Texas Fishing Forum

MLF bottom 10 losing tour card

Posted By: Lone_Wolf

MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/15/21 05:06 PM

I thought they were doing a 3 year rolling average to determine who they cut this year but this infers it will just be based on this years standings, does anyone think that say KVD is at the bottom they are actually going to cut him? It may also only be the bottom 6 cut as they didn't replace 4 of the ones that left this year.

[Linked Image]
Posted By: Tx Tree Grower

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/15/21 05:41 PM

I remember when the attached info was published, but I'm not sure if that is still valid. I believe that was published right after the purchase of FLW. Pretty much everything has changed since then. The fact that it still says "[/i]No entry fee Bass Pro Tour[i]" leads me to think maybe it isn't valid. I can't find anything on the recent press releases of Tackle Warehouse Pro Circuit info that says there is a chance to qualify for the BPT. I hope it is still valid though, the noncompetitive guys need to go for the good of any league in my opinion.
Posted By: shotgunwilly

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/15/21 05:50 PM

I doubt it still has any merit. MLF moves the goal posts constantly.
Posted By: Lone_Wolf

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/15/21 05:54 PM

Originally Posted by Tx Tree Grower
I remember when the attached info was published, but I'm not sure if that is still valid. I believe that was published right after the purchase of FLW. Pretty much everything has changed since then. The fact that it still says "[/i]No entry fee Bass Pro Tour[i]" leads me to think maybe it isn't valid. I can't find anything on the recent press releases of Tackle Warehouse Pro Circuit info that says there is a chance to qualify for the BPT. I hope it is still valid though, the noncompetitive guys need to go for the good of any league in my opinion.

That's true I didn't notice that, the names of the two feeder series have since changed also
Posted By: the skipper

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/15/21 06:37 PM

The owners wont get kicked.
Posted By: 206champion

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/15/21 06:43 PM

It’s a secret like everything else with MLF
Posted By: McLovin’

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/15/21 07:55 PM

Like playing golf and changing rules every other hole...they need to figure this out and leave it
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/15/21 11:50 PM

Originally Posted by 206champion
It’s a secret like everything else with MLF



What do they keep secret besides the results of the 4 cups?
Posted By: TxBazzn

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/15/21 11:57 PM

No. They will never kick out a brand name. That’s a major reason they started this thing in the first place. Security.

Don’t bother trying to figure this league out, nothing is set in stone until it actually happens.
Posted By: Lone_Wolf

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/16/21 01:23 AM

Originally Posted by TxBazzn
No. They will never kick out a brand name. That’s a major reason they started this thing in the first place. Security.

Don’t bother trying to figure this league out, nothing is set in stone until it actually happens.


Bassmaster has a history of changing the qualification rules year to year also, they would be smart to stop doing that and be the more credible league
Posted By: BigDozer66

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/16/21 01:29 AM

confused 3
Posted By: WAWI

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/16/21 03:09 AM

Red Crest is a stupid name and I'm boycotting such nonsense
Posted By: Finesse EMPEROR/ Dropshot King

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/16/21 06:15 AM

Originally Posted by WAWI
Red Crest is a stupid name and I'm boycotting such nonsense



popcorn
Posted By: Fishspanker

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/16/21 12:10 PM

10up and 10 down to the BPT every year. Idon’t see how they can keep a bottom 10 guy up there. However they seem to make the rules as they go along. I don’t know anyone who really follows it anymore. The whole thing isn’t going to last anyway.

It’s actually a pretty fair deal as you only go down a level at a time.

A lot of guys want out. I don’t see that number getting less but you never know.
Posted By: 206champion

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/16/21 03:17 PM

Originally Posted by Dubee
[quote=206champion]It’s a secret like everything else with MLF



What do they keep secret besides the results of the 4 cups?
It may be only the 4 cups but I never see anything live anymore and I can’t get into the results that happened months ago.
Posted By: beartrap

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/16/21 04:33 PM

keep in mind that it took several years for the Bassmaster Classic to grow to where they drew enough people to attract exhibitors to their tournament.....and for years the only TV exposure BASS fishermen got was 30 hours or less a year and most of that was standing on the stage holding up a fish or a trophy.
MLF fishing has achieved 850 hours of TV exposure a year over 5 networks and it is now rated as the #1 rated outdoor program....more importantly it's close up exposure where each fisherman and their sponsors get national TV exposure..this makes it a lot easier for pros to gain sponsorship......also both college and high school fishing is showing huge growth and this will generate future growth as the parents,friends and relatives of these kids follow their fishing careers...
there's a lot of criticism directed at boyd duckett and several others for forming major league fishing and for leaving BASS but keep in mind,BASS had 40 years to grow the sport and all they had accomphlished is about 30 hours of TV exposure and fishermen were still fishing for their own entry fees...
my prediction is that 20 years from now,professional fishermen are going to thank Duckett for paving the way for them to make a good living at fishing......and....us non professional fishermen are going to cuss him for popularizing fishing to the point where every lake to drastically overcrowded....
Posted By: Lone_Wolf

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/16/21 06:09 PM

Originally Posted by 206champion
Originally Posted by Dubee
[quote=206champion]It’s a secret like everything else with MLF



What do they keep secret besides the results of the 4 cups?
It may be only the 4 cups but I never see anything live anymore and I can’t get into the results that happened months ago.

Well it is the off season, they will be live again in february. I really don't understand why they don't do a cup after every two BPT events and show that cup LIVE. Make the BPT go to big 5 catch weigh release and leave the MLF format for the no info mystery lake cups. Make those 4 cup events the majors with the most $$$, I think if they'd had followed this route they would be in much better shape than they currently are.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/16/21 09:09 PM

Originally Posted by beartrap
...
MLF fishing has achieved 850 hours of TV exposure a year over 5 networks and it is now rated as the #1 rated outdoor program...


That’s a self proclaimed narrative that no one believes, including the sponsors that pulled out of MLF/BPT after 1 year and felt like they were sold a bill of goods because they realized those numbers weren’t coming even close to adding up. Oh, you also omitted that KSE (majority owner in MLF) also has majority ownership stakes in 4 of the 5 networks they put broadcast hours on.

If they were doing so good they wouldn’t have cheated the anglers out of so much purse money in 2020. Can’t wait to see what’s in store for 2021 after the success they had last year. That was a slick move on the skimming of $100k out from under the FLW Pro AOY winner! - There are shysters from around the world that are envious and are now incorporating the phrase “TBD” into their contracts. Who knew such a simple insert into rules and regulations document create such a nice pay.
Posted By: beartrap

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/16/21 09:52 PM

actually MLF stepped up and saved FLW from having to declare bankruptcy which saved a lot of jobs and fishing opportunities for FLW pros and their weekend series anglers....
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/16/21 10:32 PM

Well I see Warren is back with all his imaginary made up bs. Did you ever find your baseball
Posted By: emorydog

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/17/21 12:28 AM

I envision this every time I read large florida’s MLF hate....then its a bit more funny and not such a beating. Now we just need use2fish to let go of his jock. Haha, next he will be telling us moving the classic date to fishing the in the Texas summer and running fish across town for two hours in the heat is actually a BENEFIT. You go girl.


[Linked Image]
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/17/21 12:31 AM

Originally Posted by emorydog
I envision this every time I read his MLF hate....then its a bit more funny and not such a beating. Now we just need used2fish to let got of his jock. Haha, next he will be telling us moving the classic date to fishing the in the Texas summer and running fish across town for two hours in the heat is actually a BENEFIT. You go girl.


[Linked Image]


That's about nails it
Posted By: jacksonmj

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/17/21 01:50 AM

The worlds best bass anglers won’t sill be a part of MLF if they felt they were getting ripped off. I enjoy MLF and what they’ve done for bass fishing!
Posted By: Used2fish

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/17/21 04:36 AM

Originally Posted by emorydog
I envision this every time I read large florida’s MLF hate....then its a bit more funny and not such a beating. Now we just need use2fish to let go of his jock. Haha, next he will be telling us moving the classic date to fishing the in the Texas summer and running fish across town for two hours in the heat is actually a BENEFIT. You go girl.


[Linked Image]



Old man I'll steal your cane. I've never been on that dude's jock. I just can't stand most little fish.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/17/21 12:58 PM

Originally Posted by Used2fish


Old man I'll steal your cane. I've never been on that dude's jock. I just can't stand most little fish.


Don’t worry, there is a select group of people on here that can’t handle the truth about the stench coming from the boots they have been licking. I like to sit back and watch them expose their lack of intellectual capacity. You will quickly notice not a one of them can or will try and refute what’s been said... speaking of... just who was the beneficiary of all that implied money MLF had arbitrarily taken off the anglers table in 2020? I mean, it was a significant amount... e.g. [poof gone] - FW Cup, 2020 Redcrest, $100k reduction in FLW Pro AOY award from previous years payout, dilution of FLW Pro tournament purses with introduction of “super tournaments” for the last 3 normally scheduled events, how many BPT tournaments were just flat out cancelled with no effort to reschedule? Conservatively, the amount of purse money snatched away from the angler tables could be estimated well north of $1 million! Just who was the beneficiary of all that money?

Here is the funny thing... in the humongous 5 rules for 2021 they changed the wording in the clause outlining AOY award... instead of “TBD” that was used in 2020 to stealthily reflect the $100k reduction, they’ve changed it to “to be announced”! That will fool em!

What’s the old saying?; - Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on _ _! (Fill in the blank)
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/17/21 01:23 PM

Good God you are an idiot
Posted By: Dan21XRS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/17/21 01:36 PM

Originally Posted by the skipper
The owners wont get kicked.


Owners will get a special exemption while the invitees will be shown the door... Dan
Posted By: Dan21XRS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/17/21 01:47 PM

Originally Posted by Dubee
Good God you are an idiot


Good come back... That'll teach him... Dan popcorn2
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/17/21 01:57 PM

Originally Posted by Dan21XRS
Originally Posted by the skipper
The owners wont get kicked.


Owners will get a special exemption while the invitees will be shown the door... Dan


What’s going to be more interesting is who they will say qualified to get in, and how. It won’t be anything like the “official” flow chart put up by MLF that was included in the OP. Look at how they’ve handled it when needing replacements thus far for a clue as to how a membership in the “good ol’ boys” fishing club will work. Sad thing is it looks like there are some who didn’t recognize all the red flags and have re-signed up for the humongous 5 in 2021... one would think after they witnessed all the smart money leave in 2020 to fish the Opens, then experience the stealth removal of the $100k FLW Pro AOY award money, and all the other shenanigans, those who fished in anything related to MLF ownership would have got a clue... I mean, look at what was overlooked to let John Cox in... if that’s not the slap in the face needed to wake those guys up, maybe they kinda deserve what they get.
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/17/21 02:05 PM

Originally Posted by Dan21XRS
Originally Posted by Dubee
Good God you are an idiot


Good come back... That'll teach him... Dan popcorn2


Wasn't meant to be a "come back". Just stating a fact.
Posted By: Mark Jones

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/18/21 02:56 AM

Lol, he’s back and he’s good for business.
Posted By: Lone_Wolf

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/18/21 04:41 AM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida


What’s going to be more interesting is who they will say qualified to get in, and how. It won’t be anything like the “official” flow chart put up by MLF that was included in the OP. Look at how they’ve handled it when needing replacements thus far for a clue as to how a membership in the “good ol’ boys” fishing club will work. Sad thing is it looks like there are some who didn’t recognize all the red flags and have re-signed up for the humongous 5 in 2021... one would think after they witnessed all the smart money leave in 2020 to fish the Opens, then experience the stealth removal of the $100k FLW Pro AOY award money, and all the other shenanigans, those who fished in anything related to MLF ownership would have got a clue... I mean, look at what was overlooked to let John Cox in... if that’s not the slap in the face needed to wake those guys up, maybe they kinda deserve what they get.


LOL, do you hate the NPFL too?
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/18/21 08:44 AM

Originally Posted by Lone_Wolf
Originally Posted by Big O Florida


What’s going to be more interesting is who they will say qualified to get in, and how. It won’t be anything like the “official” flow chart put up by MLF that was included in the OP. Look at how they’ve handled it when needing replacements thus far for a clue as to how a membership in the “good ol’ boys” fishing club will work. Sad thing is it looks like there are some who didn’t recognize all the red flags and have re-signed up for the humongous 5 in 2021... one would think after they witnessed all the smart money leave in 2020 to fish the Opens, then experience the stealth removal of the $100k FLW Pro AOY award money, and all the other shenanigans, those who fished in anything related to MLF ownership would have got a clue... I mean, look at what was overlooked to let John Cox in... if that’s not the slap in the face needed to wake those guys up, maybe they kinda deserve what they get.


LOL, do you hate the NPFL too?


They haven’t done anything thus far to warrant any criticism and the organization seems to be looking to play nice in the bass tournament fishing industry. They need to figure out, and then be totally transparent going forward, about how anglers are going to be able to qualify for their league, otherwise they will be seen as nothing more than a “pay to be called a Pro” type of deal, such as FLW was in it’s heyday.
Posted By: Tx Tree Grower

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/18/21 02:04 PM

Originally Posted by Mark Jones
Lol, he’s back and he’s good for business.


Do you know the answer to the OP's original question?
Posted By: Lone_Wolf

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/18/21 02:24 PM

Originally Posted by Tx Tree Grower
Originally Posted by Mark Jones
Lol, he’s back and he’s good for business.


Do you know the answer to the OP's original question?


Yes please, I honestly think they will bump 6 down to the circuit after this year, either that or circuit and tour will merge into some kind of hybrid in 2022.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/18/21 02:35 PM

Originally Posted by Tx Tree Grower
Originally Posted by Mark Jones
Lol, he’s back and he’s good for business.


Do you know the answer to the OP's original question?


He’s part of the deflect and redirect crowd for MLF, so it’s doubtful he has any meaningful answers. If he did he would have to reconcile why John Cox was given an invite to BPT ahead of several others that had more AOY points than he did. I presume those guys who have been listed as being participants on the 2021 humongous 5 pro tour just don’t care if they get cheated or ripped off, or they’ve consumed so much of the MLF kool-aid they just don’t recognize it’s happening. After experiencing $100k of AOY money being snatched away in 2020 and then seeing the top points earners being skipped over for BPT invites isn’t enough to motivate them to find alternative tours to pursue, then I don’t know what would. There will always be a greater fool, Wall Street has proven that time and time again.
Posted By: SC-001

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/18/21 03:59 PM

I don't see a problem with the John Cox deal he is a generational talent, didn't bassmaster just let a bunch of FLW guys in 2 years ago. Unless ones goes under you will see pros moving back and forth between the two leagues for years to come.
Posted By: OzzieFish

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/18/21 07:18 PM

Originally Posted by WAWI
Red Crest is a stupid name and I'm boycotting such nonsense


Agreed!!
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/18/21 09:22 PM

Originally Posted by SC-001
I don't see a problem with the John Cox deal he is a generational talent, didn't bassmaster just let a bunch of FLW guys in 2 years ago. Unless ones goes under you will see pros moving back and forth between the two leagues for years to come.


Typical whataboutism used as a “deflection” for the MLF contradictions of their own published rules; and an apples & oranges comparison at that. The contradiction is, there were many anglers ahead of John Cox in FLW AOY points and they skipped right over those guys.

It’s very doubtful we’ll see anglers moving back and forth between leagues as most that remained in BASS know what MLF is all about and what it was derived from; and I expect to see MLF twisting itself into pretzel to move dates of events to try and prevent John Cox from also fishing enough of the Bassmasters elite series tournaments to remain qualified for that tour in 2022. I don’t think they expected John to commit to fishing both tours and that’s why they implied in their press release as someone who left BASS to come fish MLF. It will be interesting to see how a group that forbids their executives from even mention BASS by name in meetings, or company communications, press interviews/releases, handles him and David Dudley in this coming yearl
Posted By: Mark Jones

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/18/21 09:56 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by SC-001
I don't see a problem with the John Cox deal he is a generational talent, didn't bassmaster just let a bunch of FLW guys in 2 years ago. Unless ones goes under you will see pros moving back and forth between the two leagues for years to come.


Typical whataboutism used as a “deflection” for the MLF contradictions of their own published rules; and an apples & oranges comparison at that. The contradiction is, there were many anglers ahead of John Cox in FLW AOY points and they skipped right over those guys.

It’s very doubtful we’ll see anglers moving back and forth between leagues as most that remained in BASS know what MLF is all about and what it was derived from; and I expect to see MLF twisting itself into pretzel to move dates of events to try and prevent John Cox from also fishing enough of the Bassmasters elite series tournaments to remain qualified for that tour in 2022. I don’t think they expected John to commit to fishing both tours and that’s why they implied in their press release as someone who left BASS to come fish MLF. It will be interesting to see how a group that forbids their executives from even mention BASS by name in meetings, or company communications, press interviews/releases, handles him and David Dudley in this coming yearl


You've made 354 posts and essentially all of them have been filled with conjecture and conspiracy theory that's borderline insane. I'm not sure if you've noticed this but none of your efforts here and on BBC have had any impact on the forward movement of the league. Perhaps you're not aware but both leagues have set their fields and their respective schedules for 2021 and are going about their business.

All that's left to do now for everyone is to go fishing...

Anyway, it's good to see you found your way back. Your entertainment factor is high. bump
Posted By: Lone_Wolf

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/18/21 10:07 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida


It’s very doubtful we’ll see anglers moving back and forth between leagues as most that remained in BASS know what MLF is all about and what it was derived from; and I expect to see MLF twisting itself into pretzel to move dates of events to try and prevent John Cox from also fishing enough of the Bassmasters elite series tournaments to remain qualified for that tour in 2022. I don’t think they expected John to commit to fishing both tours and that’s why they implied in their press release as someone who left BASS to come fish MLF. It will be interesting to see how a group that forbids their executives from even mention BASS by name in meetings, or company communications, press interviews/releases, handles him and David Dudley in this coming yearl


Atkins left for BASS, Latimer went back to MLF, Hackney and Christie went back to BASS, they are all corporations of one, its all business decisions year to year.
Posted By: Tx Tree Grower

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/18/21 10:19 PM

So I guess maybe there isn't an answer to the OP's question. That or those in the know got side tracked by Big O, which is understandable I guess. If there isn't an answer to the OP's question, it does beg the question why anyone would fish the Tacklewarehouse Pro Circuit as anything other than a backup plan? Seems to me anyone fishing at that level would want a defined path to the tour at the top of the pyramid.
Posted By: 206champion

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/18/21 10:22 PM

I guess no one knows the answer or won’t tell .
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/18/21 10:30 PM

Originally Posted by Lone_Wolf

Atkins left for BASS, Latimer went back to MLF, Hackney and Christie went back to BASS, they are all corporations of one, its all business decisions year to year.


I hear there is a back story to B-Lat returning to the dumb money side of things. Something about a prank that was pulled on him at one of the opens that he took offense to. The remainder of the smart money group that didn’t qualify this year through the opens are sticking with it. Maybe his urge to just “pay to have a pro title” was too overwhelming, so he decided to skip the formalities of qualifying and earning of the title. Maybe someone should have told him before he threw in the towel that AOY and the associated points doesn’t mean squat on the humongous 5/MLF side of things...
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/18/21 10:38 PM

Originally Posted by Tx Tree Grower
So I guess maybe there isn't an answer to the OP's question. That or those in the know got side tracked by Big O, which is understandable I guess. If there isn't an answer to the OP's question, it does beg the question why anyone would fish the Tacklewarehouse Pro Circuit as anything other than a backup plan? Seems to me anyone fishing at that level would want a defined path to the tour at the top of the pyramid.


No one got sidetracked by me... they know I am absolutely correct, that’s why you haven’t seen one sensible rebuttal. The true answer you are seeking and deserve is not flattering to MLF, but you won’t hear it from the MLF boot licking fan boys.

Truth is ;Only the dumb money and greater fools will get involved in a humongous 5 tournament thinking it will lead to an established big stage.
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/18/21 11:26 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Tx Tree Grower
So I guess maybe there isn't an answer to the OP's question. That or those in the know got side tracked by Big O, which is understandable I guess. If there isn't an answer to the OP's question, it does beg the question why anyone would fish the Tacklewarehouse Pro Circuit as anything other than a backup plan? Seems to me anyone fishing at that level would want a defined path to the tour at the top of the pyramid.


No one got sidetracked by me... they know I am absolutely correct, that’s why you haven’t seen one sensible rebuttal. The true answer you are seeking and deserve is not flattering to MLF, but you won’t hear it from the MLF boot licking fan boys.

Truth is ;Only the dumb money and greater fools will get involved in a humongous 5 tournament thinking it will lead to an established big stage.


Everyone knows you are full of bs. When anyone brings up facts to dispute your bs you ignore it and just makes the same claims over and over. I don't know how many times you have claimed they cancelled the Redcrest and stole the money. When in reality the just changed from a fall championship to spring. Now go find your baseball
Posted By: fishnfireman

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 12:38 AM

flush_2
Posted By: Fishspanker

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 12:46 AM

What is the take on Iaconnelli being out at MLF - BPT? He had a stake in it.

There is a certain amount of unhappiness over there from the anglers on them feeling it’s short of what they felt they were promised going in. Some expected it, some did not.
Posted By: grout-scout

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 12:50 AM

Interesting to see that chart and how it says “NO-Entry Fee Bass Pro Tour”. Can’t be a typo if that chart is new.
Posted By: Lone_Wolf

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 03:35 AM

Originally Posted by grout-scout
Interesting to see that chart and how it says “NO-Entry Fee Bass Pro Tour”. Can’t be a typo if that chart is new.

Its an old chart

Originally Posted by Fishspanker
What is the take on Iaconnelli being out at MLF - BPT? He had a stake in it.

There is a certain amount of unhappiness over there from the anglers on them feeling it’s short of what they felt they were promised going in. Some expected it, some did not.

Ike is still a part owner I think
Posted By: grout-scout

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 04:15 AM

Old chart, makes sense then. Bass Talk Live was discussing the 10 angler drop off the other day and how guys were going to get picked to fish events. Was over my head when Mark was discussing it, didn’t make sense.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 06:24 AM

Originally Posted by Lone_Wolf
Originally Posted by grout-scout
Interesting to see that chart and how it says “NO-Entry Fee Bass Pro Tour”. Can’t be a typo if that chart is new.

Its an old chart

Originally Posted by Fishspanker
What is the take on Iaconnelli being out at MLF - BPT? He had a stake in it.

There is a certain amount of unhappiness over there from the anglers on them feeling it’s short of what they felt they were promised going in. Some expected it, some did not.

Ike is still a part owner I think


Yes, an old chart that accurately reflects the bill of goods those guys were sold. Particularly to those guys who drank the kool-aid and stayed with the humongous 5 pro tour after all the smart money left to fish the opens exclusively. The “No-Entry Fees Bass Pro Tour” being the biggest misrepresentation of the whole sales pitch. Word is, they even floated the idea of trying to get the qualifiers for the 2021 Deadcrest to pony up and pay an entry fee for that tournament too... (they even tried to call it refundable)... which goes to illustrate something that should have already been paid for and planned, never was. Contrary to what some people continue to recite.

And yes, Ike is an angler/investor of MLF and one of the dozen or so anglers I suspect would not be welcomed back to BASS under any circumstances due to his actions in 2019 and being actively involved in recruiting and pressuring the lemmings. Good luck to him with even getting his principle investment back... I suspect it’s poof gone, just like the million $ of purse money that was removed from the MLFLW anglers table during the 2020 season.
Posted By: Dan21XRS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 01:20 PM

I'm gonna say Big O Florida knows more about what's going on than the average bear... I'm thinking most just don't like the messenger... Dan
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 02:13 PM

Originally Posted by Dan21XRS
I'm gonna say Big O Florida knows more about what's going on than the average bear... I'm thinking most just don't like the messenger... Dan


If he only stated facts I would have no problem with it. I get annoyed at him constantly spouting off bs that just isn't true
Posted By: SC-001

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 02:20 PM

Why was he gone for so long, banned camp?
Posted By: J.H.S.

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 02:29 PM

Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by Dan21XRS
I'm gonna say Big O Florida knows more about what's going on than the average bear... I'm thinking most just don't like the messenger... Dan


If he only stated facts I would have no problem with it. I get annoyed at him constantly spouting off bs that just isn't true



His arguments seem well thought out and make sense. All you guys come up with is "well you're an idiot". Prove him wrong or shut up.
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 02:38 PM

Originally Posted by Josh Seale
Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by Dan21XRS
I'm gonna say Big O Florida knows more about what's going on than the average bear... I'm thinking most just don't like the messenger... Dan


If he only stated facts I would have no problem with it. I get annoyed at him constantly spouting off bs that just isn't true



His arguments seem well thought out and make sense. All you guys come up with is "well you're an idiot". Prove him wrong or shut up.



One of his main arguments has always been that they cancelled last years Redcrest championship and stole the money. They didn't cancel or steal anything. They changed from a fall to spring championship. If he can't understand that is not cancelling and stealing the money. Then he is an idiot
Posted By: Statton48

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 03:10 PM

I personally enjoy watching both sides fish. But I also think if something sounds to good to be true then it usually is. Not saying Big-O is all right but he does make some valid points. I might have missed it, but why did they push the Redcrest back? Lack of funds? Schedule interruption? Pandemic? I truly don’t know have not done any research on it. Also, why the change from contract to move it to Palestine? I’d much rather see them here locally of course and navigate the cement stump field, but why did they change? Not arguing with any of y’all and not looking for one. Truly don’t know the answers 😂....

Big-o.... I don’t think your an idiot at all especially how well you can explain yourself sometimes. Just curious if you have a leg in the industry or are you just doing research? Maybe an Acquaintance or friend fishing? Just curious where you get your info from.
Posted By: 206champion

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 03:38 PM

Originally Posted by Josh Seale
Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by Dan21XRS
I'm gonna say Big O Florida knows more about what's going on than the average bear... I'm thinking most just don't like the messenger... Dan


If he only stated facts I would have no problem with it. I get annoyed at him constantly spouting off bs that just isn't true



His arguments seem well thought out and make sense. All you guys come up with is "well you're an idiot". Prove him wrong or shut up.

Well said I also think he knows more than most other than MJ who knows a lot about it also.
Posted By: SC-001

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 03:39 PM

Not sure if they ever said exactly why Redcrest was moved forward, that might have been the plan all along to compete with the Classic before everything fell apart in March. Palestine was voted on by the anglers, most did not want to go to Grand duplicate years in a row plus Grand is not fishing good now compared to Palestine.
Posted By: SC-001

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 03:41 PM

oh and those cement stumps are old growth hardwoods, bodark are the worst
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 03:44 PM

Originally Posted by Statton48
I personally enjoy watching both sides fish. But I also think if something sounds to good to be true then it usually is. Not saying Big-O is all right but he does make some valid points. I might have missed it, but why did they push the Redcrest back? Lack of funds? Schedule interruption? Pandemic? I truly don’t know have not done any research on it. Also, why the change from contract to move it to Palestine? I’d much rather see them here locally of course and navigate the cement stump field, but why did they change? Not arguing with any of y’all and not looking for one. Truly don’t know the answers 😂....

Big-o.... I don’t think your an idiot at all especially how well you can explain yourself sometimes. Just curious if you have a leg in the industry or are you just doing research? Maybe an Acquaintance or friend fishing? Just curious where you get your info from.



The Redcrest was moved because they wanted a spring championship instead of the fall. That was done many months ago. I believe they moved it to Palestine due to covid restrictions. They promised a big expo which they aren't going to have. So they moved this one to Palestine. Next year I believe will be at grand when they can have the expo
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 03:48 PM

Originally Posted by Statton48
I personally enjoy watching both sides fish. But I also think if something sounds to good to be true then it usually is. Not saying Big-O is all right but he does make some valid points. I might have missed it, but why did they push the Redcrest back? Lack of funds? Schedule interruption? Pandemic? I truly don’t know have not done any research on it. Also, why the change from contract to move it to Palestine? I’d much rather see them here locally of course and navigate the cement stump field, but why did they change? Not arguing with any of y’all and not looking for one. Truly don’t know the answers 😂....

Big-o.... I don’t think your an idiot at all especially how well you can explain yourself sometimes. Just curious if you have a leg in the industry or are you just doing research? Maybe an Acquaintance or friend fishing? Just curious where you get your info from.


I look at what’s being said and then compare it to what is actually done or has been done. One doesn’t need to do much more than that to be able to sniff out a con job or identify bad actors that have less than honorable intent. The Deadcrest was run in 2019, its next scheduled event is 2021, and if they are to be believed, 2022 is also already scheduled (at place it was originally supposed to be held in 2021). Some people don’t see (still) the missing year of the event, but I do and so did some of the anglers, and they also noticed the massive reduction in potential purse money available for 2020. With them first cancelling the self proclaimed, biggest, most prestigious industry show on earth, then changing dates, and then ultimately changing venues all together for the 2021 event, is very telling, and I suspect they’ve got much more trouble courting sponsors and supporters than they would ever want anyone to know. Tulsa just hosted the “chili bowl” event and it was successful, so people can make their own judgements as to why MLF pulled out of Oklahoma. MLF isn’t that hard to figure out... it’s like watching the playbook of a private equity investment company being executed. If you’ve seen it before, you’ll know the only ones who end up benefitting are the few investors at the top of the pyramid; the rest end up getting the shaft once the equity has been depleted. Follow the money with MLF - the first clue was the arbitrary cancellation of FW Cup and the excuses used to justify cheating anglers... it’s been much more of the same since. I do have to say, the 2020 FLW Pro AOY purse snatching was the most epic of all... if people didn’t get a clue after that one, they likely won’t ever get a clue.
Posted By: Dan21XRS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 03:54 PM

Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by Josh Seale
Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by Dan21XRS
I'm gonna say Big O Florida knows more about what's going on than the average bear... I'm thinking most just don't like the messenger... Dan


If he only stated facts I would have no problem with it. I get annoyed at him constantly spouting off bs that just isn't true



His arguments seem well thought out and make sense. All you guys come up with is "well you're an idiot". Prove him wrong or shut up.



One of his main arguments has always been that they cancelled last years Redcrest championship and stole the money. They didn't cancel or steal anything. They changed from a fall to spring championship. If he can't understand that is not cancelling and stealing the money. Then he is an idiot



So they're having 2 Red-whatever championships this year???... Because, if they aren't last years money went somewhere other than the 2020 year end extravaganza... Or is this years championship worth 2x the amount this year... Dan
Posted By: Tx Tree Grower

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 03:56 PM

I looked at the 2021 Posted rules for the Bass Pro Tour and the TW Pro Circuit. I see nothing in the TW pro Circuit Rules about advancement opportunities to the BPT. It only mentions that the winner qualifies for the 2022 TW Pro Circuit Championship.

I see nothing in the BPT rules that says anything about any tour member being in danger of being sent down to the TW Pro Circuit. Man what an odd mix the MLF family of tournament organizations is right now.
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 03:56 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Statton48
I personally enjoy watching both sides fish. But I also think if something sounds to good to be true then it usually is. Not saying Big-O is all right but he does make some valid points. I might have missed it, but why did they push the Redcrest back? Lack of funds? Schedule interruption? Pandemic? I truly don’t know have not done any research on it. Also, why the change from contract to move it to Palestine? I’d much rather see them here locally of course and navigate the cement stump field, but why did they change? Not arguing with any of y’all and not looking for one. Truly don’t know the answers 😂....

Big-o.... I don’t think your an idiot at all especially how well you can explain yourself sometimes. Just curious if you have a leg in the industry or are you just doing research? Maybe an Acquaintance or friend fishing? Just curious where you get your info from.


I look at what’s being said and then compare it to what is actually done or has been done. One doesn’t need to do much more than that to be able to sniff out a con job or identify bad actors that have less than honorable intent. The Deadcrest was run in 2019, its next scheduled event is 2021, and if they are to be believed, 2022 is also already scheduled (at place it was originally supposed to be held in 2021). Some people don’t see (still) the missing year of the event, but I do and so did some of the anglers, and they also noticed the massive reduction in potential purse money available for 2020. With them first cancelling the self proclaimed, biggest, most prestigious industry show on earth, then changing dates, and then ultimately changing venues all together for the 2021 event, is very telling, and I suspect they’ve got much more trouble courting sponsors and supporters than they would ever want anyone to know. Tulsa just hosted the “chili bowl” event and it was successful, so people can make their own judgements as to why MLF pulled out of Oklahoma. MLF isn’t that hard to figure out... it’s like watching the playbook of a private equity investment company being executed. If you’ve seen it before, you’ll know the only ones who end up benefitting are the few investors at the top of the pyramid; the rest end up getting the shaft once the equity has been depleted. Follow the money with MLF - the first clue was the arbitrary cancellation of FW Cup and the excuses used to justify cheating anglers... it’s been much more of the same since. I do have to say, the 2020 FLW Pro AOY purse snatching was the most epic of all... if people didn’t get a clue after that one, they likely won’t ever get a clue.



They didn't snatch anything. It's no different than if I get a year end bonus every year. If my boss sells the company and the new owner doesn't give bonuses. It doesn't mean the new owner is stealing money. Things change when businesses get acquired by new ownership.
Posted By: Mark Jones

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 04:14 PM

Let’s get back to the real world here. The BPT schedule is set and the field is set. The Pro Circuit schedule is set and the field is set. The BASS schedule is set and the field is set.

There’s no need to speculate who’s in or who’s out and how they might feel about it now. As I said before, all that’s left to do now is fish.

If Big O or anyone else wants to continue to explore and pontificate about it, they’re free to but none of the pros are. They’re rigging their boats, making travel plans and gearing up for the season.
Posted By: SC-001

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 04:19 PM

So I just realized this looking at the schedules, Redcrest is now the time of year the Classic was, and the Classic is in the early summer a few months before the Forrest Wood cup used to be. This is interesting too, look at the times of year the Classic used to be https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bassmaster_Classic
Posted By: SC-001

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 04:20 PM

what a cluster
Posted By: SC-001

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 04:21 PM

Originally Posted by Mark Jones
Let’s get back to the real world here. The BPT schedule is set and the field is set. The Pro Circuit schedule is set and the field is set. The BASS schedule is set and the field is set.

There’s no need to speculate who’s in or who’s out and how they might feel about it now. As I said before, all that’s left to do now is fish.

If Big O or anyone else wants to continue to explore and pontificate about it, they’re free to but none of the pros are. They’re rigging their boats, making travel plans and gearing up for the season.

Yeah but are the Circuit guys fishing for a Tour spot next year or not?
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 04:23 PM

Originally Posted by Mark Jones
Let’s get back to the real world here. The BPT schedule is set and the field is set. The Pro Circuit schedule is set and the field is set. The BASS schedule is set and the field is set.

There’s no need to speculate who’s in or who’s out and how they might feel about it now. As I said before, all that’s left to do now is fish.

If Big O or anyone else wants to continue to explore and pontificate about it, they’re free to but none of the pros are. They’re rigging their boats, making travel plans and gearing up for the season.



How dare you mention BASS. The higher ups at MLF are going to smite you down
Posted By: Statton48

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 05:55 PM

Only difference I see is, do you pay your boss to work there and then based on performance get your check? I see it both ways. Especially being a small business owner.
Posted By: Statton48

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 06:02 PM

Dubee, I see what you’re saying for sure. I watched and read where almost 100% of the field in MLF said that the thing that brought them to fish that side is the no entry. That’s huge!! And I could see where points wouldn’t matter in that side and who cares if you finish second in every event, you weren’t first so shut up. But the guys that pay to compete in every medium-large scale of tournament, I see where AOY is rewarded something. Entry fees waived, cash, boat, etc etc. I just wonder where that money went seeing that the entry’s are still there and field numbers. Again, that is a nice chunk of change to invest back into a company, but it seems it would be a better incentive to have that to drive more people to qualify and compete. Again, just my take on it
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 08:12 PM

Originally Posted by SC-001
Originally Posted by Mark Jones
Let’s get back to the real world here. The BPT schedule is set and the field is set. The Pro Circuit schedule is set and the field is set. The BASS schedule is set and the field is set.

There’s no need to speculate who’s in or who’s out and how they might feel about it now. As I said before, all that’s left to do now is fish.

If Big O or anyone else wants to continue to explore and pontificate about it, they’re free to but none of the pros are. They’re rigging their boats, making travel plans and gearing up for the season.

Yeah but are the Circuit guys fishing for a Tour spot next year or not?


You won’t get the MLF groupies to answer you... if the truth surrounding something being discussed about MLF reflects negatively on them, they will remain silent or go into full deflection mode. Hence, you’ll see the type of deflective, change the subject content in the message you’re replying to. Fact is you have to look at how they’ve operated up to now to reach a reasonable conclusion on how they will act in the future.

In 2019 they laid out what appears to be a bait and switch and bogus pathway into the BPT, as in 2020 where they needed to fill multiple spots in the BPT roster (due to smart money departing) they showed just how bogus their published plan was by giving John Cox a spot on the BPT before many others that had more FLW Pro AOY points. If I am not mistaken, John didn’t even fish all the FLW Pro tournaments in 2020 due to conflicts with Elite series events, but yet he was chosen anyway. It appears MLF changed the criteria and goal posts without notice, and not only skipped past AOY points leaders, but also did not bring the field back up to 80. Further, at start of 2020 season MLFLW was touting and promoting how much better things were for the former FLW tours; like lower entry fees, higher payouts, etc... so when “TBD” was entered into the 2020 rules for AOY award no one thought for a second that would mean a $100k reduction in payout from what many, many, previous year winners had received. If anything people thought the award would be increased since MLF was bragging how they “have improved things”. We now know how that turned out. And they want people to trust that “to be announced” now listed in the 2021 rules means it will get better? Only the extremely gullible would believe that.

I think MLF has been around long enough now to see they change the goal posts frequently, make the rules up as they go, and pretty much will do what they (small group of investors) want despite what they’ve communicated and posted publicly. They will always say “it was voted on” like that is supposed to give their changes legitimacy. Just like it was suddenly voted upon to make the “No-Entry-Fee” BPT an “Entry-Fee” BPT. Keep in mind, the two people at the top of the investor/stakeholder pyramid are Multi-Billionaires, yet they couldn’t see fit to make the 2020 FLW Pro AOY recipient whole by honoring the long tradition of giving a $100k payout .... that should tell you all you need to know.
Posted By: Lone_Wolf

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 08:44 PM

Tomorrow is the cutoff for palestine practice, I'm sure there are many guys out there right now tearing up boats
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 08:59 PM

Originally Posted by Statton48
... But the guys that pay to compete in every medium-large scale of tournament, I see where AOY is rewarded something. Entry fees waived, cash, boat, etc etc. I just wonder where that money went seeing that the entry’s are still there and field numbers. Again, that is a nice chunk of change to invest back into a company, but it seems it would be a better incentive to have that to drive more people to qualify and compete. Again, just my take on it


That AOY money wasn’t reinvested, it was the equity being sucked out of the organization by its multibillionaire primary stakeholders; just like the purse for the FW cup, 2020 Redcrest, cancellation of multiple BPT events, dilution of FLW Pro purse by introducing increased field size and BPT angler competition into the last 3 scheduled FLW pro events, was. Oh, and let’s not forget... the reintroduction of “Entry Fees” into BPT....

that loud sucking sound you might be hearing is the private equity investor machines at work...
Posted By: Mark Jones

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 09:18 PM

Simply incredible level of conspiracy theory at work. Staggering really.
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 09:23 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Statton48
... But the guys that pay to compete in every medium-large scale of tournament, I see where AOY is rewarded something. Entry fees waived, cash, boat, etc etc. I just wonder where that money went seeing that the entry’s are still there and field numbers. Again, that is a nice chunk of change to invest back into a company, but it seems it would be a better incentive to have that to drive more people to qualify and compete. Again, just my take on it


That AOY money wasn’t reinvested, it was the equity being sucked out of the organization by its multibillionaire primary stakeholders; just like the purse for the FW cup, 2020 Redcrest, cancellation of multiple BPT events, dilution of FLW Pro purse by introducing increased field size and BPT angler competition into the last 3 scheduled FLW pro events, was. Oh, and let’s not forget... the reintroduction of “Entry Fees” into BPT....

that loud sucking sound you might be hearing is the private equity investor machines at work...



For anyone questioning if he is an idiot. He is still saying the Redcrest was cancelled and they kept the money. So now you know he is
Posted By: Statton48

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 09:36 PM

Well either way, it won’t stop me from watching it. It’s entertaining for sure and the skill level is unmatched in my opinion. I still watch all of them live and hope to attend the Classic again this year. As far as conspiracy theory goes for some..... I don’t put anything past anyone. Just look at our country and the state we are in. I’ll take my ball and watch from the sidelines now, have a good year everyone.
Posted By: Lone_Wolf

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 09:36 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Statton48
... But the guys that pay to compete in every medium-large scale of tournament, I see where AOY is rewarded something. Entry fees waived, cash, boat, etc etc. I just wonder where that money went seeing that the entry’s are still there and field numbers. Again, that is a nice chunk of change to invest back into a company, but it seems it would be a better incentive to have that to drive more people to qualify and compete. Again, just my take on it


That AOY money wasn’t reinvested, it was the equity being sucked out of the organization by its multibillionaire primary stakeholders; just like the purse for the FW cup, 2020 Redcrest, cancellation of multiple BPT events, dilution of FLW Pro purse by introducing increased field size and BPT angler competition into the last 3 scheduled FLW pro events, was. Oh, and let’s not forget... the reintroduction of “Entry Fees” into BPT....

that loud sucking sound you might be hearing is the private equity investor machines at work...


Or maybe they got caught with their pants down after buying FLW a sinking ship a few months before covid and all of this is being done to keep the organization going.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 09:49 PM

Originally Posted by Lone_Wolf
Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Statton48
... But the guys that pay to compete in every medium-large scale of tournament, I see where AOY is rewarded something. Entry fees waived, cash, boat, etc etc. I just wonder where that money went seeing that the entry’s are still there and field numbers. Again, that is a nice chunk of change to invest back into a company, but it seems it would be a better incentive to have that to drive more people to qualify and compete. Again, just my take on it


That AOY money wasn’t reinvested, it was the equity being sucked out of the organization by its multibillionaire primary stakeholders; just like the purse for the FW cup, 2020 Redcrest, cancellation of multiple BPT events, dilution of FLW Pro purse by introducing increased field size and BPT angler competition into the last 3 scheduled FLW pro events, was. Oh, and let’s not forget... the reintroduction of “Entry Fees” into BPT....

that loud sucking sound you might be hearing is the private equity investor machines at work...


Or maybe they got caught with their pants down after buying FLW a sinking ship a few months before covid and all of this is being done to keep the organization going.


Oh no, according to the MLF bootlicking excuse makers, MLF only bought the FLW assets, not any of the debts or in-pipeline obligations, and therefore they couldn’t have been caught by surprise. Conversely, they used exactly that reasoning as reason to cancel the FW Cup and to initially try and deny the Bass Federation “living the dream” package winner what was promised. Are you now saying it was not a brilliant contractual avoidance of in progress financial obligations for FLW?
Posted By: SC-001

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 10:20 PM

All you guys are just making guesses, maybe MJ might be the only one on this thread in the know
Posted By: boyd1002

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 10:54 PM

Originally Posted by SC-001
All you guys are just making guesses, maybe MJ might be the only one on this thread in the know


Agreed. All this back on forth and i just want to know what the process will be. Let us know Mark.
Posted By: Mark Jones

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 11:08 PM

Originally Posted by boyd1002
Originally Posted by SC-001
All you guys are just making guesses, maybe MJ might be the only one on this thread in the know


Agreed. All this back on forth and i just want to know what the process will be. Let us know Mark.


I don’t have visibility to it. My guess is that given the reset of agreements that were forced during Covid, that there will continue to be internal dialogue with the leadership team and the angler board and more to be announced later. Regardless of the decision the anglers will have their input on what that looks like. Clearly they will be crafting a path to the BPT and that’s always been a part of the plan.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 11:09 PM

Originally Posted by boyd1002
Originally Posted by SC-001
All you guys are just making guesses, maybe MJ might be the only one on this thread in the know


Agreed. All this back on forth and i just want to know what the process will be. Let us know Mark.


You guys don’t understand, the role MJ is tasked with is to put lipstick on a pig, and polish the turd. Not tell the truth or highlight the reality of the situation at MLF. If he had any legitimate reasons for all that 2020 purse money to go poof, gone and vanish from the anglers table, surely he would have recited it by now. He’s had plenty of opportunity to offer something constructive and clear up any confusion or misunderstandings for multiple instances. Instead he’s chosen to post replies designed to deflect away from the subject and cast aspersions my way. But I am game... let’s here it MJ, why was all that potential purse money for 2020 taken off the anglers table and where did that money go? Oh, and how is MLF instructing you to explain away the overlooking of serval anglers who had more FLW Pro AOY points to fill empty spots on BPT, than the person who was selected? What’s the incentive for the humongous 5 pro anglers in 2021?
Posted By: Mark Jones

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/19/21 11:19 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by boyd1002
Originally Posted by SC-001
All you guys are just making guesses, maybe MJ might be the only one on this thread in the know


Agreed. All this back on forth and i just want to know what the process will be. Let us know Mark.

What’s the incentive for the humongous 5 pro anglers in 2021?


I don't know but I have an idea. There's 165 of them that paid their money to compete. Here's the list: https://majorleaguefishing.com/pro-circuit/2020-12-23-tackle-warehouse-pro-circuit-roster/

Why don't you reach out to each one of them for a survey and not come back until you've reached them all and can provide us a full report of how bamboozled they feel. Everyone's on pins and needles.


Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/20/21 12:46 AM

Originally Posted by Mark Jones
Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by boyd1002
Originally Posted by SC-001
All you guys are just making guesses, maybe MJ might be the only one on this thread in the know


Agreed. All this back on forth and i just want to know what the process will be. Let us know Mark.

What’s the incentive for the humongous 5 pro anglers in 2021?


I don't know but I have an idea. There's 165 of them that paid their money to compete. Here's the list: https://majorleaguefishing.com/pro-circuit/2020-12-23-tackle-warehouse-pro-circuit-roster/

Why don't you reach out to each one of them for a survey and not come back until you've reached them all and can provide us a full report of how bamboozled they feel. Everyone's on pins and needles.


Thanks; of the 3 questions I posed, you answered .5... I’ll give you 1/2 point for quoting one to say you don’t know. The direct link was helpful though and allowed me to review the revised rules for 2021 and see who the next batch of greater fools are... first thing I noticed was they removed the phrase “to be announced” and now all indications is the AOY award is going to be (yawn), entry into the next pro championship tournament provided you commit to fishing the circuit again the following year, and next years entry fees into the same circuit OR BPT; which that annotation is kinda telling in it’s own right... It seems BPT entry fees are here to stay! Who woulda thunk? Sadly, as someone pointed out earlier, there is nothing in rules about how (AOY points or other) and or what is a guaranteed qualification into joining the BPT... so the incentive is, well... I’ll let someone else put lipstick on that pig! At least they aren’t still misleading people into thinking there could be something bigger and better! Like what many previous years AOY recipients got. Someone must have been reading this thread!
Posted By: Mark Jones

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/20/21 10:51 AM

My guess on the incentive is if you’re a professional angler and not competing on the BPT or Elites and you’re looking for a platform where you can win $100k in a week of fishing with 308 hours of TV and 108 hours of Live attached to it, then you have your answer.

For most of those 165, that’s enough incentive. Some people just have their heads down focused on their fishing careers and competing Big O. They’re not sitting behind a keyboard like Chicken Little claiming the sky is falling.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/20/21 01:22 PM

Originally Posted by Mark Jones
My guess on the incentive is if you’re a professional angler and not competing on the BPT or Elites and you’re looking for a platform where you can win $100k in a week of fishing with 308 hours of TV and 108 hours of Live attached to it, then you have your answer.

For most of those 165, that’s enough incentive. Some people just have their heads down focused on their fishing careers and competing Big O. They’re not sitting behind a keyboard like Chicken Little claiming the sky is falling.


Yeah, I hear ya... I am sure, even after last years fleecing of the masses, that Vince McMahon could still pull together and find enough uninformed players and coaches to rerun his XFL gimmick again too. Rackets being run on Wall Street have proven over and over again that there are always new batches of greater fools to be found... the secret sauce is in the marketing. Some people will believe anything regardless of what history shows.

What’s the old saying? Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on _ _? Who?
Posted By: boyd1002

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/20/21 02:00 PM

My thought is that the MLF is in a tough situation. 2 of the main talking points when MLF was formed were 1) no entry fees and 2) a clear path to the BPT tour, from high school to college to AAA/FLW to BPT. 3 years later, granted the world has been crazy, those two priorities do not seem likely any time soon. Especially when the current roster will vote on the process. Is there any chance the current anglers will vote to be cut from the tour? I think we know that answer. They will vote in their best interest (i dont blame them), not the best interest of the league.
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/20/21 02:04 PM

Originally Posted by boyd1002
My thought is that the MLF is in a tough situation. 2 of the main talking points when MLF was formed were 1) no entry fees and 2) a clear path to the BPT tour, from high school to college to AAA/FLW to BPT. 3 years later, granted the world has been crazy, those two priorities do not seem likely any time soon. Especially when the current roster will vote on the process. Is there any chance the current anglers will vote to be cut from the tour? I think we know that answer. They will vote in their best interest (i dont blame them), not the best interest of the league.


Actually when BPT was formed the plan was to have entry fees and much higher payouts. Then the anglers voted for no entry fees
Posted By: boyd1002

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/20/21 02:09 PM

Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by boyd1002
My thought is that the MLF is in a tough situation. 2 of the main talking points when MLF was formed were 1) no entry fees and 2) a clear path to the BPT tour, from high school to college to AAA/FLW to BPT. 3 years later, granted the world has been crazy, those two priorities do not seem likely any time soon. Especially when the current roster will vote on the process. Is there any chance the current anglers will vote to be cut from the tour? I think we know that answer. They will vote in their best interest (i dont blame them), not the best interest of the league.


Actually when BPT was formed the plan was to have entry fees and much higher payouts. Then the anglers voted for no entry fees


Definitely trust you on that. I am more referring to the anglers interviewed after the switch and those two seemed like the most common themes. But you are correct that it wasnt an official MLF bullet point upon formation.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/20/21 02:19 PM

Originally Posted by boyd1002
Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by boyd1002
My thought is that the MLF is in a tough situation. 2 of the main talking points when MLF was formed were 1) no entry fees and 2) a clear path to the BPT tour, from high school to college to AAA/FLW to BPT. 3 years later, granted the world has been crazy, those two priorities do not seem likely any time soon. Especially when the current roster will vote on the process. Is there any chance the current anglers will vote to be cut from the tour? I think we know that answer. They will vote in their best interest (i dont blame them), not the best interest of the league.


Actually when BPT was formed the plan was to have entry fees and much higher payouts. Then the anglers voted for no entry fees


Definitely trust you on that. I am more referring to the anglers interviewed after the switch and those two seemed like the most common themes. But you are correct that it wasnt an official MLF bullet point upon formation.


Of course it was and has all along been an official bullet point from MLF, and to this moment it still is. Like I said, it’s all in the deceptive marketing. Some people toss out all kinds of things to deflect criticism towards MLF and it infuriates them when the truth is spoken to them. Look at the highlighted text.


[Linked Image]
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/20/21 02:41 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by boyd1002
Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by boyd1002
My thought is that the MLF is in a tough situation. 2 of the main talking points when MLF was formed were 1) no entry fees and 2) a clear path to the BPT tour, from high school to college to AAA/FLW to BPT. 3 years later, granted the world has been crazy, those two priorities do not seem likely any time soon. Especially when the current roster will vote on the process. Is there any chance the current anglers will vote to be cut from the tour? I think we know that answer. They will vote in their best interest (i dont blame them), not the best interest of the league.


Actually when BPT was formed the plan was to have entry fees and much higher payouts. Then the anglers voted for no entry fees


Definitely trust you on that. I am more referring to the anglers interviewed after the switch and those two seemed like the most common themes. But you are correct that it wasnt an official MLF bullet point upon formation.


Of course it was and has all along been an official bullet point from MLF, and to this moment it still is. Like I said, it’s all in the deceptive marketing. Some people toss out all kinds of things to deflect criticism towards MLF and it infuriates them when the truth is spoken to them. Look at the highlighted text.


[Linked Image]



Well once again you prove your intelligence. We were discussing no entry fee when BPT was formed. You can see it right there. I never said anything about how you advance. But once again you just blabber on. It's easy to just spout off whatever nonsense you want when you hide behind screen names( big o, seminole wind)
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/20/21 02:57 PM

Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by boyd1002
Originally Posted by Dubee


Actually when BPT was formed the plan was to have entry fees and much higher payouts. Then the anglers voted for no entry fees


Definitely trust you on that. I am more referring to the anglers interviewed after the switch and those two seemed like the most common themes. But you are correct that it wasnt an official MLF bullet point upon formation.


Of course it was and has all along been an official bullet point from MLF, and to this moment it still is. Like I said, it’s all in the deceptive marketing. Some people toss out all kinds of things to deflect criticism towards MLF and it infuriates them when the truth is spoken to them. Look at the highlighted text.


[Linked Image]



Well once again you prove your intelligence. We were discussing no entry fee. You can see it right there. I never said anything about how you advance. But once again you just blabber on. It's easy to just spout off whatever nonsense you want when you hide behind screen names( big o, seminole wind)


I typically won’t reply directly to you, as I am not a fan of engaging with someone who has obvious decorum issues. But I have to make an exception in this case to suggest that you may want to get the prescription for your reading glasses updated. Please re-read what I posted and focus on the “first 10 words” of the highlighted text in the graphic that was attached and recognize what it refers to. Furthermore, no-entry fees has been the primary talking point from the inception of BPT; how else do you think they attracted all those other lemmings to move from an established and stable circuit? It may have been voted on by those who had acting parts in the reality TV MLF Cups, but the no entry fees was the talking point that was the bait put the hook in the mouth of the suckers who believed in the Marketing!
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/20/21 03:15 PM





[/quote]
Well once again you prove your intelligence. We were discussing no entry fee. You can see it right there. I never said anything about how you advance. But once again you just blabber on. It's easy to just spout off whatever nonsense you want when you hide behind screen names( big o, seminole wind)[/quote]

I typically won’t reply directly to you, as I am not a fan of engaging with someone who has obvious decorum issues. But I have to make an exception in this case to suggest that you may want to get the prescription for your reading glasses updated. Please re-read what I posted and focus on the “first 10 words” of the highlighted text in the graphic that was attached and recognize what it refers to. Furthermore, no-entry fees has been the primary talking point from the inception of BPT; how else do you think they attracted all those other lemmings to move from an established and stable circuit? It may have been voted on by those who had acting parts in the reality TV MLF Cups, but the no entry fees was the talking point that was the bait put the hook in the mouth of the suckers who believed in the Marketing!
[/quote]

You are just wrong. The original plan was to have entry fees and along with sponsor money have a much larger payback. It was after all the anglers had already signed up that they voted no entry fee. Which is what boyd1002 and me were talking about. Since they didn't own FLW when they formed BPT. What you posted has no relevance to what the original plan was
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/20/21 03:22 PM

And what you call decorum issues. I call blunt and saying exactly what I'm thinking. And not hiding behind a fake screen name to do it
Posted By: BigDozer66

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/20/21 09:47 PM

I would be real careful about calling others out on "Decorum Issues" unless my screen name was MotherTeresa! popcorn2
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/20/21 11:12 PM

Originally Posted by BigDozer66
I would be real careful about calling others out on "Decorum Issues" unless my screen name was MotherTeresa! popcorn2


Lmao, I have no problem admitting I'm blunt and an ahole.
Posted By: 9094

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/20/21 11:15 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by beartrap
...
MLF fishing has achieved 850 hours of TV exposure a year over 5 networks and it is now rated as the #1 rated outdoor program...


That’s a self proclaimed narrative that no one believes, including the sponsors that pulled out of MLF/BPT after 1 year and felt like they were sold a bill of goods because they realized those numbers weren’t coming even close to adding up. Oh, you also omitted that KSE (majority owner in MLF) also has majority ownership stakes in 4 of the 5 networks they put broadcast hours on.

If they were doing so good they wouldn’t have cheated the anglers out of so much purse money in 2020. Can’t wait to see what’s in store for 2021 after the success they had last year. That was a slick move on the skimming of $100k out from under the FLW Pro AOY winner! - There are shysters from around the world that are envious and are now incorporating the phrase “TBD” into their contracts. Who knew such a simple insert into rules and regulations document create such a nice pay.


And BOOM! He's back
Posted By: Duck_Hunter

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/20/21 11:45 PM

Speaking of decorum issues, I am asking everyone to tone the rhetoric and personal attacks down. Thank you.
Posted By: shotgunwilly

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/20/21 11:56 PM

Originally Posted by Dubee
And what you call decorum issues. I call blunt and saying exactly what I'm thinking. And not hiding behind a fake screen name to do it


I didn't realize Dubee was a real name.
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/21/21 12:11 AM

Originally Posted by shotgunwilly
Originally Posted by Dubee
And what you call decorum issues. I call blunt and saying exactly what I'm thinking. And not hiding behind a fake screen name to do it


I didn't realize Dubee was a real name.



It's my last name. Scott Dubee
Posted By: Smurfs

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/21/21 12:12 AM

Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by shotgunwilly
Originally Posted by Dubee
And what you call decorum issues. I call blunt and saying exactly what I'm thinking. And not hiding behind a fake screen name to do it


I didn't realize Dubee was a real name.



It's my last name. Scott Dubee

popcorn
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/21/21 02:26 PM

MLF world championship is on CBS this Sunday
Posted By: Lone_Wolf

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/21/21 02:41 PM

LOL someone finally got him to shut up.
Posted By: Used2fish

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/21/21 02:57 PM

Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by shotgunwilly
Originally Posted by Dubee
And what you call decorum issues. I call blunt and saying exactly what I'm thinking. And not hiding behind a fake screen name to do it


I didn't realize Dubee was a real name.



It's my last name. Scott Dubee



O he called you out to the carpet. Time to put up or shut up.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/21/21 03:41 PM

Originally Posted by Used2fish
Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by shotgunwilly
Originally Posted by Dubee
And what you call decorum issues. I call blunt and saying exactly what I'm thinking. And not hiding behind a fake screen name to do it

I didn't realize Dubee was a real name.
It's my last name. Scott Dubee

O he called you out to the carpet. Time to put up or shut up.


Not sure what you mean? My last post illustrated relevant details had been overlooked and I still haven’t seen one person come on here and explain where all that intended for anglers purse money from 2020 went. No matter how you calculate it, it’s a significant sum of money that never made it to the anglers. Oh, and to boot, they now are going to be required to pony up entry fees. Where did all those supportive sponsors that were going to make that happen go?... that’s priceless comedy to many.
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/21/21 04:00 PM

It's just down right funny how he ignores anything anyone says that debunks his bs. And just post more bs saying no one can debunk his bs.
Posted By: Gitter Done

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/21/21 04:14 PM

popcorn2
Posted By: J.H.S.

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/21/21 05:27 PM

Originally Posted by Dubee
It's just down right funny how he ignores anything anyone says that debunks his bs. And just post more bs saying no one can debunk his bs.



Bro you are literally no better. All you can come back with is "well you're an idiot". Great argument.
Posted By: BigDozer66

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/21/21 05:42 PM

Originally Posted by Dubee
MLF world championship is on CBS this Sunday

cheers
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/21/21 05:59 PM

Originally Posted by Josh Seale
Originally Posted by Dubee
It's just down right funny how he ignores anything anyone says that debunks his bs. And just post more bs saying no one can debunk his bs.



Bro you are literally no better. All you can come back with is "well you're an idiot". Great argument.

Read all my post. That's not nearly all I have said. I've explained over and over how the Redcrest wasn't cancelled and they didn't steal the money. I've explained how no entry wasn't the original plan. I've explained away several of his false claims. He just ignores it and repost the same stuff.
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/21/21 06:31 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Used2fish


Old man I'll steal your cane. I've never been on that dude's jock. I just can't stand most little fish.


Don’t worry, there is a select group of people on here that can’t handle the truth about the stench coming from the boots they have been licking. I like to sit back and watch them expose their lack of intellectual capacity. You will quickly notice not a one of them can or will try and refute what’s been said... speaking of... just who was the beneficiary of all that implied money MLF had arbitrarily taken off the anglers table in 2020? I mean, it was a significant amount... e.g. [poof gone] - FW Cup, 2020 Redcrest, $100k reduction in FLW Pro AOY award from previous years payout, dilution of FLW Pro tournament purses with introduction of “super tournaments” for the last 3 normally scheduled events, how many BPT tournaments were just flat out cancelled with no effort to reschedule? Conservatively, the amount of purse money snatched away from the angler tables could be estimated well north of $1 million! Just who was the beneficiary of all that money?

Here is the funny thing... in the humongous 5 rules for 2021 they changed the wording in the clause outlining AOY award... instead of “TBD” that was used in 2020 to stealthily reflect the $100k reduction, they’ve changed it to “to be announced”! That will fool em!

What’s the old saying?; - Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on _ _! (Fill in the blank)



Just for fun I'll debunk a couple more of his false accusations. He says they cancelled the cup and kept all that money. They still had a FLW championship with a huge purse. It just wasn't called the cup. He claims they kept all the money from the cancelled BPT events when they actually allowed the BPT anglers to fish the last 3 FLW tournaments. They increased the payout of those 3 tournaments by slightly more than $500,000 a tournament. A little over 1.5 million total for the 3 total
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/21/21 07:00 PM

Originally Posted by BigDozer66
Originally Posted by Dubee
MLF world championship is on CBS this Sunday

cheers


Wow, imagine the arguments happening over the TV remote in the households around America come Sunday. Live coverage of the AFC title championship to determine who goes to the 2021 Super Bowl, or a rerun of a 2020 fishing tournament no one has heard of even when it was happening live. Maybe MLF could take a page out of other professional sports playbooks and invest in some cardboard cutouts of fans and strategically place them around the lakes and boat ramps... They could even have them dressed in replica KVD jerseys and holding a Duckett fishing rod!
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/21/21 07:05 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by BigDozer66
Originally Posted by Dubee
MLF world championship is on CBS this Sunday

cheers


Wow, imagine the arguments happening over the TV remote in the households around America come Sunday. Live coverage of the AFC title championship to determine who goes to the 2021 Super Bowl, or a rerun of a 2020 fishing tournament no one has heard of even when it was happening live. Maybe MLF could take a page out of other professional sports playbooks and invest in some cardboard cutouts of fans and strategically place them around the lakes and boat ramps... They could even have them dressed in replica KVD jerseys and holding a Duckett fishing rod!



Oh come on now Warren. You know your gonna sit down and watch it with your sister Mary
Posted By: 206champion

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/21/21 07:06 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by BigDozer66
Originally Posted by Dubee
MLF world championship is on CBS this Sunday

cheers


Wow, imagine the arguments happening over the TV remote in the households around America come Sunday. Live coverage of the AFC title championship to determine who goes to the 2021 Super Bowl, or a rerun of a 2020 fishing tournament no one has heard of even when it was happening live. Maybe MLF could take a page out of other professional sports playbooks and invest in some cardboard cutouts of fans and strategically place them around the lakes and boat ramps... They could even have them dressed in replica KVD jerseys and holding a Duckett fishing rod!

Lol
Posted By: reeltexan

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/21/21 07:46 PM


Relax.
MLF is making lots of money. Everything is fine.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/21/21 07:57 PM

Originally Posted by Josh Seale
Originally Posted by Dubee
It's just down right funny how he ignores anything anyone says that debunks his bs. And just post more bs saying no one can debunk his bs.

Bro you are literally no better. All you can come back with is "well you're an idiot". Great argument.


The funny thing is much of the things I say can be easily verified. For instance, those who argue in vain about the anglers not being cheated out of their championship redcrest last season can’t show a date in 2020 when it happened. There was a redcrest in 2019, and already a completely modified and rescheduled redcrest is reported to possibly take place in 2021, and purportedly even 2022... what happened to the 2020 event and why was it rumored that the anglers were recently even asked to pony up an entry fee (refundable) for the supposed upcoming redcrest? Speaking of entry fees... I suggest the no entry fees was a major talking point and key driver to influence a large portion of anglers to move from an established and stable tournament circuit over to MLF. That’s evidenced by what’s in the public record.

See:
Major shake-up in bass tournament world
Wednesday, September 12th 2018

https://newschannel9.com/sports/outdoors/major-shake-up-in-bass-tournament-world

Quote from article:
“MLF is holding informational meetings with anglers this week. However to attend those meeting anglers are expected to be required to sign non-disclosure agreements so it is still unclear how much detail about the new BPT circuit will be known publically even following those meetings.”
——————————————

Then, around the first week of October there was a small write up that indicated that the deadline for anglers that were invited into MLF had passed and an announcement would be coming with the names of the anglers. That came shortly there after and then right on the heals of that came the following:

OCTOBER 30, 2018 • MAJOR LEAGUE FISHING • BASS PRO TOUR

https://majorleaguefishing.com/press-releases/mlf-bass-pro-tour-anglers-vote-no-entry-fees-for-2019/

Quote from press release:
“What brought this great group of anglers together in the first place was the allure of being able to ultimately control our own destiny because collectively we now make the rules,” said Gary Klein, who was instrumental in the formation of MLF and Bass Pro Tour. “It’s all about the big picture of what we want this sport to be and getting it there. We call this ‘Major League’ Fishing for a reason and no entry fees is a monumental move in our achieving that distinction.”
————————————————

Now, there may have been a vote, but it’s a big stretch to suggest that it wasn’t already a predetermined conclusion and a major talking point and huge carrot on the stick when those dozen or so conspirators within BASS (MLF angler/investors) were recruiting the lemmings that had received an invite. The “no-entry-fees” was a significant factor for a lot of those guys, and no one can blame them for that... and it was even alluded to in subsequent interviews that Brandon and Gerald gave at end of 2019 when they jumped on the wagon leading away from the kook-aid fountain.

What happened? What’s changed so significantly that they had to reintroduce entry-fees? I mean, the primary stakeholders in this venture are multi-billionaires; they could easily support retaining what’s been the #1 talking point about the BPT. Same goes for the FLW AOY award... these multi-billionaires could have easily kept the award what it has been for many years... chump change to those guys... but no... and the reason is, they are not about putting money into the venture, they are about sucking it out. Hence, the without a thought cancellation of events that should have already had operational and payout costs secured.. canceled! Where is all that money going?
Posted By: Mark Jones

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/21/21 08:04 PM

All this conspiracy theory and conjecture and you still have zero impact on the outcome of their business and along with that, your constant rants keep their brand front and center here daily. It’s much appreciated, I’ll ask if someone can start sending you a stipend.

bump
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/21/21 08:08 PM

Josh Seale, see what I mean. He is still trying to say the Redcrest was cancelled and the money stolen. A monkey could understand that the Redcrest happening in a few weeks is for the 2020 season. The fact that they decided to have it in the spring instead of the fall is irrelevant. Just like the classic in June of this year is for the 2020 season
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 12:18 AM

Originally Posted by Mark Jones
All this conspiracy theory and conjecture and you still have zero impact on the outcome of their business and along with that, your constant rants keep their brand front and center here daily. It’s much appreciated, I’ll ask if someone can start sending you a stipend. bump


Conspiracy theory, conjecture? Hmmmmm, let’s have a look at something about the 2021 Redcrest and see if it’s conjecture or a conspiracy. There are two people who qualified via total AOY points in 2020 to participate in that years “Redcrest championship” for the Bass Pro Tour. The anglers in the top 40 of points were to be eligible. Now some are still arguing that this is the 2020 Championship, so it should include all 2020 anglers who qualified... 2021 season should have nothing to do with it and no bearing on who qualified. Look at the attached graphic and tell everyone who was eligible by 2020 AOY season points and IS NOT listed as an angler for the “2020 Redcrest” and also tell everyone who was not eligible by 2020 season points who IS being listed as an angler participating in the 2020 Redcrest! Can you reconcile that?

[Linked Image]
Posted By: Duck_Hunter

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 01:27 AM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Mark Jones
All this conspiracy theory and conjecture and you still have zero impact on the outcome of their business and along with that, your constant rants keep their brand front and center here daily. It’s much appreciated, I’ll ask if someone can start sending you a stipend. bump


Conspiracy theory, conjecture? Hmmmmm, let’s have a look at something about the 2021 Redcrest and see if it’s conjecture or a conspiracy. There are two people who qualified via total AOY points in 2020 to participate in that years “Redcrest championship” for the Bass Pro Tour. The anglers in the top 40 of points were to be eligible. Now some are still arguing that this is the 2020 Championship, so it should include all 2020 anglers who qualified... 2021 season should have nothing to do with it and no bearing on who qualified. Look at the attached graphic and tell everyone who was eligible by 2020 AOY season points and IS NOT listed as an angler for the “2020 Redcrest” and also tell everyone who was not eligible by 2020 season points who IS being listed as an angler participating in the 2020 Redcrest! Can you reconcile that?

[Linked Image]



Did Hackney leave the tour to fish BASS?
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 01:34 AM

Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Mark Jones
All this conspiracy theory and conjecture and you still have zero impact on the outcome of their business and along with that, your constant rants keep their brand front and center here daily. It’s much appreciated, I’ll ask if someone can start sending you a stipend. bump


Conspiracy theory, conjecture? Hmmmmm, let’s have a look at something about the 2021 Redcrest and see if it’s conjecture or a conspiracy. There are two people who qualified via total AOY points in 2020 to participate in that years “Redcrest championship” for the Bass Pro Tour. The anglers in the top 40 of points were to be eligible. Now some are still arguing that this is the 2020 Championship, so it should include all 2020 anglers who qualified... 2021 season should have nothing to do with it and no bearing on who qualified. Look at the attached graphic and tell everyone who was eligible by 2020 AOY season points and IS NOT listed as an angler for the “2020 Redcrest” and also tell everyone who was not eligible by 2020 season points who IS being listed as an angler participating in the 2020 Redcrest! Can you reconcile that?

[Linked Image]



Did Hackney leave the tour to fish BASS?


Yes and as far as anyone knows he could have told MLF he would not being fishing the Redcrest. But Warren would never say that.
Posted By: McLovin’

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 01:56 AM

Redcrest is happening....we’ve had guys all over the lake the last couple weeks here

big zero just need to post [censored] to stir the pot.....stop taking the bait guys
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 02:03 AM

Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Mark Jones
All this conspiracy theory and conjecture and you still have zero impact on the outcome of their business and along with that, your constant rants keep their brand front and center here daily. It’s much appreciated, I’ll ask if someone can start sending you a stipend. bump


Conspiracy theory, conjecture? Hmmmmm, let’s have a look at something about the 2021 Redcrest and see if it’s conjecture or a conspiracy. There are two people who qualified via total AOY points in 2020 to participate in that years “Redcrest championship” for the Bass Pro Tour. The anglers in the top 40 of points were to be eligible. Now some are still arguing that this is the 2020 Championship, so it should include all 2020 anglers who qualified... 2021 season should have nothing to do with it and no bearing on who qualified. Look at the attached graphic and tell everyone who was eligible by 2020 AOY season points and IS NOT listed as an angler for the “2020 Redcrest” and also tell everyone who was not eligible by 2020 season points who IS being listed as an angler participating in the 2020 Redcrest! Can you reconcile that?


Did Hackney leave the tour to fish BASS?


Not just Hackney, but also Atkins but that’s for the 2021 season, this redcrest is supposed to reflect the 2020 season where both fished the entirety of that MLF season.... both qualified 36th and 37th in 2020 AOY points respectively, and it seems MLF decided to increase the amount of the qualifiers to the Redcrest championship from the top 30 (see rule highlights in graphic) to the top 40 in 2020 AOY points, which by doing so instantly made both of those guys eligible to participate... but it looks like instead they plugged in the number 41 and 42 in points in their place.

Some people are vehemently arguing this Redcrest is a 2020 championship and event and none was skipped, so therefore wouldn’t all who qualified per the 2020 rules be eligible, irrespective of anything they decide to do 2021? We are talking about about a huge tournament purse where the top 20 are listed to get a check... why would they become ineligible? Is this another in the growing amount of examples, where MLF is ripping off and cheating anglers?

[Linked Image]
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 02:12 AM

How hard is to understand it could be the anglers decision. Just like a few years ago when Hack skipped the last tournament at BASS
Posted By: TxBazzn

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 02:35 AM

Originally Posted by Dubee
How hard is to understand it could be the anglers decision. Just like a few years ago when Hack skipped the last tournament at BASS


How hard is it to comprehend there is a chance it wasn’t the angler decision? He makes a valid argument; those anglers would absolutely fish a no entry, high purse tournament that they qualified for. It’s much more likely they were told they couldn’t. MLF has a history of being a bitter ex when guys break away.

BASS allowed all those guys to fish it’s classic in the same scenario.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 02:44 AM

Originally Posted by TxBazzn
Originally Posted by Dubee
How hard is to understand it could be the anglers decision. Just like a few years ago when Hack skipped the last tournament at BASS


How hard is it to comprehend there is a chance it wasn’t the angler decision? He makes a valid argument; those anglers would absolutely fish a no entry, high purse tournament that they qualified for. It’s much more likely they were told they couldn’t. MLF has a history of being a bitter ex when guys break away.

BASS allowed all those guys to fish it’s classic in the same scenario.


Yeah, I agree... those two anglers didn’t just walk away from the opportunity to earn as much as $300k? This info (list of anglers) coming out of MLF publicly is very recent... it will be interesting to hear what Hackney and Atkins have to say about it. On surface it looks to be just another in a growing number of examples where MLF has cheated anglers out of purse money in some form or fashion. I presume the MLF water boys don’t see the glaring issue surrounding this... and you won’t hear any of them speak out for what’s right.
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 03:03 AM

Originally Posted by TxBazzn
Originally Posted by Dubee
How hard is to understand it could be the anglers decision. Just like a few years ago when Hack skipped the last tournament at BASS


How hard is it to comprehend there is a chance it wasn’t the angler decision? He makes a valid argument; those anglers would absolutely fish a no entry, high purse tournament that they qualified for. It’s much more likely they were told they couldn’t. MLF has a history of being a bitter ex when guys break away.

BASS allowed all those guys to fish it’s classic in the same scenario.


Absolutely MLF could have told them to screw off. But he is presenting it like there is no other possibility. I have no idea who's choice it was and neither does Warren. Like I said Hack no showed the last tournament with a chance to get in the classic. As far as MLF having a history of being bitter about guys leaving. I would love to hear that explanation since there has only been a handful of guys leave in BPT's 2 year history
Posted By: Techfisher

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 03:15 AM


Well Bigley O...who really cares. MLF/MOFO/BPT/etc...it's entertainment to many of us and I really don't care a bit about the mythical behind the scenes you claim to be so amped up about. I watch'em to be entertained and escape from the ridiculous reality of the pandemic and all the other crazy sh*** going on. So don't mess it up for me with your nutball raving OK..?? I have so few illusions left in life as it is.

Thanks...
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 03:25 AM

Well a quick look at the elite schedule probably explains it. The last day of the Redcrest is the 1st day of the 2nd elite tournament.
Posted By: Duck_Hunter

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 03:36 AM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by Big O Florida

Conspiracy theory, conjecture? Hmmmmm, let’s have a look at something about the 2021 Redcrest and see if it’s conjecture or a conspiracy. There are two people who qualified via total AOY points in 2020 to participate in that years “Redcrest championship” for the Bass Pro Tour. The anglers in the top 40 of points were to be eligible. Now some are still arguing that this is the 2020 Championship, so it should include all 2020 anglers who qualified... 2021 season should have nothing to do with it and no bearing on who qualified. Look at the attached graphic and tell everyone who was eligible by 2020 AOY season points and IS NOT listed as an angler for the “2020 Redcrest” and also tell everyone who was not eligible by 2020 season points who IS being listed as an angler participating in the 2020 Redcrest! Can you reconcile that?


Did Hackney leave the tour to fish BASS?


Not just Hackney, but also Atkins but that’s for the 2021 season, this redcrest is supposed to reflect the 2020 season where both fished the entirety of that MLF season.... both qualified 36th and 37th in 2020 AOY points respectively, and it seems MLF decided to increase the amount of the qualifiers to the Redcrest championship from the top 30 (see rule highlights in graphic) to the top 40 in 2020 AOY points, which by doing so instantly made both of those guys eligible to participate... but it looks like instead they plugged in the number 41 and 42 in points in their place.

Some people are vehemently arguing this Redcrest is a 2020 championship and event and none was skipped, so therefore wouldn’t all who qualified per the 2020 rules be eligible, irrespective of anything they decide to do 2021? We are talking about about a huge tournament purse where the top 20 are listed to get a check... why would they become ineligible? Is this another in the growing amount of examples, where MLF is ripping off and cheating anglers?

[Linked Image]



This is the weakest attempt at disparaging MLF/BPT I’ve seen you make yet. It’s just bald-faced BS or, worse, lies. Perhaps both. Find a new slant.
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 03:38 AM

Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by Big O Florida

Conspiracy theory, conjecture? Hmmmmm, let’s have a look at something about the 2021 Redcrest and see if it’s conjecture or a conspiracy. There are two people who qualified via total AOY points in 2020 to participate in that years “Redcrest championship” for the Bass Pro Tour. The anglers in the top 40 of points were to be eligible. Now some are still arguing that this is the 2020 Championship, so it should include all 2020 anglers who qualified... 2021 season should have nothing to do with it and no bearing on who qualified. Look at the attached graphic and tell everyone who was eligible by 2020 AOY season points and IS NOT listed as an angler for the “2020 Redcrest” and also tell everyone who was not eligible by 2020 season points who IS being listed as an angler participating in the 2020 Redcrest! Can you reconcile that?


Did Hackney leave the tour to fish BASS?


Not just Hackney, but also Atkins but that’s for the 2021 season, this redcrest is supposed to reflect the 2020 season where both fished the entirety of that MLF season.... both qualified 36th and 37th in 2020 AOY points respectively, and it seems MLF decided to increase the amount of the qualifiers to the Redcrest championship from the top 30 (see rule highlights in graphic) to the top 40 in 2020 AOY points, which by doing so instantly made both of those guys eligible to participate... but it looks like instead they plugged in the number 41 and 42 in points in their place.

Some people are vehemently arguing this Redcrest is a 2020 championship and event and none was skipped, so therefore wouldn’t all who qualified per the 2020 rules be eligible, irrespective of anything they decide to do 2021? We are talking about about a huge tournament purse where the top 20 are listed to get a check... why would they become ineligible? Is this another in the growing amount of examples, where MLF is ripping off and cheating anglers?

[Linked Image]



This is the weakest attempt at disparaging MLF/BPT I’ve seen you make yet. It’s just bald-faced BS or, worse, lies. Perhaps both. Find a new slant.


I don't know how he was allowed back on here
Posted By: Duck_Hunter

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 03:45 AM

Originally Posted by Dubee
Well a quick look at the elite schedule probably explains it. The last day of the Redcrest is the 1st day of the 2nd elite tournament.


Imagine that. They left for a different tour and the schedule conflicts.

Also, it’s not insane to think that a tour wouldn’t let you participate in an event for a tour you decided not to be a part of anymore. It seems a little insane to spend your entire existence on an Internet forum ranting and raving about fairness and conspiracy theories without backing it up, listening to reason or logic, and flat out ignoring facts/obvious reasoning while calling people lemmings, though.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 08:36 AM

Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by Dubee
Well a quick look at the elite schedule probably explains it. The last day of the Redcrest is the 1st day of the 2nd elite tournament.


Imagine that. They left for a different tour and the schedule conflicts.

Also, it’s not insane to think that a tour wouldn’t let you participate in an event for a tour you decided not to be a part of anymore. It seems a little insane to spend your entire existence on an Internet forum ranting and raving about fairness and conspiracy theories without backing it up, listening to reason or logic, and flat out ignoring facts/obvious reasoning while calling people lemmings, though.


Just imagine if MLF had denoted in the list of participating anglers for its purported 2020 Redcrest that the 41st and 42nd place points finishers qualified *only due to participants ahead of them in points withdrawing from the tournament; or, imagine this, them not changing the original format at all and capping the field at top 30 like “the official rules” are written. Just imagine that those two anglers could easily compete in both tournaments under multiple scenarios, one being if they were in the running for the “big money” they skip the first day of the conflicting tournament or another, if they weren’t in the running for big money they wouldn’t be fishing anyhow, but still would have earned a check.

What is insane is a organization forbidding someone from competing in an event that they qualified for under the rules as they were written during the time they applied. i.e. - the 2020 season. Such as BASS did for its 2019 Bassmasters Classic where as a perfect example, an angler from that competing tour was allowed to participate and actually won it. (Ott DeFoe) IMAGINE THAT! Perhaps before you criticize me, you look at all the facts, and determine if Hackney and Atkins withdrew voluntarily or were withdrawn involuntarily, and also recognize the biggest driver of the criticism towards MLF is they ARE ALWAYS DEVIATING FROM THEIR PUBLISHED RULES! And this situation is no exception.

I am sure those anglers will comment at some point and we’ll know the real truth.
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 12:45 PM

One good thing is it won't take long for you to get banned again
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 01:44 PM

It absolutely boggles my mind there are people, even after being provided with screen shots, links to published articles, etc... supporting my position and statements, that will still deny the image that’s clearly in front of them; and then suggest something I say is being made up, not true, and BS. This last point I spoke about being a perfect example. It’s a fact that Hackney and Atkins did not originally qualify for the Redcrest that is purportedly directly related to the 2020 season. The posted rules on MLF/BPT website (screenshot provided and highlighted) showed the Redcrest, as rules outlined only was to have 30 qualified anglers based on AOY points. Somewhere along the line, and recently that was changed to the top 40 anglers because the event page lists 40 anglers who qualified, but yet the published rules were not updated. With that change to 40 anglers, based on AOY points, that automatically made both Hackney and Adkins eligible based on the AOY points, yet they aren’t being listed as qualified anglers eligible to participate on the MLF/BPT event page. The question was why... simple as that. Could they have declined, it’s absolutely possible... but as it was rightly pointed out by another, considering it was a no entry fee event with a high payout, it was unlikely. There was nothing in the list showing the eligible anglers denoting that those two had withdrawn either, such as an * with note indicating they were replacement for a withdrawn participant. i.e. 41st and 42nd place anglers.

There are many scenarios in which those guys could have made it work, and one doesn’t have to look very far to see examples of that... John Cox... and if he is to be believed, he will do it again this year. There will be BPT events where he misses a day or the entire event, the first being when he is fishing the Bassmasters Classic; and the same goes for Elite series events... he may be forced to choose based on the situation he’s in at the time and potential of getting a check. So it’s not impossible for those Hackney and Atkins to accomplish the same feat. I hope we hear from them soon in an interview to learn what the deal is, but it seems the MLF water boys are already engaged in a stiff defensive posture, so maybe they already know and it doesn’t reflect well on MLF.

MLF brings on the scrutiny itself by how it conducts itself within the industry. In the short time since the inception of the BPT they’ve earned themselves quite the reputation of not being an honest broker... fans have recognized it, and most certainly sponsors have noticed it. They’ve abandoned MLF in droves; so when they are being defended for their behavior by some, it becomes incomprehension to others.
Posted By: grout-scout

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 02:00 PM

10 pages of “2 Warrens” arguing about something stupid that very few watch. flush
Posted By: TxBazzn

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 02:04 PM

Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by TxBazzn
Originally Posted by Dubee
How hard is to understand it could be the anglers decision. Just like a few years ago when Hack skipped the last tournament at BASS


How hard is it to comprehend there is a chance it wasn’t the angler decision? He makes a valid argument; those anglers would absolutely fish a no entry, high purse tournament that they qualified for. It’s much more likely they were told they couldn’t. MLF has a history of being a bitter ex when guys break away.

BASS allowed all those guys to fish it’s classic in the same scenario.


Absolutely MLF could have told them to screw off. But he is presenting it like there is no other possibility. I have no idea who's choice it was and neither does Warren. Like I said Hack no showed the last tournament with a chance to get in the classic. As far as MLF having a history of being bitter about guys leaving. I would love to hear that explanation since there has only been a handful of guys leave in BPT's 2 year history


Here’s your explanation: Guys who have fished MLF Cups since it’s infancy, which really helped MLF get off the ground, are no longer invited to participate in the MLF events when they decide BPT was not for them. Those are two separate tournament trails and MLF cups are at times when other tournaments aren’t. Why? I’m guessing it’s pettiness and bitterness.

Palaniuk loved the MLF not BPT. But he had to give it all up if he left BPT.
Posted By: TxBazzn

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 02:20 PM

Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by Dubee
Well a quick look at the elite schedule probably explains it. The last day of the Redcrest is the 1st day of the 2nd elite tournament.


Imagine that. They left for a different tour and the schedule conflicts.

Also, it’s not insane to think that a tour wouldn’t let you participate in an event for a tour you decided not to be a part of anymore. It seems a little insane to spend your entire existence on an Internet forum ranting and raving about fairness and conspiracy theories without backing it up, listening to reason or logic, and flat out ignoring facts/obvious reasoning while calling people lemmings, though.


It sort of is insane when you look at what the norm has been for every tour that’s ever existed. If you qualify for a championship, it doesn’t matter where you go next season, you qualified and can fish that championship. I can do that with every Texas tour even.
Big O’ puts evidence up to support his theories and you guys look for a million ways to disapprove him and never once for a second consider his opinion could hold water. Instead you resort to insults and put downs and root for him to banned.
But that’s the world we live in, if you don’t like what someone is saying, SILENCE THEM!
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 02:39 PM

Originally Posted by TxBazzn
Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by Dubee
Well a quick look at the elite schedule probably explains it. The last day of the Redcrest is the 1st day of the 2nd elite tournament.


Imagine that. They left for a different tour and the schedule conflicts.

Also, it’s not insane to think that a tour wouldn’t let you participate in an event for a tour you decided not to be a part of anymore. It seems a little insane to spend your entire existence on an Internet forum ranting and raving about fairness and conspiracy theories without backing it up, listening to reason or logic, and flat out ignoring facts/obvious reasoning while calling people lemmings, though.


It sort of is insane when you look at what the norm has been for every tour that’s ever existed. If you qualify for a championship, it doesn’t matter where you go next season, you qualified and can fish that championship. I can do that with every Texas tour even.
Big O’ puts evidence up to support his theories and you guys look for a million ways to disapprove him and never once for a second consider his opinion could hold water. Instead you resort to insults and put downs and root for him to banned.
But that’s the world we live in, if you don’t like what someone is saying, SILENCE THEM!



But the problem is he doesn't put up evidence. He says the Redcrest got cancelled and they stole the money. Truth is it didn't get cancelled. It's next month. He says when the last 3 BPT events got cancelled they pocketed all that purse money. Truth is they added 1.5 million in purse money to the last s FLW tournaments. Now he claims MLF won't let a couple guys fish the championship. He has no proof just like I have no proof the decided to skip it for the elite tournament.. He never has proof.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 02:48 PM

Originally Posted by TxBazzn
Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by Dubee
Well a quick look at the elite schedule probably explains it. The last day of the Redcrest is the 1st day of the 2nd elite tournament.


Imagine that. They left for a different tour and the schedule conflicts.

Also, it’s not insane to think that a tour wouldn’t let you participate in an event for a tour you decided not to be a part of anymore. It seems a little insane to spend your entire existence on an Internet forum ranting and raving about fairness and conspiracy theories without backing it up, listening to reason or logic, and flat out ignoring facts/obvious reasoning while calling people lemmings, though.


It sort of is insane when you look at what the norm has been for every tour that’s ever existed. If you qualify for a championship, it doesn’t matter where you go next season, you qualified and can fish that championship. I can do that with every Texas tour even.
Big O’ puts evidence up to support his theories and you guys look for a million ways to disapprove him and never once for a second consider his opinion could hold water. Instead you resort to insults and put downs and root for him to banned.
But that’s the world we live in, if you don’t like what someone is saying, SILENCE THEM!


Yes, it’s a shame there are people who scream ban, ban, ban the person I disagree with, but for some reason I suspect they are totally against censorship of those who have been banned on other social media for things far more dangerous, recently.

As it relates to the championship tournaments, in my last post I referenced John Cox, and in doing so I referred to him having a conflict with the Bassmasters Classic. To clarify, that was the original classic date I was referring to, and interviews John has conducted since joining BPT where he made it clear he was going to fish the BPT and Elites, AND, as many of the humongous 5 pro series events as he can, and that in doing so it may require him to miss a single day of an event depending on the circumstances... and that was going to be the case with the original classic date, because BPT scheduled on top of that date by one day and Cox said he was most certainly going to skip the first day of the BPT event to finish out the Classic.

It will be interesting to see how they handle the John Cox situation. I sure he’s not worried about forfeiting entry fees, and I will presume Crestliner pays them all, so he’s going to participate in the tournaments he has the best chance at getting a check... I think he said which ever one he has the best shot at collecting $10k and above in. What’s going to be more interesting is to see how they handle David Dudley... his new gig requires him to talk up and promote a competing tour and the anglers who fish it... as sensitive as MLF and their water carriers seems to be towards that sort of thing, I think what DD does will cause much drama within the ranks!
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 02:48 PM

Originally Posted by grout-scout
10 pages of “2 Warrens” arguing about something stupid that very few watch. flush

Lol, I'll admit I'm an idiot. i've never claimed to be smart. But it doesn't matter how many people watch. In fact to me it has nothing to do with MLF. I have no stake in the company. I don't know anyone who fishes it or owns stake in it. I just don't like the way he constantly post absolute falsehoods and every post is the same. I would feel the same way if he was doing it about BASS or Triton or Ranger or Ford or Chevy or Dr. Pepper ect....
Posted By: Duck_Hunter

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 02:49 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by Dubee
Well a quick look at the elite schedule probably explains it. The last day of the Redcrest is the 1st day of the 2nd elite tournament.


Imagine that. They left for a different tour and the schedule conflicts.

Also, it’s not insane to think that a tour wouldn’t let you participate in an event for a tour you decided not to be a part of anymore. It seems a little insane to spend your entire existence on an Internet forum ranting and raving about fairness and conspiracy theories without backing it up, listening to reason or logic, and flat out ignoring facts/obvious reasoning while calling people lemmings, though.


Just imagine if MLF had denoted in the list of participating anglers for its purported 2020 Redcrest that the 41st and 42nd place points finishers qualified *only due to participants ahead of them in points withdrawing from the tournament; or, imagine this, them not changing the original format at all and capping the field at top 30 like “the official rules” are written. Just imagine that those two anglers could easily compete in both tournaments under multiple scenarios, one being if they were in the running for the “big money” they skip the first day of the conflicting tournament or another, if they weren’t in the running for big money they wouldn’t be fishing anyhow, but still would have earned a check.

What is insane is a organization forbidding someone from competing in an event that they qualified for under the rules as they were written during the time they applied. i.e. - the 2020 season. Such as BASS did for its 2019 Bassmasters Classic where as a perfect example, an angler from that competing tour was allowed to participate and actually won it. (Ott DeFoe) IMAGINE THAT! Perhaps before you criticize me, you look at all the facts, and determine if Hackney and Atkins withdrew voluntarily or were withdrawn involuntarily, and also recognize the biggest driver of the criticism towards MLF is they ARE ALWAYS DEVIATING FROM THEIR PUBLISHED RULES! And this situation is no exception.

I am sure those anglers will comment at some point and we’ll know the real truth.


So your gripe is with MLF’s PR team not communicating effectively and you admit that the scenarios I presented are most likely and you’re just mad they’re not doing it the way you think they should be doing it, based on your limited knowledge of the situation and have been making assumptions since you signed up here for the sole purpose of bashing MLF? We’re making progress. This is good.

You’re mistaking BASS’ professional courtesy for Otte as being the only way to do something, when it’s in MLF’s right to do it a different way. You disagree with MLF’s decision, we get it. Maybe it’s unfair. Maybe Hackney is upset over it. Maybe it shouldn’t be that way.

Or, maybe Hackney didn’t want to fish it for some reason. Maybe he knowingly signed a contract that stipulated these terms (if you leave before the red crest, you can’t fish it even if you qualify) and he made an informed decision to leave anyway and forgo the money he would’ve made by fishing Redcrest? Or, his sponsors don’t want him to fish it, they’d rather him stick to BASS (isn’t that a realistic theory, since, in you keep saying MLF stinks, doesn’t get the viewership, and on and on?

Why don’t you find some credible answers to this situation and then come back to us? Until then, nobody knows what’s happening with Hack himself, MLF or BASS and this is all speculation, but some people realize it’s entirely possible he signed a contract knowing what it would mean if he left or he made an informed decision to not fish it. Declaring for over a year that MLF just keeps stealing money without any proof (or, if you’re correct, not revealing how you’re correct) is silly.

If they kept “stealing money,” as you continue to say, they would’ve been sued by now.
Posted By: Duck_Hunter

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 03:13 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
It absolutely boggles my mind there are people, even after being provided with screen shots, links to published articles, etc... supporting my position and statements, that will still deny the image that’s clearly in front of them; and then suggest something I say is being made up, not true, and BS. This last point I spoke about being a perfect example. It’s a fact that Hackney and Atkins did not originally qualify for the Redcrest that is purportedly directly related to the 2020 season. The posted rules on MLF/BPT website (screenshot provided and highlighted) showed the Redcrest, as rules outlined only was to have 30 qualified anglers based on AOY points. Somewhere along the line, and recently that was changed to the top 40 anglers because the event page lists 40 anglers who qualified, but yet the published rules were not updated. With that change to 40 anglers, based on AOY points, that automatically made both Hackney and Adkins eligible based on the AOY points, yet they aren’t being listed as qualified anglers eligible to participate on the MLF/BPT event page. The question was why... simple as that. Could they have declined, it’s absolutely possible... but as it was rightly pointed out by another, considering it was a no entry fee event with a high payout, it was unlikely. There was nothing in the list showing the eligible anglers denoting that those two had withdrawn either, such as an * with note indicating they were replacement for a withdrawn participant. i.e. 41st and 42nd place anglers.

There are many scenarios in which those guys could have made it work, and one doesn’t have to look very far to see examples of that... John Cox... and if he is to be believed, he will do it again this year. There will be BPT events where he misses a day or the entire event, the first being when he is fishing the Bassmasters Classic; and the same goes for Elite series events... he may be forced to choose based on the situation he’s in at the time and potential of getting a check. So it’s not impossible for those Hackney and Atkins to accomplish the same feat. I hope we hear from them soon in an interview to learn what the deal is, but it seems the MLF water boys are already engaged in a stiff defensive posture, so maybe they already know and it doesn’t reflect well on MLF.

MLF brings on the scrutiny itself by how it conducts itself within the industry. In the short time since the inception of the BPT they’ve earned themselves quite the reputation of not being an honest broker... fans have recognized it, and most certainly sponsors have noticed it. They’ve abandoned MLF in droves; so when they are being defended for their behavior by some, it becomes incomprehension to others.


I’m not a water carrier for anything. I only occasionally watch fishing on TV. I like the MLF format and I like the traditional BASS format. MLF is new and more exciting TV to watch, especially live, in my opinion. Watching bass fishing on TV makes up .05% or less of my annual TV consumption. So I’m not carrying water for anyone, I can promise you that.

But, I enjoy looking at things logically, and your slant on this topic is anything but logical. You’re presented with scenarios that easily answer your proposed theories. You misconstrue the “facts” you post repeatedly. You cherry pick and bombard with misdirection. You could only know some of the vague background information you post if you had first hand knowledge of it, but swear you’re not involved with either tour. That leads some people to believe you’re full of it.

It’s that black and white.
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 03:15 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by TxBazzn
Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by Dubee
Well a quick look at the elite schedule probably explains it. The last day of the Redcrest is the 1st day of the 2nd elite tournament.


Imagine that. They left for a different tour and the schedule conflicts.

Also, it’s not insane to think that a tour wouldn’t let you participate in an event for a tour you decided not to be a part of anymore. It seems a little insane to spend your entire existence on an Internet forum ranting and raving about fairness and conspiracy theories without backing it up, listening to reason or logic, and flat out ignoring facts/obvious reasoning while calling people lemmings, though.


It sort of is insane when you look at what the norm has been for every tour that’s ever existed. If you qualify for a championship, it doesn’t matter where you go next season, you qualified and can fish that championship. I can do that with every Texas tour even.
Big O’ puts evidence up to support his theories and you guys look for a million ways to disapprove him and never once for a second consider his opinion could hold water. Instead you resort to insults and put downs and root for him to banned.
But that’s the world we live in, if you don’t like what someone is saying, SILENCE THEM!


Yes, it’s a shame there are people who scream ban, ban, ban the person I disagree with, but for some reason I suspect they are totally against censorship of those who have been banned on other social media for things far more dangerous, recently.

As it relates to the championship tournaments, in my last post I referenced John Cox, and in doing so I referred to him having a conflict with the Bassmasters Classic. To clarify, that was the original classic date I was referring to, and interviews John has conducted since joining BPT where he made it clear he was going to fish the BPT and Elites, AND, as many of the humongous 5 pro series events as he can, and that in doing so it may require him to miss a single day of an event depending on the circumstances... and that was going to be the case with the original classic date, because BPT scheduled on top of that date by one day and Cox said he was most certainly going to skip the first day of the BPT event to finish out the Classic.

It will be interesting to see how they handle the John Cox situation. I sure he’s not worried about forfeiting entry fees, and I will presume Crestliner pays them all, so he’s going to participate in the tournaments he has the best chance at getting a check... I think he said which ever one he has the best shot at collecting $10k and above in. What’s going to be more interesting is to see how they handle David Dudley... his new gig requires him to talk up and promote a competing tour and the anglers who fish it... as sensitive as MLF and their water carriers seems to be towards that sort of thing, I think what DD does will cause much drama within the ranks!



I wouldn't want someone banned because I disagree with them. If you commented on MLF threads saying you don't like the format. Or any other opinion about them. And just gave your opinion. I have no problem. But I think someone who constantly post false info about an organization or business as fact. Should be banned.
Posted By: SC-001

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 03:18 PM

Originally Posted by Dubee


I don't know how he was allowed back on here


JP Greeson needs to make him go bye bye again
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 03:26 PM

Originally Posted by SC-001
Originally Posted by Dubee


I don't know how he was allowed back on here


JP Greeson needs to make him go bye bye again

I agree. With all the false accusations he post about stealing money. If MLF ever decided to sue him they could include JP for allowing it to continue. Whether or not they would have a winnable case against JP doesn't matter. He would still have to spend time and money defending himself
Posted By: SC-001

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 03:29 PM

I don't have a working knowledge of defamation law but you might be correct
Posted By: Duck_Hunter

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 03:31 PM

Originally Posted by TxBazzn
Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by Dubee
Well a quick look at the elite schedule probably explains it. The last day of the Redcrest is the 1st day of the 2nd elite tournament.


Imagine that. They left for a different tour and the schedule conflicts.

Also, it’s not insane to think that a tour wouldn’t let you participate in an event for a tour you decided not to be a part of anymore. It seems a little insane to spend your entire existence on an Internet forum ranting and raving about fairness and conspiracy theories without backing it up, listening to reason or logic, and flat out ignoring facts/obvious reasoning while calling people lemmings, though.


It sort of is insane when you look at what the norm has been for every tour that’s ever existed. If you qualify for a championship, it doesn’t matter where you go next season, you qualified and can fish that championship. I can do that with every Texas tour even.
Big O’ puts evidence up to support his theories and you guys look for a million ways to disapprove him and never once for a second consider his opinion could hold water. Instead you resort to insults and put downs and root for him to banned.
But that’s the world we live in, if you don’t like what someone is saying, SILENCE THEM!


Running a new business differently than the way it’s always been done has been vogue for twenty years now. It’s called ‘disruption.’ Will it fail? Will it forever change the landscape of professional fishing? Who knows. The economy is littered with companies that tried to disrupt an industry by flipping it on its head and failed. There are also a ton of success stories (Amazon, Uber, etc). Is MLF Amazon or uber? Of course not, but it’s the same mentality of market disruption.

I’m not saying they’re right or wrong for doing it this way, but just pointing out they are trying to go up against the institution that made bass fishing as popular as it is. They may be the worst businessmen in the world. They may fold before the end of the year. But a lot of the negativity, I think, comes from people who are resistant to change, and instead of a healthy rivalry while acknowledging they’re trying to grow the sport (and they are growing the sport) there is animosity and defensiveness.

Big O misconstrue evidence he puts out to support his theories and then calls people lemmings, shysters and water boys. His entire existence on this forum has been to bash MLF and insult anyone who enjoys watching it or simply tries to explain the flaws in his “evidence.” These are not well thought out points based on personal preference he’s making. They’re vindictive, hateful and personal to him in some way. He’s either personally involved somehow (an angler that was slighted by MLF or related to one) or somehow otherwise related to the industry. It’s just not rational dialogue or behavior any other way.
Posted By: Lone_Wolf

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 03:35 PM

Powroznik is still fishing redcrest, why they not kick him out too?
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 03:42 PM

Originally Posted by Lone_Wolf
Powroznik is still fishing redcrest, why they not kick him out too?


My guess is because he didn’t qualify for the elites and signed the new contract with MLF to pay entry fees.
Posted By: Mark Jones

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 03:49 PM

Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by TxBazzn
Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by Dubee
Well a quick look at the elite schedule probably explains it. The last day of the Redcrest is the 1st day of the 2nd elite tournament.


Imagine that. They left for a different tour and the schedule conflicts.

Also, it’s not insane to think that a tour wouldn’t let you participate in an event for a tour you decided not to be a part of anymore. It seems a little insane to spend your entire existence on an Internet forum ranting and raving about fairness and conspiracy theories without backing it up, listening to reason or logic, and flat out ignoring facts/obvious reasoning while calling people lemmings, though.


It sort of is insane when you look at what the norm has been for every tour that’s ever existed. If you qualify for a championship, it doesn’t matter where you go next season, you qualified and can fish that championship. I can do that with every Texas tour even.
Big O’ puts evidence up to support his theories and you guys look for a million ways to disapprove him and never once for a second consider his opinion could hold water. Instead you resort to insults and put downs and root for him to banned.
But that’s the world we live in, if you don’t like what someone is saying, SILENCE THEM!


Running a new business differently than the way it’s always been done has been vogue for twenty years now. It’s called ‘disruption.’ Will it fail? Will it forever change the landscape of professional fishing? Who knows. The economy is littered with companies that tried to disrupt an industry by flipping it on its head and failed. There are also a ton of success stories (Amazon, Uber, etc). Is MLF Amazon or uber? Of course not, but it’s the same mentality of market disruption.

I’m not saying they’re right or wrong for doing it this way, but just pointing out they are trying to go up against the institution that made bass fishing as popular as it is. They may be the worst businessmen in the world. They may fold before the end of the year. But a lot of the negativity, I think, comes from people who are resistant to change, and instead of a healthy rivalry while acknowledging they’re trying to grow the sport (and they are growing the sport) there is animosity and defensiveness.

Big O misconstrue evidence he puts out to support his theories and then calls people lemmings, shysters and water boys. His entire existence on this forum has been to bash MLF and insult anyone who enjoys watching it or simply tries to explain the flaws in his “evidence.” These are not well thought out points based on personal preference he’s making. They’re vindictive, hateful and personal to him in some way. He’s either personally involved somehow (an angler that was slighted by MLF or related to one) or somehow otherwise related to the industry. It’s just not rational dialogue or behavior any other way.


^^^^^ And there you have it all wrapped up nicely in a bow.

This should be the end of the thread, but I know it won't be.


cheers
Posted By: SAKS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 03:52 PM

Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by TxBazzn
Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by Dubee
Well a quick look at the elite schedule probably explains it. The last day of the Redcrest is the 1st day of the 2nd elite tournament.


Imagine that. They left for a different tour and the schedule conflicts.

Also, it’s not insane to think that a tour wouldn’t let you participate in an event for a tour you decided not to be a part of anymore. It seems a little insane to spend your entire existence on an Internet forum ranting and raving about fairness and conspiracy theories without backing it up, listening to reason or logic, and flat out ignoring facts/obvious reasoning while calling people lemmings, though.


It sort of is insane when you look at what the norm has been for every tour that’s ever existed. If you qualify for a championship, it doesn’t matter where you go next season, you qualified and can fish that championship. I can do that with every Texas tour even.
Big O’ puts evidence up to support his theories and you guys look for a million ways to disapprove him and never once for a second consider his opinion could hold water. Instead you resort to insults and put downs and root for him to banned.
But that’s the world we live in, if you don’t like what someone is saying, SILENCE THEM!


Running a new business differently than the way it’s always been done has been vogue for twenty years now. It’s called ‘disruption.’ Will it fail? Will it forever change the landscape of professional fishing? Who knows. The economy is littered with companies that tried to disrupt an industry by flipping it on its head and failed. There are also a ton of success stories (Amazon, Uber, etc). Is MLF Amazon or uber? Of course not, but it’s the same mentality of market disruption.

I’m not saying they’re right or wrong for doing it this way, but just pointing out they are trying to go up against the institution that made bass fishing as popular as it is. They may be the worst businessmen in the world. They may fold before the end of the year. But a lot of the negativity, I think, comes from people who are resistant to change, and instead of a healthy rivalry while acknowledging they’re trying to grow the sport (and they are growing the sport) there is animosity and defensiveness.

Big O misconstrue evidence he puts out to support his theories and then calls people lemmings, shysters and water boys. His entire existence on this forum has been to bash MLF and insult anyone who enjoys watching it or simply tries to explain the flaws in his “evidence.” These are not well thought out points based on personal preference he’s making. They’re vindictive, hateful and personal to him in some way. He’s either personally involved somehow (an angler that was slighted by MLF or related to one) or somehow otherwise related to the industry. It’s just not rational dialogue or behavior any other way.

I agree with you. Choice is simple, follow it or don't. No organization owes anyone outside their organization any explanations about how they do business.
Posted By: beartrap

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 03:58 PM

MLF has 6 hours of TV exposure on the Outdoor channel and CBS this weekend.....hard to argue that this isn't a huge increase in exposure for the fishermen and more importantly for their sponsors......
Posted By: boyd1002

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 04:10 PM

Originally Posted by beartrap
MLF has 6 hours of TV exposure on the Outdoor channel and CBS this weekend.....hard to argue that this isn't a huge increase in exposure for the fishermen and more importantly for their sponsors......


it does seem like the sponsors would like the MLF TV exposure, but in the past two years we have heard BP, Swindle and Christie say that their sponsors undoubtedly wanted them at BASS. Maybe different companies have different strategies, but that really stuck out to me.
Posted By: Lone_Wolf

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 04:21 PM

Originally Posted by beartrap
MLF has 6 hours of TV exposure on the Outdoor channel and CBS this weekend.....hard to argue that this isn't a huge increase in exposure for the fishermen and more importantly for their sponsors......

I watched the chili bowl race this weekend and was shocked how many fishing commercials there were, it was all MLF guys.
Posted By: Lone_Wolf

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 04:23 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Lone_Wolf
Powroznik is still fishing redcrest, why they not kick him out too?


My guess is because he didn’t qualify for the elites and signed the new contract with MLF to pay entry fees.

So they kicking pro circuit invites from 4 to 3 for every BPT event?, for the regular season I think Powroznik is OUT.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 04:55 PM

Originally Posted by SAKS
Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by TxBazzn
Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter

Imagine that. They left for a different tour and the schedule conflicts.
Also, it’s not insane to think that a tour wouldn’t let you participate in an event for a tour you decided not to be a part of anymore. It seems a little insane to spend your entire existence on an Internet forum ranting and raving about fairness and conspiracy theories without backing it up, listening to reason or logic, and flat out ignoring facts/obvious reasoning while calling people lemmings, though.

It sort of is insane when you look at what the norm has been for every tour that’s ever existed. If you qualify for a championship, it doesn’t matter where you go next season, you qualified and can fish that championship. I can do that with every Texas tour even.
Big O’ puts evidence up to support his theories and you guys look for a million ways to disapprove him and never once for a second consider his opinion could hold water. Instead you resort to insults and put downs and root for him to banned.
But that’s the world we live in, if you don’t like what someone is saying, SILENCE THEM!

Running a new business differently than the way it’s always been done has been vogue for twenty years now. It’s called ‘disruption.’ Will it fail? Will it forever change the landscape of professional fishing? Who knows. The economy is littered with companies that tried to disrupt an industry by flipping it on its head and failed. There are also a ton of success stories (Amazon, Uber, etc). Is MLF Amazon or uber? Of course not, but it’s the same mentality of market disruption.
I’m not saying they’re right or wrong for doing it this way, but just pointing out they are trying to go up against the institution that made bass fishing as popular as it is. They may be the worst businessmen in the world. They may fold before the end of the year. But a lot of the negativity, I think, comes from people who are resistant to change, and instead of a healthy rivalry while acknowledging they’re trying to grow the sport (and they are growing the sport) there is animosity and defensiveness.
Big O misconstrue evidence he puts out to support his theories and then calls people lemmings, shysters and water boys. His entire existence on this forum has been to bash MLF and insult anyone who enjoys watching it or simply tries to explain the flaws in his “evidence.” These are not well thought out points based on personal preference he’s making. They’re vindictive, hateful and personal to him in some way. He’s either personally involved somehow (an angler that was slighted by MLF or related to one) or somehow otherwise related to the industry. It’s just not rational dialogue or behavior any other way.

I agree with you. Choice is simple, follow it or don't. No organization owes anyone outside their organization any explanations about how they do business.


I agree with you that no organization owes outsiders any explanations, but at same time don’t agree with Duck Hunter that what MLF is doing is vogue and called a disruption. On surface it appears MLF is being run by the typical Wall Street equity investor playbook. There has not been much mention of the fact that before FLW, MLF tried 3x to buy BASS from the new owners and were shot down... that wasn’t a plan to grow things, it was a plan to deplete things. And that’s what they’ve accomplished with FLW and as a result they struggled to fill the spots on many of the different circuits in the 2020 season. While some claim they (MLF) deserve credit for growing the sport and the industry, they seem to overlook the opposite happened within FLW but yet there was an exponential growth seen in the last year within boat and tackle companies. No doubt that growth could be attributed to the COVID where people were seeking activities that could be done in solitary or small groups, but it certainly can’t be contributed to MLF or anything they’ve done.... Furthermore, while MLF may not owe anyone an explanation on how they conduct business, that shouldn’t mean people as outside observers, or insiders of the industry should be silenced from bringing to light questionable and unethical conduct and practices. I don’t think that type of thing is changing the industry, but rather, it’s exploiting those who are in it... and the consequences for them not having an approval of their business ethic and attitude is there for all to see with the massive loss in sponsors they’ve experienced. Contrarily, due to the bad behavior by MLF, BASS has gained popularity and sponsors, not only in endorsements, but in the recently announced multi-year 7 figure media contract they signed with Fox Sports. That’s going to once again give the sponsors and anglers who are associated with BASS the platform and big stage exposure the BASS brand is known for delivering to its customers. That’s not people who are resistant to change... that’s an industry speaking loudly that they are going to shun the type of disruption MLF and others purportedly thinks is vogue.
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 05:18 PM



I agree with you that no organization owes outsiders any explanations, but at same time don’t agree with Duck Hunter that what MLF is doing is vogue and called a disruption. On surface it appears MLF is being run by the typical Wall Street equity investor playbook. There has not been much mention of the fact that before FLW, MLF tried 3x to buy BASS from the new owners and were shot down... that wasn’t a plan to grow things, it was a plan to deplete things. And that’s what they’ve accomplished with FLW and as a result they struggled to fill the spots on many of the different circuits in the 2020 season. While some claim they (MLF) deserve credit for growing the sport and the industry, they seem to overlook the opposite happened within FLW but yet there was an exponential growth seen in the last year within boat and tackle companies. No doubt that growth could be attributed to the COVID where people were seeking activities that could be done in solitary or small groups, but it certainly can’t be contributed to MLF or anything they’ve done.... Furthermore, while MLF may not owe anyone an explanation on how they conduct business, that shouldn’t mean people as outside observers, or insiders of the industry should be silenced from bringing to light questionable and unethical conduct and practices. I don’t think that type of thing is changing the industry, but rather, it’s exploiting those who are in it... and the consequences for them not having an approval of their business ethic and attitude is there for all to see with the massive loss in sponsors they’ve experienced. Contrarily, due to the bad behavior by MLF, BASS has gained popularity and sponsors, not only in endorsements, but in the recently announced multi-year 7 figure media contract they signed with Fox Sports. That’s going to once again give the sponsors and anglers who are associated with BASS the platform and big stage exposure the BASS brand is known for delivering to its customers. That’s not people who are resistant to change... that’s an industry speaking loudly that they are going to shun the type of disruption MLF and others purportedly thinks is vogue.
[/quote]


Lol, loss "massive" amount of sponsors. Why don't you list this " massive" amount of sponsors they have lost. I don't keep up with who sponsors what. But I bet someone can make a list of new sponsors they have acquired as long or longer than your list for the same time frame. As far as BASS getting a 7 figure deal for tv. I have no idea what the details are on that. But lets use your logic. Are they putting all that money into the tournament purses. Or are they stealing it from the anglers and keeping it
Posted By: SAKS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 05:33 PM

Originally Posted by Dubee


I agree with you that no organization owes outsiders any explanations, but at same time don’t agree with Duck Hunter that what MLF is doing is vogue and called a disruption. On surface it appears MLF is being run by the typical Wall Street equity investor playbook. There has not been much mention of the fact that before FLW, MLF tried 3x to buy BASS from the new owners and were shot down... that wasn’t a plan to grow things, it was a plan to deplete things. And that’s what they’ve accomplished with FLW and as a result they struggled to fill the spots on many of the different circuits in the 2020 season. While some claim they (MLF) deserve credit for growing the sport and the industry, they seem to overlook the opposite happened within FLW but yet there was an exponential growth seen in the last year within boat and tackle companies. No doubt that growth could be attributed to the COVID where people were seeking activities that could be done in solitary or small groups, but it certainly can’t be contributed to MLF or anything they’ve done.... Furthermore, while MLF may not owe anyone an explanation on how they conduct business, that shouldn’t mean people as outside observers, or insiders of the industry should be silenced from bringing to light questionable and unethical conduct and practices. I don’t think that type of thing is changing the industry, but rather, it’s exploiting those who are in it... and the consequences for them not having an approval of their business ethic and attitude is there for all to see with the massive loss in sponsors they’ve experienced. Contrarily, due to the bad behavior by MLF, BASS has gained popularity and sponsors, not only in endorsements, but in the recently announced multi-year 7 figure media contract they signed with Fox Sports. That’s going to once again give the sponsors and anglers who are associated with BASS the platform and big stage exposure the BASS brand is known for delivering to its customers. That’s not people who are resistant to change... that’s an industry speaking loudly that they are going to shun the type of disruption MLF and others purportedly thinks is vogue.



Once again your choice is simple. Follow it or don't. Frankly I could care less about your argument or those arguments that oppose you. I do agree with Duck Hunter and to tell me who I should or should not agree with is just unjustified arrogance. You shouting from the mountain top isn't changing a thing (at least here). I am going to keep watching MLF/BPT just like I am going to also watch BASS. So let me ask, as you referenced above, are you an outside observer or an insider in the industry? Now questionable and unethical practices are as subjective as the Ford/Chevy debate. It's going to be relative to how an individual perceives it or how it affects/affected said individuals. Lot of unnecessary concern for those that drive a Dodge or Toyota. So which are you? A Ford/Chevy guy or just a Dodge/Toyota guy injecting his opinion?
Dubee this was in response to Big O. Not you.



Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 06:14 PM

Originally Posted by SAKS
Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by Big O Florida

I agree with you that no organization owes outsiders any explanations, but at same time don’t agree with Duck Hunter that what MLF is doing is vogue and called a disruption. On surface it appears MLF is being run by the typical Wall Street equity investor playbook. There has not been much mention of the fact that before FLW, MLF tried 3x to buy BASS from the new owners and were shot down... that wasn’t a plan to grow things, it was a plan to deplete things. And that’s what they’ve accomplished with FLW and as a result they struggled to fill the spots on many of the different circuits in the 2020 season. While some claim they (MLF) deserve credit for growing the sport and the industry, they seem to overlook the opposite happened within FLW but yet there was an exponential growth seen in the last year within boat and tackle companies. No doubt that growth could be attributed to the COVID where people were seeking activities that could be done in solitary or small groups, but it certainly can’t be contributed to MLF or anything they’ve done.... Furthermore, while MLF may not owe anyone an explanation on how they conduct business, that shouldn’t mean people as outside observers, or insiders of the industry should be silenced from bringing to light questionable and unethical conduct and practices. I don’t think that type of thing is changing the industry, but rather, it’s exploiting those who are in it... and the consequences for them not having an approval of their business ethic and attitude is there for all to see with the massive loss in sponsors they’ve experienced. Contrarily, due to the bad behavior by MLF, BASS has gained popularity and sponsors, not only in endorsements, but in the recently announced multi-year 7 figure media contract they signed with Fox Sports. That’s going to once again give the sponsors and anglers who are associated with BASS the platform and big stage exposure the BASS brand is known for delivering to its customers. That’s not people who are resistant to change... that’s an industry speaking loudly that they are going to shun the type of disruption MLF and others purportedly thinks is vogue.


Lol, loss "massive" amount of sponsors. Why don't you list this " massive" amount of sponsors they have lost. I don't keep up with who sponsors what. But I bet someone can make a list of new sponsors they have acquired as long or longer than your list for the same time frame. As far as BASS getting a 7 figure deal for tv. I have no idea what the details are on that. But lets use your logic. Are they putting all that money into the tournament purses. Or are they stealing it from the anglers and keeping it


Once again your choice is simple. Follow it or don't. Frankly I could care less about your argument or those arguments that oppose you. I do agree with Duck Hunter and to tell me who I should or should not agree with is just unjustified arrogance. You shouting from the mountain top isn't changing a thing (at least here). I am going to keep watching MLF/BPT just like I am going to also watch BASS. So let me ask, as you referenced above, are you an outside observer or an insider in the industry? Now questionable and unethical practices are as subjective as the Ford/Chevy debate. It's going to be relative to how an individual perceives it or how it affects/affected said individuals. Lot of unnecessary concern for those that drive a Dodge or Toyota. So which are you? A Ford/Chevy guy or just a Dodge/Toyota guy injecting his opinion?
Dubee this was in response to Big O. Not you.


I don’t tell anyone who or what to follow or watch, I just bring to light for discussion observations I have of MLF that perhaps will give someone something to think about and research themselves if they are contemplating getting involved with them in some capacity. My perspective as being an outside observer or industry insider is irrelevant, but I think both see and question the same types of things I’ve questioned and opined on. And you are correct, the perspective and view point of anyone regarding this is subjective. It seems not may people understand that, but I do. That’s why you won’t see me personally bash or insult them directly for having their own perspective. I will just try to counter it with information. To address one of the questions above, I don’t have a list detailing the departures of sponsors... perhaps MJ can help you with that, as that’s in his wheel house... but I took Boyd Duckett at his word in a recent article when he used that (loss of sponsorship because of COVID) as an excuse to introduce entry-fees into the 2021 BPT. As far as what BASS will do with the money they receive for signing that massive multi-year live TV and media contract; I would hope the anglers become a beneficiary of some of it, but they also should use it to expand and improve their existing infrastructure to support more circuits and affiliations with the BASS brand. Perhaps they will form a union of sorts with JM and his new venture on the west coast and be part of that as an expansion to BASS. Word is, not all will be lost for MLF when that comes to life - rumor is their new tour could be prominently named MPGT and those who remain loyal to the MLF kook-aid will get 1 complimentary bedding set for each event, delivered directly to the anglers airb&b abode.
Posted By: SAKS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 08:04 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by SAKS
Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by Big O Florida

I agree with you that no organization owes outsiders any explanations, but at same time don’t agree with Duck Hunter that what MLF is doing is vogue and called a disruption. On surface it appears MLF is being run by the typical Wall Street equity investor playbook. There has not been much mention of the fact that before FLW, MLF tried 3x to buy BASS from the new owners and were shot down... that wasn’t a plan to grow things, it was a plan to deplete things. And that’s what they’ve accomplished with FLW and as a result they struggled to fill the spots on many of the different circuits in the 2020 season. While some claim they (MLF) deserve credit for growing the sport and the industry, they seem to overlook the opposite happened within FLW but yet there was an exponential growth seen in the last year within boat and tackle companies. No doubt that growth could be attributed to the COVID where people were seeking activities that could be done in solitary or small groups, but it certainly can’t be contributed to MLF or anything they’ve done.... Furthermore, while MLF may not owe anyone an explanation on how they conduct business, that shouldn’t mean people as outside observers, or insiders of the industry should be silenced from bringing to light questionable and unethical conduct and practices. I don’t think that type of thing is changing the industry, but rather, it’s exploiting those who are in it... and the consequences for them not having an approval of their business ethic and attitude is there for all to see with the massive loss in sponsors they’ve experienced. Contrarily, due to the bad behavior by MLF, BASS has gained popularity and sponsors, not only in endorsements, but in the recently announced multi-year 7 figure media contract they signed with Fox Sports. That’s going to once again give the sponsors and anglers who are associated with BASS the platform and big stage exposure the BASS brand is known for delivering to its customers. That’s not people who are resistant to change... that’s an industry speaking loudly that they are going to shun the type of disruption MLF and others purportedly thinks is vogue.


Lol, loss "massive" amount of sponsors. Why don't you list this " massive" amount of sponsors they have lost. I don't keep up with who sponsors what. But I bet someone can make a list of new sponsors they have acquired as long or longer than your list for the same time frame. As far as BASS getting a 7 figure deal for tv. I have no idea what the details are on that. But lets use your logic. Are they putting all that money into the tournament purses. Or are they stealing it from the anglers and keeping it


Once again your choice is simple. Follow it or don't. Frankly I could care less about your argument or those arguments that oppose you. I do agree with Duck Hunter and to tell me who I should or should not agree with is just unjustified arrogance. You shouting from the mountain top isn't changing a thing (at least here). I am going to keep watching MLF/BPT just like I am going to also watch BASS. So let me ask, as you referenced above, are you an outside observer or an insider in the industry? Now questionable and unethical practices are as subjective as the Ford/Chevy debate. It's going to be relative to how an individual perceives it or how it affects/affected said individuals. Lot of unnecessary concern for those that drive a Dodge or Toyota. So which are you? A Ford/Chevy guy or just a Dodge/Toyota guy injecting his opinion?
Dubee this was in response to Big O. Not you.


I don’t tell anyone who or what to follow or watch, I just bring to light for discussion observations I have of MLF that perhaps will give someone something to think about and research themselves if they are contemplating getting involved with them in some capacity. My perspective as being an outside observer or industry insider is irrelevant, but I think both see and question the same types of things I’ve questioned and opined on. And you are correct, the perspective and view point of anyone regarding this is subjective. It seems not may people understand that, but I do. That’s why you won’t see me personally bash or insult them directly for having their own perspective. I will just try to counter it with information. To address one of the questions above, I don’t have a list detailing the departures of sponsors... perhaps MJ can help you with that, as that’s in his wheel house... but I took Boyd Duckett at his word in a recent article when he used that (loss of sponsorship because of COVID) as an excuse to introduce entry-fees into the 2021 BPT. As far as what BASS will do with the money they receive for signing that massive multi-year live TV and media contract; I would hope the anglers become a beneficiary of some of it, but they also should use it to expand and improve their existing infrastructure to support more circuits and affiliations with the BASS brand. Perhaps they will form a union of sorts with JM and his new venture on the west coast and be part of that as an expansion to BASS. Word is, not all will be lost for MLF when that comes to life - rumor is their new tour could be prominently named MPGT and those who remain loyal to the MLF kook-aid will get 1 complimentary bedding set for each event, delivered directly to the anglers airb&b abode.

Now the part of the post that applies to me in this I can totally get on board with. The way it's written and worded makes it a discussion. I do think your being an outsider vs insider is relevant but only in how serious you expect people to take your opinions. If your a bona fide insider you will be taken seriously but if your an outsider they view you as a raving lunatic. Either way it's all good. Hell you may be right for all I know. I am still going to watch though.
Posted By: Duck_Hunter

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 08:56 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
I agree with you that no organization owes outsiders any explanations, but at same time don’t agree with Duck Hunter that what MLF is doing is vogue and called a disruption. On surface it appears MLF is being run by the typical Wall Street equity investor playbook. There has not been much mention of the fact that before FLW, MLF tried 3x to buy BASS from the new owners and were shot down... that wasn’t a plan to grow things, it was a plan to deplete things. And that’s what they’ve accomplished with FLW and as a result they struggled to fill the spots on many of the different circuits in the 2020 season. While some claim they (MLF) deserve credit for growing the sport and the industry, they seem to overlook the opposite happened within FLW but yet there was an exponential growth seen in the last year within boat and tackle companies. No doubt that growth could be attributed to the COVID where people were seeking activities that could be done in solitary or small groups, but it certainly can’t be contributed to MLF or anything they’ve done.... Furthermore, while MLF may not owe anyone an explanation on how they conduct business, that shouldn’t mean people as outside observers, or insiders of the industry should be silenced from bringing to light questionable and unethical conduct and practices. I don’t think that type of thing is changing the industry, but rather, it’s exploiting those who are in it... and the consequences for them not having an approval of their business ethic and attitude is there for all to see with the massive loss in sponsors they’ve experienced. Contrarily, due to the bad behavior by MLF, BASS has gained popularity and sponsors, not only in endorsements, but in the recently announced multi-year 7 figure media contract they signed with Fox Sports. That’s going to once again give the sponsors and anglers who are associated with BASS the platform and big stage exposure the BASS brand is known for delivering to its customers. That’s not people who are resistant to change... that’s an industry speaking loudly that they are going to shun the type of disruption MLF and others purportedly thinks is vogue.


The growth in boat and tackle industries last year was 100% due to Covid. As you said, no one was allowed to do much besides be outside. At the same time, Covid put immense pressure on all businesses, especially new ones, and wreaked havoc on professional sports, especially ones where you have at least two dudes in a boat. Cities, counties and states were all in various state of lockdown. I recall you saying that wasn’t the issue with MLF last year and it was just an excuse for them to steal more money from people - which you’re continuing to do here now. Using last year to say MLF stole money by cancelling Redcrest without addressing the reason for it, playing the same about all of the other cancellations, including the expo, which you beat your drums incessantly about, is Jonathan taking into account the effect on a startup business in an extreme down cycle economy. You may be happy they suffered because you hate it, but you should still understand that a younger organization is going to suffer more than the only game in town for 50 years, all else being equal.

The “recently announced multi-year 7 figure media contract” was definitely influenced by MLF having however many 100s of hours of coverage across several different channels.

I’m sure one of the selling points to anglers was the TV coverage MLF has, since social media and TV coverage like that are the best and easiest ways to make money for anglers (and you don’t even have to be a pro; non-pro you tubers are killing it with their fishing channels). And MLF anglers being able to tell their sponsors they’re going to be on hundreds of hours of TV is appealing, but I don’t know the financials behind that or who sponsors who. But, how can you say MLF isn’t growing the sport when BASS could’ve had a similar deal to the one they recently signed when they were the biggest and oldest tournament trail in the industry but TV coverage wasn’t at all what were seeing now? It was in response to MLF having hundreds of hours of coverage across multiple networks, including CBS, and the selling point to Fox Sports was, I’m sure, “you’re competitor has 800 hours of fishing, let’s make a deal.” MLF grew the sport that way, and you’re trying to give BASS credit for growing the industry and sport by signing a 7 year deal in response? Come on.

What I actually meant by “growing the sport” in addition to the TV coverage, is MLF made a product that’s way more TV friendly and also changed the tournament format that oftentimes results in incredibly intriguing TV, even for a sport like bass fishing. There are cameras on multiple guys for the last several minutes, all within a few ounces of each other, jockeying to make a cut, make a bigger check or win.

I like the five best format too, but adding live drama to the finish is appealing to way more people watching on TV or streaming. It’s much more exciting that watching a weigh in an hour after lines out. Allowing anglers to know in real time where they stand to the ounce adds intrigue and drama like other, way more popular sports. That’s how the MLF format has grown the sport. It appeals more to fans of stick and ball sports. If anyone has a casual interest in fishing, but doesn’t care enough to watch it on TV, having a format with more drama and last-second theatrics without having to wait to see who wins is appealing.

They can coexist without a doubt, but you’re not taking any of this into account. It’s just blind hate, cherry-picking facts, misconstruing facts, and more.
Posted By: Duck_Hunter

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 09:16 PM

Originally Posted by SAKS
Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by SAKS


Once again your choice is simple. Follow it or don't. Frankly I could care less about your argument or those arguments that oppose you. I do agree with Duck Hunter and to tell me who I should or should not agree with is just unjustified arrogance. You shouting from the mountain top isn't changing a thing (at least here). I am going to keep watching MLF/BPT just like I am going to also watch BASS. So let me ask, as you referenced above, are you an outside observer or an insider in the industry? Now questionable and unethical practices are as subjective as the Ford/Chevy debate. It's going to be relative to how an individual perceives it or how it affects/affected said individuals. Lot of unnecessary concern for those that drive a Dodge or Toyota. So which are you? A Ford/Chevy guy or just a Dodge/Toyota guy injecting his opinion?
Dubee this was in response to Big O. Not you.


I don’t tell anyone who or what to follow or watch, I just bring to light for discussion observations I have of MLF that perhaps will give someone something to think about and research themselves if they are contemplating getting involved with them in some capacity. My perspective as being an outside observer or industry insider is irrelevant, but I think both see and question the same types of things I’ve questioned and opined on. And you are correct, the perspective and view point of anyone regarding this is subjective. It seems not may people understand that, but I do. That’s why you won’t see me personally bash or insult them directly for having their own perspective. I will just try to counter it with information. To address one of the questions above, I don’t have a list detailing the departures of sponsors... perhaps MJ can help you with that, as that’s in his wheel house... but I took Boyd Duckett at his word in a recent article when he used that (loss of sponsorship because of COVID) as an excuse to introduce entry-fees into the 2021 BPT. As far as what BASS will do with the money they receive for signing that massive multi-year live TV and media contract; I would hope the anglers become a beneficiary of some of it, but they also should use it to expand and improve their existing infrastructure to support more circuits and affiliations with the BASS brand. Perhaps they will form a union of sorts with JM and his new venture on the west coast and be part of that as an expansion to BASS. Word is, not all will be lost for MLF when that comes to life - rumor is their new tour could be prominently named MPGT and those who remain loyal to the MLF kook-aid will get 1 complimentary bedding set for each event, delivered directly to the anglers airb&b abode.

Now the part of the post that applies to me in this I can totally get on board with. The way it's written and worded makes it a discussion. I do think your being an outsider vs insider is relevant but only in how serious you expect people to take your opinions. If your a bona fide insider you will be taken seriously but if your an outsider they view you as a raving lunatic. Either way it's all good. Hell you may be right for all I know. I am still going to watch though.


Bonafide insider matters if he continues to refuse to disclose his credentials/affiliation. If he isn’t an insider, then he is making statements that appear t be based on inside information without actually having inside information and is just a troll. His entire purpose in signing up for a TFF account has been to disparage MLF, but his handle refers to a lake in Florida.

If he just makes arguments because he hates it and disagrees, fine. But that’s not how his entire post history has come off. He signed up to bash MLF and that’s it. He claims to know inside things, or alludes to knowing inside things, and then calls MLF thieves and liars and more. It’s too late for him to disclose his affiliation with BASS or a BASS angler or the FLW before it was purchased because of the way he has carried himself since he joined TFF. Whatever reputation he has in the industry would be ruined. Yet he continues to disparage MLF with ridiculous claims, falsehoods, misrepresented fact, half truths under a fake name. It’s either someone affiliated with BASS/old FLW/the industry in some way, or the biggest BASS fan on the planet. I’m guessing it’s the former. Especially if you look at his early posts about MLF stealing money.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/22/21 11:02 PM

Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter

The growth in boat and tackle industries last year was 100% due to Covid. As you said, no one was allowed to do much besides be outside. At the same time, Covid put immense pressure on all businesses, especially new ones, and wreaked havoc on professional sports, especially ones where you have at least two dudes in a boat. Cities, counties and states were all in various state of lockdown. I recall you saying that wasn’t the issue with MLF last year and it was just an excuse for them to steal more money from people - which you’re continuing to do here now. Using last year to say MLF stole money by cancelling Redcrest without addressing the reason for it, playing the same about all of the other cancellations, including the expo, which you beat your drums incessantly about, is Jonathan taking into account the effect on a startup business in an extreme down cycle economy. You may be happy they suffered because you hate it, but you should still understand that a younger organization is going to suffer more than the only game in town for 50 years, all else being equal.

The “recently announced multi-year 7 figure media contract” was definitely influenced by MLF having however many 100s of hours of coverage across several different channels.

I’m sure one of the selling points to anglers was the TV coverage MLF has, since social media and TV coverage like that are the best and easiest ways to make money for anglers (and you don’t even have to be a pro; non-pro you tubers are killing it with their fishing channels). And MLF anglers being able to tell their sponsors they’re going to be on hundreds of hours of TV is appealing, but I don’t know the financials behind that or who sponsors who. But, how can you say MLF isn’t growing the sport when BASS could’ve had a similar deal to the one they recently signed when they were the biggest and oldest tournament trail in the industry but TV coverage wasn’t at all what were seeing now? It was in response to MLF having hundreds of hours of coverage across multiple networks, including CBS, and the selling point to Fox Sports was, I’m sure, “you’re competitor has 800 hours of fishing, let’s make a deal.” MLF grew the sport that way, and you’re trying to give BASS credit for growing the industry and sport by signing a 7 year deal in response? Co
me
on.


What I actually meant by “growing the sport” in addition to the TV coverage, is MLF made a product that’s way more TV friendly and also changed the tournament format that oftentimes results in incredibly intriguing TV, even for a sport like bass fishing. There are cameras on multiple guys for the last several minutes, all within a few ounces of each other, jockeying to make a cut, make a bigger check or win.

I like the five best format too, but adding live drama to the finish is appealing to way more people watching on TV or streaming. It’s much more exciting that watching a weigh in an hour after lines out. Allowing anglers to know in real time where they stand to the ounce adds intrigue and drama like other, way more popular sports. That’s how the MLF format has grown the sport. It appeals more to fans of stick and ball sports. If anyone has a casual interest in fishing, but doesn’t care enough to watch it on TV, having a format with more drama and last-second theatrics without having to wait to see who wins is appealing.

They can coexist without a doubt, but you’re not taking any of this into account. It’s just blind hate, cherry-picking facts, misconstruing facts, and more.


Come on man... for how many years was BASS owned by ESPN? And before that they were a huge TV thing for years and a many related and successful fishing shows were born and spun off as a result of the “BASS - Big stage, Big Fish” brand. Roland Martin, Hank Parker, the king Bill Dance, Jimmy Houston, etc... all of those guys media exposure and success in subsequent TV markets is directly related to BASS... MLF - they are only really known for trying to create a second rate reality TV show based on what Ray Scott did with the concept of old BASS and the secret destinations equal boats, etc... sure, their format is different, but it’s been criticized more than praised. The Fox Sports deal had nothing whatsoever to do with MLF and certainly wasn’t influenced by MLF’s rerun coverage on sub par back channels owned by the same entity as MLF itself. Sure, I’ll give you the coverage of BASS degraded while under the ownership of ESPN, but it has never went away and BASS themselves weren’t in control of the TV coverage... ESPN was. So, come on man... cherry picking and revisionist history - me?
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 12:24 AM

Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by SAKS
Originally Posted by Big O Florida

I don’t tell anyone who or what to follow or watch, I just bring to light for discussion observations I have of MLF that perhaps will give someone something to think about and research themselves if they are contemplating getting involved with them in some capacity. My perspective as being an outside observer or industry insider is irrelevant, but I think both see and question the same types of things I’ve questioned and opined on. And you are correct, the perspective and view point of anyone regarding this is subjective. It seems not may people understand that, but I do. That’s why you won’t see me personally bash or insult them directly for having their own perspective. I will just try to counter it with information. To address one of the questions above, I don’t have a list detailing the departures of sponsors... perhaps MJ can help you with that, as that’s in his wheel house... but I took Boyd Duckett at his word in a recent article when he used that (loss of sponsorship because of COVID) as an excuse to introduce entry-fees into the 2021 BPT. As far as what BASS will do with the money they receive for signing that massive multi-year live TV and media contract; I would hope the anglers become a beneficiary of some of it, but they also should use it to expand and improve their existing infrastructure to support more circuits and affiliations with the BASS brand. Perhaps they will form a union of sorts with JM and his new venture on the west coast and be part of that as an expansion to BASS. Word is, not all will be lost for MLF when that comes to life - rumor is their new tour could be prominently named MPGT and those who remain loyal to the MLF kook-aid will get 1 complimentary bedding set for each event, delivered directly to the anglers airb&b abode.

Now the part of the post that applies to me in this I can totally get on board with. The way it's written and worded makes it a discussion. I do think your being an outsider vs insider is relevant but only in how serious you expect people to take your opinions. If your a bona fide insider you will be taken seriously but if your an outsider they view you as a raving lunatic. Either way it's all good. Hell you may be right for all I know. I am still going to watch though.

Bonafide insider matters if he continues to refuse to disclose his credentials/affiliation. If he isn’t an insider, then he is making statements that appear t be based on inside information without actually having inside information and is just a troll. His entire purpose in signing up for a TFF account has been to disparage MLF, but his handle refers to a lake in Florida.

If he just makes arguments because he hates it and disagrees, fine. But that’s not how his entire post history has come off. He signed up to bash MLF and that’s it. He claims to know inside things, or alludes to knowing inside things, and then calls MLF thieves and liars and more. It’s too late for him to disclose his affiliation with BASS or a BASS angler or the FLW before it was purchased because of the way he has carried himself since he joined TFF. Whatever reputation he has in the industry would be ruined. Yet he continues to disparage MLF with ridiculous claims, falsehoods, misrepresented fact, half truths under a fake name. It’s either someone affiliated with BASS/old FLW/the industry in some way, or the biggest BASS fan on the planet. I’m guessing it’s the former. Especially if you look at his early posts about MLF stealing mon
ey.


Did I join TFF to bash MLF exclusively, no... did I join TFF to discuss MLF, yes... when I joined there was an ongoing MLF discussion and it seemed logical since it’s a tournament fishing type discussion site and the Florida dedicated side seemed dead at the time and nothing else really exists. I will reiterate that being an industry insider or just an astute observer from the outside is irrelevant, and anything I’ve ever commented on or put forward has already been publicly disclosed or discussed, and or speculated out loud about. Am I a fan of the BASS tournament fishing scene, yes and have been since I was a young boy. You don’t have to be an insider of the industry to hear anecdotal stories about how MLF has conducted themselves behind the scenes with sponsors or anglers, because it’s been talked about somewhere, on someone’s YouTube channel, social media account, etc... and it’s typically widespread, not just here on TFF where I may bring it to light for discussion and debate. Further, I have never come out and said they’ve stolen money. Have I used terms like snatch purse, etc... yes, because I truly believe that’s what they have done. Some argue it’s business, some argue it’s their right to do what they want... my argument is their whole platform has been to make the industry bigger and better for the anglers, yet there has been example after example of them doing things that are completely contradictory to their mission statement.

Let’s start at beginning and formation of BPT - that was a high pressure tactical maneuver that was executed by a dozen or so disgruntled BASS insiders. There is no doubt in my mind there was a huge carrot dangled in front of those who they were trying to influence, and that was the “no-entry-fees” big show. Well, here we are just 2 short years in and look at how that has worked out for them. It wasn’t but a short time after their first season that they acquired FLW after failing to acquire BASS 3x. The first order of business for MLF once the sale of FLW to them was announced was to arbitrarily cancel the FW Cup. All the arguments for MLF are based on it being their right to do so, and the unsubstantiated claims FLW was headed for bankruptcy and MLF saved them. A contested estate battle, yes... bankruptcy, no. That action alone set the ever lasting tone and there is hardly no one standing up for all the anglers who got cheated out of a huge purse of money that they believed was going to be available to them to fish for. Contrarily, there sure is a many (on TFF) that are defending MLF... question is, just how was that beneficial to the sport and the anglers of? Next was the revelation of another underhanded move by MLF - the Bass Federation kid who won the “live the dream” package. It took a major social media blast by the kid and the Federation to get MLF to just honor the long established commitment that FLW made... MLF was originally telling them to go pound sand, just like the anglers who got cheated out of the FW Cup. Keep in mind, the two primary stakeholders in MLF are multi-billionaires, and yes, that matters if they don’t want to look hypocritical to their mission statement of growing the sport and being better for the anglers. and all that happened prior to 2020 season start. i wont rehash it again, but much, much of the same has happened during the 2020 season, and from my perspective no one here on TFF (accept me) is holding MLF's feet to the fire about doing whats right for growing the sport and the betterment for the anglers... no matter how you slice it, thats a lot of purse money that was originally slated to go to anglers was taken away... have i called it snatched off the angler table, yes because it seemingly was... but the word stolen didn't come or originate from me. Where did that money go that it helped grow the sport and make things better for the anglers? Thats the question... do you have the answer? start with 2020 FLW Pro AOY award that was reduced by $100k from historically what’s been paid out using the term “TBD” in the posted rules. Being good for the industry and the anglers is subjective, and it’s not just me who recognizes what’s happened...
Posted By: Dan21XRS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 01:08 AM

Originally Posted by Dubee
Josh Seale, see what I mean. He is still trying to say the Redcrest was cancelled and the money stolen. A monkey could understand that the Redcrest happening in a few weeks is for the 2020 season. The fact that they decided to have it in the spring instead of the fall is irrelevant. Just like the classic in June of this year is for the 2020 season


Ok, so they had a 2019 and moved the 2020 event to 2021... So will they have an additional 2021 Redcrap???... If no, they've canceled a RedCrap... Take your pick it's either the 2020 or 2021 event that didn't happen... So where did the money go???... Dan
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 01:41 AM

Originally Posted by Dan21XRS
Originally Posted by Dubee
Josh Seale, see what I mean. He is still trying to say the Redcrest was cancelled and the money stolen. A monkey could understand that the Redcrest happening in a few weeks is for the 2020 season. The fact that they decided to have it in the spring instead of the fall is irrelevant. Just like the classic in June of this year is for the 2020 season


Ok, so they had a 2019 and moved the 2020 event to 2021... So will they have an additional 2021 Redcrap???... If no, they've canceled a RedCrap... Take your pick it's either the 2020 or 2021 event that didn't happen... So where did the money go???... Dan


Hopefully you are joking. I bet even big o understands but just keeps harping on it. The money didn't go anywhere. It will be going to the anglers when they have the tournament next month. All they did was move from fall to spring. Just like the Classic did years ago. It's still the championship for the 2020 season. Just because it's after Jan 1 means nothing
Posted By: Dan21XRS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 02:40 AM

Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by Dan21XRS
Originally Posted by Dubee
Josh Seale, see what I mean. He is still trying to say the Redcrest was cancelled and the money stolen. A monkey could understand that the Redcrest happening in a few weeks is for the 2020 season. The fact that they decided to have it in the spring instead of the fall is irrelevant. Just like the classic in June of this year is for the 2020 season


Ok, so they had a 2019 and moved the 2020 event to 2021... So will they have an additional 2021 Redcrap???... If no, they've canceled a RedCrap... Take your pick it's either the 2020 or 2021 event that didn't happen... So where did the money go???... Dan


Hopefully you are joking. I bet even big o understands but just keeps harping on it. The money didn't go anywhere. It will be going to the anglers when they have the tournament next month. All they did was move from fall to spring. Just like the Classic did years ago. It's still the championship for the 2020 season. Just because it's after Jan 1 means nothing


So, if the 2019 was staged in 2019 and the 2020 was moved to 2021, there wasn't an big event in 2020, right??? It's pretty easy to say the "moved" it, but in reality they canceled it... Now, if they double the money for the scheduled 2021 event no harm no foul... But if it's the same payout somebody got a big bonus and it wasn't the fishermen... Dan
Posted By: Lone_Wolf

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 02:40 AM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida


I don’t tell anyone who or what to follow or watch, I just bring to light for discussion observations I have of MLF that perhaps will give someone something to think about and research themselves if they are contemplating getting involved with them in some capacity. My perspective as being an outside observer or industry insider is irrelevant, but I think both see and question the same types of things I’ve questioned and opined on. And you are correct, the perspective and view point of anyone regarding this is subjective. It seems not may people understand that, but I do. That’s why you won’t see me personally bash or insult them directly for having their own perspective. I will just try to counter it with information. To address one of the questions above, I don’t have a list detailing the departures of sponsors... perhaps MJ can help you with that, as that’s in his wheel house... but I took Boyd Duckett at his word in a recent article when he used that (loss of sponsorship because of COVID) as an excuse to introduce entry-fees into the 2021 BPT. As far as what BASS will do with the money they receive for signing that massive multi-year live TV and media contract; I would hope the anglers become a beneficiary of some of it, but they also should use it to expand and improve their existing infrastructure to support more circuits and affiliations with the BASS brand. Perhaps they will form a union of sorts with JM and his new venture on the west coast and be part of that as an expansion to BASS. Word is, not all will be lost for MLF when that comes to life - rumor is their new tour could be prominently named MPGT and those who remain loyal to the MLF kook-aid will get 1 complimentary bedding set for each event, delivered directly to the anglers airb&b abode.


You forgot the part about Duckett being one of the head cult leaders of satanic cannibolistic pedophiles that's running an underground child sex trafficing operation.
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 02:41 AM

Originally Posted by Dan21XRS
Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by Dan21XRS
Originally Posted by Dubee
Josh Seale, see what I mean. He is still trying to say the Redcrest was cancelled and the money stolen. A monkey could understand that the Redcrest happening in a few weeks is for the 2020 season. The fact that they decided to have it in the spring instead of the fall is irrelevant. Just like the classic in June of this year is for the 2020 season


Ok, so they had a 2019 and moved the 2020 event to 2021... So will they have an additional 2021 Redcrap???... If no, they've canceled a RedCrap... Take your pick it's either the 2020 or 2021 event that didn't happen... So where did the money go???... Dan


Hopefully you are joking. I bet even big o understands but just keeps harping on it. The money didn't go anywhere. It will be going to the anglers when they have the tournament next month. All they did was move from fall to spring. Just like the Classic did years ago. It's still the championship for the 2020 season. Just because it's after Jan 1 means nothing


So, if the 2019 was staged in 2019 and the 2020 was moved to 2021, there wasn't an big event in 2020, right??? It's pretty easy to say the "moved" it, but in reality they canceled it... Now, if they double the money for the scheduled 2021 event no harm no foul... But if it's the same payout somebody got a big bonus and it wasn't the fishermen... Dan



Lmao.
Posted By: SteezMacQueen

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 02:45 AM

Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by Dan21XRS
Originally Posted by Dubee
Josh Seale, see what I mean. He is still trying to say the Redcrest was cancelled and the money stolen. A monkey could understand that the Redcrest happening in a few weeks is for the 2020 season. The fact that they decided to have it in the spring instead of the fall is irrelevant. Just like the classic in June of this year is for the 2020 season


Ok, so they had a 2019 and moved the 2020 event to 2021... So will they have an additional 2021 Redcrap???... If no, they've canceled a RedCrap... Take your pick it's either the 2020 or 2021 event that didn't happen... So where did the money go???... Dan


Hopefully you are joking. I bet even big o understands but just keeps harping on it. The money didn't go anywhere. It will be going to the anglers when they have the tournament next month. All they did was move from fall to spring. Just like the Classic did years ago. It's still the championship for the 2020 season. Just because it's after Jan 1 means nothing

Sounds like a shell game.

If they keep moving back the dates, eventually they will lose a championship tourney.
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 02:57 AM

Originally Posted by SteezMacQueen
Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by Dan21XRS
Originally Posted by Dubee
Josh Seale, see what I mean. He is still trying to say the Redcrest was cancelled and the money stolen. A monkey could understand that the Redcrest happening in a few weeks is for the 2020 season. The fact that they decided to have it in the spring instead of the fall is irrelevant. Just like the classic in June of this year is for the 2020 season


Ok, so they had a 2019 and moved the 2020 event to 2021... So will they have an additional 2021 Redcrap???... If no, they've canceled a RedCrap... Take your pick it's either the 2020 or 2021 event that didn't happen... So where did the money go???... Dan


Hopefully you are joking. I bet even big o understands but just keeps harping on it. The money didn't go anywhere. It will be going to the anglers when they have the tournament next month. All they did was move from fall to spring. Just like the Classic did years ago. It's still the championship for the 2020 season. Just because it's after Jan 1 means nothing

Sounds like a shell game.

If they keep moving back the dates, eventually they will lose a championship tourney.

roflmao
Posted By: Dan21XRS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 03:04 AM

Originally Posted by Dubee
Lmao.


You have to be on the MLFLW/ BPsT/ Huge 5 payroll... I hope you don't work on commission... Dan
Posted By: grout-scout

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 03:12 AM

So are there 2 Redcrest in 2020? If not, theft of money to the anglers makes sense to me too.
Posted By: J.H.S.

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 04:58 AM

I’m with Big O. Even if his claims are “false”. His arguments are well thought out and typed and not one person on here has offered a viable argument against what he is saying aside from “false claims” and “you’re an idiot”. Much of what he said has been publicly stated by other anglers. G-man, Palanuik, Christie, Atkins, Hackney, and others didn’t just leave for no reason. Some of you better hope Big O isn’t right because that is a ton of crow to snack on.
Posted By: Darin S.

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 05:11 AM

Unless they have 2 redcrest championships this calendar year, 2020 will go down as cancelled.
Posted By: Duck_Hunter

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 06:56 AM

Originally Posted by Josh Seale
I’m with Big O. Even if his claims are “false”. His arguments are well thought out and typed and not one person on here has offered a viable argument against what he is saying aside from “false claims” and “you’re an idiot”. Much of what he said has been publicly stated by other anglers. G-man, Palanuik, Christie, Atkins, Hackney, and others didn’t just leave for no reason. Some of you better hope Big O isn’t right because that is a ton of crow to snack on.


Well thought out?

You don’t have to prove a false statement wrong. That’s not how debates work. You make a statement backed up with facts. You don’t get to make absurd statements and then tell people to look up the accuracy of your statement to prove you right. He’s known for making statements that are either inside info or indisputable because they’re false. He doesn’t back up his statements. That’s the issue. It’s either complete BS or it’s insider info from someone who won’t disclose his source or relation to the issue. If he’s right, fine, but it’s too late for him to reveal himself because he’s burned too many bridges if he is somehow related to FLW or BASS. If he’s not related to those entities and he’s just torching MLF because he’s a BASS super fan, then he is misrepresenting facts, making things up, completely wrong on some things, and is a troll. This is beyond someone disagreeing with a rival tour.

“Even if his claims are false.” When he purports to present facts, they don’t even make sense, like when he says the Redcrest was cancelled and money was stolen. Either he has inside info, or he’s just trolling. I don’t know how else to say it.

Come on, Josh.
Posted By: Duck_Hunter

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 07:04 AM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter

The growth in boat and tackle industries last year was 100% due to Covid. As you said, no one was allowed to do much besides be outside. At the same time, Covid put immense pressure on all businesses, especially new ones, and wreaked havoc on professional sports, especially ones where you have at least two dudes in a boat. Cities, counties and states were all in various state of lockdown. I recall you saying that wasn’t the issue with MLF last year and it was just an excuse for them to steal more money from people - which you’re continuing to do here now. Using last year to say MLF stole money by cancelling Redcrest without addressing the reason for it, playing the same about all of the other cancellations, including the expo, which you beat your drums incessantly about, is Jonathan taking into account the effect on a startup business in an extreme down cycle economy. You may be happy they suffered because you hate it, but you should still understand that a younger organization is going to suffer more than the only game in town for 50 years, all else being equal.

The “recently announced multi-year 7 figure media contract” was definitely influenced by MLF having however many 100s of hours of coverage across several different channels.

I’m sure one of the selling points to anglers was the TV coverage MLF has, since social media and TV coverage like that are the best and easiest ways to make money for anglers (and you don’t even have to be a pro; non-pro you tubers are killing it with their fishing channels). And MLF anglers being able to tell their sponsors they’re going to be on hundreds of hours of TV is appealing, but I don’t know the financials behind that or who sponsors who. But, how can you say MLF isn’t growing the sport when BASS could’ve had a similar deal to the one they recently signed when they were the biggest and oldest tournament trail in the industry but TV coverage wasn’t at all what were seeing now? It was in response to MLF having hundreds of hours of coverage across multiple networks, including CBS, and the selling point to Fox Sports was, I’m sure, “you’re competitor has 800 hours of fishing, let’s make a deal.” MLF grew the sport that way, and you’re trying to give BASS credit for growing the industry and sport by signing a 7 year deal in response? Co
me
on.


What I actually meant by “growing the sport” in addition to the TV coverage, is MLF made a product that’s way more TV friendly and also changed the tournament format that oftentimes results in incredibly intriguing TV, even for a sport like bass fishing. There are cameras on multiple guys for the last several minutes, all within a few ounces of each other, jockeying to make a cut, make a bigger check or win.

I like the five best format too, but adding live drama to the finish is appealing to way more people watching on TV or streaming. It’s much more exciting that watching a weigh in an hour after lines out. Allowing anglers to know in real time where they stand to the ounce adds intrigue and drama like other, way more popular sports. That’s how the MLF format has grown the sport. It appeals more to fans of stick and ball sports. If anyone has a casual interest in fishing, but doesn’t care enough to watch it on TV, having a format with more drama and last-second theatrics without having to wait to see who wins is appealing.

They can coexist without a doubt, but you’re not taking any of this into account. It’s just blind hate, cherry-picking facts, misconstruing facts, and more.


Come on man... for how many years was BASS owned by ESPN? And before that they were a huge TV thing for years and a many related and successful fishing shows were born and spun off as a result of the “BASS - Big stage, Big Fish” brand. Roland Martin, Hank Parker, the king Bill Dance, Jimmy Houston, etc... all of those guys media exposure and success in subsequent TV markets is directly related to BASS... MLF - they are only really known for trying to create a second rate reality TV show based on what Ray Scott did with the concept of old BASS and the secret destinations equal boats, etc... sure, their format is different, but it’s been criticized more than praised. The Fox Sports deal had nothing whatsoever to do with MLF and certainly wasn’t influenced by MLF’s rerun coverage on sub par back channels owned by the same entity as MLF itself. Sure, I’ll give you the coverage of BASS degraded while under the ownership of ESPN, but it has never went away and BASS themselves weren’t in control of the TV coverage... ESPN was. So, come on man... cherry picking and revisionist history - me?


Exactly my point. Owned by ESPN on Saturday mornings. The tournaments weren’t flashed on nine channels for 1,000 hours a year (that’s hyperbole). Bass was on a gravy train with biscuit wheels. New show comes in to town, with a “billionaire owner” as you like to point out, and he has connections to TV networks. All the sudden, their is 800 hours of bass fishing showcasing a tour that’s more relatable to the average sports fan who might also fish. Then, a year later, a rival sports network picks up BASS, which rested on its laurels for five decades and all of the sudden has to adjust.

The format has been criticized more than praised by you, the disgruntled old guard. The disgruntled pro who feels wronged. The disgruntled parent of an angler who bankrolled a kid who didn’t make it and feels slighted.

Competition is a good thing. ESPN is a failing entity, by the way.
Posted By: Duck_Hunter

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 07:22 AM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by SAKS
Originally Posted by Big O Florida

I don’t tell anyone who or what to follow or watch, I just bring to light for discussion observations I have of MLF that perhaps will give someone something to think about and research themselves if they are contemplating getting involved with them in some capacity. My perspective as being an outside observer or industry insider is irrelevant, but I think both see and question the same types of things I’ve questioned and opined on. And you are correct, the perspective and view point of anyone regarding this is subjective. It seems not may people understand that, but I do. That’s why you won’t see me personally bash or insult them directly for having their own perspective. I will just try to counter it with information. To address one of the questions above, I don’t have a list detailing the departures of sponsors... perhaps MJ can help you with that, as that’s in his wheel house... but I took Boyd Duckett at his word in a recent article when he used that (loss of sponsorship because of COVID) as an excuse to introduce entry-fees into the 2021 BPT. As far as what BASS will do with the money they receive for signing that massive multi-year live TV and media contract; I would hope the anglers become a beneficiary of some of it, but they also should use it to expand and improve their existing infrastructure to support more circuits and affiliations with the BASS brand. Perhaps they will form a union of sorts with JM and his new venture on the west coast and be part of that as an expansion to BASS. Word is, not all will be lost for MLF when that comes to life - rumor is their new tour could be prominently named MPGT and those who remain loyal to the MLF kook-aid will get 1 complimentary bedding set for each event, delivered directly to the anglers airb&b abode.

Now the part of the post that applies to me in this I can totally get on board with. The way it's written and worded makes it a discussion. I do think your being an outsider vs insider is relevant but only in how serious you expect people to take your opinions. If your a bona fide insider you will be taken seriously but if your an outsider they view you as a raving lunatic. Either way it's all good. Hell you may be right for all I know. I am still going to watch though.

Bonafide insider matters if he continues to refuse to disclose his credentials/affiliation. If he isn’t an insider, then he is making statements that appear t be based on inside information without actually having inside information and is just a troll. His entire purpose in signing up for a TFF account has been to disparage MLF, but his handle refers to a lake in Florida.

If he just makes arguments because he hates it and disagrees, fine. But that’s not how his entire post history has come off. He signed up to bash MLF and that’s it. He claims to know inside things, or alludes to knowing inside things, and then calls MLF thieves and liars and more. It’s too late for him to disclose his affiliation with BASS or a BASS angler or the FLW before it was purchased because of the way he has carried himself since he joined TFF. Whatever reputation he has in the industry would be ruined. Yet he continues to disparage MLF with ridiculous claims, falsehoods, misrepresented fact, half truths under a fake name. It’s either someone affiliated with BASS/old FLW/the industry in some way, or the biggest BASS fan on the planet. I’m guessing it’s the former. Especially if you look at his early posts about MLF stealing mon
ey.


Did I join TFF to bash MLF exclusively, no... did I join TFF to discuss MLF, yes... when I joined there was an ongoing MLF discussion and it seemed logical since it’s a tournament fishing type discussion site and the Florida dedicated side seemed dead at the time and nothing else really exists. I will reiterate that being an industry insider or just an astute observer from the outside is irrelevant, and anything I’ve ever commented on or put forward has already been publicly disclosed or discussed, and or speculated out loud about. Am I a fan of the BASS tournament fishing scene, yes and have been since I was a young boy. You don’t have to be an insider of the industry to hear anecdotal stories about how MLF has conducted themselves behind the scenes with sponsors or anglers, because it’s been talked about somewhere, on someone’s YouTube channel, social media account, etc... and it’s typically widespread, not just here on TFF where I may bring it to light for discussion and debate. Further, I have never come out and said they’ve stolen money. Have I used terms like snatch purse, etc... yes, because I truly believe that’s what they have done. Some argue it’s business, some argue it’s their right to do what they want... my argument is their whole platform has been to make the industry bigger and better for the anglers, yet there has been example after example of them doing things that are completely contradictory to their mission statement.

Let’s start at beginning and formation of BPT - that was a high pressure tactical maneuver that was executed by a dozen or so disgruntled BASS insiders. There is no doubt in my mind there was a huge carrot dangled in front of those who they were trying to influence, and that was the “no-entry-fees” big show. Well, here we are just 2 short years in and look at how that has worked out for them. It wasn’t but a short time after their first season that they acquired FLW after failing to acquire BASS 3x. The first order of business for MLF once the sale of FLW to them was announced was to arbitrarily cancel the FW Cup. All the arguments for MLF are based on it being their right to do so, and the unsubstantiated claims FLW was headed for bankruptcy and MLF saved them. A contested estate battle, yes... bankruptcy, no. That action alone set the ever lasting tone and there is hardly no one standing up for all the anglers who got cheated out of a huge purse of money that they believed was going to be available to them to fish for. Contrarily, there sure is a many (on TFF) that are defending MLF... question is, just how was that beneficial to the sport and the anglers of? Next was the revelation of another underhanded move by MLF - the Bass Federation kid who won the “live the dream” package. It took a major social media blast by the kid and the Federation to get MLF to just honor the long established commitment that FLW made... MLF was originally telling them to go pound sand, just like the anglers who got cheated out of the FW Cup. Keep in mind, the two primary stakeholders in MLF are multi-billionaires, and yes, that matters if they don’t want to look hypocritical to their mission statement of growing the sport and being better for the anglers. and all that happened prior to 2020 season start. i wont rehash it again, but much, much of the same has happened during the 2020 season, and from my perspective no one here on TFF (accept me) is holding MLF's feet to the fire about doing whats right for growing the sport and the betterment for the anglers... no matter how you slice it, thats a lot of purse money that was originally slated to go to anglers was taken away... have i called it snatched off the angler table, yes because it seemingly was... but the word stolen didn't come or originate from me. Where did that money go that it helped grow the sport and make things better for the anglers? Thats the question... do you have the answer? start with 2020 FLW Pro AOY award that was reduced by $100k from historically what’s been paid out using the term “TBD” in the posted rules. Being good for the industry and the anglers is subjective, and it’s not just me who recognizes what’s happened...


You started a thread with the term “purse snatchers” in it relating to MLF/FLW. I think we’re done here.
Posted By: Duck_Hunter

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 07:49 AM

The definition of purse snatching is theft. It’s literally a type of theft. All of the sudden, you’re using rational thoughts and discussions. I’m all for it. Keep it up. The forum and your posts will be better off.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 08:07 AM

Originally Posted by Dan21XRS
Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by Dan21XRS
Originally Posted by Dubee
Josh Seale, see what I mean. He is still trying to say the Redcrest was cancelled and the money stolen. A monkey could understand that the Redcrest happening in a few weeks is for the 2020 season. The fact that they decided to have it in the spring instead of the fall is irrelevant. Just like the classic in June of this year is for the 2020 season


Ok, so they had a 2019 and moved the 2020 event to 2021... So will they have an additional 2021 Redcrap???... If no, they've canceled a RedCrap... Take your pick it's either the 2020 or 2021 event that didn't happen... So where did the money go???... Dan


Hopefully you are joking. I bet even big o understands but just keeps harping on it. The money didn't go anywhere. It will be going to the anglers when they have the tournament next month. All they did was move from fall to spring. Just like the Classic did years ago. It's still the championship for the 2020 season. Just because it's after Jan 1 means nothing


So, if the 2019 was staged in 2019 and the 2020 was moved to 2021, there wasn't an big event in 2020, right??? It's pretty easy to say the "moved" it, but in reality they canceled it... Now, if they double the money for the scheduled 2021 event no harm no foul... But if it's the same payout somebody got a big bonus and it wasn't the fishermen... Dan


This gets into the weeds a little bit, but if deadcrest 2021 happens on this latest newly scheduled date, it will have been a full 18 months since the last one. Oh, did I mention they also left Oklahoma out to dry on having the to big to describe expo and tournament as well? They had originally planned to have it there but then cancelled the biggest expo on earth, then weeks later moved and rescheduled the tournament itself too... lmfao
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 08:21 AM

Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
The definition of purse snatching is theft. It’s literally a type of theft. All of the sudden, you’re using rational thoughts and discussions. I’m all for it. Keep it up. The forum and your posts will be better off.


You all will twist yourselves into pretzels to avoid talking about what happened to the 2020 FLW Pro AOY purse that has been historically $100k. I’ve asked multiple times now and not one of you have an explanation for that... whatever you want to call it. At beginning of 2020 MLF distributed its talking points to all the water boys and they ran with the narrative of how MLF was making things better, lowering entry fees and increasing payouts in the FLW circuits, and under the FLW Pro AOY rules for 2020 it stated the payout was “TBD”... no one for a minute thought that was going to mean a reduction of $100k considering the overall narrative the water boys were disseminating on behalf of MLF. When B.Duckett was cornered with the question in an interview on BTL late last year, he seemed annoyed at the question and then blamed the angler commission for the payout reduction while avoiding the most pressing question of “when were the anglers actually informed” they were fishing for significantly reduced purse.... again, I find it humorous that no one has a legit argument that also supports the over riding MLF narrative of growing the sport and better for the anglers, yadda, yadda, yadda...
Posted By: Neal G

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 09:45 AM

I like Big O and most all he says is accurate BUT I am going fishing, this [censored] gives me a headache.

Big O and Dubee just need to get on the phone and talk it through. Then give us a report as to who "won".
Posted By: grout-scout

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 01:05 PM

Well so far, Big O has been correct on more issues than Dubee. Look at the number of guys that left already, some with no backup plan. Guys aren’t leaving because it’s great over there.
Posted By: beartrap

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 02:02 PM

Originally Posted by grout-scout
Well so far, Big O has been correct on more issues than Dubee. Look at the number of guys that left already, some with no backup plan. Guys aren’t leaving because it’s great over there.


look at the big picture....5 fishermen leaving out of the original 80 isn't exactly a mass exodus,94% of the best and most established pros believe MLF is now the dominant fishing trail, the wave of the future and the television ratings prove this.......all the yapping about them postponing Redcrest is ignoring the fact that every major sport has had numerous cancellations this past year due to the covid 19 pandemic....MLF is providing 800 hours of TV exposure and a venue where the fishermen share that revenue along with revenue from the cities where they hold events and exhibitor income at their championships.....also if MLF hadn't of bought the FLW,it's almost certain FLW would have ceased to exist.....
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 02:24 PM

Originally Posted by grout-scout
Well so far, Big O has been correct on more issues than Dubee. Look at the number of guys that left already, some with no backup plan. Guys aren’t leaving because it’s great over there.


A lot of those guys are still there because they really have no alternative outside of trying to requalify for the Elites, or maybe in another year getting into the NPFL. And what’s going to be more interesting to see is if they can make it through the whole season this year without cancelling the majority of their tournaments - cancelling tournaments may be the final nails needed in the coffin. I suspect at end of this season they will lose their BP marquee support too, as its rumored JM is involved in a new venture out west designed for filling a long open void in the BASS tournament scene west of the DFW metro. That’s being evidenced by his massive parring down of pro staff in white river marine, etc... so me thinks BPT is on borrowed time and an extremely unstable foundation. Sadly, the remnants of FLW will only remain in a severely weakened state if there is a complete change of ownership and management; if that doesn’t happen, it will go under too. The only ones who will have financially benefitted will be the two multi-billionaires who sit atop of the equity investor pyramid, the rest will be burned.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 02:34 PM

Originally Posted by beartrap
Originally Posted by grout-scout
Well so far, Big O has been correct on more issues than Dubee. Look at the number of guys that left already, some with no backup plan. Guys aren’t leaving because it’s great over there.


look at the big picture....5 fishermen leaving out of the original 80 isn't exactly a mass exodus,94% of the best and most established pros believe MLF is now the dominant fishing trail, the wave of the future and the television ratings prove this.......all the yapping about them postponing Redcrest is ignoring the fact that every major sport has had numerous cancellations this past year due to the covid 19 pandemic....MLF is providing 800 hours of TV exposure and a venue where the fishermen share that revenue along with revenue from the cities where they hold events and exhibitor income at their championships.....also if MLF hadn't of bought the FLW,it's almost certain FLW would have ceased to exist.....


My guess is no one at BASS was surveyed in that poll.. LMFAO - they don’t understand that asking themselves who is best has been MLF’s problem all along. They are in an echo chamber. The fans and sponsors have pretty much spoken... they just keep wanting a recount of the votes. Sound familiar? Like I said before, they have a marquee supporter in the wings... the newly named tour will be the MPGT... complimentary bedding provided to all pros who participate.
Posted By: grout-scout

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 02:35 PM

Originally Posted by beartrap
Originally Posted by grout-scout
Well so far, Big O has been correct on more issues than Dubee. Look at the number of guys that left already, some with no backup plan. Guys aren’t leaving because it’s great over there.


look at the big picture....5 fishermen leaving out of the original 80 isn't exactly a mass exodus,94% of the best and most established pros believe MLF is now the dominant fishing trail, the wave of the future and the television ratings prove this.......all the yapping about them postponing Redcrest is ignoring the fact that every major sport has had numerous cancellations this past year due to the covid 19 pandemic....MLF is providing 800 hours of TV exposure and a venue where the fishermen share that revenue along with revenue from the cities where they hold events and exhibitor income at their championships.....also if MLF hadn't of bought the FLW,it's almost certain FLW would have ceased to exist.....



It’s 6 as of now. If they had an easier exit strategy, it would be more. When a guy like Hackney that was as pizzed at BASS as he was, tucks his tail and admits that he was wrong, it’s got to be a bad situation. You seem to pass over the idea that some of the biggest names left the BPT, these aren’t scrubs leaving it.
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 02:57 PM

Originally Posted by grout-scout
Well so far, Big O has been correct on more issues than Dubee. Look at the number of guys that left already, some with no backup plan. Guys aren’t leaving because it’s great over there.


It's funny that the handful of guys saying big o is well spoken and provides proof. Are the same guys that have always hated BPT. He said Redcrest was cancelled and the owners kept the money. Wrong. It is next month. He said the owners kept all the money for the cancelled BPT tournaments. Wrong. They let the BPT anglers fish the last 3 FLW tournaments and added over 1.5 million to the prize money. He has claimed many times MLF has lost "massive" amounts of sponsors due to how shady they are. Then when asked to list this massive amount of sponsors that left. He says he doesn't know but Boyd said they lost sponsors due to covid. Anyone can take all of his claims and prove them wrong. The only was on here that keep saying he is well spoken and provides proof are the guys that have hated BPT since it was formed. And Dan, no I'm not on their payroll. I have zero stake in it. It wouldn't affect me one bit if the went out of business tomorrow
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 03:05 PM

Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by grout-scout
Well so far, Big O has been correct on more issues than Dubee. Look at the number of guys that left already, some with no backup plan. Guys aren’t leaving because it’s great over there.


It's funny that the handful of guys saying big o is well spoken and provides proof. Are the same guys that have always hated BPT. He said Redcrest was cancelled and the owners kept the money. Wrong. It is next month. He said the owners kept all the money for the cancelled BPT tournaments. Wrong. They let the BPT anglers fish the last 3 FLW tournaments and added over 1.5 million to the prize money. He has claimed many times MLF has lost "massive" amounts of sponsors due to how shady they are. Then when asked to list this massive amount of sponsors that left. He says he doesn't know but Boyd said they lost sponsors due to covid. Anyone can take all of his claims and prove them wrong. The only was on here that keep saying he is well spoken and provides proof are the guys that have hated BPT since it was formed. And Dan, no I'm not on their payroll. I have zero stake in it. It wouldn't affect me one bit if the went out of business tomorrow


[Linked Image]
Posted By: grout-scout

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 03:09 PM

Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by grout-scout
Well so far, Big O has been correct on more issues than Dubee. Look at the number of guys that left already, some with no backup plan. Guys aren’t leaving because it’s great over there.


It's funny that the handful of guys saying big o is well spoken and provides proof. Are the same guys that have always hated BPT. He said Redcrest was cancelled and the owners kept the money. Wrong. It is next month. He said the owners kept all the money for the cancelled BPT tournaments. Wrong. They let the BPT anglers fish the last 3 FLW tournaments and added over 1.5 million to the prize money. He has claimed many times MLF has lost "massive" amounts of sponsors due to how shady they are. Then when asked to list this massive amount of sponsors that left. He says he doesn't know but Boyd said they lost sponsors due to covid. Anyone can take all of his claims and prove them wrong. The only was on here that keep saying he is well spoken and provides proof are the guys that have hated BPT since it was formed. And Dan, no I'm not on their payroll. I have zero stake in it. It wouldn't affect me one bit if the went out of business tomorrow





I don’t like Duckett and what he stands for, I don’t think anglers deserve to be paid to fish, if they don’t win. Nobody is forcing them to fish and it’s obvious that most don’t make the number of sales that they think they do.

If I told you that I was giving you a bonus check in 2019 and you didn’t get it, how does that benefit you? So again, unless they have 2 Redcrest in 2020, that money disappeared.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 03:14 PM

Originally Posted by grout-scout
Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by grout-scout
Well so far, Big O has been correct on more issues than Dubee. Look at the number of guys that left already, some with no backup plan. Guys aren’t leaving because it’s great over there.


It's funny that the handful of guys saying big o is well spoken and provides proof. Are the same guys that have always hated BPT. He said Redcrest was cancelled and the owners kept the money. Wrong. It is next month. He said the owners kept all the money for the cancelled BPT tournaments. Wrong. They let the BPT anglers fish the last 3 FLW tournaments and added over 1.5 million to the prize money. He has claimed many times MLF has lost "massive" amounts of sponsors due to how shady they are. Then when asked to list this massive amount of sponsors that left. He says he doesn't know but Boyd said they lost sponsors due to covid. Anyone can take all of his claims and prove them wrong. The only was on here that keep saying he is well spoken and provides proof are the guys that have hated BPT since it was formed. And Dan, no I'm not on their payroll. I have zero stake in it. It wouldn't affect me one bit if the went out of business tomorrow





I don’t like Duckett and what he stands for, I don’t think anglers deserve to be paid to fish, if they don’t win. Nobody is forcing them to fish and it’s obvious that most don’t make the number of sales that they think they do.

If I told you that I was giving you a bonus check in 2019 and you didn’t get it, how does that benefit you? So again, unless they have 2 Redcrest in 2020, that money disappeared.



Grout - the ones who are in constant defense of MLF never do their own homework to back up and support their disagreement with what’s said by someone else... have you noticed that. But as soon as support is provided to support one of my claims it’s dismissed and turned into a semantics battle. I am still waiting on one of them to address the 2020 FLW Pro AOY and the missing $100k... I am not holding my breath.
Posted By: beartrap

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 03:41 PM

if MLF hadn't stepped up and bought FLW,it would have gone into bankruptcy and there would have been no All American or FLW championship....all those entry fees and expenses incurred by the FLW fishermen to qualify would have been wasted and that $100,000. would have have been peanuts in comparison...
you can nitpick,piss and moan all you want but the reality is that 94% of the top ranked and most recognizable fishermen are still with MLF,they have 800 hours of TV time booked as #1 rated outdoor show.....and....they share the TV,Venue and exhibitor/advertiser revenue....
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 03:50 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by grout-scout
Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by grout-scout
Well so far, Big O has been correct on more issues than Dubee. Look at the number of guys that left already, some with no backup plan. Guys aren’t leaving because it’s great over there.


It's funny that the handful of guys saying big o is well spoken and provides proof. Are the same guys that have always hated BPT. He said Redcrest was cancelled and the owners kept the money. Wrong. It is next month. He said the owners kept all the money for the cancelled BPT tournaments. Wrong. They let the BPT anglers fish the last 3 FLW tournaments and added over 1.5 million to the prize money. He has claimed many times MLF has lost "massive" amounts of sponsors due to how shady they are. Then when asked to list this massive amount of sponsors that left. He says he doesn't know but Boyd said they lost sponsors due to covid. Anyone can take all of his claims and prove them wrong. The only was on here that keep saying he is well spoken and provides proof are the guys that have hated BPT since it was formed. And Dan, no I'm not on their payroll. I have zero stake in it. It wouldn't affect me one bit if the went out of business tomorrow





I don’t like Duckett and what he stands for, I don’t think anglers deserve to be paid to fish, if they don’t win. Nobody is forcing them to fish and it’s obvious that most don’t make the number of sales that they think they do.

If I told you that I was giving you a bonus check in 2019 and you didn’t get it, how does that benefit you? So again, unless they have 2 Redcrest in 2020, that money disappeared.



Grout - the ones who are in constant defense of MLF never do their own homework to back up and support their disagreement with what’s said by someone else... have you noticed that. But as soon as support is provided to support one of my claims it’s dismissed and turned into a semantics battle. I am still waiting on one of them to address the 2020 FLW Pro AOY and the missing $100k... I am not holding my breath.


I haven't looked at the aoy payout so I'm obviously not going to dispute. But if MLF bought FLW and changed the payout. I wouldn't exactly call that money missing. I would say that the new business owners changed the bonus structure
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 04:06 PM

Originally Posted by beartrap
if MLF hadn't stepped up and bought FLW,it would have gone into bankruptcy and there would have been no All American or FLW championship....all those entry fees and expenses incurred by the FLW fishermen to qualify would have been wasted and that $100,000. would have have been peanuts in comparison...
you can nitpick,piss and moan all you want but the reality is that 94% of the top ranked and most recognizable fishermen are still with MLF,they have 800 hours of TV time booked as #1 rated outdoor show.....and....they share the TV,Venue and exhibitor/advertiser revenue....


That’s interesting - the Jacobs estate never filed bankruptcy and as a matter of fact is still in probate, where a partial of land adjacent to their homestead was just sold for a little under $2 million.

Just where would those 94% go? You really need to think that kind of thing through before you post such a statement. They are stuck, and now, stuck paying entry fees, just like the circuits they left. Truth is, A dozen or so of them would not be welcomed back to BASS under any circumstances, and the remainder would have to try and requalify for the Elites via the Opens. - again, you’re shouting the same nonsense into an echo chamber, that’s why you’re continuing to only hear back what you want to hear. You can continue to recount the votes until the cows come home, it’s not going to change the outcome.
Posted By: Duck_Hunter

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 05:06 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
The definition of purse snatching is theft. It’s literally a type of theft. All of the sudden, you’re using rational thoughts and discussions. I’m all for it. Keep it up. The forum and your posts will be better off.


You all will twist yourselves into pretzels to avoid talking about what happened to the 2020 FLW Pro AOY purse that has been historically $100k. I’ve asked multiple times now and not one of you have an explanation for that... whatever you want to call it. At beginning of 2020 MLF distributed its talking points to all the water boys and they ran with the narrative of how MLF was making things better, lowering entry fees and increasing payouts in the FLW circuits, and under the FLW Pro AOY rules for 2020 it stated the payout was “TBD”... no one for a minute thought that was going to mean a reduction of $100k considering the overall narrative the water boys were disseminating on behalf of MLF. When B.Duckett was cornered with the question in an interview on BTL late last year, he seemed annoyed at the question and then blamed the angler commission for the payout reduction while avoiding the most pressing question of “when were the anglers actually informed” they were fishing for significantly reduced purse.... again, I find it humorous that no one has a legit argument that also supports the over riding MLF narrative of growing the sport and better for the anglers, yadda, yadda, yadda...



My statement above was in reference to you saying you never called them thieves or said they stole something. I was pointing out that’s false because you started a thread calling them purse snatchers.
Posted By: Mark Perry

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 08:58 PM

People keep referring that 5 anglers have left BPT. The number is 7. Ike and Powroznik left as well.
Posted By: SAKS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 09:04 PM

So someone please explain the missing purse that is keeps getting brought up because they moved Redcrest. There have been 2 BPT seasons correct? There has been 1 Redcrest? Will there be another Redcrest before the 2021 BPT season starts? If so, I am not clear on how the purse is missing.
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 09:21 PM

Originally Posted by SAKS
So someone please explain the missing purse that is keeps getting brought up because they moved Redcrest. There have been 2 BPT seasons correct? There has been 1 Redcrest? Will there be another Redcrest before the 2021 BPT season starts? If so, I am not clear on how the purse is missing.



Yes it is in February. It is for the 2020 qualifiers. Their is no missing purse money
Posted By: Jimfishes

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 09:48 PM

Originally Posted by SAKS
So someone please explain the missing purse that is keeps getting brought up because they moved Redcrest. There have been 2 BPT seasons correct? There has been 1 Redcrest? Will there be another Redcrest before the 2021 BPT season starts? If so, I am not clear on how the purse is missing.


Pro Andrew Upshaw has a Youtube video explaining his side of purse snatching.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 10:38 PM

Originally Posted by Mark Perry
People keep referring that 5 anglers have left BPT. The number is 7. Ike and Powroznik left as well.


Not to leave without mention MLF’s actions also led to a mass exodus of the FLW Pro top ranks; It was most of the top 10 and then some. I call those guys the smart money gang. The only ones who remained were Dudley and Thrift which got picked up by BPT when Gerald and Brandon paid the get out of jail fees. Oh, and John Cox, but he doesn’t count because he’s a tournament fishing phnom that will fish any circuit and tournament that he has a chance to win $10k or above in, per event.
Posted By: Dan21XRS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 11:51 PM

Originally Posted by grout-scout
So are there 2 Redcrest in 2020? If not, theft of money to the anglers makes sense to me too.


So there was a 2019 and maybe a 2021... Seems if you count they're missing a year... 2019, ...., 2021... Hmmmmmm... Dan
Posted By: emorydog

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/23/21 11:52 PM

Originally Posted by SAKS
So someone please explain the missing purse that is keeps getting brought up


The only purse in this thread I can recognize with a great deal of certainty is the proverbial BASS coin purse, which someone just can’t seem to keep their tongue off of.
Posted By: SAKS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 12:21 AM

Originally Posted by Jimfishes
Originally Posted by SAKS
So someone please explain the missing purse that is keeps getting brought up because they moved Redcrest. There have been 2 BPT seasons correct? There has been 1 Redcrest? Will there be another Redcrest before the 2021 BPT season starts? If so, I am not clear on how the purse is missing.


Pro Andrew Upshaw has a Youtube video explaining his side of purse snatching.

Unless he has more than one video I have seen that one. He is one that you can say was slighted when BPT acquired FLW. He has a good argument also I think. I specifically want to know how people feel that just because they moved the Redcrest to a later date (that just happened to extend into the next year) somehow that purse disappeared. Even though it was postponed 4-5 months it will still be fished prior to any tournament that starts the 2021 season.
Posted By: grandbassslayer

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 12:29 AM

Originally Posted by beartrap
if MLF hadn't stepped up and bought FLW,it would have gone into bankruptcy and there would have been no All American or FLW championship....all those entry fees and expenses incurred by the FLW fishermen to qualify would have been wasted and that $100,000. would have have been peanuts in comparison...
you can nitpick,piss and moan all you want but the reality is that 94% of the top ranked and most recognizable fishermen are still with MLF,they have 800 hours of TV time booked as #1 rated outdoor show.....and....they share the TV,Venue and exhibitor/advertiser revenue....

Hey don't spoil a thread with facts... grin
Posted By: grandbassslayer

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 12:33 AM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Mark Perry
People keep referring that 5 anglers have left BPT. The number is 7. Ike and Powroznik left as well.


Not to leave without mention MLF’s actions also led to a mass exodus of the FLW Pro top ranks; It was most of the top 10 and then some. I call those guys the smart money gang. The only ones who remained were Dudley and Thrift which got picked up by BPT when Gerald and Brandon paid the get out of jail fees. Oh, and John Cox, but he doesn’t count because he’s a tournament fishing phnom that will fish any circuit and tournament that he has a chance to win $10k or above in, per event.

Actions? Its a tournament series, people come and go from all of them for a variety of reasons.... and to call them the "smart money gang"??? not a whole lot of smart money fishing tourneys.
Posted By: SteezMacQueen

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 12:35 AM

Originally Posted by SAKS
Originally Posted by Jimfishes
Originally Posted by SAKS
So someone please explain the missing purse that is keeps getting brought up because they moved Redcrest. There have been 2 BPT seasons correct? There has been 1 Redcrest? Will there be another Redcrest before the 2021 BPT season starts? If so, I am not clear on how the purse is missing.


Pro Andrew Upshaw has a Youtube video explaining his side of purse snatching.

Unless he has more than one video I have seen that one. He is one that you can say was slighted when BPT acquired FLW. He has a good argument also I think. I specifically want to know how people feel that just because they moved the Redcrest to a later date (that just happened to extend into the next year) somehow that purse disappeared. Even though it was postponed 4-5 months it will still be fished prior to any tournament that starts the 2021 season.

I think the “purse snatching “ is still in the prediction phase. Big O is predicting that the moving(delaying) of a championship into the following year, makes it easy to forget that the current year will likely be moved now too. And so on, until it is convenient to “skip” a year. Then the purse fades away. With less notice of it missing. Basically. MLF would fall behind a year and use the “extra years” money it has held to pad pockets.
Posted By: SAKS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 12:42 AM

Originally Posted by SteezMacQueen
Originally Posted by SAKS
Originally Posted by Jimfishes
Originally Posted by SAKS
So someone please explain the missing purse that is keeps getting brought up because they moved Redcrest. There have been 2 BPT seasons correct? There has been 1 Redcrest? Will there be another Redcrest before the 2021 BPT season starts? If so, I am not clear on how the purse is missing.


Pro Andrew Upshaw has a Youtube video explaining his side of purse snatching.

Unless he has more than one video I have seen that one. He is one that you can say was slighted when BPT acquired FLW. He has a good argument also I think. I specifically want to know how people feel that just because they moved the Redcrest to a later date (that just happened to extend into the next year) somehow that purse disappeared. Even though it was postponed 4-5 months it will still be fished prior to any tournament that starts the 2021 season.

I think the “purse snatching “ is still in the prediction phase. Big O is predicting that the moving(delaying) of a championship into the following year, makes it easy to forget that the current year will likely be moved now too. And so on, until it is convenient to “skip” a year. Then the purse fades away. With less notice of it missing. Basically. MLF would fall behind a year and use the “extra years” money it has held to pad pockets.

I could see that. Would be sh***y if they did it.
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 12:54 AM

Originally Posted by SteezMacQueen
Originally Posted by SAKS
Originally Posted by Jimfishes
Originally Posted by SAKS
So someone please explain the missing purse that is keeps getting brought up because they moved Redcrest. There have been 2 BPT seasons correct? There has been 1 Redcrest? Will there be another Redcrest before the 2021 BPT season starts? If so, I am not clear on how the purse is missing.


Pro Andrew Upshaw has a Youtube video explaining his side of purse snatching.

Unless he has more than one video I have seen that one. He is one that you can say was slighted when BPT acquired FLW. He has a good argument also I think. I specifically want to know how people feel that just because they moved the Redcrest to a later date (that just happened to extend into the next year) somehow that purse disappeared. Even though it was postponed 4-5 months it will still be fished prior to any tournament that starts the 2021 season.

I think the “purse snatching “ is still in the prediction phase. Big O is predicting that the moving(delaying) of a championship into the following year, makes it easy to forget that the current year will likely be moved now too. And so on, until it is convenient to “skip” a year. Then the purse fades away. With less notice of it missing. Basically. MLF would fall behind a year and use the “extra years” money it has held to pad pockets.


But that's not the case at all. They moved it after the first year having it in the fall. To having it the following spring just like the classic. Big o isn't using the rationale you just did of it continually moving. He thinks just because this one isn't in the same calendar year that means they stole the purse money.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 01:26 AM

Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
Originally Posted by beartrap
if MLF hadn't stepped up and bought FLW,it would have gone into bankruptcy and there would have been no All American or FLW championship....all those entry fees and expenses incurred by the FLW fishermen to qualify would have been wasted and that $100,000. would have have been peanuts in comparison...
you can nitpick,piss and moan all you want but the reality is that 94% of the top ranked and most recognizable fishermen are still with MLF,they have 800 hours of TV time booked as #1 rated outdoor show.....and....they share the TV,Venue and exhibitor/advertiser revenue....

Hey don't spoil a thread with facts... grin


Spoil it with facts... I want to see something that definitively shows FLW was headed for bankruptcy. I don’t think it exists, and that is just a MLF talking point designed to deflect criticism. The Jacobs Estate never filed for bankruptcy, and it still seems to be in a contested state between the heirs within probate. I think the only reason FLW sale was allowed to proceed was due to it already being in progress at the time of Jacobs death.
Posted By: Duck_Hunter

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 01:35 AM

Originally Posted by SteezMacQueen
Originally Posted by SAKS
Originally Posted by Jimfishes
Originally Posted by SAKS
So someone please explain the missing purse that is keeps getting brought up because they moved Redcrest. There have been 2 BPT seasons correct? There has been 1 Redcrest? Will there be another Redcrest before the 2021 BPT season starts? If so, I am not clear on how the purse is missing.


Pro Andrew Upshaw has a Youtube video explaining his side of purse snatching.

Unless he has more than one video I have seen that one. He is one that you can say was slighted when BPT acquired FLW. He has a good argument also I think. I specifically want to know how people feel that just because they moved the Redcrest to a later date (that just happened to extend into the next year) somehow that purse disappeared. Even though it was postponed 4-5 months it will still be fished prior to any tournament that starts the 2021 season.

I think the “purse snatching “ is still in the prediction phase. Big O is predicting that the moving(delaying) of a championship into the following year, makes it easy to forget that the current year will likely be moved now too. And so on, until it is convenient to “skip” a year. Then the purse fades away. With less notice of it missing. Basically. MLF would fall behind a year and use the “extra years” money it has held to pad pockets.


Right, absolutely a possibility. But saying it has happened, the way that he does, is not only annoying, it ignores all of the facts as we know them now and nothing has actually happened yet.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 01:36 AM

Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Mark Perry
People keep referring that 5 anglers have left BPT. The number is 7. Ike and Powroznik left as well.


Not to leave without mention MLF’s actions also led to a mass exodus of the FLW Pro top ranks; It was most of the top 10 and then some. I call those guys the smart money gang. The only ones who remained were Dudley and Thrift which got picked up by BPT when Gerald and Brandon paid the get out of jail fees. Oh, and John Cox, but he doesn’t count because he’s a tournament fishing phnom that will fish any circuit and tournament that he has a chance to win $10k or above in, per event.

Actions? Its a tournament series, people come and go from all of them for a variety of reasons.... and to call them the "smart money gang"??? not a whole lot of smart money fishing tourneys.


You may have a point about not much smart money in fishing tourneys, but those who I classify as being that seemingly foresaw what was ahead and moved out to fish the opens, many of them fished FLW their whole careers. And it paid off... look at what happened with the AOY award, and the last 3 events... It made them look smart.

I have to wonder if they would have pulled the same stunt if someone like Scott Martin had stayed and ended up being AOY instead of a relatively unknown angler like the guy that won it? Me seems to think they would have found $100k in the cushions around the homes of the billionaires owners to make things equal to previous years.... lol
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 01:46 AM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Mark Perry
People keep referring that 5 anglers have left BPT. The number is 7. Ike and Powroznik left as well.


Not to leave without mention MLF’s actions also led to a mass exodus of the FLW Pro top ranks; It was most of the top 10 and then some. I call those guys the smart money gang. The only ones who remained were Dudley and Thrift which got picked up by BPT when Gerald and Brandon paid the get out of jail fees. Oh, and John Cox, but he doesn’t count because he’s a tournament fishing phnom that will fish any circuit and tournament that he has a chance to win $10k or above in, per event.

Actions? Its a tournament series, people come and go from all of them for a variety of reasons.... and to call them the "smart money gang"??? not a whole lot of smart money fishing tourneys.


You may have a point about not much smart money in fishing tourneys, but those who I classify as being that seemingly foresaw what was ahead and moved out to fish the opens, many of them fished FLW their whole careers. And it paid off... look at what happened with the AOY award, and the last 3 events... It made them look smart.

I have to wonder if they would have pulled the same stunt if someone like Scott Martin had stayed and ended up being AOY instead of a relatively unknown angler like the guy that won it? Me seems to think they would have found $100k in the cushions around the homes of the billionaires owners to make things equal to previous years.... lol


You mean the last 3 events where they raised the purse of each by $500,000 and pay $10,000 down to around 100th place. How dare they. Lmao
Posted By: grandbassslayer

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 02:10 AM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
Originally Posted by beartrap
if MLF hadn't stepped up and bought FLW,it would have gone into bankruptcy and there would have been no All American or FLW championship....all those entry fees and expenses incurred by the FLW fishermen to qualify would have been wasted and that $100,000. would have have been peanuts in comparison...
you can nitpick,piss and moan all you want but the reality is that 94% of the top ranked and most recognizable fishermen are still with MLF,they have 800 hours of TV time booked as #1 rated outdoor show.....and....they share the TV,Venue and exhibitor/advertiser revenue....

Hey don't spoil a thread with facts... grin


Spoil it with facts... I want to see something that definitively shows FLW was headed for bankruptcy. I don’t think it exists, and that is just a MLF talking point designed to deflect criticism. The Jacobs Estate never filed for bankruptcy, and it still seems to be in a contested state between the heirs within probate. I think the only reason FLW sale was allowed to proceed was due to it already being in progress at the time of Jacobs death.

Like they owe you any of that information. MLF/FLW did not hurt you in any way, its just another tourney series, watch it if you like. All the hurt is self inflicted.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 02:31 AM

Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
Originally Posted by beartrap
if MLF hadn't stepped up and bought FLW,it would have gone into bankruptcy and there would have been no All American or FLW championship....all those entry fees and expenses incurred by the FLW fishermen to qualify would have been wasted and that $100,000. would have have been peanuts in comparison...
you can nitpick,piss and moan all you want but the reality is that 94% of the top ranked and most recognizable fishermen are still with MLF,they have 800 hours of TV time booked as #1 rated outdoor show.....and....they share the TV,Venue and exhibitor/advertiser revenue....

Hey don't spoil a thread with facts... grin


Spoil it with facts... I want to see something that definitively shows FLW was headed for bankruptcy. I don’t think it exists, and that is just a MLF talking point designed to deflect criticism. The Jacobs Estate never filed for bankruptcy, and it still seems to be in a contested state between the heirs within probate. I think the only reason FLW sale was allowed to proceed was due to it already being in progress at the time of Jacobs death.

Like they owe you any of that information. MLF/FLW did not hurt you in any way, its just another tourney series, watch it if you like. All the hurt is self inflicted.


But, for as much as that talking point has been recited by the MLF water boys, they surely is some truth to it, right? Why else would they be using that as an excuse and to deflect criticism? For some reason those who do recite it, or scripted it forgot there is actually information out there that is contrary to that narrative. And ironically it’s published in one of the media outlets the majority owner of MLF is an owner of.

You won’t see anything about FLW being in financial distress here.. hmmm, wonder why?

http://bassfan.com/news_article/9756/flw-sale-an-emotional-process-for-blake#.YAzZKi08Kf0
Posted By: grandbassslayer

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 02:53 AM

That's a puff piece designed to make FLW and the like look good, nothing more. You can read nothing into about their financial health. I guess I don't get the MLF water boy statement, does BASS have water boys? It doesn't need to be an us vs. them either or mentality.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 03:14 AM

Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
That's a puff piece designed to make FLW and the like look good, nothing more. You can read nothing into about their financial health. I guess I don't get the MLF water boy statement, does BASS have water boys? It doesn't need to be an us vs. them either or mentality.


What the article demonstrates, contrary to the often recited narrative is, is MLF did not come to FLW’s rescue after Irwin Jacobs death. Talks had been well underway prior to that and Jacobs himself was directly involved.

BASS doesn’t need water boys to stand up and defend them... they aren’t being seen by fans and sponsors as the bad actors in the industry that can’t be trusted.
Posted By: grandbassslayer

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 03:21 AM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
That's a puff piece designed to make FLW and the like look good, nothing more. You can read nothing into about their financial health. I guess I don't get the MLF water boy statement, does BASS have water boys? It doesn't need to be an us vs. them either or mentality.


What the article demonstrates, contrary to the often recited narrative is, is MLF did not come to FLW’s rescue after Irwin Jacobs death. Talks had been well underway prior to that and Jacobs himself was directly involved.

BASS doesn’t need water boys to stand up and defend them... they aren’t being seen by fans and sponsors as the bad actors in the industry that can’t be trusted.

lol thats what you take from it? Of course they were in talks, they wanted out of the deal and needed a buyer. What sponsors say MLF BPT can't be trusted? The only reason a fan, short for fanatic, btw wouldn't trust them is they believe everything they hear from someone that came up short with an axe to grind.
Posted By: Mark Jones

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 03:27 AM

Here we are 15 pages later and MLF is still in business. Oh and Big O, your stipend got approved. Send me your email and I'll get the PayPal started.
Posted By: Lone_Wolf

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 03:46 AM

Originally Posted by beartrap
Originally Posted by grout-scout
Well so far, Big O has been correct on more issues than Dubee. Look at the number of guys that left already, some with no backup plan. Guys aren’t leaving because it’s great over there.


look at the big picture....5 fishermen leaving out of the original 80 isn't exactly a mass exodus,94% of the best and most established pros believe MLF is now the dominant fishing trail, the wave of the future and the television ratings prove this.......all the yapping about them postponing Redcrest is ignoring the fact that every major sport has had numerous cancellations this past year due to the covid 19 pandemic....MLF is providing 800 hours of TV exposure and a venue where the fishermen share that revenue along with revenue from the cities where they hold events and exhibitor income at their championships.....also if MLF hadn't of bought the FLW,it's almost certain FLW would have ceased to exist.....


5 out of 80 leaving over 2 years is definitely not 70 out of 110 leaving all at once roflmao
Posted By: grandbassslayer

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 03:49 AM

Originally Posted by Lone_Wolf
Originally Posted by beartrap
Originally Posted by grout-scout
Well so far, Big O has been correct on more issues than Dubee. Look at the number of guys that left already, some with no backup plan. Guys aren’t leaving because it’s great over there.


look at the big picture....5 fishermen leaving out of the original 80 isn't exactly a mass exodus,94% of the best and most established pros believe MLF is now the dominant fishing trail, the wave of the future and the television ratings prove this.......all the yapping about them postponing Redcrest is ignoring the fact that every major sport has had numerous cancellations this past year due to the covid 19 pandemic....MLF is providing 800 hours of TV exposure and a venue where the fishermen share that revenue along with revenue from the cities where they hold events and exhibitor income at their championships.....also if MLF hadn't of bought the FLW,it's almost certain FLW would have ceased to exist.....


5 out of 80 leaving over 2 years is definitely not 70 out of 110 leaving all at once roflmao

Don't poke too many holes in his faux outrage, not sure if he has upright flotation....lol
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 03:49 AM

Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
That's a puff piece designed to make FLW and the like look good, nothing more. You can read nothing into about their financial health. I guess I don't get the MLF water boy statement, does BASS have water boys? It doesn't need to be an us vs. them either or mentality.


What the article demonstrates, contrary to the often recited narrative is, is MLF did not come to FLW’s rescue after Irwin Jacobs death. Talks had been well underway prior to that and Jacobs himself was directly involved.

BASS doesn’t need water boys to stand up and defend them... they aren’t being seen by fans and sponsors as the bad actors in the industry that can’t be trusted.

lol thats what you take from it? Of course they were in talks, they wanted out of the deal and needed a buyer. What sponsors say MLF BPT can't be trusted? The only reason a fan, short for fanatic, btw wouldn't trust them is they believe everything they hear from someone that came up short with an axe to grind.


No, I think you read the article wrong. MLF needed and was seeking a feeder circuit, its even stated within that write up and they needed it quick. That’s why they were also trying to buy BASS at the same time, and got 3 offers shot down cold. Whether MLF wanted to buy both and have control of the whole pro tournament industry, or just destroy BASS, who knows... but it almost reads that MLF was more in need of the sale than FLW was when all things are considered.

The sponsors who don’t trust MLF have spoken with their $$ in a big and powerful way... that’s why those guys who drank the kook-aid Boyd’s boys have been serving are now paying entry fees and are worse off than they ever were before... BASS is and has always been the big fish, big stage brand and platform... MLF is the No stage and No Fans platform. Follow the industry and media money... the winner in this battle is about to be declared! Will it be a mid season knockout, or called at the end by unanimous decision... stay tuned.
Posted By: grout-scout

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 03:50 AM

Originally Posted by Lone_Wolf
Originally Posted by beartrap
Originally Posted by grout-scout
Well so far, Big O has been correct on more issues than Dubee. Look at the number of guys that left already, some with no backup plan. Guys aren’t leaving because it’s great over there.


look at the big picture....5 fishermen leaving out of the original 80 isn't exactly a mass exodus,94% of the best and most established pros believe MLF is now the dominant fishing trail, the wave of the future and the television ratings prove this.......all the yapping about them postponing Redcrest is ignoring the fact that every major sport has had numerous cancellations this past year due to the covid 19 pandemic....MLF is providing 800 hours of TV exposure and a venue where the fishermen share that revenue along with revenue from the cities where they hold events and exhibitor income at their championships.....also if MLF hadn't of bought the FLW,it's almost certain FLW would have ceased to exist.....


5 out of 80 leaving over 2 years is definitely not 70 out of 110 leaving all at once roflmao


Apparently it’s 7, not 5 and when those guys are fishing every division of the Opens to go back...what does that tell anyone with common sense? It’s not all roses across the fence. Then to have Hackney, who isn’t the most outspoken talk about how happy he is to have made it back to BASS. It really shows that some are miserable. But hell, my job is miserable too! I just wish we could take fishing back to how it used to be, before new boats cost $75k. I’d rather watch working guys fishing jackpots, than to watch guys that spend days & days practicing on the water. I hope the NPFL is more of that style, if so, I’ll watch it.
Posted By: Dan21XRS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 03:55 AM

Originally Posted by Lone_Wolf
5 out of 80 leaving over 2 years is definitely not 70 out of 110 leaving all at once roflmao


Where are all the BPsT/ MLFLW guys supposed to go???... If you were sponsoring one of the guys at the highest level of fishing and they decide to drop down to AAA would you continue to sponsor them???... Heck no I wouldn't... I'd either restructure their contracts lowering my investment or drop them altogether... Dan
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 04:00 AM

Originally Posted by grout-scout
Originally Posted by Lone_Wolf
Originally Posted by beartrap
Originally Posted by grout-scout
Well so far, Big O has been correct on more issues than Dubee. Look at the number of guys that left already, some with no backup plan. Guys aren’t leaving because it’s great over there.


look at the big picture....5 fishermen leaving out of the original 80 isn't exactly a mass exodus,94% of the best and most established pros believe MLF is now the dominant fishing trail, the wave of the future and the television ratings prove this.......all the yapping about them postponing Redcrest is ignoring the fact that every major sport has had numerous cancellations this past year due to the covid 19 pandemic....MLF is providing 800 hours of TV exposure and a venue where the fishermen share that revenue along with revenue from the cities where they hold events and exhibitor income at their championships.....also if MLF hadn't of bought the FLW,it's almost certain FLW would have ceased to exist.....


5 out of 80 leaving over 2 years is definitely not 70 out of 110 leaving all at once roflmao


Apparently it’s 7, not 5 and when those guys are fishing every division of the Opens to go back...what does that tell anyone with common sense? It’s not all roses across the fence.


These guys aren’t paying attention to the reality of the situation, they didn’t even consider all the big names that was left in FLW Pro series that bailed too... they’ve got their head in the sand and nose out of joint because they backed the wrong horse in the race... and now their favorite jockeys soon won’t have a ride... what happened with those guys defecting was ironically the best thing that could ever happen to BASS... it sent the dead weight and bad for business actors out to pasture by their own accord instead of BASS trying to find a way to remove them by other means. It showed who the self interested traitors were who don’t respect the brand and platform that made them who they are.
Posted By: grandbassslayer

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 04:07 AM

Jerry Fletcher is that you?
Posted By: grout-scout

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 04:13 AM

Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
Jerry Fletcher is that you?



popcorn Who ‘dat?
Posted By: grandbassslayer

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 04:20 AM

Originally Posted by grout-scout
Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
Jerry Fletcher is that you?



popcorn Who ‘dat?

Google is your friend, actually its not, Jerry won't go there, they are tracking him.... roflmao
Posted By: grout-scout

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 04:28 AM

Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
Originally Posted by grout-scout
Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
Jerry Fletcher is that you?



popcorn Who ‘dat?

Google is your friend, actually its not, Jerry won't go there, they are tracking him.... roflmao



Appears to be a movie, guess I’ve never seen it. I envision Big O more as Jules in Pulp Fiction. He is the shepherd, protecting the weak.
Posted By: grandbassslayer

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 04:31 AM

Not familiar with that character haven't seen it in years, was that Samuel or John? I get it some people don't like it, but its comical at this point.
Posted By: grout-scout

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 04:35 AM

Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
Not familiar with that character haven't seen it in years, was that Samuel or John? I get it some people don't like it, but its comical at this point.




It was Samuel, we just need to know if Big O eats pigs or not.
Posted By: grandbassslayer

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 04:36 AM

Originally Posted by grout-scout
Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
Not familiar with that character haven't seen it in years, was that Samuel or John? I get it some people don't like it, but its comical at this point.




It was Samuel, we just need to know if Big O eats pigs or not.

Did Samuel save the guy that was gettin it? Can't remember... offtopiclol
Posted By: grout-scout

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 04:46 AM

Originally Posted by grandbassslayer

Did Samuel save the guy that was gettin it? Can't remember... offtopiclol



Us taking this topic, off topic, can only help this thread. Lol

There was a scene in PF where Samuel (Jules) keeps Vincent (John Travolta) from shooting a pair of crazies. Jules gives a speech about how he is the shepherd, protecting the weak from evil & tyranny. You see, Big O is protecting the weak from the big bad evil tyranny Duckett.

I wonder how Big O feels about BassCat owners??? popcorn

Hey Big O, do you watch Ken Smiths videos? Did any of his videos set you off or are you good with his opinion?
Posted By: grandbassslayer

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 02:47 PM

Originally Posted by grout-scout
Originally Posted by grandbassslayer

Did Samuel save the guy that was gettin it? Can't remember... offtopiclol



Us taking this topic, off topic, can only help this thread. Lol

There was a scene in PF where Samuel (Jules) keeps Vincent (John Travolta) from shooting a pair of crazies. Jules gives a speech about how he is the shepherd, protecting the weak from evil & tyranny. You see, Big O is protecting the weak from the big bad evil tyranny Duckett.

I wonder how Big O feels about BassCat owners??? popcorn

Hey Big O, do you watch Ken Smiths videos? Did any of his videos set you off or are you good with his opinion?

Love it! roflmao
Posted By: SC-001

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 06:17 PM

Oh lord Big O and and Dubee still going at it? Both organizations are going to be around for a long time, if it gets so bad one goes for bankruptcy the other one won't be far behind it, until the Fox deal BASS was probably it worse shape than most realize, BTW MLF is on CBS right now.
Posted By: grandbassslayer

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 06:33 PM

Originally Posted by SC-001
Oh lord Big O and and Dubee still going at it? Both organizations are going to be around for a long time, if it gets so bad one goes for bankruptcy the other one won't be far behind it, until the Fox deal BASS was probably it worse shape than most realize, BTW MLF is on CBS right now.

Big O is defending the honor of BASS...... roflmao It just seems so un-American that we don't want someone to succeed. Used to you would see a guy with a new Cadillac and say "look there kids, good for him." Nowadays the " attitude is " who did that guy rip off to buy that Cadillac."
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 08:51 PM

Originally Posted by SC-001
Oh lord Big O and and Dubee still going at it? Both organizations are going to be around for a long time, if it gets so bad one goes for bankruptcy the other one won't be far behind it, until the Fox deal BASS was probably it worse shape than most realize, BTW MLF is on CBS right now.


That’s laughable. They’ve been the standard bearer for over 50 years now. Just about anyone who is anyone notable in tournament bass fishing became who they are due to their association with the BASS brand and platform. They still retain over 500k in memberships, and despite the COVID was able to execute and deliver all of their tournaments for 2020 to their fans, sponsors, and anglers. I think Fox Sports was able to recognize that and it was a no brainier to them to seize the opportunity when the availability of a BASS partnership became open. No endemic sponsor will want to be left on the outside looking in from that kind of exposure, so even the ones who can’t afford the costly BASS and Fox splash, will still jump on board with the anglers. The non-endemic will come on board naturally because of Fox sports and the cross promoting with other interests they do. There is probably never a better time to be an angler fishing under the BASS brand.

Unlike the pretenders who cancelled all of their 2020 tournaments once COVID became a thing, left their anglers and sponsors, and host cities out to dry, and then instituted entry fees into a no-entry-fee league due to the “down turn in their economy”... the only question now is, will MLF be knocked out before the end of the 2021 season, or will it just fold at the end due to a unanimous decision that they sucked and never have had a marketable value.
Posted By: Duck_Hunter

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 09:27 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by SC-001
Oh lord Big O and and Dubee still going at it? Both organizations are going to be around for a long time, if it gets so bad one goes for bankruptcy the other one won't be far behind it, until the Fox deal BASS was probably it worse shape than most realize, BTW MLF is on CBS right now.


That’s laughable. They’ve been the standard bearer for over 50 years now. Just about anyone who is anyone notable in tournament bass fishing became who they are due to their association with the BASS brand and platform. They still retain over 500k in memberships, and despite the COVID was able to execute and deliver all of their tournaments for 2020 to their fans, sponsors, and anglers. I think Fox Sports was able to recognize that and it was a no brainier to them to seize the opportunity when the availability of a BASS partnership became open. No endemic sponsor will want to be left on the outside looking in from that kind of exposure, so even the ones who can’t afford the costly BASS and Fox splash, will still jump on board with the anglers. The non-endemic will come on board naturally because of Fox sports and the cross promoting with other interests they do. There is probably never a better time to be an angler fishing under the BASS brand.

Unlike the pretenders who cancelled all of their 2020 tournaments once COVID became a thing, left their anglers and sponsors, and host cities out to dry, and then instituted entry fees into a no-entry-fee league due to the “down turn in their economy”... the only question now is, will MLF be knocked out before the end of the 2021 season, or will it just fold at the end due to a unanimous decision that they sucked and never have had a marketable value.


I mean, come on.
Posted By: grandbassslayer

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 09:32 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by SC-001
Oh lord Big O and and Dubee still going at it? Both organizations are going to be around for a long time, if it gets so bad one goes for bankruptcy the other one won't be far behind it, until the Fox deal BASS was probably it worse shape than most realize, BTW MLF is on CBS right now.


That’s laughable. They’ve been the standard bearer for over 50 years now. Just about anyone who is anyone notable in tournament bass fishing became who they are due to their association with the BASS brand and platform. They still retain over 500k in memberships, and despite the COVID was able to execute and deliver all of their tournaments for 2020 to their fans, sponsors, and anglers. I think Fox Sports was able to recognize that and it was a no brainier to them to seize the opportunity when the availability of a BASS partnership became open. No endemic sponsor will want to be left on the outside looking in from that kind of exposure, so even the ones who can’t afford the costly BASS and Fox splash, will still jump on board with the anglers. The non-endemic will come on board naturally because of Fox sports and the cross promoting with other interests they do. There is probably never a better time to be an angler fishing under the BASS brand.

Unlike the pretenders who cancelled all of their 2020 tournaments once COVID became a thing, left their anglers and sponsors, and host cities out to dry, and then instituted entry fees into a no-entry-fee league due to the “down turn in their economy”... the only question now is, will MLF be knocked out before the end of the 2021 season, or will it just fold at the end due to a unanimous decision that they sucked and never have had a marketable value.

You think you'd just enjoy BASS and not worry about MLF then. I mean I like both, but I'm also a mature adult. As for the 500k members, thats great, I wonder if they all actually pay. I get bassmaster magazine for free compliments of bps.
Posted By: Lone_Wolf

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 11:19 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by SC-001
Oh lord Big O and and Dubee still going at it? Both organizations are going to be around for a long time, if it gets so bad one goes for bankruptcy the other one won't be far behind it, until the Fox deal BASS was probably it worse shape than most realize, BTW MLF is on CBS right now.


That’s laughable. They’ve been the standard bearer for over 50 years now. Just about anyone who is anyone notable in tournament bass fishing became who they are due to their association with the BASS brand and platform. They still retain over 500k in memberships, and despite the COVID was able to execute and deliver all of their tournaments for 2020 to their fans, sponsors, and anglers. I think Fox Sports was able to recognize that and it was a no brainier to them to seize the opportunity when the availability of a BASS partnership became open. No endemic sponsor will want to be left on the outside looking in from that kind of exposure, so even the ones who can’t afford the costly BASS and Fox splash, will still jump on board with the anglers. The non-endemic will come on board naturally because of Fox sports and the cross promoting with other interests they do. There is probably never a better time to be an angler fishing under the BASS brand.

Unlike the pretenders who cancelled all of their 2020 tournaments once COVID became a thing, left their anglers and sponsors, and host cities out to dry, and then instituted entry fees into a no-entry-fee league due to the “down turn in their economy”... the only question now is, will MLF be knocked out before the end of the 2021 season, or will it just fold at the end due to a unanimous decision that they sucked and never have had a marketable value.


Fox didn't realize shiat, BASS is hustling like hell because of MLF, its all reactionary BASS sat on their hands all those years when they were top dog over FLW, now look. Competition is good.
Posted By: RANDYSGLIDE

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 11:25 PM

After reading all of this i started watching Mlf even more and I enjoy it just like I do BASS
Posted By: Mark Perry

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/24/21 11:46 PM

Originally Posted by Lone_Wolf
Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by SC-001
Oh lord Big O and and Dubee still going at it? Both organizations are going to be around for a long time, if it gets so bad one goes for bankruptcy the other one won't be far behind it, until the Fox deal BASS was probably it worse shape than most realize, BTW MLF is on CBS right now.


That’s laughable. They’ve been the standard bearer for over 50 years now. Just about anyone who is anyone notable in tournament bass fishing became who they are due to their association with the BASS brand and platform. They still retain over 500k in memberships, and despite the COVID was able to execute and deliver all of their tournaments for 2020 to their fans, sponsors, and anglers. I think Fox Sports was able to recognize that and it was a no brainier to them to seize the opportunity when the availability of a BASS partnership became open. No endemic sponsor will want to be left on the outside looking in from that kind of exposure, so even the ones who can’t afford the costly BASS and Fox splash, will still jump on board with the anglers. The non-endemic will come on board naturally because of Fox sports and the cross promoting with other interests they do. There is probably never a better time to be an angler fishing under the BASS brand.

Unlike the pretenders who cancelled all of their 2020 tournaments once COVID became a thing, left their anglers and sponsors, and host cities out to dry, and then instituted entry fees into a no-entry-fee league due to the “down turn in their economy”... the only question now is, will MLF be knocked out before the end of the 2021 season, or will it just fold at the end due to a unanimous decision that they sucked and never have had a marketable value.


Fox didn't realize shiat, BASS is hustling like hell because of MLF, its all reactionary BASS sat on their hands all those years when they were top dog over FLW, now look. Competition is good.



Didn't you predict BASS was dead though 2 years ago when the split happened?
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 12:39 AM

Originally Posted by Mark Perry
Originally Posted by Lone_Wolf
Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by SC-001
Oh lord Big O and and Dubee still going at it? Both organizations are going to be around for a long time, if it gets so bad one goes for bankruptcy the other one won't be far behind it, until the Fox deal BASS was probably it worse shape than most realize, BTW MLF is on CBS right now.

That’s laughable. They’ve been the standard bearer for over 50 years now. Just about anyone who is anyone notable in tournament bass fishing became who they are due to their association with the BASS brand and platform. They still retain over 500k in memberships, and despite the COVID was able to execute and deliver all of their tournaments for 2020 to their fans, sponsors, and anglers. I think Fox Sports was able to recognize that and it was a no brainier to them to seize the opportunity when the availability of a BASS partnership became open. No endemic sponsor will want to be left on the outside looking in from that kind of exposure, so even the ones who can’t afford the costly BASS and Fox splash, will still jump on board with the anglers. The non-endemic will come on board naturally because of Fox sports and the cross promoting with other interests they do. There is probably never a better time to be an angler fishing under the BASS brand.
Unlike the pretenders who cancelled all of their 2020 tournaments once COVID became a thing, left their anglers and sponsors, and host cities out to dry, and then instituted entry fees into a no-entry-fee league due to the “down turn in their economy”... the only question now is, will MLF be knocked out before the end of the 2021 season, or will it just fold at the end due to a unanimous decision that they sucked and never have had a marketable value.

Fox didn't realize shiat, BASS is hustling like hell because of MLF, its all reactionary BASS sat on their hands all those years when they were top dog over FLW, now look. Competition is good.

Didn't you predict BASS was dead though 2 years ago when the split happened?


A lot of these guys did, and that’s now why they realize they picked the wrong horse in the race and are disgruntled about it and are lashing out in defense. They were cheering on the defecting anglers and not realizing that they were cutting their own throats. They demonized BASS, etc... and terribly miscalculated that MLF was also going to be able to be the same type of pedestal that BASS was to elevate all those guys.... they now are starting to realize how wrong they were. They also didn’t realize the leadership egos saying we’re the “best anglers in the world” wasn’t understanding it’s not an individual thing, but has been a collective thing tied to a long storied brand, that brand being BASS. Big Stage, and big fish!

MLF and the egos in its leadership brought to the other industry players a bag of garbage, yet demanded they be paid more. They terribly underestimated the industries sponsors and fan reactions and were under the misguided impression they had the golden pedestal to keep these guys elevated. How wrong they were. Kevin Vandam was not and is not the same Kevin Vandam without BASS, none of those guys are, yet their egos have kept them in denial. Now look at them... they are stuck, they are literally stuck in a career ending league again paying entry fees and losing quality sponsors in droves. Those that were just misguided followers now have to requalify... a consequence for being a lemming. BASS isn’t hustling and chasing Fox Sports, it was a natural fit and they found each other once BASS was available. The saddest thing in all of this is, FLW was destroyed in the process... the MLF water boys will say they were bankrupt and were going to fail anyhow, but there is no evidence of that... but that is now surely the prognosis.
Posted By: grandbassslayer

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 12:51 AM

There is no horse, its not a race, just enjoy the fishing. There is plenty of room for both, no either-or proposition.
Posted By: grandbassslayer

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 12:53 AM

Originally Posted by RANDYSGLIDE
After reading all of this i started watching Mlf even more and I enjoy it just like I do BASS

Cmon, can't be, you have to hate one or the other according to some... roflmao
Posted By: BigDozer66

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 01:33 AM

Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
Originally Posted by RANDYSGLIDE
After reading all of this i started watching Mlf even more and I enjoy it just like I do BASS

Cmon, can't be, you have to hate one or the other according to some... roflmao

cheers
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 01:43 AM

Current list pf MLF sponsors
Bass Pro Shops
General Tire
Toyota
Lucas
Berkley
Ferguson
B&W
Wiley
Phoenix
Squincher
Yeti
Kubota
Mercury
Abu Garcia
Academy
Sig Sauer
Federal
Lowrance
Nitro
Power Pole
True timber
Huk
Covercraft
Sonic
Bass Cat
Strike King
Mossy Oak
Rapala
Favorite
Optima
NGK
Frogg Toggs
TH Marine
Startron
Mustad
Garmin
Barbasol
Daiwa
St Croix
Plano
Knighten Ind.
Onyx
Duckett Fishing
Lithium Pros
Red Devil
Zoom
Yo Zuri
Lews
Brecknell
Gator Guards
Crockett Creek
Genesis
Bully Dog
Power Stop
Fulton
Black Rifle Coffee
Champion Power Equipment
Grundens

But big o keeps trying to tell everyone the have lost sponsors in droves. Lmao
Posted By: 9094

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 01:49 AM

I think I’m going to get one of my companies to buy ads when Big O runs a thread. They last a long time!
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 02:00 PM

Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
There is no horse, its not a race, just enjoy the fishing. There is plenty of room for both, no either-or proposition.


The industry overall is too small to have bad and untrustworthy actors in it. The sponsors and fans are capable of identifying and expelling those who they deem being just that, and what you’re seeing with MLF and their services and products being rejected is the result.
Posted By: Dan21XRS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 02:52 PM

Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
There is no horse, its not a race, just enjoy the fishing. There is plenty of room for both, no either-or proposition.


You missed it, the race is over... MLFLW/ BPsT/ Humongous 5 lost and have been sent to the glue factory... BASS is out roaming the pastures and studding in the evening... Life's good when you're the winner... Dan cheers coolio
Posted By: grandbassslayer

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 02:53 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
There is no horse, its not a race, just enjoy the fishing. There is plenty of room for both, no either-or proposition.


The industry overall is too small to have bad and untrustworthy actors in it. The sponsors and fans are capable of identifying and expelling those who they deem being just that, and what you’re seeing with MLF and their services and products being rejected is the result.

If the sponsors and fans are capable then why are you so worried about it? Perhaps this struggle is between your ears?
Posted By: Dan21XRS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 02:57 PM

[/quote]If the sponsors and fans are capable then why are you so worried about it? Perhaps this struggle is between your ears?[/quote]

Someone has to write the postmortem... Just like they'll be article for the next few days about how and why the Packers and Bills got slapped around... Just the mature of the beast... Dan
de
Posted By: grandbassslayer

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 03:00 PM

Originally Posted by Dan21XRS
If the sponsors and fans are capable then why are you so worried about it? Perhaps this struggle is between your ears?[/quote]

Someone has to write the postmortem... Just like they'll be article for the next few days about how and why the Packers and Bills got slapped around... Just the mature of the beast... Dan
de[/quote]
cheers Good to hear from you Dan!
Posted By: Dan21XRS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 05:35 PM

cheers... Dan
Posted By: Duck_Hunter

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 05:53 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
There is no horse, its not a race, just enjoy the fishing. There is plenty of room for both, no either-or proposition.


The industry overall is too small to have bad and untrustworthy actors in it. The sponsors and fans are capable of identifying and expelling those who they deem being just that, and what you’re seeing with MLF and their services and products being rejected is the result.


What products and services have been rejected, and by whom?
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 06:01 PM

Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
There is no horse, its not a race, just enjoy the fishing. There is plenty of room for both, no either-or proposition.


The industry overall is too small to have bad and untrustworthy actors in it. The sponsors and fans are capable of identifying and expelling those who they deem being just that, and what you’re seeing with MLF and their services and products being rejected is the result.


What products and services have been rejected, and by whom?

You know you won't get a legitimate answer
Posted By: grout-scout

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 07:09 PM

You fellas sure are persistent. You have to give Big O’ one thing, wether you like him or not. He generates responses, lol.
Posted By: Used2fish

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 07:39 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
There is no horse, its not a race, just enjoy the fishing. There is plenty of room for both, no either-or proposition.


The industry overall is too small to have bad and untrustworthy actors in it. The sponsors and fans are capable of identifying and expelling those who they deem being just that, and what you’re seeing with MLF and their services and products being rejected is the result.



If that is the case big o nobody needs you on a soap box.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 09:28 PM

Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
There is no horse, its not a race, just enjoy the fishing. There is plenty of room for both, no either-or proposition.


The industry overall is too small to have bad and untrustworthy actors in it. The sponsors and fans are capable of identifying and expelling those who they deem being just that, and what you’re seeing with MLF and their services and products being rejected is the result.


What products and services have been rejected, and by whom?


It’s almost like some people purposefully overlook the obvious.

Your answer: What ever it is they are selling to bring in revenue, by those who were buying it.

That’s evidenced by the anglers that were swayed to leave their established and stable circuits by those reciting the MLF sales pitch, are now paying entry fees and are worse off because of it.
Posted By: BigDozer66

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 09:33 PM

Originally Posted by Dubee
Current list pf MLF sponsors
Bass Pro Shops
General Tire
Toyota
Lucas
Berkley
Ferguson
B&W
Wiley
Phoenix
Squincher
Yeti
Kubota
Mercury
Abu Garcia
Academy
Sig Sauer
Federal
Lowrance
Nitro
Power Pole
True timber
Huk
Covercraft
Sonic
Bass Cat
Strike King
Mossy Oak
Rapala
Favorite
Optima
NGK
Frogg Toggs
TH Marine
Startron
Mustad
Garmin
Barbasol
Daiwa
St Croix
Plano
Knighten Ind.
Onyx
Duckett Fishing
Lithium Pros
Red Devil
Zoom
Yo Zuri
Lews
Brecknell
Gator Guards
Crockett Creek
Genesis
Bully Dog
Power Stop
Fulton
Black Rifle Coffee
Champion Power Equipment
Grundens

But big o keeps trying to tell everyone the have lost sponsors in droves. Lmao


He probably meant "Real" sponsors not these "lightweights" listed! peep
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 09:59 PM

Originally Posted by BigDozer66
Originally Posted by Dubee
Current list pf MLF sponsors
Bass Pro Shops
General Tire
Toyota
Lucas
Berkley
Ferguson
B&W
Wiley
Phoenix
Squincher
Yeti
Kubota
Mercury
Abu Garcia
Academy
Sig Sauer
Federal
Lowrance
Nitro
Power Pole
True timber
Huk
Covercraft
Sonic
Bass Cat
Strike King
Mossy Oak
Rapala
Favorite
Optima
NGK
Frogg Toggs
TH Marine
Startron
Mustad
Garmin
Barbasol
Daiwa
St Croix
Plano
Knighten Ind.
Onyx
Duckett Fishing
Lithium Pros
Red Devil
Zoom
Yo Zuri
Lews
Brecknell
Gator Guards
Crockett Creek
Genesis
Bully Dog
Power Stop
Fulton
Black Rifle Coffee
Champion Power Equipment
Grundens

But big o keeps trying to tell everyone the have lost sponsors in droves. Lmao


He probably meant "Real" sponsors not these "lightweights" listed! peep


I wonder how many made it on that list just because they sent some swag to Boyd Duckett? It’s obvious, regardless of the number, there aren’t enough to pay the bills and the anglers too.
Posted By: grandbassslayer

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 10:06 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by BigDozer66
Originally Posted by Dubee
Current list pf MLF sponsors
Bass Pro Shops
General Tire
Toyota
Lucas
Berkley
Ferguson
B&W
Wiley
Phoenix
Squincher
Yeti
Kubota
Mercury
Abu Garcia
Academy
Sig Sauer
Federal
Lowrance
Nitro
Power Pole
True timber
Huk
Covercraft
Sonic
Bass Cat
Strike King
Mossy Oak
Rapala
Favorite
Optima
NGK
Frogg Toggs
TH Marine
Startron
Mustad
Garmin
Barbasol
Daiwa
St Croix
Plano
Knighten Ind.
Onyx
Duckett Fishing
Lithium Pros
Red Devil
Zoom
Yo Zuri
Lews
Brecknell
Gator Guards
Crockett Creek
Genesis
Bully Dog
Power Stop
Fulton
Black Rifle Coffee
Champion Power Equipment
Grundens

But big o keeps trying to tell everyone the have lost sponsors in droves. Lmao


He probably meant "Real" sponsors not these "lightweights" listed! peep


I wonder how many made it on that list just because they sent some swag to Boyd Duckett? It’s obvious, regardless of the number, there aren’t enough to pay the bills and the anglers too.

And it affects you how? Your obsession is borderline...., the wild conspiracies with no factual evidence, I find it funny that Boyd occupies that much free rent in your brain. Let it go, for your own health...
Posted By: SC-001

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 10:10 PM

listen close and you can hear Big O's head explode
https://ispot.tv/a/AmUk
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 10:14 PM

Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by BigDozer66


But big o keeps trying to tell everyone the have lost sponsors in droves. Lmao


He probably meant "Real" sponsors not these "lightweights" listed! peep


I wonder how many made it on that list just because they sent some swag to Boyd Duckett? It’s obvious, regardless of the number, there aren’t enough to pay the bills and the anglers too.

And it affects you how? Your obsession is borderline...., the wild conspiracies with no factual evidence, I find it funny that Boyd occupies that much free rent in your brain. Let it go, for your own health...[/quote]

[Linked Image]
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 10:24 PM

Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by BigDozer66
Originally Posted by Dubee
Current list pf MLF sponsors
Bass Pro Shops
General Tire
Toyota
Lucas
Berkley
Ferguson
B&W
Wiley
Phoenix
Squincher
Yeti
Kubota
Mercury
Abu Garcia
Academy
Sig Sauer
Federal
Lowrance
Nitro
Power Pole
True timber
Huk
Covercraft
Sonic
Bass Cat
Strike King
Mossy Oak
Rapala
Favorite
Optima
NGK
Frogg Toggs
TH Marine
Startron
Mustad
Garmin
Barbasol
Daiwa
St Croix
Plano
Knighten Ind.
Onyx
Duckett Fishing
Lithium Pros
Red Devil
Zoom
Yo Zuri
Lews
Brecknell
Gator Guards
Crockett Creek
Genesis
Bully Dog
Power Stop
Fulton
Black Rifle Coffee
Champion Power Equipment
Grundens

But big o keeps trying to tell everyone the have lost sponsors in droves. Lmao


He probably meant "Real" sponsors not these "lightweights" listed! peep


I wonder how many made it on that list just because they sent some swag to Boyd Duckett? It’s obvious, regardless of the number, there aren’t enough to pay the bills and the anglers too.

And it affects you how? Your obsession is borderline...., the wild conspiracies with no factual evidence, I find it funny that Boyd occupies that much free rent in your brain. Let it go, for your own health...


He should be a fiction writer. Or maybe comedy because he makes laugh with the stuff he comes up
Posted By: Mudman63

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 10:26 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
The industry overall is too small to have bad and untrustworthy actors in it. The sponsors and fans are capable of identifying and expelling those who they deem being just that, and what you’re seeing with MLF and their services and products being rejected is the result.


Which is probably why you aren’t part of it and the root cause of your bitterness. And the fact that you’re also probably a lousy fisherman.
Posted By: SAKS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 11:06 PM

Damn. All ya’ll still here? Did anyone go to sleep last night or was this like an all night poker party? 18 pages. Does anyone think TFF will monetize like the social media networks do one day? If you come up with a topic and you can get Big O and his adversaries to get going you could make a killing. I would play devils advocate all day. I would hope they would pay by the word because O posts some novels on here.
Posted By: emorydog

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 11:42 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida


The industry overall is too small to have bad and untrustworthy actors in it. The sponsors and fans are capable of identifying and expelling those who they deem being just that, and what you’re seeing with MLF and their services and products being rejected is the result.


Since you present yourself as an ambassador for BASS, I deem you an untrustworthy actor and worthy of expulsion. In addition I will provide contact info to combat this constant negativity towards an industry competitor that is only driving business towards the fishing industry and its continued prosperity for its sales, service, broadcast and end users.

To cancel your BASS subscription/ membership or get a refund please contact customer service at Bassmaster@emailcustomerservice.com or call 1-877-227-7872.

If they ask tell them their fanboy big O from the TFF sent you.

Your welcome.
Posted By: Lone_Wolf

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/25/21 11:59 PM

I did not re-up my membership when all the guys left and don't plan to until they have an elite series even close to where I live where I would like to marshall in that case, the magazine is thin and worthless now.
Posted By: grout-scout

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 01:14 AM

Interesting show on BTL today, every one thinks the sport is large now and apparently that is NOT the case. In 1991 35,000 new bassboats were sold, only 6,000 were sold last year. Only 12% of fisherman consider themselves bass anglers. ESPN lost millions on BASS when they bought them and attempted to promote them, I figure FOX and the BPT owner will do the same.
Posted By: Used2fish

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 01:33 AM

Originally Posted by grout-scout
Interesting show on BTL today, every one thinks the sport is large now and apparently that is NOT the case. In 1991 35,000 new bassboats were sold, only 6,000 were sold last year. Only 12% of fisherman consider themselves bass anglers. ESPN lost millions on BASS when they bought them and attempted to promote them, I figure FOX and the BPT owner will do the same.



I'm calling major bs in 35k vs 6k boats sold.
Posted By: grout-scout

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 01:34 AM

Originally Posted by Used2fish
Originally Posted by grout-scout
Interesting show on BTL today, every one thinks the sport is large now and apparently that is NOT the case. In 1991 35,000 new bassboats were sold, only 6,000 were sold last year. Only 12% of fisherman consider themselves bass anglers. ESPN lost millions on BASS when they bought them and attempted to promote them, I figure FOX and the BPT owner will do the same.



I'm calling major bs in 35k vs 6k boats sold.




Seems odd to me too, but this dude is the man in fishing that keeps all the records. A boat didn’t cost $75k either back then.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 01:38 AM

Originally Posted by grout-scout
Interesting show on BTL today, every one thinks the sport is large now and apparently that is NOT the case. In 1991 35,000 new bassboats were sold, only 6,000 were sold last year. Only 12% of fisherman consider themselves bass anglers. ESPN lost millions on BASS when they bought them and attempted to promote them, I figure FOX and the BPT owner will do the same.


That’s not surprising about ESPN, as BASS was just a tiny fraction of their portfolio and terribly managed, and ESPN itself was even smaller fraction of Disney’s portfolio. The amount of bass boats sold is not surprising either. They priced themselves out of market years ago and is perfect example of how the theory supply & “demand” drives prices higher is really false. High prices is driven higher by low demand because the entities building them want to maintain the same annual revenue regardless of volume of sales. Supply is adjusted lower according to demand.

I think the dynamic with Fox and BASS is different. BASS is a privately owned entity now, so profitability in this venture for both are measured differently. MLF is more like the BASS/ESPN situation of yesteryear... where the majority owner of MLF is also the owner of most of the TV networks its broadcast on.
Posted By: emorydog

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 01:42 AM

All great points.
Posted By: grandbassslayer

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 02:17 AM

Originally Posted by Lone_Wolf
I did not re-up my membership when all the guys left and don't plan to until they have an elite series even close to where I live where I would like to marshall in that case, the magazine is thin and worthless now.

So you never check out the website or keep up with it at all?
Posted By: grandbassslayer

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 02:19 AM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by grout-scout
Interesting show on BTL today, every one thinks the sport is large now and apparently that is NOT the case. In 1991 35,000 new bassboats were sold, only 6,000 were sold last year. Only 12% of fisherman consider themselves bass anglers. ESPN lost millions on BASS when they bought them and attempted to promote them, I figure FOX and the BPT owner will do the same.


That’s not surprising about ESPN, as BASS was just a tiny fraction of their portfolio and terribly managed, and ESPN itself was even smaller fraction of Disney’s portfolio. The amount of bass boats sold is not surprising either. They priced themselves out of market years ago and is perfect example of how the theory supply & “demand” drives prices higher is really false. High prices is driven higher by low demand because the entities building them want to maintain the same annual revenue regardless of volume of sales. Supply is adjusted lower according to demand.

I think the dynamic with Fox and BASS is different. BASS is a privately owned entity now, so profitability in this venture for both are measured differently. MLF is more like the BASS/ESPN situation of yesteryear... where the majority owner of MLF is also the owner of most of the TV networks its broadcast on.
You have the boat business model all figured out....
hammer
Posted By: grout-scout

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 02:56 AM

Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by grout-scout
Interesting show on BTL today, every one thinks the sport is large now and apparently that is NOT the case. In 1991 35,000 new bassboats were sold, only 6,000 were sold last year. Only 12% of fisherman consider themselves bass anglers. ESPN lost millions on BASS when they bought them and attempted to promote them, I figure FOX and the BPT owner will do the same.


That’s not surprising about ESPN, as BASS was just a tiny fraction of their portfolio and terribly managed, and ESPN itself was even smaller fraction of Disney’s portfolio. The amount of bass boats sold is not surprising either. They priced themselves out of market years ago and is perfect example of how the theory supply & “demand” drives prices higher is really false. High prices is driven higher by low demand because the entities building them want to maintain the same annual revenue regardless of volume of sales. Supply is adjusted lower according to demand.

I think the dynamic with Fox and BASS is different. BASS is a privately owned entity now, so profitability in this venture for both are measured differently. MLF is more like the BASS/ESPN situation of yesteryear... where the majority owner of MLF is also the owner of most of the TV networks its broadcast on.
You have the boat business model all figured out....
hammer


Well we know the prices are BS. A 21’ boat should not cost $30k more than a 18’ boat, but they get it.

Sorry to off topic the thread again. Back to your regular scheduled bickering. Lol
Posted By: grandbassslayer

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 03:40 AM

Originally Posted by grout-scout
Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by grout-scout
Interesting show on BTL today, every one thinks the sport is large now and apparently that is NOT the case. In 1991 35,000 new bassboats were sold, only 6,000 were sold last year. Only 12% of fisherman consider themselves bass anglers. ESPN lost millions on BASS when they bought them and attempted to promote them, I figure FOX and the BPT owner will do the same.


That’s not surprising about ESPN, as BASS was just a tiny fraction of their portfolio and terribly managed, and ESPN itself was even smaller fraction of Disney’s portfolio. The amount of bass boats sold is not surprising either. They priced themselves out of market years ago and is perfect example of how the theory supply & “demand” drives prices higher is really false. High prices is driven higher by low demand because the entities building them want to maintain the same annual revenue regardless of volume of sales. Supply is adjusted lower according to demand.

I think the dynamic with Fox and BASS is different. BASS is a privately owned entity now, so profitability in this venture for both are measured differently. MLF is more like the BASS/ESPN situation of yesteryear... where the majority owner of MLF is also the owner of most of the TV networks its broadcast on.
You have the boat business model all figured out....
hammer


Well we know the prices are BS. A 21’ boat should not cost $30k more than a 18’ boat, but they get it.

Sorry to off topic the thread again. Back to your regular scheduled bickering. Lol
Most business models have what they call "loss leaders", I suspect 18' boats are in that category.
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 01:53 PM

Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by grout-scout
Interesting show on BTL today, every one thinks the sport is large now and apparently that is NOT the case. In 1991 35,000 new bassboats were sold, only 6,000 were sold last year. Only 12% of fisherman consider themselves bass anglers. ESPN lost millions on BASS when they bought them and attempted to promote them, I figure FOX and the BPT owner will do the same.


That’s not surprising about ESPN, as BASS was just a tiny fraction of their portfolio and terribly managed, and ESPN itself was even smaller fraction of Disney’s portfolio. The amount of bass boats sold is not surprising either. They priced themselves out of market years ago and is perfect example of how the theory supply & “demand” drives prices higher is really false. High prices is driven higher by low demand because the entities building them want to maintain the same annual revenue regardless of volume of sales. Supply is adjusted lower according to demand.

I think the dynamic with Fox and BASS is different. BASS is a privately owned entity now, so profitability in this venture for both are measured differently. MLF is more like the BASS/ESPN situation of yesteryear... where the majority owner of MLF is also the owner of most of the TV networks its broadcast on.
You have the boat business model all figured out....
hammer


Nope, I sure don’t, but it’s not a business I would want to be in. There are single brand car lots that sell more units in a month than all brands of bass boats that get sold in a year... something is wrong with that business model, and it appears incessant greed and ego’s prevent the industry from pricing these things and it’s related components, more in line with actual costs to produce..
Posted By: Dan21XRS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 02:01 PM

Originally Posted by emorydog
To cancel your BASS subscription/ membership or get a refund please contact customer service at Bassmaster@emailcustomerservice.com or call 1-877-227-7872.

If they ask tell them their fanboy big O from the TFF sent you.

Your welcome.


I just re-upped my BASS Times subscription for 3 years... Dan
bannana2
Posted By: SC-001

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 02:48 PM

Originally Posted by Used2fish
Originally Posted by grout-scout
Interesting show on BTL today, every one thinks the sport is large now and apparently that is NOT the case. In 1991 35,000 new bassboats were sold, only 6,000 were sold last year. Only 12% of fisherman consider themselves bass anglers. ESPN lost millions on BASS when they bought them and attempted to promote them, I figure FOX and the BPT owner will do the same.



I'm calling major bs in 35k vs 6k boats sold.


Probably not including aluminum and multi species boats, just glass bass boats.
Posted By: Mark Perry

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 03:19 PM

Bassmaster says boat sales reached a 13 year high in 2020:

https://m.bassmaster.com/bass-life/us-boat-sales-reached-13-year-high-2020
Posted By: Duck_Hunter

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 03:38 PM

Originally Posted by Mark Perry
Bassmaster says boat sales reached a 13 year high in 2020:

https://m.bassmaster.com/bass-life/us-boat-sales-reached-13-year-high-2020


I believe it. There wasn’t anything else to do besides be outdoors for 10 months. The kayak situation was incredibly bleak if you tried to buy one last year.
Posted By: SC-001

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 03:49 PM

The woods and water were hammered this year, so many used it for their covidcation some of my relatives haunted the lake and deer lease. Curious what this year brings more of the same or less outdoor activity. No working money runs out at some point.
Posted By: Used2fish

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 04:15 PM

Originally Posted by SC-001
Originally Posted by Used2fish
Originally Posted by grout-scout
Interesting show on BTL today, every one thinks the sport is large now and apparently that is NOT the case. In 1991 35,000 new bassboats were sold, only 6,000 were sold last year. Only 12% of fisherman consider themselves bass anglers. ESPN lost millions on BASS when they bought them and attempted to promote them, I figure FOX and the BPT owner will do the same.



I'm calling major bs in 35k vs 6k boats sold.


Probably not including aluminum and multi species boats, just glass bass boats.



I still call BS.
Posted By: SAKS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 07:23 PM

Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by Mark Perry
Bassmaster says boat sales reached a 13 year high in 2020:

https://m.bassmaster.com/bass-life/us-boat-sales-reached-13-year-high-2020


I believe it. There wasn’t anything else to do besides be outdoors for 10 months. The kayak situation was incredibly bleak if you tried to buy one last year.

I am guessing that is all boats sales and not just one type? I didn't have time to read the link.
Posted By: SteezMacQueen

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 07:28 PM

Originally Posted by SAKS
Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by Mark Perry
Bassmaster says boat sales reached a 13 year high in 2020:

https://m.bassmaster.com/bass-life/us-boat-sales-reached-13-year-high-2020


I believe it. There wasn’t anything else to do besides be outdoors for 10 months. The kayak situation was incredibly bleak if you tried to buy one last year.

I am guessing that is all boats sales and not just one type? I didn't have time to read the link.

Surely it’s total boat sales. Non-specific.
Posted By: Mark Perry

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 07:30 PM

Originally Posted by SAKS
Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by Mark Perry
Bassmaster says boat sales reached a 13 year high in 2020:

https://m.bassmaster.com/bass-life/us-boat-sales-reached-13-year-high-2020


I believe it. There wasn’t anything else to do besides be outdoors for 10 months. The kayak situation was incredibly bleak if you tried to buy one last year.

I am guessing that is all boats sales and not just one type? I didn't have time to read the link.



Half of the 140,000 plus new boats sold in 2020 were fishing/pontoon boats
Posted By: J.P. Greeson

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 08:02 PM

Originally Posted by Mark Perry
Originally Posted by SAKS
Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by Mark Perry
Bassmaster says boat sales reached a 13 year high in 2020:

https://m.bassmaster.com/bass-life/us-boat-sales-reached-13-year-high-2020


I believe it. There wasn’t anything else to do besides be outdoors for 10 months. The kayak situation was incredibly bleak if you tried to buy one last year.

I am guessing that is all boats sales and not just one type? I didn't have time to read the link.



Half of the 140,000 plus new boats sold in 2020 were fishing/pontoon boats

Actually, more than 310,000 new powerboats were sold in 2020.

Sales of freshwater fishing boats and pontoons boats, often sought for their versatility and entry-level price points and accounting for 50 percent of new powerboats sold in 2020, are expected to be up 12 percent to 143,000 units.

https://www.nmma.org/statistics/article/23526
Posted By: BigDozer66

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 08:18 PM

Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
Originally Posted by grout-scout
Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
Originally Posted by Big O Florida

That’s not surprising about ESPN, as BASS was just a tiny fraction of their portfolio and terribly managed, and ESPN itself was even smaller fraction of Disney’s portfolio. The amount of bass boats sold is not surprising either. They priced themselves out of market years ago and is perfect example of how the theory supply & “demand” drives prices higher is really false. High prices is driven higher by low demand because the entities building them want to maintain the same annual revenue regardless of volume of sales. Supply is adjusted lower according to demand.

I think the dynamic with Fox and BASS is different. BASS is a privately owned entity now, so profitability in this venture for both are measured differently. MLF is more like the BASS/ESPN situation of yesteryear... where the majority owner of MLF is also the owner of most of the TV networks its broadcast on.
You have the boat business model all figured out....
hammer


Well we know the prices are BS. A 21’ boat should not cost $30k more than a 18’ boat, but they get it.

Sorry to off topic the thread again. Back to your regular scheduled bickering. Lol
Most business models have what they call "loss leaders", I suspect 18' boats are in that category.


The 18' boat is what sells mostly because most people don't want to spend $75K on one just like most 1/2T trucks sold are XLT/Silverado/Big Horns as those are the ones with the most incentives.

Some of the price difference on boats are the outboards themselves.

You can buy a 30K Mustang/Camaro/Challenger but if you want to put the ponies under the hood then you will pay more for them. bolt
Posted By: BigDozer66

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 08:20 PM

Originally Posted by J.P. Greeson
Originally Posted by Mark Perry
Originally Posted by SAKS
Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter


I believe it. There wasn’t anything else to do besides be outdoors for 10 months. The kayak situation was incredibly bleak if you tried to buy one last year.

I am guessing that is all boats sales and not just one type? I didn't have time to read the link.



Half of the 140,000 plus new boats sold in 2020 were fishing/pontoon boats

Actually, more than 310,000 new powerboats were sold in 2020.

Sales of freshwater fishing boats and pontoons boats, often sought for their versatility and entry-level price points and accounting for 50 percent of new powerboats sold in 2020, are expected to be up 12 percent to 143,000 units.

https://www.nmma.org/statistics/article/23526


cheers
Posted By: Lone_Wolf

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 08:23 PM

But dealerships mostly carry 20 foot boats because thats was sells, at least thats what I've heard over and over for 20 years. Like you can not find a 18 or 19 foot model unless you order it, but when they show up in the classifieds they seem to sell the fastest.
Posted By: Mark Perry

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/26/21 08:33 PM

I definitely misresd the link I posted. hammer
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/27/21 12:51 PM

Originally Posted by J.P. Greeson
Originally Posted by Mark Perry
Originally Posted by SAKS

I am guessing that is all boats sales and not just one type? I didn't have time to read the link.


Half of the 140,000 plus new boats sold in 2020 were fishing/pontoon boats

Actually, more than 310,000 new powerboats were sold in 2020.

Sales of freshwater fishing boats and pontoons boats, often sought for their versatility and entry-level price points and accounting for 50 percent of new powerboats sold in 2020, are expected to be up 12 percent to 143,000 units.

https://www.nmma.org/statistics/article/23526


See from 41:30 - 51:00 where this industry historian talks about sales and trends, particularly 2020. He claims only about “6000 fully outfitted bass boats” were sold in 2020.


Posted By: Used2fish

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/27/21 12:53 PM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by J.P. Greeson
Originally Posted by Mark Perry
Originally Posted by SAKS

I am guessing that is all boats sales and not just one type? I didn't have time to read the link.


Half of the 140,000 plus new boats sold in 2020 were fishing/pontoon boats

Actually, more than 310,000 new powerboats were sold in 2020.

Sales of freshwater fishing boats and pontoons boats, often sought for their versatility and entry-level price points and accounting for 50 percent of new powerboats sold in 2020, are expected to be up 12 percent to 143,000 units.

https://www.nmma.org/statistics/article/23526


See from 41:30 - 51:00 where this industry historian talks about sales and trends, particularly 2020. He claims only about “6000 fully outfitted bass boats” were sold in 2020.





I don't care what he said. It's BS.
Posted By: grout-scout

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/27/21 02:11 PM

Originally Posted by Used2fish



I don't care what he said. It's BS.


roflmao sure it is...let’s compare your credentials to his.
Posted By: Dan21XRS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/27/21 02:54 PM

Originally Posted by Used2fish
I don't care what he said. It's BS.


Gotta remember C-19 closed a lot of these manufactures for weeks on end, sometimes months, plus it's not like they could just ramp up production. A boat has to sit in the mold for X number of days... Supply chains were stressed along with a lot of other obstacles... 6000 seems about right... Heck, the dealer I bought from only has 6 new bass boats on his lot right now and he sells BCB, Phoenix, Bullet and Crestliner... Oh, and Mercury and Yamaha had trouble meeting demands in early 2020... So yeah, seems about right... Dan
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/27/21 02:54 PM

Originally Posted by grout-scout
Originally Posted by Used2fish



I don't care what he said. It's BS.


roflmao sure it is...let’s compare your credentials to his.


6000 is hard to believe. 6000÷ 300 days to account for Sunday's and holidays is 20 boats a day
20 boats a day ÷ 40 states to account for states that don't sell many bass boats is an average of half a boat sold a day per state
Posted By: Dan21XRS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/27/21 03:03 PM

Some pleasure boat manufactures have told their dealers they'll be getting the same number of boats that they ordered in 2020 because they can't ramp up production. So don't expect record smashing numbers this year either. Just as an example, last I heard Bullet has a 4 month waiting period and that doesn't count the prep time once it arrives at your dealership... These boats aren't built on an assembly line with robots... Dan
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/27/21 08:30 PM

Originally Posted by Dan21XRS
Some pleasure boat manufactures have told their dealers they'll be getting the same number of boats that they ordered in 2020 because they can't ramp up production. So don't expect record smashing numbers this year either. Just as an example, last I heard Bullet has a 4 month waiting period and that doesn't count the prep time once it arrives at your dealership... These boats aren't built on an assembly line with robots... Dan


That’s probably an over estimate and will result in a glut of inventory on show room floors. 2020 was an anomaly and not a trend. The people who had money to spend in 2020, did so to help them find solitary & remote things to do, like camping and fishing and purchasing the related peripherals to do so. e.g. campers, boats, tackle, gear, etc... By all authoritative accounts, 2021 will not be the same with much more people back at work, etc... (let’s hope so) and therefore less free time. Not to leave without mention, if someone didn’t have the money in 2020 to buy those things to get on board the outdoor lifestyle bandwagon, then it’s doubtful they will suddenly find it to spend in 2021... my guess is 2021 might be the year that some bargains on new or slightly used bass boats and other outdoor toys can be found.
Posted By: Dan21XRS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/27/21 10:23 PM

With the C-19 stimulus checks still being promised there's gonna be some discretionary funds available... Dan
Posted By: Darin S.

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/28/21 06:56 PM

I see that a couple of the BPT pro’s (Sprague,Klein) are fishing the Toyota series on Rayburn. So they can fish any MLF event they want but others must qualify to fish the BPT? Both of these quys were invites and didn’t have to qualify. I can understand allowing them to fish the TW pro series but not anything they want. What’s next the college series!

Also: any reports on today’s fishing? I don’t see anything on their website.
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/28/21 06:59 PM

Originally Posted by Darin S.
I see that a couple of the BPT pro’s (Sprague,Klein) are fishing the Toyota series on Rayburn. So they can fish any MLF event they want but others must qualify to fish the BPT? Both of these quys were invites and didn’t have to qualify. I can understand allowing them to fish the TW pro series but not anything they want. What’s next the college series!

Also: any reports on today’s fishing? I don’t see anything on their website.

Why in the world shouldn't they be allowed to. That makes no sense. FLW guys have always fished lowet trails. Even BFL's. Elite guys fish opens.
Posted By: Darin S.

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/28/21 07:05 PM

This is not the equivalent of Elites fishing Opens. This is like Elites fishing bass Nation events..I’m not going to throw a temper tantrum like others but it just doesn’t sit well with me.
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/28/21 07:13 PM

Originally Posted by Darin S.
This is not the equivalent of Elites fishing Opens. This is like Elites fishing bass Nation events..I’m not going to throw a temper tantrum like others but it just doesn’t sit well with me.


Ok, i just don't understand that mentality. Elite guys fish bfl tournaments. I'll just never get why someone would have a problem with it
Posted By: Dan21XRS

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/28/21 08:19 PM

While I don't care if they fish or not... I've had the pleasure to fish events where Elites have also, I can see where some might get their nose outa joint... Just like when local guides and sticks cherry pick certain tourneys... Dan
Posted By: BigDozer66

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/28/21 09:49 PM

Originally Posted by Dubee
Originally Posted by Darin S.
I see that a couple of the BPT pro’s (Sprague,Klein) are fishing the Toyota series on Rayburn. So they can fish any MLF event they want but others must qualify to fish the BPT? Both of these quys were invites and didn’t have to qualify. I can understand allowing them to fish the TW pro series but not anything they want. What’s next the college series!

Also: any reports on today’s fishing? I don’t see anything on their website.

Why in the world shouldn't they be allowed to. That makes no sense. FLW guys have always fished lowet trails. Even BFL's. Elite guys fish opens.

thumb
Posted By: Big O Florida

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/28/21 10:25 PM

Originally Posted by Darin S.
I see that a couple of the BPT pro’s (Sprague,Klein) are fishing the Toyota series on Rayburn. So they can fish any MLF event they want but others must qualify to fish the BPT? Both of these quys were invites and didn’t have to qualify. I can understand allowing them to fish the TW pro series but not anything they want. What’s next the college series!

Also: any reports on today’s fishing? I don’t see anything on their website.


They must find some way to supplements their income. They have to now pay those BPT entry fees on a reduced payout and sponsor support. They got to feed their family!
Posted By: rj74955

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/29/21 12:59 AM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Darin S.
I see that a couple of the BPT pro’s (Sprague,Klein) are fishing the Toyota series on Rayburn. So they can fish any MLF event they want but others must qualify to fish the BPT? Both of these quys were invites and didn’t have to qualify. I can understand allowing them to fish the TW pro series but not anything they want. What’s next the college series!

Also: any reports on today’s fishing? I don’t see anything on their website.


They must find some way to supplements their income. They have to now pay those BPT entry fees on a reduced payout and sponsor support. They got to feed their family!

I don't know which of the two posts is the most ridiculous but I'm going to assume that Big O is just joking on this one. We have Elite and MLF guys fish Friday night jackpots around here. It's what they do.
Posted By: Dubee

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/29/21 01:28 AM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Darin S.
I see that a couple of the BPT pro’s (Sprague,Klein) are fishing the Toyota series on Rayburn. So they can fish any MLF event they want but others must qualify to fish the BPT? Both of these quys were invites and didn’t have to qualify. I can understand allowing them to fish the TW pro series but not anything they want. What’s next the college series!

Also: any reports on today’s fishing? I don’t see anything on their website.


They must find some way to supplements their income. They have to now pay those BPT entry fees on a reduced payout and sponsor support. They got to feed their family!


I guess that's why Elite guys are fishing it also
Posted By: Darin S.

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/29/21 02:16 AM

All I’m saying is I’d like to see some separation between pros who spend 300 days a year on the water and have huge sponsorship deals and a semi pro who still has to work for a living and can only afford to fish a handful of these a year. Like a real feeder system.
Posted By: grandbassslayer

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/29/21 03:31 AM

Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Darin S.
I see that a couple of the BPT pro’s (Sprague,Klein) are fishing the Toyota series on Rayburn. So they can fish any MLF event they want but others must qualify to fish the BPT? Both of these quys were invites and didn’t have to qualify. I can understand allowing them to fish the TW pro series but not anything they want. What’s next the college series!

Also: any reports on today’s fishing? I don’t see anything on their website.


They must find some way to supplements their income. They have to now pay those BPT entry fees on a reduced payout and sponsor support. They got to feed their family!

Are you off your meds???? eeks
Posted By: Duck_Hunter

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/31/21 01:48 AM

Originally Posted by rj74955
Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Darin S.
I see that a couple of the BPT pro’s (Sprague,Klein) are fishing the Toyota series on Rayburn. So they can fish any MLF event they want but others must qualify to fish the BPT? Both of these quys were invites and didn’t have to qualify. I can understand allowing them to fish the TW pro series but not anything they want. What’s next the college series!

Also: any reports on today’s fishing? I don’t see anything on their website.


They must find some way to supplements their income. They have to now pay those BPT entry fees on a reduced payout and sponsor support. They got to feed their family!

I don't know which of the two posts is the most ridiculous but I'm going to assume that Big O is just joking on this one. We have Elite and MLF guys fish Friday night jackpots around here. It's what they do.


So they’re not supplementing their income with a $300 Friday night jackpot?
Posted By: rj74955

Re: MLF bottom 10 losing tour card - 01/31/21 03:59 AM

Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by rj74955
Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Darin S.
I see that a couple of the BPT pro’s (Sprague,Klein) are fishing the Toyota series on Rayburn. So they can fish any MLF event they want but others must qualify to fish the BPT? Both of these quys were invites and didn’t have to qualify. I can understand allowing them to fish the TW pro series but not anything they want. What’s next the college series!

Also: any reports on today’s fishing? I don’t see anything on their website.


They must find some way to supplements their income. They have to now pay those BPT entry fees on a reduced payout and sponsor support. They got to feed their family!

I don't know which of the two posts is the most ridiculous but I'm going to assume that Big O is just joking on this one. We have Elite and MLF guys fish Friday night jackpots around here. It's what they do.


So they’re not supplementing their income with a $300 Friday night jackpot?


roflmao They throw their money in the hat the same way everyone else does.
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