.

There are lots of things that may be legal but are a really bad idea. You go to the top of a tall building, you can stand in the middle, you can stand inside the rail, but you decide to stand on the top of the rail on one leg..... a gust of wind suddenly blows you off. Is it the winds fault..... this is what I think of some of the castle, stand your ground, dummies with gun laws. And I'm pro gun, I have a bunch, I keep one here and there in case I need one. I'm anti stupid and when bad things happen to stupid people I blame the stupid person. It's a simple concept.

And before you say he was within his rights can you at least admit the obvious that coming out from behind a wall with an AR 15 at your side telling the cops don't cone in here is incredibly stupid..... if we can't agree on that then I can't help you.

Been in a lot of armed suspect situations, have you?

But what is she was talking a lot of sh**? Like mad s talking.

Never, ever present yourself as a threat to a police officer. Unless you are ready to assume room temperature.

I like to consider possible outcomes....I see 3 and 2 are really bad and 1 while better is still bad.

1. What happened, you are dead....
2. You end up shooting the Leo and he is dead and you are getting the death penalty
3. The Leo backs out, you end up in some kind of hostage situation whether that was your intention or not. You go to jail or the nut house or both.

Any other outcome is pie in the sky nonsense. Call me crazy but I would choose none of the above and leave my guns in the closet, take the domestic disturbance wrap, get a divorce, and move on.

That math is pretty easy.

"Hello, 911, yeah it's me again, my dad's calmed down but now my mom is screaming a lot"

Badda bing!

I have to say that in that situation, having a gun in your hand with a cop coming in and doing anything except putting it down is about the least intelligent thing you could possibly do.

^This 100%! I’ll bet her husband learned a very valuable lesson and will never do it again.

I've watched this about 25 or 40 times trying to see and hear what was said inside the house.
Gave up on that but I'm guessing that cop had trained pretty darn well on when to drop a mag and slap in a fresh one like that.
it looked like he started out with pistol in right hand, then went to both hands?

7 rounds fired. He dropped that first mag and slammed in a full one and looked to me like he had a round back in the chamber - all in a bit less than 1 second from mag drop till ready to fire.
I can't imagine learning to do that so quick especially in a real life situation without practing 100's and 100's of hours.
Mabe one of our current or retired LEO'S can explain what kind of training that requires. Or other comments on the whole affair.

Good shooting, sure, but shouldn't he have announced his presence before going in? " Hey police are here, come out so we can talk to you". Are they not trained to do that?

Hard to make a judgement based on that video. He came around the corner and there the guy is armed and ready. If you hesitate, maybe he starts shooting, it's a bad situation and I am in the camp, that if the cops come, don't have a weapon in your hands because they may shoot you if you do.

He never even had an opportunity to drop it- he didn’t point it at the officer. I don’t think the officer had any other options at that point- but he should’ve waited to go in.

My only question is who parks a hot rod side by side in their driveway in the suburbs?

WAWI I have never said he wasn’t stupid,dumbazz or anything else you would like to write in here, He had options for sure, my point is the officer is the adult and should have waited when he lady ran outside, no one was in there at that point. That guy should be in jail right now not dead. I am only saying the office didn't need to push the issues right then nothing more. He didn't announce a police officer was coming in, he did nothing from what I can tell on the video to deescalate the situation. The guy doesn't have great IQ are he wouldn't be arguing with his wife to the point the kid felt the need to call the police and the kid didn't say on the call he was beating his mother he said they won't quit hollerin at one another.

I don't think the cop had a heck of a lot of choices once he decided to push the issue. The guy is dead because he's stupid, the cop could have and should have once the wife ran outside to stop and find out what needs to be done at that point, not just ran in and killed some nut so he can have a good video. just my .02

I agree with you on this. From the video it’s a hold not a push. There may be a lot more we don’t know and that one video alone may not tell the whole story. I will also tell you that bodycam playback has limitations in real time due to how the massive amounts of video are stored in the cloud based systems. You would need to break the original video down frame by frame to get all the detail the officer saw.

I’m tired of seeing LE have to baby these idiots. Act right and there’s near zero chance what happened to the idiot happens to you. I think his FA and his FO were at equilibrium.

Yup, fafo 100 percent applies here. Clearly the dead guy was a moron and those aren't in short supply anyway

from here on out it will be the dead dudes wife

So where was the kid that made the call? Was he in the house? Maybe that is why the cop went in.

don't know but if he stops and talks to the wife he would have found out.

She wasn't stopping to talk.