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Re: People crying about background checks.
[Re: Emit R Detsaw]
#14377532
05/26/22 01:45 PM
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Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 15,795
921 Phoenix
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 15,795 |
I've had the part-time job of selling guns in sporting goods stores at various times in my life. It is interesting to look back at the different periods and the different ways we had to do things. I remember when we could sell the person a gun, but not ammo at the same time. I remember the 5 day waiting period time for taking a purchased gun home. One thing that remained consistent was the paperwork that the store had to keep for the Government. Pre and Post background check we would have ATF or FBI come in and look through the paperwork when a gun was used in a crime. That is the only place that the gun is tied to the purchaser. What a Universal background check, done at a FFL store/site would do is complete the paper trail. The background check itself only clears the transaction, it doesn't record what gun you have bought or sold. In the past, when I have done a private sale of one of my guns, I kept a signed (by me and the guy buying the gun) receipt showing the gun and serial number that I sold. Just in case the gun was ever used in a crime. The Feds can only track the gun by serial number by getting the store that the firearm was sold to, and then physically going to the store and going through file cabinets of paperwork to see who that gun was sold to.They tried several years back to get that data into a federal data base, but that was blocked by the courts. this is all correct from what I have been told when I question store owners while I was buying guns.
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Re: People crying about background checks.
[Re: kjwolvy]
#14377533
05/26/22 01:46 PM
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 95,454
Bigbob_FTW
Big Sprocket Bob
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Big Sprocket Bob
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 95,454 |
Why is the first responds to punish ever one who didn't do it? Seems a short trip to a firing squad makes more sense.
FJB
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Re: People crying about background checks.
[Re: patriot07]
#14377572
05/26/22 02:16 PM
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 11,614
Razorback
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 11,614 |
You don't have to have a database for universal background checks.
Is there anyone who actually believes the government won't maintain such a list? Come on, now...anyone? I don't trust government as far as I can throw them, especially Washington. If you ever buy a gun that is checked or registered in any way Washington will have a record of it, and if they ever need to see what you have the record will be available and used.
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Re: People crying about background checks.
[Re: Bigbob_FTW]
#14377573
05/26/22 02:16 PM
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Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 15,795
921 Phoenix
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 15,795 |
Why is the first responds to punish ever one who didn't do it? Seems a short trip to a firing squad makes more sense. Firing squad is to quick Let them chose between being tied down to a fire ant bed naked and with honey pour over them or tied to wood and set on fire Needs to be enough consequences to deter them from doing it. The Roman’s crucified them on the roads leading into the towns to make people think. Putting these people in jail three meals a day and all the time to play there games like on line is what they want
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Re: People crying about background checks.
[Re: 921 Phoenix]
#14377587
05/26/22 02:21 PM
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 26,161
patriot07
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 26,161 |
I don't know that it's wrong for them to try and trap people, because you selling a gun, you may not know that person and if they are lying to you. You also don't have the way to background check so to be trapped seams wrong to me.
I would suggest if you know you can't buy a gun and you try that should be a felony, but even if it would to become law what would anyone do about it. I say nothing so no matter what you put in place the only ones hurt are honest law abiding people criminals will always find away.
Who doesn't have a way to do a background check? Specify every police station as a free FFL check location. Also any FFL could perform checks as well. I'm just saying - this provides a way to put less guns in the hands of people who can't legally buy them. It also doesn't infringe on 2A rights. And hopefully it would show some moderates that conservatives can be reasonable in an effort to try and stem the bleeding. We absolutely still need to make schools safer. I don't understand how this hasn't already been addressed. At least one armed guard and bullet proof exterior glass should be the bare minimum requirements.
Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards. - Soren Kierkegaard
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Re: People crying about background checks.
[Re: 921 Phoenix]
#14377607
05/26/22 02:40 PM
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Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 489
flashman252
Angler
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Angler
Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 489 |
I've had the part-time job of selling guns in sporting goods stores at various times in my life. It is interesting to look back at the different periods and the different ways we had to do things. I remember when we could sell the person a gun, but not ammo at the same time. I remember the 5 day waiting period time for taking a purchased gun home. One thing that remained consistent was the paperwork that the store had to keep for the Government. Pre and Post background check we would have ATF or FBI come in and look through the paperwork when a gun was used in a crime. That is the only place that the gun is tied to the purchaser. What a Universal background check, done at a FFL store/site would do is complete the paper trail. The background check itself only clears the transaction, it doesn't record what gun you have bought or sold. In the past, when I have done a private sale of one of my guns, I kept a signed (by me and the guy buying the gun) receipt showing the gun and serial number that I sold. Just in case the gun was ever used in a crime. The Feds can only track the gun by serial number by getting the store that the firearm was sold to, and then physically going to the store and going through file cabinets of paperwork to see who that gun was sold to.They tried several years back to get that data into a federal data base, but that was blocked by the courts. this is all correct from what I have been told when I question store owners while I was buying guns. It sure is and I know a guy sells weapons privately (buys and sells CONSTANTLY) but ALWAYS keeps a bill of sale with serial number. Saved his arse one day as we were at his house for a bbq and 3 blacked out SUV's roll up. When answering the door, they asked about a firearm that he had bought at a local gun shop. Told him he sold it and went to his gun safe, pulled out a big stack of bill of sales and gave a copy to them. Cleared his name right then and there. If that one document did not exist, he would of been taken in for questioning, guaranteed.
Last edited by flashman252; 05/26/22 02:41 PM.
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Re: People crying about background checks.
[Re: patriot07]
#14377609
05/26/22 02:43 PM
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 19,866
Emit R Detsaw
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 19,866 |
We absolutely still need to make schools safer. I don't understand how this hasn't already been addressed. At least one armed guard and bullet proof exterior glass should be the bare minimum requirements.
After our school shooting a few years back there was a bond measure on the ballot to do just that. People voted it down because they didn't want their taxes raised. It was on the ballot again this year along with other school upgrades for covid ventilation and so forth, and yup, it got voted down again. People want it done, but they don't want to pay for it.
May you be treated the way you treat other people, today and everyday!
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Re: People crying about background checks.
[Re: flashman252]
#14377612
05/26/22 02:44 PM
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 11,614
Razorback
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 11,614 |
It sure is and I know a guy sells weapons privately (buys and sells CONSTANTLY) but ALWAYS keeps a bill of sale with serial number. Saved his arse one day as we were at his house for a bbq and 3 blacked out SUV's roll up. When answering the door, they asked about a firearm that he had bought at a local gun shop. Told him he sold it and went to his gun safe, pulled out a big stack of bill of sales and gave a copy to them. Cleared his name right then and there. If that one document did not exist, he would of been taken in for questioning, guaranteed. No, the government would never keep a record of every gun you buy and register and be able to come to your house at any time, and for any reason that serves their purposes.
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Re: People crying about background checks.
[Re: kjwolvy]
#14377626
05/26/22 02:52 PM
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 16,990
Pat Goff
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 16,990 |
Pat Goff Seadrift TX
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Re: People crying about background checks.
[Re: Razorback]
#14377646
05/26/22 03:02 PM
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Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 489
flashman252
Angler
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Angler
Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 489 |
It sure is and I know a guy sells weapons privately (buys and sells CONSTANTLY) but ALWAYS keeps a bill of sale with serial number. Saved his arse one day as we were at his house for a bbq and 3 blacked out SUV's roll up. When answering the door, they asked about a firearm that he had bought at a local gun shop. Told him he sold it and went to his gun safe, pulled out a big stack of bill of sales and gave a copy to them. Cleared his name right then and there. If that one document did not exist, he would of been taken in for questioning, guaranteed. No, the government would never keep a record of every gun you buy and register and be able to come to your house at any time, and for any reason that serves their purposes. Well I am telling you, they came to his house and had questions right then and there about a handgun with a serial number in question. The above statement is correct about ATF coming and getting a name off a 4473 form. When I worked at sportsmans, they did it every so often. If there is a firearm bought and used in a crime, they can and will figure out who the original buyer was and follow a paper trail if there is one.
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Re: People crying about background checks.
[Re: kjwolvy]
#14377649
05/26/22 03:06 PM
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Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 489
flashman252
Angler
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Angler
Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 489 |
On the subject of all this, here in new mexico we have a craigslist just for guns. Where people can sell and buy privately all the time. I have done this one time in my entire life and the only thing I did was a bill of sale. No background check at all. Could we enforce background checks for private sells, sure could but I wonder how many firearms have been passed around at this point without a background check tied to the owner at this point. Sure it may help going forward but there are far too many weapons in this country that are not with the person who originally did the background check. Criminals will ALWAYS find a way to get their hands on one as well. Any law we make restricting guns will only keep the honest more honest.
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Re: People crying about background checks.
[Re: Emit R Detsaw]
#14377658
05/26/22 03:15 PM
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Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 1,367
D.O.C.989
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 1,367 |
We absolutely still need to make schools safer. I don't understand how this hasn't already been addressed. At least one armed guard and bullet proof exterior glass should be the bare minimum requirements.
After our school shooting a few years back there was a bond measure on the ballot to do just that. People voted it down because they didn't want their taxes raised. It was on the ballot again this year along with other school upgrades for covid ventilation and so forth, and yup, it got voted down again. People want it done, but they don't want to pay for it. Actually there is no viable reason to hold a bond issue for these things. Schools are infrastructure and we just passed a trillion some odd dollar bill for infrastructure. Where is that money? Oh that's right some of it went to improving the park in San Francisco and other pork projects instead of schools. How far would 53 billion dollars go that went to a corrupt nation? The money is already there but all this stuff has been politicized. For verification one only needs to look at a former POTUS comparing the Texas tragedy to George Floyd yet liberals say they want to come together with us. It's all BS and eventually the responsibility to protect your children will be on you and that won't be done without the 2nd. Just my opinion.
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Re: People crying about background checks.
[Re: D.O.C.989]
#14377671
05/26/22 03:27 PM
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 19,866
Emit R Detsaw
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 19,866 |
We absolutely still need to make schools safer. I don't understand how this hasn't already been addressed. At least one armed guard and bullet proof exterior glass should be the bare minimum requirements.
After our school shooting a few years back there was a bond measure on the ballot to do just that. People voted it down because they didn't want their taxes raised. It was on the ballot again this year along with other school upgrades for covid ventilation and so forth, and yup, it got voted down again. People want it done, but they don't want to pay for it. Actually there is no viable reason to hold a bond issue for these things. Schools are infrastructure and we just passed a trillion some odd dollar bill for infrastructure. Where is that money? Oh that's right some of it went to improving the park in San Francisco and other pork projects instead of schools. How far would 53 billion dollars go that went to a corrupt nation? The money is already there but all this stuff has been politicized. For verification one only needs to look at a former POTUS comparing the Texas tragedy to George Floyd yet liberals say they want to come together with us. It's all BS and eventually the responsibility to protect your children will be on you and that won't be done without the 2nd. Just my opinion. The way the voting measure stated it, there is federal money, but it is a matching deal. School would get X amount of Federal Infrastructure money if they matched it. People voted against matching it. I think they still get to spend Covid Relief money from the Fed, but that is only for the HVAC/Ventilation stuff.
May you be treated the way you treat other people, today and everyday!
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Re: People crying about background checks.
[Re: flashman252]
#14377713
05/26/22 04:15 PM
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 11,614
Razorback
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 11,614 |
It sure is and I know a guy sells weapons privately (buys and sells CONSTANTLY) but ALWAYS keeps a bill of sale with serial number. Saved his arse one day as we were at his house for a bbq and 3 blacked out SUV's roll up. When answering the door, they asked about a firearm that he had bought at a local gun shop. Told him he sold it and went to his gun safe, pulled out a big stack of bill of sales and gave a copy to them. Cleared his name right then and there. If that one document did not exist, he would of been taken in for questioning, guaranteed. No, the government would never keep a record of every gun you buy and register and be able to come to your house at any time, and for any reason that serves their purposes. Well I am telling you, they came to his house and had questions right then and there about a handgun with a serial number in question. The above statement is correct about ATF coming and getting a name off a 4473 form. When I worked at sportsmans, they did it every so often. If there is a firearm bought and used in a crime, they can and will figure out who the original buyer was and follow a paper trail if there is one. I was being sarcastic. Of course government will use any and every tool at its disposal for any purpose government wants, constitutional or not. Phone records, wiretaps, eavesdropping...we already know about a lot of it. There is a lot more that we as citizens haven't learned about yet.
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Re: People crying about background checks.
[Re: Razorback]
#14377772
05/26/22 05:00 PM
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Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 489
flashman252
Angler
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Angler
Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 489 |
It sure is and I know a guy sells weapons privately (buys and sells CONSTANTLY) but ALWAYS keeps a bill of sale with serial number. Saved his arse one day as we were at his house for a bbq and 3 blacked out SUV's roll up. When answering the door, they asked about a firearm that he had bought at a local gun shop. Told him he sold it and went to his gun safe, pulled out a big stack of bill of sales and gave a copy to them. Cleared his name right then and there. If that one document did not exist, he would of been taken in for questioning, guaranteed. No, the government would never keep a record of every gun you buy and register and be able to come to your house at any time, and for any reason that serves their purposes. Well I am telling you, they came to his house and had questions right then and there about a handgun with a serial number in question. The above statement is correct about ATF coming and getting a name off a 4473 form. When I worked at sportsmans, they did it every so often. If there is a firearm bought and used in a crime, they can and will figure out who the original buyer was and follow a paper trail if there is one. I was being sarcastic. Of course government will use any and every tool at its disposal for any purpose government wants, constitutional or not. Phone records, wiretaps, eavesdropping...we already know about a lot of it. There is a lot more that we as citizens haven't learned about yet. FACTS!!!
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