you read it here first...

three years from now,there is a good possibility that B.A.S.S. will no longer exist or at best be the 3rd ranked national tournament organization similar to what FLW has previously been.
look no further than the interest,excitement and viewership the current MLF tournament has generated with the current Eufaula tournament and it is obvious MLF has a winner...both in concept,name recognition of the pros and probably most important ,the hours this tournament will be shown on 5 national television networks and the exposure each pro,their sponsors and advertisers will receive...
hate on Boyd Duckett,Gary Klein and the 80 pros who believed in the concept all you want but it's pretty obvious that they "have built a better mousetrap"....

That's funny as hell right there ^^^^

that's what major league baseball owners thought back when they tried to replace their regular players during their strike with replacement players...didn't work out too well for them....

Where have I heard this kind of ranting before? LOL. Can't quite put my finger on it.

They thought kicking back eating popcorn was funny?

He's going to give you a 2 minute penalty.

There is something about the South-Eastern portion of the USA that has the professional bass fishing tournament organizations figured out, whereas the rest of us just have no clue.

BASS will always be number 1 .

Plugs and announcements section please.

Well I kind of agree,Bass will always be #1 with true anglers, MLF has learned how to actually make money with reality tv.

It’s going to be interesting to see what happens in two more years with the hands that signed the contract .

I wonder what Big O thinks. Hope he jumps in.

Why? Did they sign Colin Kaepernick?

Lmao wow. That won't ever happen.

Did big O change his name?

Was that an advertisement for the XFL? Next thing you’ll hear is their championship will be bigger and better than the Super Bowl too?

Hey Beartrap, what is your son’s name? It’s obvious that he is one of the bpt anglers.

move to plugs and announcements please

And we're off!

I don't have any connection with MLF whatsoever...... I hope both tours succeed however and
it's just my opinion that MLF has come up with a great opportunity for good fishermen to make a living tournament fishing by increasing the revenue by obtaining a huge increase in television exposure which will ultimately greatly increase revenue. ….fishermen have pretty much been fishing for their own entry fees for past 40 years and the greatly increased television exposure is going to create revenue that was never before available....

anybody watching MLF today and few minutes ago saw Wheeler catch 20 lbs in 17 minutes..came from 10 lbs down to 10 lbs in the lead....now he is 21 lbs in the lead...pretty exciting to watch.....

So MLF pros are the only ones who can catch schooling bass? Or is it just that they are the only ones able to count every one they catch?

I fished an MLF-style tournament a couple of years ago. Almost as soon as we got on the water one guy was putting a fish on the board every 1-2 minutes. He obviously pulled up on a school. Were we supposed to be awestruck that he was able to throw out a rattletrap or Zara Spook and catch them? My wife can do that.

But when you film it and put it on TV 4-5 times at the 4am in the morning time slot, it’s sponsorship gold! They’ve built a better system that doesn’t involve angler fans or customers of endemic sponsors. The only thing required is shyster level marketing people who know how to sell and serve sh!t sandwiches to clueless executives at these companies buying advertising space and time. They’ve even been convinced their ROI is better when there are no fans of the sport attending events. Just frogs and birds singing at the boat docks is all that’s required!

Here is the kicker, the anglers don’t get any royalties for the TV airtime no matter how many times they rerun it.

Do BASS anglers get royalties from TV?

You’re just making up anything possible, no matter how nonsensical it is.

Considering TV is the MLF primary revenue model, so it’s not nonsensical. Are the TV eyeballs being gleaned because of the commercials put forth by the sponsors, or are they attracted to what the anglers do? MLF should be giving the anglers a cut into the TV revenue since it’s them producing the product being sold. They might have been able to negotiate that had they not sold out their bargaining power to KSE, essentially making them in no better of a position than they were in with BASS - who was the winner in that? KSE

Bass puts on live events, that includes putting on a road show production that attracts an attendance... different marketing model for that group.

Then why weren't you catching them while he was. I mean even your wife can

Did you see the sponsorshio news today

I thought that was the whole point of wanting to reach the big TV crowds, for anglers to receive money from the advertising. If it’s not, then what’s the money going to go too? The organization or the winnings of each tournament?

not sure what agreements are in place with TV royalties however keep in mind that each MLF TV show provides 1-2 hours of television exposure and during that time numerous anglers and their sponsor patches and equipment is shown close up on television....in addition,MLF allows a lot of time and freedom for anglers to discuss what equipment and lures they are using....it's a huge improvement in an anglers ability to sell himself to sponsors as opposed to the TV exposure they previously got...

Grout, i'm sure a huge chunck of it goes to the tournament prize money. Remember they are paying entry fees.

“...in no better position than they were in BASS...”

How do you quantify that? It’s a worse position (or I guess left room with that statement to be an equal position) because they didn’t negotiate TV royalties? Then BASS Anglers are getting screwed, too, if they’re not getting royalties.

Thank you for admitting that it’s a completely differed model for each tour. For the last few weeks, it’s seemed like you’re not understanding that.

It’s been one week of each tour. Which tour was impacted more significantly? BASS, which had a shortened week and went to Monday due to weather, which impacted attendance, including your prized road show, or an event that’s far more nimble because it doesn’t rely on that road show production that is impacted by weather?

Let’s say 10,000 people lived streamed MLF this week (no idea if that’s low or high) and another 10,000 watch it when it airs on TV. Would 20,000 people attend a non-classic event for BASS held in February?

As explained in other posts in this topic, brands will adapt to reach the audience. Attendance is down for nearly all live sporting events because consumerism has changed. Brands have adapted. Social media presence matters more. TV/internet access matters much more. Having an expo (which, by the way, expos are suffering in many, if not all industries) as your primary revenue source, or even a big chunk of it, is going to continue to be a challenge.

But most of all, they’re two different tours with two different models. And if MLF or it’s sponsors, or the angler’s sponsors don’t adapt and capitalize, it will die. But it’s not dying because they’re isn’t an expo or a weigh in at the end of the day.

If it is so easy as some suggest it is then everyone of the pros would be catching tons of fish.

It just doesn't happen on any of the Big 3 tours nor on any of the other lesser tourney's.

Yep, that is one of the dumbest arguments i see against MLF/BPT

Look at the history and purported reasons why MLF was created in the first place and the excuse used for why they say all those anglers left BASS for the BPT; (ignoring the smoke and mirrors) then you will see the context in which I quantify that. If they wanted to have control over the revenue sharing and other decisions, then why did they sell 50% of MLF to an other entity which by default makes the majority of anglers no better off than where they were at with BASS, where they also had little to no say in things? The angler owner (12) has a small fraction of ownership rights, KSE is 50% and the remaining belongs to Duckett and his few merry men, which is significantly more of a % than the anglers.

I never said I didn’t understand they had different models, thats obvious; what I am saying is the MLF one is going to prove out to be a failed business model, and It couldn’t happen to a more deserving group.

I think you are going to single handedly convert BASS fans to BPT

Please mods move this off of the bass fishing section! It's getting old fast.

Bound to be a hunk of it. They got off to a great start, that is for sure, thread after thread about the first tournament.

I did some reading about KSE and Kroenke’s association with MLF. He is not running the business, and the anglers do decide on the rules. Kroenke is involved in so many things, it would be impossible to run the day-to-day of MLF, in addition to everything else he owns and is involved in.

Duckett said this, back in 2018:



https://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com...s-and-Governing-Bodies/Bass-Fishing.aspx

KSE got involved because they needed funding (as every startup does, especially one trying to expand), and KSE owns outdoor properties.

Stan Kroenke doesn’t run all of his properties. He isn’t going to care if the anglers decide to change the minimum weight on a scorable fish.

Your animosity isn’t factual, it’s hopeful. You hope MLF fails and you’re making mountains out of molehills or completely misrepresenting aspects of the tour.

I’ll say it again: it may very well fail, but you’re blowing this stuff out of proportion.

I heart MLF.

Serious, I'm a fan now thanks to Big-O.

I dig seeing fish caught and hearing how these guys go about figuring it out. Wall to wall coverage streaming with some sharp commentators, and anglers I know? It's a win.

Home run!

Not saying I support Big O in all that I read but he did lead me to take a step back and really think about the changes that have taken place. At the start I was 50/50 but the more research I do and the more I read and see take place leads me right back the the organization I’ve been watching and supporting for many years. I was also a huge FLW fan.

So I guess it’s not all one way as some of us fans who once like all circuits are now committed to BASS. It really sucks that a lot of guys I grew up admiring now fish a circuit I can’t bring myself to enjoy past the first year I watched it. I wish all MLF prod the best as individual fisherman but some of us will be loyal to BASS as long as they do not chance the aspects of fishing that we grew to love. And for that I fully disagree that BASS will ever go away during my lifetime.

I have never seen a dead horse continually beaten as many times as this whole BASS/ MLF debate. It is like politics, the people are so extreme one way or the other they miss the entire big picture.

what is the big picture?

You either A: Like one. B: Like the other. C: Like both or D: like neither. What’s debatable?

I might like BASS too. Have not watched since I was a kid. Like Bob Cobb on TNN days or at 4am on ESPN.

Where can I see them now? I had never seen MLF till I read about all the hype here then fouz posted a link to the live stream and it was great!

I will watch BASS as well if I get the time and give my full review on that one... been years since I have seen it.

I enjoy these threads and like reading through them. I don't think they should be moved to plugs and announcements because we're discussing bass fishing on a bass fishing forum. I'm a recreational fisherman and like to catch fish while I'm on the water. I'm not going out throwing a big swimbait all day looking for a big fish. I'll throw whatever I'm getting the most bites on. If a big one eats it, great. If not, great. As long as I have some action I'm happy.

I don't understand the logic behind disliking a tournament because it doesn't weigh the best five fish. What makes catching the most weight worse than catching the best 5? Both formats require a lot of skill with some luck thrown in to win. Yesterday, Wheeler found a school of fish that were setup right at the time he pulled up. That is not easy to do. If it was easy, the rest of them would pull up on their located school and keep up.

Lots of points I could make here, but I don't have any interest in convincing others that my favorite tournament format is superior to their favorite tournament format.

Make no mistake, this is not constructive discussion. This is a pissing match between overly sensitive grown men that will continue into perpetuity. But your last line is spot on no matter what side of the line you are on.

What 5 networks is it on? I haven't seen but reruns on discovery

These MLF vs BASS are like the smell of stepping in a pile of wet dog s—t....IT JUST WONT GO AWAY!!!

The first event was just held this week. The TV show won’t be on for a while, I imagine. Here is the TV information.

https://majorleaguefishing.com/tv-schedule/

I don't really have any skin in this game. I watch whatever I have time to watch. Getting tired of all of it, anyway. Can only take so much Zona and his ilk.

But I can tell you how it's going to go down. Not sure who will win, but I understand the game.

It's the money, moron. Nothing else matters.

If Strike King/Lews, or Ranger, or BPS, or whomever is funding this game, decide that there is more money in having KVD and their other anglers fish B.A.S.S., they'll be there. Change the names, and if FLW or BPT or whatever it is, brings the money, that's where they will go.

Once (if) the BPT sponsors pull out, it's all over. I like Duckett. Seems like a real good guy, but a damn good business man. I can't believe he sold this scam to some high level sponsors to start with. I wish him well.

Don't get high and mighty on me about the anglers. They'll go where the money is. A few that already have money, may make their decisions for other reasons, but the non-KVD's have to chase the money.

I will post one personal rant about all of them. Once television gets involved it all goes to hell.

I've caught a lot of schooling bass. When I used to fish Lake Nacogdoches and Pinkston, for instance, there were huge schools almost every day. You could catch 1-2 pound fish on just about every cast when they were up. Of course if I was fishing a tournament back then I would have left those fish alone and gone for something a little bigger...unless, of course it was an MLF style tournament and I got to count 40 or 50 of them.

It would have all been a matter of happening to be there when they surfaced.

By the way, I put on a Baby 1 Minus or trap for my wife back then and she did catch the heck out of them. She just better not hear me refer to it as an idiot bait.

Also, if you are going to take away the pro to fan interaction (like mlf has), you better be giving your anglers a cut of the TV revenue. If there is any.

Did the anglers ask for TV revenue share? Does taking away the fan interaction (they have fan interaction, by the way; there was a schedule for attendees on the webpage for this week’s event; fans could show up everyday, there were several options to mingle with the pros) lower the angler’s income? Does no entry fee makeup for the lost income by no fan interaction?

Serious questions, by the way.

Professional athletes (let’s use golf as an example, since it’s the closest thing to pro fishing) have the ability to market themselves. Fan interaction is a small part of that (and getting smaller). With social media, it’s so much easier to do that than it was even a decade ago. Livestream podcasts, Facebook, Twitter, YouTube, etc are all there for the taking. No-name people are making millions of dollars a year on Instagram and YouTube.

And MLF’s primary revenue model is TV. The anglers are fishing for purses. If the TV portion is successful, that should drive up the purses. Do golfers get TV rev-share? No. Do NBA players? No. The PGA gets TV money. The NBA owners get TV money. Again, they’re not paying entry fees.

out of curiousity, I looked up the purse for the U.S.Open golf tournament which is paid out by the P.G.A. (professional golf association which is the players)...1st place 2.2 million,10th place $288,000.,20th place $172,000. last place $21,000.
As near as I can determine, these funds are from TV revenue plus any revenue from expo space,vendor income and revenue from the venue.(city where tournament was held)…
obviously MLF has nowhere near the viewership that golf does but the sport is growing as evidenced by the huge increase in high school and college participation. The important point is that MLF fishermen instead of paying entry fees and fishing for their own money are now going to share TV,venue and whatever other income they produce among themselves just like the P.G.A. does...

somebody accused me of being prejudiced like Big O but trust me,I'm neutral and have no connection to either B.A.S.S. of MLF..I just think MLF has come up with a "better mousetrap"....(actually I do have a good friend who is a well known elite fisherman and I hope for his sake that B.A.S.S.stays viable)

Yes, and if MLF keeps growing, it should increase the prize money. But PGA golfers don’t get a cut of TV revenue simply for teeing it up each week.

All of those you cite make a hellava lot more money than a pro fisherman on a tour. As a matter of fact, the reason they do make so much money is because they understand how much revenue tour organizations are making on TV and demanded salaries or purses that properly coincide with ownership revenue. A flipping caddy for a decent PGA pro puts the income of a pro fisherman to shame. If MLF is going to be a made for TV production more than anything, the anglers should be getting a significant portion of that revenue generated by TV.

Just Incase you didn’t see my other one, Happy Valentines Big O!! ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️

You missed the entire point. Also, the amount of money made is not the point.

Answer the questions, though:

Did the anglers ask for a cut of the TV revenue?
Does not have “fan interaction” at tournaments take money away from the anglers? (For the record, there are ways to interact with anglers at MLF events, as I’ve said multiple times.)
Without entry fees, does that make up for the money you claim is lost by “not having any fan interaction?”

(The purses are paid by the title sponsor of the tournament on the PGA. Major tournaments are different. But for the majority of regular tour stops, if you don’t make the cut, you don’t get a check. It’s that simple. TV rev share is not a part of the equation.)

* I have no idea what they’ve asked for. MLF fosters a culture of fear and secrecy, so it’s doubtful you’ll have anyone speak out about terms of contracts, etc... perhaps due to NDA’s - but going back to the formation of MLF and particularly the BPT, it was purportedly all about being better for the anglers and them getting better share of the revenue pie.

* I would say it does by way of sponsorship opportunities. The less they are in front and interacting with fans, the less sponsors are being promoted by the individual anglers. How that translates into less money per se would be hard to calculate without knowing terms of Individual sponsors agreements. As it relates to your additional comment, the fans aren’t coming to them at their tournament events themselves, what makes you think they are showing up at some VFW meet and greet in the town they’re fishing in? The only ones who are showing up to those are the regulars who would be there regardless. Why, cause no one knows who MLF is and doesn’t care... tournaments under a many names visit those lakes on a regular basis.. unless it’s the most widely known tour for pros names BASS, it’s just another tournament to most of the locals with nothing to do.

*Without entry fees? Just what amount would the entry fees be? See what I said above about why there really isn’t any fan interaction for the MLF anglers.

PGA tournament winners often get north of $1 million in winnings, apples and oranges in comparison.

1) So why keep saying they better get a piece of the TV revenue, if you don’t know whether they asked for it. If they haven’t asked for it, and they’re happy with their situation, then it’s not an issue, but you keep saying it is without evidence.

2) I know you would say it would impact sponsorship relationships, but you haven’t shown that, and I’ve shown you how it might not impact sponsorships. You just keep repeating yourself without backing it up with data. By being on TV and having a camera in their boat during the live stream, with fewer anglers and a more competitive format in real time (because they weigh all the fish immediately and know what everyone has) they do get more face time. And, as has been explained, being on TV or livestream more, reaches more people who can’t or won’t attend in person than have a weigh in ever will. They get more time in front of more people five feet away from the camera than they would with a weigh in.

3) You’re overestimating the value of interacting with fans in person. That’s just a fact. If they don’t have to pay entry fees, they save money. Agree? That means there is a tradeoff in money saved vs whatever they would “make” in interacting with fans. What does a BASS guy earn just because they have a weigh in and people there. How does that compare to a made-for-TV version of bass fishing? Quantify it, if you can. You haven’t yet, but I think you should. If they’re not paying entry fees, then subtract that from what the BASS guys make via the sacred time spent with fans. Then add what the TV and other opportunities make up. Every other sports league in the world does just fine with social media, endorsements, etc. It’s the way of the future and it’s the way of now. Bass fishing will be more profitable under the same model. You’re on social media right now. Instagram, YouTube and Twitter are moving the pro athletes forward. It will happen with fishing. That’s why Andrew Upshaw has a YouTube channel and posts it here. That’s why IKE has a YouTube channel/podcast. MLF will open the same avenues up for these guys, if they don’t already use them. It’s a little more work with a lot more upside. Again, people you’ve never heard of are making millions on Instagram putting on makeup for a living. Hot chicks in bikinis are making a living off Instagram fishing with their boyfriends in the Keys. Bass fisherman have a head start when you’re on TV and live stream for a captive audience. That’s how the world works now. It’s not being towed across a stage to hold up 12 pounds of bass in front of 200 people. It’s marketing yourself.

4) PGA tournament players are the closest thing to bass fishing. The amount of money is irrelevant. Like I said before, you didn't get the point.

Ill bet anyone a crisp clean hundy on the op.

That he is right or that he is delusional?

Delusional

Ok, I agree and I won’t take that bet.

More likely to be the reverse. BASS isn’t going anywhere unless it’s brought and shut down.

If an athlete in other types of professional sports makes revenue off of social media, endorsements, etc..., that’s in leu of their salary which is much much higher than what earnings are for pro fisherman. The reason other professional sports figures are paid so much money is because they’re being compensated for the amount of revenue brought in to the team owners by TV and other merchandise. Sporting leagues have gone on strike in years past because greedy owners didn’t want to pay accordingly. PGA purses are much higher because of the TV revenue the tour operator brings in. Why should fisherman settle for less if what they are doing is making the tour operators loads of money on TV? Since MLF boasts having the “best professional fisherman” in the world, why aren’t they being compensated as such. $100k winnings for first is about a 10th of what a PGA pro would earn for winning a tournament. Why is that?

Well that’s an easy answer. Because fishing is considered redneck and most rednecks, other than Duck Dynasty have no draw to 99% of the world. That’s what makes the “we are professional anglers” hilarious, they have next to zero impact on boat sales, rod & reel sales and they think they are going to be big corporations to pay them like real athletes...


It’ll only take about 5 minutes for someone that is intrigued by fishing to realize that the business is pricing itself out. Prefect examples were made on BTL.

Have they asked for rev share of TV? I’m not saying they should, but you’ve already said you have no idea if they’ve even asked for it, and we don’t know what the revenues are. One thing is for sure, they’re not going to get as rich as NBA players or golfers, so there is no need to continue to bring up the amount of money. It’s entirely irrelevant.

I'll throw out my 2 cents for what it worth (not much)

I've been a long time BASS supporter and will continue to do so. Do I think BASS will still be around in 2 years? 5 years? 10 years? Absolutely. It may look and feel different, or the same. Only time will tell, but it will still be around.

Having said that. The product MLF is producing right now is superior . I get that most didn't like the every bass counts, but this new 2lb minimum is the fix we have been looking for. I watch both tournaments last weekend and the content is so much better with MLF its not even close. The way its produced, the commentary, the drama, the excitement, everything. It is just better, and there is no debating it. I can understand the loyalty to BASS and how you can choose based on the format, but I think this year MLF is going to really show out with the new minimum size bass rule.

I don't know that I understand the hard line everyone is drawing in the sand. Competing professional trails only pushes the sport forward and lights a fire under the organizations to do better. I love all the options we have now. I will continue to watch both, but if both are on, which would I watch? I'll try to watch both, but will tend to lean toward MLF this year. Maybe things will change as the season progresses, but comparing the BASS and MLF 1st tournaments, MLF definitely won that battle.

Haha. I guess yall haven't checked what the PGA players are contemplating have yall? All that money and they are contemplating making a new league because the big bad PGA is making to much off of them. Sound familiar? Sounds like the future of MLF too if they start really making money. That is what this is all about, the almighty dollar that they worship. The same reason they started MLF will be the same reason it will fail. Theyve already set it on that path by giving all control over to the money people, even Ike said that. I dont mean fail as in go away, but more as in fail in the anglers having the say they wanted. Technically nothing has changed for anybody outside the bpt either, you still have to fork out a ton of entry fees to fish the flw for a small chance at the bpt. What will be interesting is after the 3 year period what/if they change the rules to keep the originals in the bpt. Plus, how will sponsors respond to a guys bouncing back and forth between 40k of entry fees to none? I'm definitely not going anywhere with anything I'm saying, just think it will be interesting to see how it all plays out. Same for BASS, the year they had last year was the best thing that could have ever happened to them, they have to keep improving on that too which will be extremely hard.

The point you make about the line being drawn is a valid one for sure and seeing the response to this early on was certainly interesting. Many on here have posted the reasons for their disdain but the reactions of some have been pretty extreme and then there’s Big O’s crusade, which has crossed the threshold any of us would consider remotely sane.

Possibly the most interesting part of this is the rants of the five fish faithful screaming at MLF to “hear them” and make changes and then MLF responds and makes a few adjustments for 2020 and those people now move on to the next list of complaints. It’s a head shaking moment for sure.

Based on the numbers from Stage One, the market agrees with you on the impact of these recent adjustments.

This will continue to evolve for MLF and for BASS. They’re going to compete and provide the best products they can for the viewer base. Pick what you like and enjoy. Neither of them are going anywhere.

Can you link to something explaining PGA players are thinking about starting their own tour?

Here you go duck. Took me a whole 3 seconds.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.fo...-chipping-away-at-pga-tour-hegemony/amp/

Yet, no one knows or gives a sh!t who MLF/BPT is, and they could be no more evidenced than the amount of people who show up to their events to see “the best fisherman in the world”. These fisheries they visit have numerous tournaments a year Putin by various clubs and leagues, but the only one that brings in the crowds are the ones that BASS host.

You can try and reconcile the superiority of MLF by touting some highly massaged and manipulatable viewership numbers all you want, that fact is and remains BASS puts butts in the seats at their events and customers at the check out lines for the sponsors. I’ll give it to you though, MLF has that vast majority of click farm based devices tuning in. Let’s see how that translates into the sponsors sales data.

Thanks!

That’s nothing close to players starting their own tour because the PGA is making too much money off of the players. It is interesting, though. Sounds like it could be fun to watch, if big names participate.

I seen something about it. They were trying to link Phil Michelson to it. Believe it is being funded by Saudi money. I didn’t see anything that said PGA players were trying to bail though. Was going to be just another tour from what I read. There hasn’t been much on it so it’s probably in its infancy.

Betting theres a fairly good chance Chase Anderson is looking at an exit strategy as we speak, the guys left for a reason they didn't like what they saw at the top in the new leadership...

Yeah, they’ve reached out to everybody. It’s not player funded or a player idea. It’s a british group trying to start something g up. Not a bad idea, and it may work, but it was misrepresented by the posted who brought it up.

Actually not true, they didn’t like what happened at the end of the previous season. You know, where there were 2 west coast scheduled tournaments, that the anglers always claim they want to go too. Then they got canceled because of flooding and BASS held their money and wanted to apply it to the next season entry fees.

Then there was Duckett & Klein who didn’t qualify to fish the Elites the following year, hence their big rush to start a new league so quickly. Got the anglers on their side while they were still pissed about the west coast incident.

Big Zero is like a bad case of diarrhea. You wish it would go away and you know it will eventually, but it’s just going to take some time. Haha.....

Fact is Elites were the cream of the crop hands down no questions asked in the fishing realm. Then a great majority left because someone found a way to have a free entry, chance for TV money to enter the arena, different daily tournament schedule, a different format where everyone knows the score during the entire tournament, and includes catch and release among other fresh ideas.

The Elites are no doubt the new XFL and Bass had to scramble to reformat entries and try to save face after they sh!t on the anglers for years, if the original Elite group as a whole were satisfied, they would not have left, it’s really pretty simple. They will probably be around in a few years, but I’m sure they are not innovative enough to make it marketable for TV,and thus will never be a mainstream format as it is. It’s a snoozer now for sure.

They had the highest level fishing tournament world all to themselves for years, and couldn’t get much more at the weigh in(excluding Classic) than all the elites families and their local friends, tournament staff and their families and local friends, those waiting for a check, and a handful of fishing groupies, some vendors and their families, the sponsors and their families, a few DB’s like yourself, basically equating to a few hundred attendees traveling like a pod to each tournament, most already targeted, and not gaining much in NEW interest. People not showing up to events not primarily designed for a crowd seems like it is working perfect. The bass weigh ins are generally a beating unless you are broke and need something free to do or the locals are stuck all day with the grandkids and need to fill a few hours until their parent come get them, they are perfect for an elite weigh in. Another 15 years and those 7yr old kids attending that magnificent weigh in might buy something they saw at the event, marketing genius.

You are obviously a dem, as in lieu of letting the market work itself out everyone chugs along selling their wares, some winners and some losers, you must disparage others to attempt to force your less than appealing second rate product on others. A superior product doesn’t need that tactic and crystal clear why you feel the need to do so. You are a simple shill for BASS and that’s fine... but don’t infer you aren’t. You are the clickfarm.

Bass pays actors to be at weigh in

I seem to remember a guy from the old BFHP (Bass Fishing Home Page) days with the moniker "beartrap" who was from the Great State of Georgia... Moultrie, Georgia to be exact... Which is sorta kinda southwest georgia USA... Hmmmmmm... His son was J Todd Tucker who was fishing the BASS Elite series at the time... And now fishes the FLW's Tackle Warehouse Pro Circuit... Hmmmmmm... Maybe just a coincidence???... Dan

Sure makes you wonder why he would keep lying about it???

you are thinking of Butch tucker who lives in Moultrie,Ga. whose son is J.Todd Tucker and fished BASS for several years and has fished FLW past few years...Butch was also regular contributor to BFHP...
my handle was Beartrap on old BFHP and I live in Albany,Ga.I pretty much retired from fishing tournaments several years ago (young guys were whipping me on regular basis)….

Getting olds a b!tch... Thanks for the refresher... Dan

I had posted a new thread yesterday that would have adequately addressed or refuted much of what you say above, which showed a video from a year ago of those who are now on the outside looking in and are quickly being forgotten about; but that post must have hit a nerve with someone that runs this joint because the whole thread was deleted after thee had already been multiple posts to it. So, it’s obvious there are some here that are very sensitive to the critical truth being put out there. I presume they are trying to protect the feelings of someone or something, who knows... but censorship is never a good thing. I can’t help but notice, the personal insults directed towards me are never censored, so I presume it’s one of those MLF protectionist deals, which they probably pay for censorship just like they probably do for views to their online content.

Bye bye Warren

MLF pays for mine, theen my baseball?

Are you saying that professional sports figure that makes say, 1,000,000 a year on contract has what he makes from outside indorsmental
Deducts from his 1,000,000 contract salary? That would be in lieu of?

I missed the word “not” after that’s... it was a typo and happens on a phone more times than I like. Going back to edit Is sometimes hard depending on length of reply thread as my typed texts is too far down and won’t scroll to it.

did a google search and came up with an estimated 24 million people play golf in this country and assuming only half of them watch golf on TV,that's till 12 million that watch the masters,U.S.Open etc...even if it is only half that number, it still dwarfs the audience for bass fishing...
and that is your answer as to why golfers earn far more than professional fishermen........
high school and college tournament fishing is growing,whether that will translate into a bigger audience and participants for tournament fishing remains to be seen...

Maybe your dog buried your baseball. Go look in the yard

You seem to inject yourself and blurt out totally unrelated noise and are distracting in just about every thread I’ve been a part of. I am not sure that’s on purpose and you’re looking to be disruptive and are seeking attention, or it’s something out of your control due to some sort of neurological or personality disorder.

Back when I was in school, I, as I am confident many others were taught, that we were to be patient, compassionate, and empathetic to our peers that may be inflicted with some sort of condition where they uncontrollably would make noises, sounds, or comments during class time. We were taught that often times the people who did this were not in control of their own reflexes and they might not even know they were doing something that was disruptive to the class. We were always taught to not tease or make fun of those who were displaying that type of behavior.

Are you someone who has been diagnosed with a neurological or other disorder that manifests itself in that way, Dubee?

On the other hand, there was always a couple of people in the schools, and we all experienced them, where they would sit in the back of class and purposely make noise or create other ways to be disruptive while people were trying to listen or study, etc.. and they were doing it for the sole purpose to try and get others to turn around and give them attention; good or bad. Of course those are the ones that were never bright enough to figure out people were not laughing with them, but at them.

I always like to give people the benefit of the doubt in this type of situation so I figured I needed to ask. If you have an issue that your not in control of Dubee, it’s alright... most people should understand that’s why you do what you are doing.

Otherwise, you may be the type of a person to just be ignored completely.

I had to call my source to get this information. He was able to find out that MLF has never paid any click farms to artificially inflate their numbers. All of the clicks have been authenticated by the FBI: Cyber Click Authentication Division (CCAD). He was also able to get the numbers for BASS and found out that 37% of their reported numbers originated from ASIA. There is strong speculation within the CCAD that BASS is being forced to inflate their viewer numbers due to losing all of their big name fishermen to MLF.

Sounds like you have the same source that said Clinton was going to win the last presidential election.

You do know that bass fishing is pretty big in Japan, right?

[/quote]I had to call my source to get this information. He was able to find out that MLF has never paid any click farms to artificially inflate their numbers. All of the clicks have been authenticated by the FBI: Cyber Click Authentication Division (CCAD). He was also able to get the numbers for BASS and found out that 37% of their reported numbers originated from ASIA. There is strong speculation within the CCAD that BASS is being forced to inflate their viewer numbers due to losing all of their big name fishermen to MLF.[/quote]



... Dan

How's Mary doing?

He’s right ^^^^ y’all know. There ARE “those types of persons”.

TTT

Anyone ever find out who the Big O was?

Now comes the TV time reply......

I think the TFF upper management found out. I think we can all just be glad that he’s gone.

Why? He was a riot!

Wasnt he right about a decent amount of what he said?

Well let's see. He was correct in alot he spoke about and it was absolutely HILARIOUS how everyone's panties got in a wad over him.

Was it Errol?

I see the pattern 100%, say anything negative about a certain someone and the panties start to scrunch.

He was just too much for me. That says a lot.

He was probably real close to ending it last year when the Rams won the Super Bowl.
His love for Kroenke was legendary.

Big Kroenke fan

Still blowing smoke up everybody’s arse . MLF still sucks and will always be 2nd fiddle to BASS

So, please someone catch me up and let me know who won this thing?

No

This didn’t age well

Note to self... Don't take investment advice from beartrap... Dan

MLF - Most Little Fish

Give 10 kids beetle spins on a Zebco and they could compete in this **** show.

Mlf is the xfl of the fishing world.

I wonder how Trapper feels, knowing that there was going to be a mass exodus if they hadn’t changed back to the 5 fish limit this year? I hear the “every fish counts”, is the future of the sport.

This is why you don't post on the TFF while under the influence. Things on the internet don't disappear.

This is pretty accurate.

Can’t believe ole bear trap hasn’t admitted he was wrong. Oh well

I think he's chasing peacocks down in the Amazon. He'll chime in when he gets back

I was wrong about how long BASS would last and now believe with growth of high school and college tourneys,there is room for two professional trails…..keep in mind that KVD,wheeler,Defoe,Evers ,Morgan,strider and 74 more still believe MLF is the best choice for them……

Where else can they go? Most cannot go back to BASS without requalifying through the Opens. KVD is retiring after this season.

That’s our Trapper!

Wonder why he didn’t address the “mass exodus if they didn’t change back to 5 fish limit” though.

I have no information or connection to MLF organization nor any of it’s fishermen…..I have no idea whether there would have been a mass exodus or not but I believe that the members were allowed to vote on the issue….I am a fan of both MLF and BASS…..all I have tried to is point out the obvious….the huge increase in TV exposure for the fishermen and their sponsors and the sharing of TV,sponsor and venue revenue plus being the #1 rated outdoor TV show that MLF has provided….

Just stop already…..

I've looked at what the payout is for an average PGA tournament vs what most pro bass tournaments pay. It's been a while but even with what MLF is doing there is still a huge gap. If MLF is as strong as they claim to be why aren't they closer to pro golf on payouts?[img]https://brandongaille.com/24-bass-fishing-industry-statistics-and-trends/[/img] Stats from 2018 but still should be quite relevant. If the sport is bringing in this kind of cash and participation??????

you're that guy

#superfan

This is hilarious....the reason payouts aren't close to what PGA pays out is very simple. Golf makes WAY more money then Bass Fishing. Same goes for most other sports. As much as we want to believe Bass Fishing has increased in popularity or that this industry can some how match other main stream sports, its just not going to happen. The data proves it.

Golf sells beer. Fishing sells baits. Big difference in money.

Golf sells BMW's, Lexus', Porsche's, Cadillac's, Range Rovers and investment services... Fishing sells the High Life, Bud Light and Mt. Dew... Dan

Yet arguably the best angler in tbe BPT is choosing to publicly debut a boat he helped design at the Classic. You have to admit there is a little irony there.

I think that’s a business decision, just like the decision to leave was, they are doing what’s best for them.

Because he wants people to see it before waiting 6-9 months. Haha.

You wouldn't figure he would want to debut it at an event of an organization that is supposed to be done or at best a third tier league by now per the OP. Surely those 1153 hours of TV time spread out over 12 channels would suffice.

Lol the classic is a big draw as a stand alone event vs. redcrest, I think that’s all it boils down to.

But again the OP predicted that BASS would die by now. Personally I am happy he is bringing it out at the Classic as it looks like a great boat and I am excited to see it. I hope BPT succeeds as well as I think two leagues are best to keep each other trying to get better. Plus there are some good guys fishing BPT.

Completely agree. Did you see the first BPT stop where Chris Lane ended up taking the win in the last 1 min? Unreal and some of the most excited Bass Fishing coverage I've seen. I like the move to biggest 5. The way BPT covers the tournament, the announcers, and the live score tracker really is more exciting to watch that BASS tournaments in my opinion. I know many won't accept MLF just b/c they are pro Bassmaster, but I for one love that we get to watch both.

I'll say it again...I like all the trails. What a time to be alive and get to watch fishing on so many platforms with so many Pro Anglers representing the sport I love.

The reason Ikon is debuting the boat at the Classic is because they actually want people to see it. There was like 17 people at the Redcrest last year

I don't think Wheeler will need either platform for his boat to make it's mark on the industry. So BASS vs MLF is irrelevant here IMO. Does not mean it doesn't make sense to advertise wherever you can.
On a side note, I don't think the majority of people that witness this boat at The Classic will be able to buy one. I see this thing being very pricey at the start. Maybe more economical models (as bass boats go anyway) may come later if the brand does grow.

Parent company HSC’s smallest boat is over 38’ and starts at close to 1mm

Contrary to the OP Bassmaster is doing just fine and contrary to all the MLF haters here Duckett World is doing just fine too. Anglers in both places are probably doing better today than if the split never happened. They both NEED to get along and stop scheduling Elites and BPT on top of each other. Would like to see one day where there is one championship between the two, but thats a long ways off if ever, the AFL and NFL decided to do that 50 years ago... seems like that might have been a good idea...

First world problems. One day I would like to experience that.

I was wondering about this as well... ie if any tension between Wheeler and MLF/Duckett over it... Boyd's known to hold a grude

Not sure Boyd can afford to hold a grudge against Wheeler. He’s the league cash cow. That’s why they let him break the rules and pay a small fine lol

will Wheeler be at the Classic?........does he own Ikon boats,if not,it may not be his decision to debut the boat at the classic....

I'm sure there will be a bunch of MLF guys at the classic unless their league forbids it. Question is are any Bassmaster guys at the redcrest expo this week?

There's no ability to stop them from being at either event. Their sponsors hold more weight and will have their pros at either event to aid in marketing.

The classic here on Roberts I heard there were a few MLF anglers in attendance due to sponsor obligations.

Yes remember seeing 4 BPT guys during that classic expo, sure there was more.

while the concept of MLF is much better for the sport and the fish I really don't see BASS being completely displaced by it. Just look at the popularity of the other MLF trails. People want to see the weigh in of meat hanging on someone's hands and listening to the anglers tell their stories.