texasfishingforum.com logo
Main Menu
Advertisement
Affiliates
Advertisement
Newest Members
Todd Farnsley, Buster Delagarza, TXPuma, dallasangler, The Faceless Fisherman
116096 Registered Users
Top Posters(All Time)
TexDawg 105,099
hopalong 101,066
Pilothawk 81,439
John175☮ 80,342
Bigbob_FTW 77,385
JDavis7873 67,408
Derek 🐝 67,156
Mark Perry 64,446
Forum Statistics
Forums61
Topics1,159,882
Posts15,865,660
Members141,096
Most Online36,273
Jan 23rd, 2013
Print Thread
Page 2 of 4 1 2 3 4
Re: THE STICKLE HOOK [Re: leanin post] #13981130 05/01/21 12:25 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6,496
L
leanin post Offline OP
TFF Celebrity
OP Offline
TFF Celebrity
L
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6,496
Bud I looked at my Do - it mold and the mold is slotted for a 90 degree bend hook. the only way it could be modified to work is to fill the existing slot with jb weld, or solder, and recut slots in the mold with a dremel tool to fit the bend in the shank and drill the eye deeper. .
Im sure a custom mold could be made though, Ive heard of blank molds that can be cut at a machine shop, or mold maker.
It will be alot easier to just drill the eye a bit deeper in an existing mold. a 5 minute modification, no money spent and use a 90 degree bend hook.
Im working to get a high quality, nickel plated , low flex hook made at an affordable price. those mustads are great hooks.
I tried just bending a regular hook eye to the horizontal angle and they snap. I tried heating one up as well and it will bend, but when it cools, it becomes brittle and loses strength, and snaps easily.

Last edited by leanin post; 05/01/21 12:34 AM.

COMING SOON! .. THE STICKLE HOOK " the stay level sickle hook". sits level in the water with all knots.! Provides better hook sets and more natural jigging motion. No more adjusting the knot, gluing , or tying loop knots that cause the hook point to tangle in the loop, or worse knick the line.. The jighook that will make all others obsolete !
Re: THE STICKLE HOOK [Re: leanin post] #13981741 05/01/21 03:46 PM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,002
B
Bud B Offline
Extreme Angler
Offline
Extreme Angler
B
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,002
Originally Posted by leanin post
thanks Bud, I have seen those, but I want a 90 degree angle for the balancing factor as well as hookset action.

But if the eye is in the right place, and the rest of the bend is pretty much contained within the jig, it doesn't much matter what the bend was. And I suspect those 32900 jigs are strong enough that the bend could be changed a bit, too. I don't mind modifying my round head mold, since I really don't make round head jigs anymore. I was already making a Barlow's order. I'll post a photo when I get a jig made.


Bud Baker
Gun Barrel City, Tx

[Linked Image]
Re: THE STICKLE HOOK [Re: leanin post] #13981781 05/01/21 04:30 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6,496
L
leanin post Offline OP
TFF Celebrity
OP Offline
TFF Celebrity
L
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6,496
typically in metallurgy, the stronger the metal is, the more brittle. this goes for hooks, knives, ect. you can have one, or the other, but not both.,. there is a balance. the tempering process usually determines this. I spoke with someone abt the process, and asked why light wire hooks are so flexible compared to other and they told me tempering. Getting a hook just right is quite a task, because of the thickness parameters that must be used. there are many recipes. some closely gaurded secrets in the industry. in respect to the strength of the hook, cost to manufacture plays a large role in what can be made and sold. nobody is going to pay a dollar for a crappie hook, made from an exotic alloy of expensive materials.
I have tried bending the eye on several, and they snap, maybe yours are different. some will bend, but try bending it the other way, simulating a hookset on a big fish, and see what happens, it will break.
The angle of the eye is very important in my opinion for vertical fishing. with the eye at a 45, the jig is simply not going to sit as level in the water as with a 90 degree angle, and when you set the hook, the 45 will tend to pull out of the fishes mouth, rather than upward, especially if your not fishing horizontally. like pitching a jig out.
also as I mentioned the jigging motion will also be different.
Before you modify your mold, maybe try bending a few hooks, then try them out, the eye may not snap off right away, like several of the ones I tried did but may snap off when one of those big 2 lb slabs you catch runs around a bridge column.
in the pic of the jig I posted, the eye snapped inside the head, I just turned the eye horizontally to get the idea across.
you may be better finding a lightwire hook, bending it, then try some tempering,.
if you decide you dont want to spend weeks or months trying to work all of this out, just wait a bit, and the perfect hook will be available to just do a 5 minute mod to your mold, pour it, and have the best crappie fishing hook in the world made for everyone from beginning anglers, to competition anglers who realize the importance of a natural presentation for thier jigs, and with minimal hookflex , wide gap and sharp point to seal the deal while being able to tie a strong knot. that wont get tangled or knicked by point. all increasing the chances of putting more fish and bigger fish in the livewell.
increase strikes, and reduce loss of fish. If this hook helps to catch even 30 percent more fish in a year, its well worth it in my opinion,.
Thank you for taking interest in what im trying to do, it really helps solidifies my belief in the design of the hook im going to produce. I will likely give samples away for testing and would love to send u some, as I respect your opinion. thanks
I will be headed to cedar creek in a couple weeks, to do some fishing, hoping to find some big fish. im yet to catch a 2 lb er.,. very close, but they are rare in central texas, for me anyway. with central texas having mostly white crappie, u would think there would be plenty. our crappie tend to be quite long, like racehorses, but just dont have the girth or retain as much weight. when cleaned the vee in the fillets is almost non existent.


COMING SOON! .. THE STICKLE HOOK " the stay level sickle hook". sits level in the water with all knots.! Provides better hook sets and more natural jigging motion. No more adjusting the knot, gluing , or tying loop knots that cause the hook point to tangle in the loop, or worse knick the line.. The jighook that will make all others obsolete !
Re: THE STICKLE HOOK [Re: leanin post] #13981932 05/01/21 08:11 PM
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 3,498
K
Ken Gaby Offline
TFF Team Angler
Offline
TFF Team Angler
K
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 3,498
Reference the bend of the shank and an eye at 45 or 90 degrees to facilitate the hook set: worm hooks for bass fishing have no bend, shank is straight to the eye except for the hooks with an offset to aid in getting the worm straight. Those hooks have the eye bending away from the point. Seems the bass guys don't have a problem with hook sets and straight shanks; even when casting long distances. Crappie minnow hooks have been straight for 100 years. Maybe the hook gap has more to do with the hook set than the direction of the eye.


A life without God is like an unsharpened pencil, it has no point. Billy Graham
http://www.proanglertackle.com Best crappie and catfish rods/reels
http://www.crazyanglertackle.com Premium crappie baits and jig tying accessories
www.thermoclinelures.com / "Helping YOU catch MORE & LARGER fish!"
http://www.beereadys.com World's Best Rod Holders
Re: THE STICKLE HOOK [Re: leanin post] #13981942 05/01/21 08:23 PM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,002
B
Bud B Offline
Extreme Angler
Offline
Extreme Angler
B
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,002
I don't think I would need to bend the 32900 hooks at all to fit my mold. But if I do bend them, I wouldn't try bending at the eye. I'll bend at the bottom of the angle. If you'll check the jig makers forum, you'll see my thread there about Victory hooks. I posted some photos of Mustad 32746 hooks that I had widened the gap on (that's always been my only gripe about those hooks; I like a wider gap, hence my attraction to the Victory/Matsuo hooks). Even after bending to widen the gap, the 32746 hooks still pretty much refused to bend when I hung them up. That is some really strong metal. But I've never had a problem with them breaking, so it's not over-hardened metal, either.

But even if they refuse to bend at the bottom of the angle, you'd still be tying to the center of the eye of a round wire. I wouldn't think 60 degrees would have a lot of effect, as long as that round wire eye is sitting at the correct placement on top of the jig. A knot would center itself, or rotate, the same on an eye that's sitting at 60 degrees or 90 degrees. Perhaps the eye will be far enough above the jig that the location of the eye will be, as you surmise, too far forward. If that's the case, and I can't bend the angle, I'll try the hooks on the pill head jigs I normally use. The hook eyes are much closer to the jig head on them, so an eye sitting too far forward because of the 60 degree bend shouldn't happen.

Your hook inspiration happened at a time when I'm already experimenting with hooks myself, so it's another thing to try. I really like the 32746 hooks, when I'm wanting a stronger hook, especially now that I've learned to widen the gap. But, there are places where I still want a more bendy hook. And I want one that, unlike the Victory or Matsuo hooks, is still a viable hook after it's been bent once, and you have to bend it back. I know hooks like that are out there, but it's been so long since I've used a softer hook other than a Matsuo that I don't remember which ones tolerate re-bending better. And so many of the softer hooks have a curved point, which I really don't like. I enjoy experimenting when jig making, and it will be even more fun testing them out on the lake. It doesn't take much of an excuse to get me out crappie fishing on Cedar Creek. I go a couple of times most weeks.


Bud Baker
Gun Barrel City, Tx

[Linked Image]
Re: THE STICKLE HOOK [Re: Ken Gaby] #13982011 05/01/21 09:33 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6,496
L
leanin post Offline OP
TFF Celebrity
OP Offline
TFF Celebrity
L
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6,496
Originally Posted by Ken Gaby
Reference the bend of the shank and an eye at 45 or 90 degrees to facilitate the hook set: worm hooks for bass fishing have no bend, shank is straight to the eye except for the hooks with an offset to aid in getting the worm straight. Those hooks have the eye bending away from the point. Seems the bass guys don't have a problem with hook sets and straight shanks; even when casting long distances. Crappie minnow hooks have been straight for 100 years. Maybe the hook gap has more to do with the hook set than the direction of the eye.


I believe you are correct, in instances when you are not fishing vertically, , it doesnt matter as much, but most crappie fisherman usually do fish mostly vertically.
the bass sector is also getting in on the eye, check out CROSS EYEZ jighead. but it too sits at a 45 degree angle to the shank.
Bass fisherman have many different ways to fish different baits, such as octopus hooks for drop shotting, true turn hooks for worms, . super wide gap hooks for flukes, from an 18 inch worm to a 2 inch coffee tube. the list goes on forever. as crappie fisherman we either put a one to 3 inch plastic jig on it, or tie some feathers on it.
comparing a bass fishermans hooks to crappie fishermans is really comparing apples to oranges, just way to different. most bass fisherman who fish vertically use slab spoons in deeper water. 95 percent of thier presentation is a cast and retrieve.


COMING SOON! .. THE STICKLE HOOK " the stay level sickle hook". sits level in the water with all knots.! Provides better hook sets and more natural jigging motion. No more adjusting the knot, gluing , or tying loop knots that cause the hook point to tangle in the loop, or worse knick the line.. The jighook that will make all others obsolete !
Re: THE STICKLE HOOK [Re: leanin post] #13982786 05/02/21 07:07 PM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,002
B
Bud B Offline
Extreme Angler
Offline
Extreme Angler
B
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,002
One of the reasons I'd like to test this style hook is that most of my crappie fishing is no longer vertical fishing, it's casting. But even when swimming crappie jigs, the retrieve is so slow, I still think that hook eye needs to be in the same place as when vertical fishing. I'll be comparing eye placement of these new hooks with other jigs I've made to see if I get it the same. One of the questions I have is: how well will a jig keep itself horizontal during a retrieve with this eye orientation versus a conventional jig? It makes me wish I could watch retrieves in a big tank to compare.

I also wonder if small braided line will still be as prone to escaping the hook eye through the eye gap if a loop knot is used with this style hook.


Bud Baker
Gun Barrel City, Tx

[Linked Image]
Re: THE STICKLE HOOK [Re: leanin post] #13982824 05/02/21 07:54 PM
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 4,704
B
BJH ( JUST JIGGING) Online Crying
TFF Team Angler
Online Crying
TFF Team Angler
B
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 4,704
Yeah !!!!! Let's reinvent the Wheel!!! hammer


I would agree with you , but then we would both be WRONG !!!!!
Re: THE STICKLE HOOK [Re: BJH ( JUST JIGGING)] #13983222 05/03/21 02:53 AM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,002
B
Bud B Offline
Extreme Angler
Offline
Extreme Angler
B
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,002
Originally Posted by BJH ( JUST JIGGING)
Yeah !!!!! Let's reinvent the Wheel!!! hammer

Let's be thankful the wheel went through some improvements. That stone wheel might ride a little rough on the highways.


Bud Baker
Gun Barrel City, Tx

[Linked Image]
Re: THE STICKLE HOOK [Re: Bud B] #13983294 05/03/21 04:57 AM
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 209
B
Brent's Dad Offline
Outdoorsman
Offline
Outdoorsman
B
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 209
I am 70 years of age, been fishing for 60 years. First 30 years bass fishing, last 30 years crappie fishing. I guess you can call me a cross breed fisherman. Can’t honestly say that I have experience the issue that Is trying to be resolved or improved upon here. The only time I have experienced a hook set issue is when the hook eye is not aligned with the hook point or the hook gap is wrong. Each can be easily fixed with a needle noise pliers. Until I experience a hook set problem, I don’t believe I will find a need for a new improved hook that Mr. Leaning Post is developing here. When developed and is proven to be the best hook ever, I doubt that I will discard the many 100s of jigs I own now to resolve a problem I don’t have. Not bashing the idea, fishing tackle improvement is always good. And if I deplete my current stash of jigs/hooks, I see no reason not to try the Leaning Post design.


(Crappie Jigging)
Re: THE STICKLE HOOK [Re: Brent's Dad] #13983687 05/03/21 03:45 PM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,002
B
Bud B Offline
Extreme Angler
Offline
Extreme Angler
B
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,002
Originally Posted by Brent's Dad
I am 70 years of age, been fishing for 60 years. First 30 years bass fishing, last 30 years crappie fishing. I guess you can call me a cross breed fisherman. Can’t honestly say that I have experience the issue that Is trying to be resolved or improved upon here. The only time I have experienced a hook set issue is when the hook eye is not aligned with the hook point or the hook gap is wrong. Each can be easily fixed with a needle noise pliers. Until I experience a hook set problem, I don’t believe I will find a need for a new improved hook that Mr. Leaning Post is developing here. When developed and is proven to be the best hook ever, I doubt that I will discard the many 100s of jigs I own now to resolve a problem I don’t have. Not bashing the idea, fishing tackle improvement is always good. And if I deplete my current stash of jigs/hooks, I see no reason not to try the Leaning Post design.

I am also 70. I switched from mostly bass fishing to mostly crappie fishing a bit more recent than you, 15 years ago. And as many fish as I catch, I really don't need to change anything. But, there will always be those of us who like to tinker. That's why there will always be new innovations coming along. People can choose to use those new innovations, or not. I, for example, have nothing but cheap electronics on my boat, and haven't seen the need or had to urge to upgrade to what so many anglers now think they can no longer live without. To each his own.


Bud Baker
Gun Barrel City, Tx

[Linked Image]
Re: THE STICKLE HOOK [Re: leanin post] #13987069 05/05/21 08:21 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6,496
L
leanin post Offline OP
TFF Celebrity
OP Offline
TFF Celebrity
L
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6,496
I believe fishing has alot to do with human instincts, Ive seen folks with great boats, sonar, equiptment , but they just cant figure it out,. they are not tuned in to nature and rely on reports of where a guy caught fish yesterday.

300 years ago man fished with fishhooks made of bone and thorn, then something better came along, iron.
centuries later, tempering, forging and alloys, then plating. all of this came to be because we are always trying to improve the effectiveness of the tools we use. new technology always opens doors for improvements across many spectrum's.
Sometimes improvements are hiding in plain sight, because we tend to think that it must not be a good idea, because nobody else has not done it yet, and just continue to use the same old same old.
some folks are initiators, some imitators. its just how it is.
Time will tell if my idea is a worthwhile endeavor. I am getting alot of positive feedback from peoples whose opinion I value. with the covid situation the hobby of fishing is at an all time high, over 8 million new fisherman and woman above last years average, so its a great time to put out new tackle. cheers


COMING SOON! .. THE STICKLE HOOK " the stay level sickle hook". sits level in the water with all knots.! Provides better hook sets and more natural jigging motion. No more adjusting the knot, gluing , or tying loop knots that cause the hook point to tangle in the loop, or worse knick the line.. The jighook that will make all others obsolete !
Re: THE STICKLE HOOK [Re: Bud B] #13988165 05/06/21 05:15 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6,496
L
leanin post Offline OP
TFF Celebrity
OP Offline
TFF Celebrity
L
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6,496
Originally Posted by Bud B
Originally Posted by BJH ( JUST JIGGING)
Yeah !!!!! Let's reinvent the Wheel!!! hammer

Let's be thankful the wheel went through some improvements. That stone wheel might ride a little rough on the highways.



yes, not many people are still driving thier great grandfathers model T anymore. and nobody is making them. when they were made they were revolutionary, now they are considered crude, inefficient, unsafe . unreliable dinosaurs. If it wasnt for people who challenged the status quo, its good enough already mindset, we may still be driving them., hammer


COMING SOON! .. THE STICKLE HOOK " the stay level sickle hook". sits level in the water with all knots.! Provides better hook sets and more natural jigging motion. No more adjusting the knot, gluing , or tying loop knots that cause the hook point to tangle in the loop, or worse knick the line.. The jighook that will make all others obsolete !
Re: THE STICKLE HOOK [Re: Brent's Dad] #13988196 05/06/21 05:35 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6,496
L
leanin post Offline OP
TFF Celebrity
OP Offline
TFF Celebrity
L
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6,496
Originally Posted by Brent's Dad
I am 70 years of age, been fishing for 60 years. First 30 years bass fishing, last 30 years crappie fishing. I guess you can call me a cross breed fisherman. Can’t honestly say that I have experience the issue that Is trying to be resolved or improved upon here. The only time I have experienced a hook set issue is when the hook eye is not aligned with the hook point or the hook gap is wrong. Each can be easily fixed with a needle noise pliers. Until I experience a hook set problem, I don’t believe I will find a need for a new improved hook that Mr. Leaning Post is developing here. When developed and is proven to be the best hook ever, I doubt that I will discard the many 100s of jigs I own now to resolve a problem I don’t have. Not bashing the idea, fishing tackle improvement is always good. And if I deplete my current stash of jigs/hooks, I see no reason not to try the Leaning Post design.



thanks for your thoughts, let me ask you what type of knot do you tie to keep the jig level in the water with the vertical eyed hooks u use now? unless u tie a loop knot, its not sitting level. so your either missing ALOT of fish because they wont hit it do to sitting vertically in the water, or your constantly adjusting the knot position.
the only remedy for this is glue, which is messy, weakens the line because it makes it brittle, and gives off chemicals that may turn crappie away. OR the loop knot, which is a dicey knot. if you dont tie it so the loop is close to the eye, it will tangle in the hook point, or knick the line, it also has 2 points of potential failure instead of one,.
last when u set the hook, the eye slides on the knot causing abrasions. The eye lets are not micro polished, they are tumbled mostly and polishing the inside of the eye would take alot of extra work.
Let me ask you, how do you know how many fish you are missing, if you have never tried something better? Do you hook and land every fish almost every time? If u do, dont change a thing.
I think alot of the reasoning for some folks not liking the idea, is because they have 100s of vertical style hooks on hand, and feel like they will become obsolete if they find that my jighook is better., wasted money.
I have thousands of the vertical style hooks on hand, so I understand this feeling, but theres plenty of people to sell them to right now, there is a tackle shortage. or make a kids week by giving them away.


COMING SOON! .. THE STICKLE HOOK " the stay level sickle hook". sits level in the water with all knots.! Provides better hook sets and more natural jigging motion. No more adjusting the knot, gluing , or tying loop knots that cause the hook point to tangle in the loop, or worse knick the line.. The jighook that will make all others obsolete !
Re: THE STICKLE HOOK [Re: leanin post] #13989386 05/07/21 06:36 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6,496
L
leanin post Offline OP
TFF Celebrity
OP Offline
TFF Celebrity
L
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6,496
I have discovered another benefit to having the horizontally faced eye today, when you tie a double jig rig, for fishing bridge pilings or deeper structure, the jig stands outward from the line, in a natural, horizontal position. less likely to tangle in the main line and easier for a crappie to eat it. I like to peg a split shot in between the 2 jigs, to keep the whole rig from tangling. I also tie a lighter jig on the top instead of bottom, to keep the weight heavier towards the bottom to prevent tangles.
I also sometimes do a set up called the triple threat, 3 different jigs with a split shot in between them at abt 14 inches apart on a long rod. it is a quick way to find out what depth the fish are hanging in and if theyy are prefering a certain color,or profile
in saltwater baitfishing, ive seen something similar called the Sabiki rig.


COMING SOON! .. THE STICKLE HOOK " the stay level sickle hook". sits level in the water with all knots.! Provides better hook sets and more natural jigging motion. No more adjusting the knot, gluing , or tying loop knots that cause the hook point to tangle in the loop, or worse knick the line.. The jighook that will make all others obsolete !
Page 2 of 4 1 2 3 4
Previous Thread
Index
Next Thread

© 1998-2021 OUTDOOR SITES NETWORK all rights reserved USA and Worldwide
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.3