John 14::6 question

Jesus said no one gets to the father except thru me....so the way I understand it Jesus is saying the only way to heaven is thru him....my question What about the time before the birth of Jesus .How did people get to heaven ?

before him it was by living by God's laws

I want to know if dinosaurs were before or after Jesus. If the earth was void with darkness , then when were the dinosaurs here?

so many questions

Law of Moses had to keep the law. God is the ultimate judge.

Stairway

The Bible says once one is Heaven that mysteries will be answered.

Ecclesiastes 3:11 “He has made everything beautiful in its time. Also, he has put eternity into man’s heart, yet so that he cannot find out what God has done from the beginning to the end.” (this last phrase is important.

Read more: https://www.whatchristianswanttoknow.com/8-favorite-bible-verses-about-gods-timing/#ixzz64cI3r88j

I personally believe God did things over time, a long time. Created the Earth, in his order of things. Humans were last. The Bible also say God's timing is not the same as ours II Peter 3:8

Zep?

Way, way before.

Jesus was on earth approximately 2000 years ago. The Dino extinction began approx. 245 million years ago and the last Dinos died about 65 million years ago.

Good chance the first Dino's may have been created during the 6 days that God created the heavens and the earth.

John 3:13


Revelation 20 11-15

Before him you had to keep the law to "earn" your way if you will. But no one could keep the law. Jesus sacrifice allowed those who were faithful and believed to have their sins covered by his blood as well. So they "get to the Father" through him as well.

I hope that helps.

Following the law of God before Jesus wouldn't save you anymore then following it today. God's law was put forth to show the futility of man trying to earn his way into heaven, it is impossible to follow God's law. Jesus wasn't contradicting himself, when he said no man enters heaven but through me.

Paul said, “Whom God set forth as a propitiation by His blood, through faith, to demonstrate His righteousness, because in His forbearance God had passed over the sins that were previously committed” Romans 3:25 God could pass over these sins previously committed because in his mind Jesus had already paid the price.

Before Jesus folks were saved on the basis of His death. But it required faith as it does today, faith that Jesus was going to come and pay for your sins. 2000 years before Christ, Job said, "I know that my Redeemer lives, and He shall stand at last on the earth. And after my skin is destroyed, this I know, that in my flesh I shall see God” Job 19:25-26

Avoid putting a timeline on God as he doesn't live in the constraints of the time that he created for us. If you exist out of time then you have always been. At the Mount of Olives the Pharisees thought Jesus was demon possesed because he spoke of the past, this confused them and rightly so. But Jesus spoke the truth. They said to him, “You are not yet fifty years old and you have seen Abraham!” Jesus replied, “Very truly I tell you before Abraham was born, I am!” John 8:57-58

Day 6

If Adam was the first man, then was he a caveman?

Science can explain away lots of things especially things that contradict their narrative. For example intact 75 million year old red blood cells and proteins in bones. We are talking hemoglobin, collagen and soft tissue surviving for 75 million years!! You ask a scientist before this was discovered he'd say with certainty it would be impossible! But now it has been discovered, science can explain it away! Like those star trek show with a bunch of techno/psudeo science babble. More and more scientist are distancing themselves from the "evolution as we know it" theory. DNA is becoming more and more of an issue. Because DNA is programmed. Like a PC our body parts is the hardware but who put all the ones and zeros in perfect order to program it? Except DNA is infinitely more complex, hell a single cell is more complex then a computer. How many billions of years would it take for a PC to finally form by random technological mutation and then intelligently program itself? It is improbable mathematically even with infinite time. Faith is required just as much in science as in religion.

Tell me more about this hemoglobin you speak of. I think I might enjoy hemoglobin talk.

So much wrongness in these statements.

Wow...that's insightful.


Very insightful thanks for your opinion.

DNA..and O.J. got away free

In Revelations Chapter 20 it says that two books were open and then the Book of Life. The dead were judged by what they did, meaning to me the first two unnamed books are the good and bad deeds recorded. Continuing on it says that whoever name is not found in the Book of Life will be cast into the lake of fire. I believe that everyone's name starts out in the Book of Life. Read Luke 10:20. In the Old Testament both Moses and David asked God to blot the names of their enemies out of the "book", which I believe is the Book of Life. John 3:16 says "whoever believes in Him (Christ) will not perish but have eternal life". It becomes necessary then to confess that belief and follow. To do that you must be able to understand what it means. Now, what about those aborted, babies, children, the mentally challenged that had no understanding of what is necessary to follow Christ? I do not believe because of their innocence God would cast these into the lake of fire anyway, but their names must be in the Book of Life to fulfill the Word. Since God knew this their names are already in the Book of Life and will not blot them out because they never had a chance to believe. Therefore they will be waiting on us in heaven. Those that never confessed or believed in Christ at an accountable age, their names will be blotted out at the time of their death after giving them the chance up to death.

So those that died prior to Christ, their names are in the Book of Life unless blotted out by God. Remember they had the sacrificial opportunities for the forgiveness of sin.
One man's understanding of scripture.

Well said! I’ve known pastors who had less understanding on this subject! Also the one who posted about the ones who lived before Christ believing He would come and die for them were saved by their belief just as we who live after Him believe he did come and die for us.

Humans, dinosaurs and Amazon delivery drivers all roamed the earth at the same time.

That’s in the Bible too Exodus 4:24–26

Chapter 20 is the judgement of the lost that are in hades. The books are records of every deed that a person has done. These lost folks being judge will all be casted into the lake of fire as well as death.

Revelation 17:8 contradicts that everyone starts off in the book of life. "The beast that you saw was, and is not, and is about to come up out of the abyss and go to destruction. And those who dwell on the earth, whose name has not been written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, will wonder when they see the beast, that he was and is not and will come"

The psalmist was referring to the book of the living, a register of those born, from which you then become a candidate for salvation. When you are blotted out then you have crossed the line and are no longer a candidate for salvation (shall not be written with the righteous). This is a prophetic.

Romans Chapter 1 and 2 deals with your premise.

The Bible is extremely clear. "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God, not by works, so that no one can boast." Ephesians 2:8-9

Faith in the redemption of the coming Christ, during His life or after His death and resurrection, is the only way to get your name into the book of life.

A George Carlin routine comes to mind. Nope. Not posing that.

Great reply and I appreciate being corrected. "The inhabitants of the earth whose names have not been written in the book of life from the creation of the earth will be astonished". Indeed by this scripture you are correct that not all names are in the book of life. If I read this right then there must have been names that were written in the book of life at the beginning of the world and some were not. Which now brings up the subject of "God's chosen". If they were names in the book of life at the creation of world then these must be God's chosen as Paul wrote about many times. I know we can go on and on, many of the mysteries of the Bible will be revealed to us at the proper time. God Bless my friends.

Plus #1.


Jesus is the only way to haven! All I am is a "Sinner Saved by Grace"! God said. "Repent and call upon the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shall be saved". Thank God for Jesus!

First read Genesis 1:26

26 Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals, and over all the creatures that move along the ground.” 27 So God created mankind in his own image, in the image of God he created them; male and female he created them.

Who do you think God was talking to when he said “Let us make man in our image” . God was talking to Jesus cause Jesus was with God from the beginning . In the bible Jesus says when you’ve seen me you’ve seen the Father . God and Jesus are one and the Trinity is God the Father , Jesus and the Holy Ghost . You are correct when you stated Jesus said no one gets to the father except thru me....so the way I understand it Jesus is saying the only way to heaven is thru him .

Now what happened to those who believe in God in the Old Testament when they died ?

1 Thessalonians 4:16 NIV
16 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.

This happens at the beginning of the Tribulations because Believers in Christ will not be on earth during the Tribulations . We will rise at the Trumpet Call and meet Jesus in the clouds . You can study this all in the book of Revelations which is the last book of the bible and was written for the believer . Believers will be with Christ until Judgement day which is after the 7 yrs of Tribulations .

So to pinpoint your question “What happened to believers before Christ that died ? The Dead In Christ Will Rise First , that’s everyone that was a believer from the beginning of the creation of man up to the time of the Trumpet call !

Pre Tribulation Fasle Doctrine- Doctrine of the Devil!

explanation pls

According to Christianity... Jeffrey Dahmer is in heaven and Anne Frank is in hell. That's all you need to know.

There is no Rapture RayBob! That's not what Paul's letter too the Thesalonican Church said..... Scripture taken out of context by Men. False Teachings.


When the Great Flood came Noah and his family were left behind, The Wicked were Taken. So it will
be in The Coming of the Son of Man!

agree on no rapture.

+2

ridiculous

some great thoughts here

John 17:5 is where it's at. Peace and love.

I like these threads.

Why is that ridiculous?

The second coming of Christ is not the end of mortal humans living on this earth. It is also not the end of the tares among the wheat – that is to say, bad people being mixed in with God’s people before the harvest. It is not the end of Satan’s evil influence on earth either. That all happens a thousand years later. Regarding the explanation that Jesus gave about the wicked first being removed and cast into the fire at the end of the age, that is indeed confirmed in Revelation 20. But the end of the age is when the final judgment comes (or more accurately, the White Throne Judgment) and it happens ten centuries after the second coming.

In th final judgment. Satan is then cast into the lake of fire as its third occupant. The books are opened and everybody who ever lived gets their day in court before God. Not pre-millennial Christians of course, for us it is simply case dismissed. This event is the great white throne judgment, and is the actual gathering of the tares spoken of in the parable. It is described in Revelation 20:11-15.

This is not true sir. Overall support for the theory of evolution among scientist sits at about 97% across all disciplines. (Note, with this lose definition I would count as a scientist as an Engineer) When we look at biologist specifically, the folks who actually are experts in the area, it's 99%+. Even the pope recognizes evolution is real. A great book I recommend is "Finding Darwin's God, by Kenneth Miller." It was written by the man who headed up the human genome project, and who also happens to be a Christian, and a evolutionist. You cannot read this book and be a thinking human being and walk away not recognizing evolution happened. It's easily had tomorrow at your door step for 10 dollars. Links below:

Book: https://www.amazon.com/Finding-Darw...arwins+god&qid=1573237922&sr=8-3
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Level_of_support_for_evolution

In fact, here's a challenge I'll throw out. If you buy the book and read the book, and are willing to discuss it with me so I know you actually read it... I will reimburse you for your expense if you are unconvinced.


DNA is not programmed. It only appears programmed because it's the result of billions of years of evolution. If it were programmed, it would actually be a terrible programming job. Why? Because big chunks of the information in our genome is junk. Estimates range anywhere from 15-75%, but whatever the number, huge chunks of our DNA is just left over useless junk form our evolutionary history. If you want to know exactly how evolution built up the genome in great detail, please see that book I recommended.


I don't know how long it would take a PC to program itself intelligently, but our DNA was stitched together in about 3 or 4 billion years of natural selection. Once you understand how that process works, you'll realize it's not only mathematically possible, but probable. (Again reference that book I recommended). Cheers good sir!

My offer on the book by the way, is open to anyone on the forum. Just let me know you plan to take me up on it. If you are sure it's wrong, you've got nothing to lose right? Worst case, you'll be a little more educated on the other side of things!

That I agree with , all things will be revealed in Heaven . Personally what I believe with dinosaurs is they were before Noahs' time cause the great flood covered the face of the earth and all creatures that were left behind were destroyed . However 25 yrs ago my preacher gave me a research copy which I no longer have and what we know for sure is one male and one female of every creature God had created was on the Ark . So I asked were dinosaurs on the Ark too and he said did you ever think about "EGGS" ? But for some reason I was very skeptical about the study so I never got into it and since then have lost my study material my preacher gave me . One thing I do know for certain is that Satan or Lucifer as mentioned was kicked out of Heaven before the creation of Man and he was given the right to rule over darkness on the Earth . His goal was to corrupt man that God created which has been successful starting when Eve took a bite of the Forbidden Fruit in the Garden Eden .

Yes many mysteries for man to wonder , but will be revealed in Heaven after the Final Judgement .

you don't know what God does
why would he send Anne Frank to he77 ?

This stuff is wild. Reminds me of a big fishing expedition with no end in sight.

PM sent

Darwins book is a contradictory book to the Holy Bible . Don’t believe it and dont waste your money !!

Because she was Jewish and the Jewish faith does not recognize the divinity of Jesus.

Are you suggesting belief and acceptance of Jesus and the resurrection are not required to go to heaven? Isn't the entire religion centered around that belief? Will you please explain what IS required to go to heaven? And what does it mean to be a Christian in your mind?

There's only 2 options right? Heaven or Hell? If Anne Frank is not in heaven because she did not accept Jesus as her lord and savior, then she's in hell right? (I don't think's she's in either)

I'm an atheist, if I were to die right now would I go to heaven or hell? Jefferey Dahmer was baptized and converted to Christianity in prison; assuming he was sincere, is he in heaven?

so to be clear, you want someone here to be an apologist for God? to presume to know the will of God?

Because she was Jewish and the Jewish faith does not recognize the divinity of Jesus.

Are you suggesting belief and acceptance of Jesus and the resurrection are not required to go to heaven? Isn't the entire religion centered around that belief? Will you please explain what IS required to go to heaven? And what does it mean to be a Christian in your mind?

There's only 2 options right? Heaven or Hell? If Anne Frank is not in heaven because she did not accept Jesus as her lord and savior, then she's in hell right? (I don't think's she's in either)

I'm an atheist, if I were to die right now would I go to heaven or hell? Jefferey Dahmer was baptized and converted to Christianity in prison; assuming he was sincere, is he in heaven?
[/quote]

Dahmer might well be.
One of the thieves on the cross accepted Jesus just before death. Jesus said 'today you'll be in heaven with me'. So he gives you a chance to the last minute to trust in his death. How cool is that? But don't wait, no man know the day and time of his last breath to accept this free gift, today may be your last! ;/0

Dahmer might well be.
One of the thieves on the cross accepted Jesus just before death. Jesus said 'today you'll be in heaven with me'. So he gives you a chance to the last minute to trust in his death. How cool is that? But don't wait, no man know the day and time of his last breath to accept this free gift, today may be your last! ;/0
[/quote]

Right so Dahmer is in heaven... how about Anne Frank?

Wouldn't mind acknowledgement of everything that comes with the faith.

How about you Bob? Is Anne Frank in heaven? Hell? Neither? I don't expect you to know the will of god; I just want your opinion.

According to Christianity... Jeffrey Dahmer is in heaven and Anne Frank is in hell. That's all you need to know.[/quote]

ridiculous

Why is that ridiculous?[/quote]

you don't know what God does
why would he send Anne Frank to he77 ? [/quote]

Because she was Jewish and the Jewish faith does not recognize the divinity of Jesus.

Are you suggesting belief and acceptance of Jesus and the resurrection are not required to go to heaven? Isn't the entire religion centered around that belief? Will you please explain what IS required to go to heaven? And what does it mean to be a Christian in your mind?

There's only 2 options right? Heaven or Hell? If Anne Frank is not in heaven because she did not accept Jesus as her lord and savior, then she's in hell right? (I don't think's she's in either)

I'm an atheist, if I were to die right now would I go to heaven or hell? Jefferey Dahmer was baptized and converted to Christianity in prison; assuming he was sincere, is he in heaven?
[/quote]

since you don't follow Christ, you will not understand how he works.
I hope when you die, & see the truth, you will have the opportunity to change your mind.

yep
wacked out

No idea. Seriously. I don't know her heart and my judgment is clouded by sin. Don't get the Anne Frank thing, i live with an agnostic and a son who has limited understanding of it. Same thing.

If any of you actually read the dairy of Anne Frank you may be surprised that her father asked for a children's Bible so "I (Anne) could finally learn something about the new testament". This doesn't mean she is saved but certainly means she was open to other views of religion. No one knows the thoughts of man except God. It is a rhetorical question anyways so Matthew 7:6 would apply here.

Didn't realize there are so many theologians here on TFF. There has only been one response that made any biblical sense out of the 4 pages ROFL

Ill explain. Because that particular doctrine is from the 1800s, Margrett Mcdonald comes to mind, a short time later John Darby and C.I. Scofield come along with there "new" bibles after her prophesies. Lastly, all biblical prophecy ended around 70 AD , its a mute point for today other than causing Chritians and Non Christians to argue .

For those who believe Revelation is speaking about future events, you would do well to read the Prologue. The writer of the book of Revelation was clear and precise as too "when" the events of the book or Revelation were to occur. No matter what you or I think the symbolism, apocalyptic language, metaphors ect mean the author of the letter clearly said "when" it would happen.

1 The revelation from Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show his servants what must soon take place. He made it known by sending his angel to his servant John, 2 who testifies to everything he saw—that is, the word of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ. 3 Blessed is the one who reads aloud the words of this prophecy, and blessed are those who hear it and take to heart what is written in it, because the time is near.

Google the greek words for "soon" and "near". its no secret what they meant in the first century and is why our translators used the English words in our bible.

Soon. τάχει (tachei) meaning speed
Near. ἐγγύς (Angus) meaning near (in place or time)

What's your point?

what's your point ? You at least looked up the meanings (kinda) . Look up each usage of those words in the N.T. and see how the apostles used them and what they meant . I think you will get my point.

Genesis 15:6
Abram believed the Lord, and he credited it to him as righteousness.

Jesus IS God. In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God. Nothing has changed.. There is no before Jesus.

Acts 2:21
And everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.’

Speed ………………………….doesn't mean 2000 years.

Near in place or time ……………….doesn't mean 2000 years

At least that is not how N.T. writers used those greek words in other text.

Please don't quote Second Peter 3:8 unless you read the whole context of what Peter wrote.

i am really interested in your opinion
you obviously know The Word
what was the right response?

C.S. Lewis, one of the greatest defenders of the Christian faith, once stated:


Say what you like, we shall be told, ‘the apocalyptic beliefs of the first Christians have been proved to be false. It is clear from the New Testament that they all expected the Second Coming in their own lifetime. And, worse still, they had a reason, and one which you will find very embarrassing. Their Master had told them so.
He shared, and indeed created, their delusion. He said in so many words, ‘this generation shall not pass till all these things be done.’ And He was wrong. He clearly knew no more about the end of the world than anyone else.’ It is certainly the most embarrassing verse in the Bible [emphasis mine].


How sad...…………………………….. Cant we take Jesus and His apostles at their word ? Instead we make statements like "false" "embarrassing" "delusion" "He (Jesus) was wrong"...……………...………….

It is not the most embarrassing verse in the Bible...…...………...…………...I say, it is the most accurate words in the Bible.


Hope you all read Mathew 24 closely...…………...its starts with disciples questions ……………………..ends with Jesus stating that "THIS current" NOT "THAT future" generation would not pass away until ALL THESE THINGS COME TO PASS.

We'll said.

24 Then Jesus said to his disciples, “Whoever wants to be my disciple must deny themselves and take up their cross and follow me. 25 For whoever wants to save their life[f] will lose it, but whoever loses their life for me will find it. 26 What good will it be for someone to gain the whole world, yet forfeit their soul? Or what can anyone give in exchange for their soul? 27 For the Son of Man is going to come in his Father’s glory with his angels, and then he will reward each person according to what they have done.
28 “Truly I tell you, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom.”[u][/u]


There were some standing in the presence of Jesus while He was speaking 2000 years ago...……….Jesus said "Truly I tell you...………………………………….some who are standing here will not taste death before...…………..the see the Son of Man coming (Parousia) in His kingdom.


think about that

There is not a Revelations (plural) there is only one letter Revelation.

simper answer...……………..Faith

Living by Gods law NEVER saved one soul. Law brings death.

Zep is closer to answers than most of these replies LOL Keep the faith.

That's funny. LOL

GODSDOZER you seem to be a pretty smart and well versed when it comes to this. I have a question. Do you know/think if hemoglobin can live for 75 million years?

thanks

Not many believers read that text correctly as you have. Thanks

They think the righteous are taken (rapture, uggh ) and evil left, exact opposite of the scripture says.

LOL Derek, I have no clue. I just read the bible and undertand that the Hemoblogin of Jesus is very sufficient. On a different note, instead of Science (hypothesis) I lean more towards the scriptures as we have them.

Good enough for me. I like very sufficient stuff. Like my Ford F150. I think I would like some of Jesus' Hemoglobin. Or at least my hemoglobin to be like his hemoglobin.

I believe in one God, the Father Almighty, Maker of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible. And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of the Father before all worlds; God of God, Light of Light, very God of very God; begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father, by whom all things were made. Who, for us men and for our salvation, came down from heaven, and was incarnate by the Holy Spirit of the virgin Mary, and was made man; and was crucified also for us under Pontius Pilate; He suffered and was buried; and the third day He rose again, according to the Scriptures; and ascended into heaven, and sits on the right hand of the Father; and He shall come again, with glory, to judge the quick and the dead; whose kingdom shall have no end. And I believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord and Giver of Life; who proceeds from the Father and the Son; who with the Father and the Son together is worshipped and glorified; who spoke by the prophets. And I believe in one holy Christian and apostolic Church. I acknowledge one baptism for the remission of sins; and I look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the world to come. Amen.

Is that the Athenians creed ?

I believe in one God, the Father almighty, maker of heaven and earth and of all things visible and invisible. And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of the Father before all ages, God of God, Light of Light, very God of very God, begotten not made, being of one substance with the Father, through Whom all things were made: Who for us men and for our salvation came down from heaven, was incarnate by the Holy Spirit of the virgin Mary, and was made man: Who for us, too, was crucified under Pontius Pilate, suffered, and was buried: the third day He rose according to the Scriptures, ascended into heaven, and is seated on the right hand of the Father: He shall come again with glory to judge the living and the dead, and His kingdom shall have no end. And in the Holy Spirit, the Lord and Giver of life, Who proceeds from the Father and the Son: Who together with the Father and the Son is worshiped and glorified: Who spoke by the prophets. And I believe one holy, Christian, and apostolic Church. I acknowledge one baptism for the remission of sins, and I look for the resurrection of the dead and life of the age to come. Amen.

Or the Nicene ?

I believe in God the Father Almighty, Maker of heaven and earth. And in Jesus Christ, His only Son, our Lord; Who was conceived by the Holy Spirit; Born of the Virgin Mary; Suffered under Pontius Pilate; Was crucified, dead and buried; He descended into Hell; The third day He rose again from the dead; He ascended into heaven; And sitteth on the right hand of God the Father Almighty; From thence He shall come to judge the living and the dead. I believe in the Holy Spirit; The Holy Christian Church, the Communion of Saints; The Forgiveness of sins; The Resurrection of the body; And the life everlasting. Amen.


Or the Apostles creed ?

creeds

Nicene. Lutheran version.

I prefere Dodge Ram Cummins

I cried when Ivan Drago killed him.

With extended mirrors?

I know Bigbob just trying to educate TFF and let them know there are many Creeds over the centuries. Blessings.

I concur as long as baptism is spiritual and not physical.

You must be Catholic?

Can you expand on that please?

I don't believe getting dunked saves you but I do believe in the cleansing power of Christ.


Matthew 3:11
“I baptize you with water for repentance. But after me comes one who is more powerful than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.

Agree.

Matthew 16:28 refers to the transfiguration of Jesus coming into His Kingdom. Which Peter was witness to in 2 Peter 1:16-18. This is the completetion of what was said in Matthew 16:28.


As for rapture. I am tired and really don't feel like educating at the moment but if you want to be, then read this It is about as clear as it gets on the subject and saves me the time of typing it.

As long as you have accepted Christ into your heart and follow his teaching I could care less what a person believes as far as creation or tribulation, that will not keep you from heaven. While I believe reading and understanding the Scripture is very important. What really matters is you are saved and your relationship with Christ.

If you are saved, then that does my heart well enough. From there I would encourage those to seek out the Truth for themselves by asking God to interpret the Scripture through the Holy Spirit. Don't believe simply by hearing mine or anyone else's commentary, do your own homework and by doing so you will grow in the Lord. This I can promise you.

Goodnight y'all.

But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father

Written a few decades after Jesus' ascension ………………………..Think about the implications if you believe in inerrancy/inspiration ect.

Dear children, this is the last hour; and as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come. This is how we know it is the last hour.

Yall have a great day.

[quote=Alumacraft 14]Matthew 16:28 refers to the transfiguration of Jesus coming into His Kingdom. Which Peter was witness to in 2 Peter 1:16-18. This is the completetion of what was said in Matthew 16:28.


As for rapture. I am tired and really don't feel like educating at the moment but if you want to be, then read this It is about as clear as it gets on the subject and saves me the time of typing it.

As long as you have accepted Christ into your heart and follow his teaching I could care less what a person believes as far as creation or tribulation, that will not keep you from heaven. While I believe reading and understanding the Scripture is very important. What really matters is you are saved and your relationship with Christ.

If you are saved, then that does my heart well enough. From there I would encourage those to seek out the Truth for themselves by asking God to interpret the Scripture through the Holy Spirit. Don't believe simply by hearing mine or anyone else's commentary, do your own homework and by doing so you will grow in the Lord. This I can promise you.



4 Then Jesus said to his disciples, “Whoever wants to be my disciple must deny themselves and take up their cross and follow me. 25 For whoever wants to save their life[f] will lose it, but whoever loses their life for me will find it. 26 What good will it be for someone to gain the whole world, yet forfeit their soul? Or what can anyone give in exchange for their soul? 27 For the Son of Man is going to come in his Father’s glory with his angels, and then he will reward each person according to what they have done.


If the passage is speaking of His Transfiguration...……………………...where are the angles in any of the text of the NT that describe Jesus' transfiguration ? (there is none).

Gotta go fishing see yall later

There are no angels in Jesus's transfiguration. Matthew 16:27 is explaining what will happen in the second coming during the final judgement (see Matt 25:31-46). Verse 28 is describing his transfiguration that happens in the next Chapter. Verse 27 doesn't share the same timeline that Jesus proposed in verse 28.

"What does God require of you, O man, other than that you love justice, do kindness and walk humbly before the Lord your God."

21 From that time on Jesus began to explain to his disciples

According to the text, the disciples where the audience Jesus was addressing Verse 21

and is confirmed again in V "24 Then Jesus said to his disciples"


There were no others present according the text.

Jesus then makes this statement to those he was addressing (his disciples)

"28 “Truly I tell you, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom.”

Not all of the disciples were alive when Jesus appeared a second time (Parousia) but rest assured Jesus' words were accurate . Most of the disciples had been martyred before his return but "some" who were standing there when he spoke those words to them didn't taste before the Parousia.

Not sure why you would detach a verse and say Verse 27 and Verse 28 don't share the same timeline unless it is to protect a belief you have.


Enjoy


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Mathew 10 ………………. should make it abundantly clear what Jesus was teaching his disciples about his Parousia (second appearing) and gives a accurate timeline of "when" it would occur.

Jesus Sends Out the Twelve
10 Jesus called his twelve disciples to him and gave them authority to drive out impure spirits and to heal every disease and sickness.
2 These are the names of the twelve apostles: first, Simon (who is called Peter) and his brother Andrew; James son of Zebedee, and his brother John; 3 Philip and Bartholomew; Thomas and Matthew the tax collector; James son of Alphaeus, and Thaddaeus; 4 Simon the Zealot and Judas Iscariot, who betrayed him.
5 These twelve Jesus sent out with the following instructions: “Do not go among the Gentiles or enter any town of the Samaritans. 6 Go rather to the lost sheep of Israel. 7 As you go, proclaim this message: ‘The kingdom of heaven has come near.’ 8 Heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse those who have leprosy,[a] drive out demons. Freely you have received; freely give.
9 “Do not get any gold or silver or copper to take with you in your belts— 10 no bag for the journey or extra shirt or sandals or a staff, for the worker is worth his keep. 11 Whatever town or village you enter, search there for some worthy person and stay at their house until you leave. 12 As you enter the home, give it your greeting. 13 If the home is deserving, let your peace rest on it; if it is not, let your peace return to you. 14 If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, leave that home or town and shake the dust off your feet. 15 Truly I tell you, it will be more bearable for Sodom and Gomorrah on the day of judgment than for that town.
16 “I am sending you out like sheep among wolves. Therefore be as shrewd as snakes and as innocent as doves. 17 Be on your guard; you will be handed over to the local councils and be flogged in the synagogues. 18 On my account you will be brought before governors and kings as witnesses to them and to the Gentiles. 19 But when they arrest you, do not worry about what to say or how to say it. At that time you will be given what to say, 20 for it will not be you speaking, but the Spirit of your Father speaking through you.
21 “Brother will betray brother to death, and a father his child; children will rebel against their parents and have them put to death. 22 You will be hated by everyone because of me, but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved. 23 When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes.


Now unless the 12 apostles are still alive going through the cities of Israel...………………………….The Son of Man must have come already.

Think on these things

Good night.

Seems to me you need to ask Jesus this question.....

As anyone can see in the old testament the best/without blemish animals were sacrificed. Blood was shed. These sacrifices all point forward to Jesus as the ultimate sacrifice.

God is real and his word is indeed the living word.

The book you qoute is actually one of my favorites. Here is my favorite verse although the whole book needs to be read.

John 14 verse 21. He that hath my commandments and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me:and he who loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him. Wanna know if Jesus or God is real? It's written and I am a witness of his love and forgiveness.

Now that's powerful. He is inside of me!!! I am so far from perfect and have plenty of issues but I know for a fact I will go to heaven when I die.

The OP's question is based upon scripture and he/she is seeking an answer from scripture. With this being the chase... on the basis of scripture, the question is flawed. This is not to say that it's a bad question, only that the question implies something that is not true.

The question implies that Jesus came into existence when He was born as a man. However, scripture tells us that Jesus is "God in flesh" and that Jesus has always existed as part of the Trinity.

The first reference to Jesus is in Genesis 1 when God refers to "us" before man was even created.

Genisis1:26 "Then God said, "Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals, and over all the creatures that move along the ground."

All mainstream theologians agree that "us" refers to the Godhead. The Godhead is another word for Trinity, which includes the Father, Son [Jesus] and Holy Spirit. This is based upon several Old and New Testament passages that speak about the Godhead (Father, Son, Holy Spirit) as one God and that the Godhead has always been. There are many Old and New Testament passages that back this up... too many to reference in this post.

The most direct passage that addresses the OP's question is John 1

John 1:1-5: "1 In the beginning was the Word [Jesus], and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning. 3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4 In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind. 5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it."

If you read the entire chapter of John 1 you will see that "the Word" is Jesus. This means that Jesus was "in the beginning"

So, to answer the OP's question... according to scripture, Jesus was in existence before man was created. Therefore, Jesus was able to work in people's life before His birth, as He lived on earth and after He was raised from the dead. This promise extends to us today... and to all generations that follow.

Matthew 24:36 contradicts your preterist theory. I read your rebuttal that this was written a few decades after Christ acension and argueing that is semantics, what matters is when Jesus said it not when it was written (unless you are stating it was written by a false prophet/anti christ, you were quite vague). Jesus spoke the words before he was even crucified as he referenced the destruction of the temple(which was still standing).

Furthermore, verse 3 same Chapter begins with his disciples asking Christ when will He return and what will be the signs. He explains some of the signs refering the book of Daniel and then answers the question of when he will return with verse 36 very clearly.

So within the context of the Matt chapter 24: Christ hasn't been crucified yet, he isn't resurrected and he hasn't ascended yet, the 2nd coming hasn't happened because he is explaining it to the disciples and they are all alive. He is is being asked about when is his second coming will be and he clearly answer, I don't know, no one does, only God.

Back to Matthew 16:28, with Jesus not knowing the day or time there is no way his is speaking about his 2nd coming. Hence Transfiguration. Same applies to Matthew 16:27, and to answer your question, this is how I know he is talking about a different time then the life of the disciples.

Hope you had a good day fishing.

alumacraft, I guess you don't pay attention to my responses, that's ok.

John wrote it was the "last hour"……………………….it seems he knew.

you have to read the scriptures...………………..Jesus told his disciples that he would send the Holy Spirit to them to guide them into ALL TRUTH.

Yes at the time Jesus made the comment to his disciples, No One knew...….Only the Father. That is why it is important to understand when the letters (books of the bible) were written. CONTEXT CONTEXT CONTEXT.

You and I are reading someone elses' mail.

So to be clear, the "tribulation" is now. It started the day Jesus died.

The fourth day and no end in sight.

Why would a god care whether or not you are a believer? Sounds a little self centered to me,

5000 years and no end in sight....

For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.

I've had it with this stuff. Starting my own church - "Church of the Latter Day Sinners". Meets on Sat. nights at Jose Gardcia's Lumber Yard in South Oak Cliff. Pastor is a pole dancer in rehab who provides entertainment after the service. Testimonials and fellowship given around BBQ and beer in the parking lot . Collection plate passed for expenses only.