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Re: MLF Rayburn [Re: Monty Wright] #13938202 03/27/21 03:41 AM
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BigDozer66 Offline
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Originally Posted by Monty Wright
Originally Posted by SC-001
Originally Posted by mlatham
Enjoyed watching all week. The guy on top of Lucas today is a turd. What the hell....

You should have seen the 5 on top of Ehler yesterday


Adrian Avena posted a video on his Instagram story yesterday of an old timer in a john boat basically rubbing his rail as he passed by him hammer


The old guy lives right up in there and seemed to be respecting AA by paddling on by before firing up. cheers


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Re: MLF Rayburn [Re: Big O Florida] #13938550 03/27/21 06:17 PM
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Duck_Hunter Offline
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Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by Mark Jones
Originally Posted by Tx Tree Grower
Ott is one of the best. He's proven that in every format he has ever fished, but it is ironic and eye opening that mighty Sam was won on a string of 2lbers. It really does highlight the major major differences in the two formats. In a 5 fish format Clausen beats Ott by around 5lbs today. Sphorer would have also beat Ott. I'm not saying one is right and one is wrong, but they are very different. Lots of traditional 5 fish guys will never like this format because of this exact scenario. So just to clarify Mark and Dubee, I'm not criticizing. I enjoyed watching. Just pointing out some facts as I see them.


I have ZERO issue with anyone’s honest feedback on watching MLF or BASS. That ending was flat crazy but that’s exactly what it’s built for, drama. In a BASS event you wouldn’t see any of that and you’d still be sitting there watching the weigh in roll...

Some people love it, others don’t but that drama is way more fun to me as a viewer. Can’t wait for Heavy Hitters!


Well, “30,000 people with $1,000,000” in their pockets ready to spend would definitely be there to see it.

The world is digital. It just is, Big O. Nobody gives a flying fart about weigh ins. You tubes, instagrams, TV time is where the money is at. It’s been the future for a decade and Bass tournament fishing is finally catching up. Every other legitimate sports league in the world realizes TV and social media are the way of the future. Hell, it’s been more profitable for a decade.

Nobody in a position of decision making gives two sneezes about 300 people at a weigh in if you can put it in front of 300,000 people on TV.

Sponsors will make way more money via social media than showing tournaments on TV. Give it a rest.


With all due respect, Duck, I am not even going to get into trying to rebut that nonsensical post. However, since you seem convinced of what you write, then surely you can list many examples of other “legitimate sports” that have forgone live spectator audiences for TV and social media exclusively. Let’s start with you naming 5, if you can’t name 5, then name 4, and if you can’t 4, then 3, and so on.... also notice I emphasized live... because I don’t know any apart from MLF that thinks there is more marketing value in a prerecorded broadcast 4-5 months after the event took place.


I am not saying any other sport is foregoing live spectators. I am saying the majority of the revenue comes from TV deals and other promotions as a rebuttal to your continued insistence that having a few thousand people at a weigh in is the end-all, be-all of success of pro sports. Most of the videos on Twitter the PGA puts out are highlights of players and are preceded by a short advertisement, which makes money for the PGA and allows fans to see cool shots on their phone while they’re going about their business. The vast majority of fans do NOT attend one specific game or tournament in person. There are only so many people that can attend, so there’s a cap on revenue to be made from in-person attendance. They watch it on TV, stream it or listen to it on the radio. If they can’t, they DVR it or watch highlights on social media.

You’re arguing that professional sports leagues have to have live audiences is ridiculous because the majority of their revenue comes from sports media rights, online promotion and merchandise. NFL stadiums average 70,000 ticket sales per game (basically selling out every game). But, you can’t grow when you’re already selling out, and there’s a breaking point when you start raising ticket and concession costs. The TV rights bring in $296 million for each team. They continue to go up every few years when contracts are renegotiated.

That is where every pro sports league makes its money, and that is my point. Bass fishing is incredibly hard to watch in person and you can’t (or shouldn’t) get too close to the anglers due to the nature of the sport. Sponsors get way more exposure from people viewing on TV streaming, or anglers posting on social media. That’s my point. You keep railing on and on about in person audiences, and that’s an important piece for a lot of sports, but the real exposure comes from people watching sports on TV or their other devices.

When I go to the Colonial, I can’t tell who made the shirt Ricky Fowler is wearing. When I watch on TV, I can clearly see he’s decked out in Puma gear. You think Puma pays him so a fraction of the people at golf tournaments who actually get close enough to him to see Puma on his hat might buy Puma merchandise? Or is it the 100 closeups the TV cameras capture of him that clearly show PUMA across his hat?

Here are revenue numbers for MLB, NFL, NBA, NHL and PGA. The majority does not come from ticket or concession sales. MLF intentionally holds tournaments during the week and obviously created a tournament style that puts an emphasis on live scoring and drama, not a weigh in two hours and 60 miles after the event.

The point is, you continue to overemphasize BASS’ weigh ins as some miracle money maker. The exposure comes from more people watching, and that happens remotely for every sport since cable television was invented. It’s only grown more because of the Internet. Live audiences are important, but that’s not the only metric that matters, ESPECIALLY in a sport like bass fishing, and MLF is showing you can have a viable tournament trail without them being a major part of the pie.

“MLB estimates that 40% of revenue comes from tickets, concessions and other gate-related income.”

https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id...e-2020-mlb-season-get-really-really-ugly

“ A previous deal between the PGA Tour, CBS and NBC was valued at around $400 million, according to people familiar with the matter. PGA Tour officials are said to have negotiated an increase of at least 70% for the next rights pact, meaning the new cost could come to at least $680 million.”

https://variety.com/2020/tv/news/pga-tour-golf-rights-cbs-nbc-espn-1203527292/

(Ticket and concession sales aren’t going to magically increase 70% like TV revenues did.)

“TV accounts for most of the NBA’s revenue. For the 2016-2017 season, TNT and ESPN re-upped their contracts to an estimated $24 billion in total. The nine-year deal earns the NBA approximately $2.6 billion per year. Even with a total of 400-odd active players making an average of close to $6.7 million annually (as of 2019-20), national TV contracts generate enough revenue to cover salaries and then some.”

“You may be surprised that ticketing is actually not one of the primary sources of revenue for the NBA. It tends to lag behind some of the other revenue streams mentioned above.”

https://www.investopedia.com/articles/personal-finance/071415/how-nba-makes-money.asp

“The NFL earns the lion’s share of its money with TV deals. According to the Chicago Tribune, more than 50% of the league’s $15 billion annual revenue comes from TV deals.”

“On average, NFL stadiums seat about 70,000 people, and games usually sell out. This doesn’t leave much opportunity for growth. The average ticket price has increased by about 7% annually since the turn of the century. The average price for an NFL ticket cost about $30 in 2000 and increased to about $151 in 2020, but the added revenue from these increases are negligible when compared to revenue growth from TV.”

https://www.investopedia.com/articles/personal-finance/062515/how-nfl-makes-money.asp

“ Gate revenue is approximately 36.6% of the NHL’s entire revenue for a season (30% in baseball, 22% in NBA basketball, and 15% in the NFL). In contrast, the AHL generates 70-75% of its annual revenue from fans attending games.”

https://novacapsfans.com/2020/05/13/how-much-money-does-an-nhl-home-game-generate/


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Re: MLF Rayburn [Re: J.H.S.] #13938557 03/27/21 06:33 PM
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Duck_Hunter Offline
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Originally Posted by J.H.S.
Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by Mark Jones
Originally Posted by Tx Tree Grower
Ott is one of the best. He's proven that in every format he has ever fished, but it is ironic and eye opening that mighty Sam was won on a string of 2lbers. It really does highlight the major major differences in the two formats. In a 5 fish format Clausen beats Ott by around 5lbs today. Sphorer would have also beat Ott. I'm not saying one is right and one is wrong, but they are very different. Lots of traditional 5 fish guys will never like this format because of this exact scenario. So just to clarify Mark and Dubee, I'm not criticizing. I enjoyed watching. Just pointing out some facts as I see them.


I have ZERO issue with anyone’s honest feedback on watching MLF or BASS. That ending was flat crazy but that’s exactly what it’s built for, drama. In a BASS event you wouldn’t see any of that and you’d still be sitting there watching the weigh in roll...

Some people love it, others don’t but that drama is way more fun to me as a viewer. Can’t wait for Heavy Hitters!


Well, “30,000 people with $1,000,000” in their pockets ready to spend would definitely be there to see it.

The world is digital. It just is, Big O. Nobody gives a flying fart about weigh ins. You tubes, instagrams, TV time is where the money is at. It’s been the future for a decade and Bass tournament fishing is finally catching up. Every other legitimate sports league in the world realizes TV and social media are the way of the future. Hell, it’s been more profitable for a decade.

Nobody in a position of decision making gives two sneezes about 300 people at a weigh in if you can put it in front of 300,000 people on TV.

Sponsors will make way more money via social media than showing tournaments on TV. Give it a rest.



If that’s your opinion then tell me why certain sponsors have jumped ship. Also why did G-Man publicly state his were relieved that he was heading back to BASS? Just curious.


I am not sure. Each business is different and has to find the right deal for their business model. I’m also unsure why that’s the case for Swindle. Originally he said he was returning to his home and what he was comfortable with. Perhaps his sponsors felt the same. Without context, it’s hard to understand.


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Re: MLF Rayburn [Re: Duck_Hunter] #13938665 03/27/21 10:05 PM
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B
Big O Florida Offline
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Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter

... That’s my point. You keep railing on and on about in person audiences, and that’s an important piece for a lot of sports, but the real exposure comes from people watching sports on TV or their other devices...


All that you listed would not have the TV or other social media audiences if it wasn’t for them first catering to the spectators that attend “live” events. Not one. As a matter of fact there has been much written in 2020/21 about how the TV audience for all sports has gone down significantly since COVID became a thing, and I would opine that has a direct correlation with those sports not being able to have and entertain spectators in attendance during their live events. Despite the challenges for fishing tournaments and in attendance spectators being able to view the action, the tournament scene for years has always drawn crowds to the boat ramps at the conclusion for people to see the catches made by the anglers. The weigh-in is part of the event spectators can be part of, and minus that people start to lose interest in the sport all together. As evidenced by what’s transpired in all the other sports during COVID.

MLF provides nothing for spectators/fans and it’s LIVE action is very limited to their website exclusively and is considered unreliable because it is totally dependent on the quality of the customers connection to the website. They seem t think there is an appetite for and apply just as much value (sold to potential sponsors) to broadcast of pre-recorded tournaments that took place many months ago, and I opine that could not be further from the truth.

Re: MLF Rayburn [Re: Darin S.] #13938711 03/27/21 11:02 PM
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Duck_Hunter Offline
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“Considered unreliable”

roflmao

In-person attendance is completely reliant on people’s willingness and ability to attend, rather than watch on TV or stream.


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Re: MLF Rayburn [Re: Duck_Hunter] #13938720 03/27/21 11:22 PM
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Big O Florida Offline
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Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
“Considered unreliable”

roflmao

In-person attendance is completely reliant on people’s willingness and ability to attend, rather than watch on TV or stream.


BASS has proven “people’s willingness and ability to attend” for years and years now. How else do you explain the crowds they consistently bring to their tournaments? Not to leave without mention, their once a year Classic event. How do you explain it? And they’ve been broadcasting their events LIVE since before the internet - go figure!

Re: MLF Rayburn [Re: Darin S.] #13938768 03/28/21 12:18 AM
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the skipper Offline
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I will say this, quite a few times the announcers talked about the score tracker and who was so far behind or whatever and the score tracker wasnt even close to what they said. At first I thought, well they will show a guy catch a fish soon and it will catch up but it didnt happen. It just seemed weird. There may a good reason but it does seem they may be trying to create some last minute drama

Re: MLF Rayburn [Re: Big O Florida] #13938839 03/28/21 01:31 AM
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Duck_Hunter Offline
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Originally Posted by Big O Florida
Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
“Considered unreliable”

roflmao

In-person attendance is completely reliant on people’s willingness and ability to attend, rather than watch on TV or stream.


BASS has proven “people’s willingness and ability to attend” for years and years now. How else do you explain the crowds they consistently bring to their tournaments? Not to leave without mention, their once a year Classic event. How do you explain it? And they’ve been broadcasting their events LIVE since before the internet - go figure!


Again, the money to be made is in TV and other media. I don’t know how else to explain it to an obtuse fanboy.


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Re: MLF Rayburn [Re: Darin S.] #13940595 03/29/21 04:39 PM
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J.H.S. Offline
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[/quote] I am not sure. Each business is different and has to find the right deal for their business model. I’m also unsure why that’s the case for Swindle. Originally he said he was returning to his home and what he was comfortable with. Perhaps his sponsors felt the same. Without context, it’s hard to understand. [/quote]

That's fair enough. I am genuinely curious myself. Probably won't ever know the true reasons.


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Re: MLF Rayburn [Re: J.H.S.] #13940639 03/29/21 05:10 PM
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SC-001 Offline
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Originally Posted by J.H.S.

I am not sure. Each business is different and has to find the right deal for their business model. I’m also unsure why that’s the case for Swindle. Originally he said he was returning to his home and what he was comfortable with. Perhaps his sponsors felt the same. Without context, it’s hard to understand. [/quote]

That's fair enough. I am genuinely curious myself. Probably won't ever know the true reasons.
[/quote]
From the outside looking in he seems like an idiot savant.

Re: MLF Rayburn [Re: J.H.S.] #13940982 03/29/21 10:20 PM
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Duck_Hunter Offline
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Originally Posted by J.H.S.
That's fair enough. I am genuinely curious myself. Probably won't ever know the true reasons.


cheers

I doubt we’ll ever know the true reasons. Probably wouldn’t help anyone out in the long run. Never know what might happen and if you’ll ever want to change again or, hell, another pandemic might cause one tour to fold completely.


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Re: MLF Rayburn [Re: Duck_Hunter] #13941297 03/30/21 03:06 AM
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BigDozer66 Offline
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Originally Posted by Duck_Hunter
Originally Posted by J.H.S.
That's fair enough. I am genuinely curious myself. Probably won't ever know the true reasons.


cheers

I doubt we’ll ever know the true reasons. Probably wouldn’t help anyone out in the long run. Never know what might happen and if you’ll ever want to change again or, hell, another pandemic might cause one tour to fold completely.

cheers


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