redoing boat floor - suggestions?

I am fixing to start redoing the floor on my fiberglass boat. The wood is soft, and I am sure the supporting wood (stringers?) under the decking is soft as well. Does anyone have experience with this before I start ripping things out? I intend to take measurements and pictures along the way for documentation, just hoping for a little of the been there done that type advice.
Thanks,
chris

I just did mine. It wasn't that difficult but, I am not a perfectionist either.

Instead of trying to match up the new flooring to meet flush with the old flooring I just left about 4 inches all the way around the edge and placed my new flooring on top of that ledge. It raised the floor of the boat 3/4" but, that didn't bother me as much as trying to get everything exactly flush and level.

If you are going to fiberglass the decking make sure you get marine plywood not pressure treated plywood. They aren't the same. Marine plywood is not treated and uses waterproof glue to bond the layers. Pressure treated is petroleum based and the glass will not adhere to it properly.

Oh yeah, it is harder than it looks and no matter how hot it is outside, make sure you wear long sleeves and long pants when cutting out the old floor and laying the new fiberglass. Also, get a box of disposable gloves to wear when you are applying the glass mate and resin.

C.. We recently replaced a transom in a 1969 glastron ski boat it was not all that hard to do but if I can offer any advice I will be happy to do so.. also have lots of pics of what we did

Bozo.. see my previous post.. we used treated plywood from the local Home depot and the fiberglass resin stuck to it nice and it was a heck of alot cheaper than marine grade wood

One more thing, my oldest brother always says (measure three times cut 1 time you can never cut longer) !!!!!!!!!

[This message has been edited by oldtimer (edited 07-15-2003).]

If the treated wood has dried out well it will bond and you may be ok. If you get fresh wood that is green and wet and then encapsilate it in resin, you are asking for trouble in the long run.

A sawsall and 3" grinder works great. Wear long sleeves and respirator as you'll be creating ALOT of dust and it is very bad for the lungs. Make sure the boat hull is very clean before glassing in the stringers and take extra time on this as the stringers are the most important part. You must really love your boat as this is a job I wouldn't wish on anyone based on my experience. I found alot more rot than I bargined for when I was do it.

Thank you all for your replies - I am not looking forward to this, but it's got to be done. I don't think the stringers will be too bad, but I want to be prepared for the worst when I start. What type of glassing material do you use? I was thinking epoxy resin, but fiberglass seems to be what everyone is mentioning.
Thanks,
Chris

Fiberglass is what you put in the epoxy resin to increase the strength.

There is fiberglass mat and fiberglass cloth. Mat is stronger but a little harder to work with.

The difference between the two is the way the fiber is running. Mat looks like BSD plywood where the fibers run in all directions and angles. Clothe is pretty much like you would imagine cloth looking like, uniformed weave at 90 degrees from each other.


Make sure you go to an auto paint supply store to buy the material if you decide to use the fiberglass material. They sell it at Lowes/Home Depot but, it is like 5 or 6 buck for a small piece that will only cover about a square yard. At a supply house you could buy enough to redo your whole boat for 10 to 15 bucks.

I noticed West Marine has all the stuff needed to do this. Also, might want to search on line for supplier. 10-15$ would be a great cost if you could find it but to do a whole floor and stringers, think more along the $50-100 for materials. NOTE- wear gloves(disposable) and get a bunch of disposalble brushes or applicators. Resin on the skin is a bear to get off and causes irritation,also, you'er working with fiberGLASS, will cut and leave glass fibers.

Call one of these shops in your area.
http://www.autobodypro.com/star_jobbers/states/tx.htm

West marine is expensive because it is a specialty store.

Body shops go through tons of this stuff and it is much cheaper.

Bozo I think I must have gotten dried wood then cause all went well..

Just another note if you do not have gloves and do get resin on your hands I found out that Simple Green works realy well to remove it

The difference between "chopped" or "random strand" glass and mat in strength is unbelievable. If I were going to take the time and extreme effort to gut a boat to the bare hull and replace the stringers I would encapsulate the stringers with a light weight mat or heavy grade chooped and use strips of mat to bond the covered stringers to the hull. Do the same thing with the plywood decking top and bottom. If you are replacing the transom too figure out how to strengthen the transom by adding knee braces - triangular shaped layers of plywood and glass that are firmly affixed to the sides of the stringer and to the inside face of the transom - these go on either side of the engine mounting holes. Not much weight gain but serious gain in strength. No matter what else you do make double sure to use a roller tool to lay the resin soaked 'glass evenly and smoothly. This is an art that I've have watched at several boat plants... the art is not leaving too much resin but leaving enough to fill the tiny gaps and without any not any air bubbles or wrinkles before the resin begins to set up and becoming sticky and hard to work with. Resin has no strength at all and becomes brittle and will chip and crack - think about the the exterior gelcoat's strength. All the strength comes from either the wooden pieces or the covering fiberglass random strand or mat. Mat looks like burlap and can be lumpy Random strand is smooth and silky but weak. Used together in layers is how boat mfg's get the necessary strength for the hull and yet give a slick outside or finished surface. Below decks don't worry about the finish work but concentrate on the strength factors. And use structural foam to fill the voids and walls to restablish the flotation levels but be sure to leave a channel down the middle of the boat for a bilge drainage. Ranger Bass Boats are solid foam over only 2 main very wide and tall, very thick mat stringers and arms that are also foam injected after being glassed into the hull with only a narrowish bilge running from the front floor drain to the sump in front of the transom. This forms a solid one peice hull when the decking is glassed into place as the one piece deck is lowered into the hull using a hoist. Bayliner uses the same principal but uses individual encapsulated plywood decking over a notched together plywood frame that fit around and is glassed to the primary stringers for their runabouts. Bayliner is now using the Ranger system for the Saltwater Trophy line and the Stringer and Arms insert looks like it would support a truck it is so heavy. Good Luck and go as slow as you need to. BTDT and won't do it again unless I absolutely have to.
Ron
PS If you usae the right kind and amount of glass it won't matter if the wood you use rots out since the Glass is where the strength will come from and the wood is only a form on which to mount the glass.
RV

I put a new floor in my boat about three years ago and used 3/4" treated plywood and it worked fine. I went to Sun Valley Fiberglass in Ft. Worth (off FM 1187 toward Rendon) and talked to the owner. They primarily fix wrecked boats and rebuild transoms. (I have his card at work) He was extremely helpful. He gave me all the ins and outs of using the fiberglass matt and resin. He sold me the matt in bulk, we just unrolled it off his roll and cut it to length. He also told me where I could buy the resin in a 5 gallon bucket for about $90 in Ft Worth. He also sold me (from his bulk supply) the gel coat and tinted it to the color I needed. I wish I could remember his name, he really helped in providing info and sold me the material at a good price, a lot cheaper than you could buy it packaged. I put a new floor in my 17" CC for about $400 complete with gelcoat.
I will try to find his card if interested. Let me know.
BTW The waterless hand cleaners (GoJo, GOOP, etc.. work well to clean the resin from your skin. Everything else needs to be disposable!!

[This message has been edited by lonestar (edited 07-16-2003).]

Thank you all for your help! Lonestar, if you do find that number or remember the name, email me. I could certainly use all the help I can get. I was doing some pre-checking, and the stringers I was able to see from the small section of floor I removed looked pretty good. I guess I won't know for sure till I rip it all out...<sigh>

I was reading this thread very intresting. Is the wood under the glass floor if so do you need to remove the cap or top deck and get to it from the bottom ??? if you cut the floor out what are you going to put your wood on ?? sorry for being slow

My advice is to use wolmanized 2x6 or 2x?? material for the stringers and cut them to fit the contour of the boat bottom. Use 3/4" Marine Plywood for the floor (you can get it at Craddock Lumber on Harry Hines in Dallas). Encapsulate everything before assembly with a thick (multiple coats) of poured and spread EPOXY RESIN/HARDENER. You would not need to lay any fiberglass cloth or mat other than to perhaps strengthen even more the joints between the various pieces. After cutting all pieces to fit, lay out all the pieces on polyethelene sheeting and spread on the epoxy coating and allow to cure overnight, then flip over and coat the other side, then the 2 remaining sides and ends. Repeat this process as needed. Just make sure everything is coated top, bottom, and all sides. After encapsulation is complete, then glue stringers in place with epoxy resin/hardener and allow to cure 12 to 24 hours. After stringers are in place and fully cured, fasten the encapsulated flooring in place by pouring a bead of epoxy resin/hardener along the top of the stringers and screwing the flooring down to the stringers with oval head Stainless Steel self tapping screws (#10/#12/#14). Pre-drill and countersink all holes for the screws for precision fit. After pouring and screwing the flooring in place, fill all screw heads in the countersinks with epoxy resin/hardener mixture and level off. Epoxy is a superior and true adhesive for repairing and joining wood to wood or fiberglass to wood or fiberglass to fiberglass, and is a better water barrier than fiberglass resin. As long as th epoxy coating is not breached and remains sealed, the wood will not rot. If the floor is to be exposed to direct sunlight, apply a final coat of polyurethane topside for UV protection. Get quart kits of epoxy resin/hardener at Home Depot/Lowes/West Marine @ about $20.00 per quart kit. Use MEK to clean-up and for any thinning needed. I prefer MEK over acetone since it evaporates slower. Get polyethelene serrated spreaders to spread the mixture. Use quart to half gallon or gallon glass jugs with good lids to mix the epoxy mixture. If needed, get PreVal disposable butane sprayer kits if any small spraying is needed (thin with MEK). Get 80 grit abrasive paper to do any sanding needed. Remember that epoxy will not stick to polyethelene (use thick polyethelene sheeting). Don't mix too much in hot weather as it sets up rapidly and begins curing quickly at our hot temperatures this time of year. This process is not cheap and is very time consuming and no boat repair shops will do this process unless specifically requested to if at all, but your floor will be stronger and better than brand new.

Ok.. Here is my 2 cents worth,

Marine grade plywood is completely different than pressure treated plywood. You cannot but marine grade wood at Lowe's or Home Depot. We buy ours from Fort Worth Plywood Company. 3/4 inch will cost us about 58.50 per sheet.

The stuff you buy at Lowes or HD, is not treated against moisture. Just termites. It can have a problem holding the chemical and physical bond from the resin to the wood in long term use.

Do not mix the resin with the MEK hardner more than 2% with a 45% solution MEK in this heat. YOU CAN CATCH YOUR BOAT ON FIRE.

We do not sell out fiberglass materials to the general public just for this reason. It isn't that we are trying to not make them available, we just don't want the liablility if someome catches their boat on fire!

If anyone has any questions, please feel free to call. We can help and direct you to the proper resources.

Oh, BTW: baby powder takes away the burning of the fiberglass dust.



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Michael Bristow
North Texas Fiberglass
www.northtexasfiberglass.com
940-243-2628

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