Cormorants - Good or bad?

I live on a cove known for good bass and recently I have watched as the cormorants come into the cove to feed. It is fascinating to watch them. I estimate there are two to three thousand at a time with a dozen or so pelicans joining in. They start at the mouth of the cove and leap-frog each other all the way down the cove. The birds in back fly to the front and beat their wings on the water as they go scaring shad into the waiting cormorants up front. I've even seen them line up maybe twenty birds deep and 200 yards long along the shore and swim toward shore chasing the shad into shallow water. They must be taking literally a ton of bait fish out of my cove.

So, here is the question. No doubt this is nature's way of controlling the fish population. But I want a healthy cove that attracts good bass. Should I try to scare these cormorants out of the cove? Or do I want the bait fish thinned out to make the bass have to hunt a little more aggressively?

If you do, remember they are a protected bird.

It isn't every day someone asks "good or bad" about this piece of [censored] bird.

Do you realize they conservatively eat 1.5 pounds of fish per bird per day. Do the math and ask your question again.

Nothing, absolutely nothing good about water turkeys. The only good one is a dead one.

Find a tree they are roosting in and start fishing for catfish

BAD ! Seen them eat 12" Bass not just shad ! !

Cormorants are protected by state and federal laws, be careful hazing them. I would expect that cormorants are doing well on population numbers, there are more assessable feeding locations than in the past. We have impounded more waterways and created more standing water that allows there feeding style than was in historical records. We have changed the balance of fishery and select bird predators.
All this does is promote fish hatcheries and spend funds A never ending battle of getting the state to set priorities.

I went to a seminar this weekend hosted by Tarponfly - Carey Thorn - he said they
were no longer protected.

Bozz

I thought only private land owners could shoot them now. No hunting cormorants allowed by the general public.

They devastate trees when they roost.

Why do you think fish farms have been given special permits to eradicate cormorants? Why do you think a lot of State Game Wardens here in Texas don't care if you shoot them? Bad BAD Worst.

They need to have an open, unlimited season on them like they do for geese on the coast.

It is illegal to shoot cormorants.

http://tpwd.texas.gov/publications/pwdpubs/media/pwd_lf_w7000_1159.pdf

That link doesn't say shooting the double-crested commorant is ILLEGAL - it says it is CONTROLLED. Follow requirements, and they can be shot - though i have no idea how hard or easy the hoops are to be allowed to do so.

Remember, the taking of almost every critter is controlled to an extent, some more than others. Personally, I'd like to see the double crested commorant limit restricted to 100 per shooter on days that end in "y".

Need a permit and be a landowner where the birds r considered a nuisance.

Actually if you will read the "link", it says regulated by state and federal government. But you go ahead and shoot all you want.

Double-crested cormorants are one of approximately 800 species protected under the Migratory Bird Treaty Act of 1918, and subsequent amendments. This act was first passed to implement the terms of a treaty between the U.S. and Canada for the protection of migratory birds.

You can get a special permits to hunt them on private property. You have to keep a log and bury or burn the bodies.

Basically cormorants compete with other fish for the same food source. In addition they can feed heavily on game and food fish fingerlings and young.

Between intensive conservation efforts, state, federal and international laws and regulations, as well as state and federal programs to help cormorant populations recover from previous problems involving certain pesticides, they have become far more numerous than the wild food supply can provide for.

At some point they and other predatory birds come into places like farms and intensively managed fisheries and eat up most of the fish. Even risking being shot and killed in order to not starve to death.

Licensed (or permitted where there is no license requirement) aquaculture facilities in 13 Southern states have a general permit to kill cormorant depredating on crops. Beyond that, I don't know.

I do know that other than fire ants, they are one of the scourges of the Earth, at least the wet parts and the edges.....

White pork rind on a #2 treble 24" under a cork and plop it in the water under the roost tree. Hold on tight. Blue cats hit hard.

Its the three S's.
Shoot
Shovel
Shut up

Bad. Unless you are a catfisherman.

I had a favorite fishing spot where I could catch a lot of perch , crappie and bass every time . 2 years ago a flock of cormorants moved in . I'm lucky to get a bite now .

As stated , they're protected . Check your local ordinances concerning fireworks . Bottle rockets are your friend .

Your not going to get a permit unless you are a fish farmer.

& start shooting them too

Ummm...no.

Fish farmers in Mississippi got tired of losing millions of dollars and hired aerial applicators to spray the roosts with soapy water before cold rains, causing the cormorants to lose their oily coating and die of exposure. It worked very well and limited losses.

However, the farmers were filed against for the massacre by the feds. The feds lost in court due to jury nullification, too many relatives of the jurors worked in the fish industry and would not vote themselves out of work.

Now if we could get some of that common sense here in Texas....

So pork skins taste Cormorant $h/***??

Come to Mesquite City lake and watch them water turkeys do their work when the rainbow trout shows up. I bet they get 80% of the fish that the state releases. I hate them dam birds.

Reggie

Definitely a law that goes against preserving the fish in the lakes & should be changed!

They consume allot of bait fish. & game fish.

i know i have caught ALOT of bass and crappie in my lifetime that have battle scars from them

Cormorants have been around the same length of time as fish. So how do we have fish if they eat them all?

I don't want to kill them all. Just about 95% of them. Them and the gar.

So have you ever attempted to get a permit got depredation to shoot them? I have and was unsuccessful because, yes I did not have a hatchery and wasn't a fish farmer.
I know it says in the regs that a permit can be issued for protecting game fish but I can assure you you will not get one at the Fort Eorth office or the Abilene office. And they take their orders from Austin. I was told the part of the law that says issued for protection of game fish meant that TPWD could get a permit for their people or to contract a company to control them.
If you have received a permit to kill them to protect you tanks or private lakes I sure would like to know which office.
The definition of a fish farm was someplace that was permitted to sell fish. For example even though Camalot Bell isn't a hatchery per se they sell fingerlings so hence they are permitted to sell them.

Probably not but I'd rather eat bacon than bird poop . I'm sure the catfish feel the same .

We have a permit to shoot them at my family ranch (not a fish farm.) I know several other private landowners who have obtained permits as well. You are misinformed.

Licensed fish farmers in 13 Southern states are covered by a general permit and do not have to apply for anything.

Others with interests being damaged by pests such as cormorants have to make an application and receive a specific permit. All very doable IF you can show damages from the marauding birds.

Not so great

The white pork rind used for jigging looks like bird poop when it plops into the water. The bite is a reaction bite like a bass. The cats gather under the roost trees to gorge on digested fish. Nature's way of chumming. Presentation should be a soft toss so it makes the plop sound. One or two fish from under a tree and then move on to the next tree on trolling motor as quiet as possible. It's a lot like fishing for them green trash fish. Make a lot of casts for one good bite but when it's on it's a hoot.

I have used just the store bought catfish bait chunks and fished under trees with them in the past, the birds are great to bring the catfish to that area for sure.

They come in our cove twice a day , start from one end and move toward the main lake .

I'm all for clean shooting, but this seems a little cruel.

What's cruel is that they have no predators, yet they consume twice their body weight, per day, of our beloved fish resources. They have grown drastically, in the last couple of decades, with very little relief in sight. Thank goodness it's recognized by Authorities, to allow some form of control. You guys that have feelings for them, must not be much about fishin', maybe ya'll need 'em as pets. The whole population is out of hand.

"Cruel" is not having a job, unable to make a house payment, send your kids to school, pay your taxes, live a decent life in pursuit of the American Dream. Finding an effective, inexpensive, ecologically sound, non-toxic, method to control pests, not so much.

Real biology, I s'pose in the eyes of those unused to the harshness of real life, looks cruel.

Perhaps watching a savannah monitor eat a rat would help folks get past what is cruel and what is real.

Now, I do draw a line....I refuse to use glue traps for anything other than invertebrates.

As I was taught a long time ago, good law, bad law, it is the law. Work to get it changed, but until it is changed it is the law.


Ain't got nothing to do with cruel, only the law.

No doubt the law is the law, but not everybody sees and enforces the law the same.

In another episode, to do with white pelicans depredating and spreading disease on fish farms, the exact same law was enforced very differently by the feds in the Western office than the ones in the Eastern office. However, when it was all said and done, the law (and permitting) was brought into equity across the board.

Nobody in their right mind wants to cause the demise to extinction of another species. However, some species are more problematic than others and require management intervention to restore balance and prevent undue loss. The double crested cormorant (Phalacrocorax auritus) is among those.

In Vegas was had a 4 little city ponds that would get stocked with trout in winter for the kids.

Yeah... someone said 80%? I would be willing to bet they ate 90% of those stocked fish within a few days.

State just dumping money in for nothing, 1 out of 10 kids might have caught a fish if they were there the day of stocking. By the time 2-3 days went by, there were not any more trout to speak of.

Still is that way.

Cormorants are good for soaking up spilled oil.

Hookem found the only good thing about water turkeys

Maybe we can get those guys that hunt the wild hogs from copters to get some permitsion to hunt the water turkeys by copter.

A friend of a friend, owns a crawfish farm in LA, lets just say that half of the dikes out there are made of cormorant carcasses

Apparently they eat them in England.

Cormorant Stew

You really think your gonna win the battle against nature??

You're right. Humans have never had an impact on the population of another species. What are we thinking.

I found the use as a flare far more intriguing.

Cormorants are good.

We have a neighborhood lake, and it's covered with Cormorants since they started the rainbow trout stockings.
They just swim around and around and follow the schools of fish and dive down, come up with a trout in the bill and they toss it up and swallow it down, while the people fishing along the bank just watch and catch nothing.
They'll then waddle out of the water on the bank because they are too full to fly.
At least when they stock catfish the cats are too big for the Cormorants to eat whole but they continue to stock the trout to feed the birds. You're tax dollars at work!

Bad

I have personally seen them dive and come up with a two pound base on Toledo Bend.
My late and great bass fishing friend Robert Hale carried a shotgun with him. He hated them for eating the bass.

Good grief. Cormorants and Grackles. Something needs to be done about this in Texas.

I shoot all I see on our stock tank........

I must admit I have accidentally smacked one or two during the trout stocking .

They are what they are and they do what they do. They do it well. Too well at times. I personally love them for being the 'fish finders' that they are as they help 'zero-in' on where baitfish are located on reserviors

Bad, very bad.... Basically eat all the bait/pan fish out of lake in a hurry. big problem up north as well. st.lawrence, lake ontario. same kind of deal, illegal to kill them and no one seems to be able to get a permit. has been a half full of guys that have taken this into there own hands, have had there find's, paid for by the local fishing community.

http://blogs.canoe.com/outdoorsguy/fishing/cormorant-coming-soon-to-a-waterway-near-you/

I like them. The eat ditch pickles and show me where the catfish are

Bad. Too many of them. Time to get the punt gun out of hiding.

are those smallmouths in your picture?
where do you fish