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Clutter on Hummingbird Helix 7 (HELP) #13492548 03/29/20 03:15 AM
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I will try to find a similar picture but have a lot of clutter on my newly installed Hummingbird Helix 7 unit. When side imaging, where it is supposed to be black there is a lot of light color of clutter. Down imaging is very cluttered and not clear. I think my unit might have accidentally been installed on the trolling motor battery (deep cycle) instead of the cranking battery.

Thoughts?


Drew
Re: Clutter on Hummingbird Helix 7 (HELP) [Re: NoobBass] #13492558 03/29/20 03:26 AM
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First thing is to verify if the unit is wired to the tm battery if so remove it and put it on the cranking battery. Majority of the time when you wire a graph to the trolling battery you will get rfi

Last edited by 44 Diesel; 03/29/20 03:28 AM.
Re: Clutter on Hummingbird Helix 7 (HELP) [Re: 44 Diesel] #13492562 03/29/20 03:29 AM
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Originally Posted by 44 Diesel
First thing is to verify if the tm is wired to the cranking battery and if so put to on its own dedicated battery


I believe I have the TM wired to deep cycle battery and Cranking battery is dedicated to boat. I want to say fish finder is accidentally installed on TM batter (deep cycle). [Linked Image]

Image is a good example of what mine looks like on DI, maybe not quite as bad. Side imaging has a lot of clutter in the middle where the boat is.


Drew
Re: Clutter on Hummingbird Helix 7 (HELP) [Re: NoobBass] #13492566 03/29/20 03:31 AM
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Does it go away when the trolling motor is off? Where is your transducer installed, pic if possible

Last edited by 44 Diesel; 03/29/20 03:32 AM.
Re: Clutter on Hummingbird Helix 7 (HELP) [Re: NoobBass] #13492567 03/29/20 03:31 AM
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Also, there is an on board charger hooked to both batteries. Obviously not in use while out on the lake.


Drew
Re: Clutter on Hummingbird Helix 7 (HELP) [Re: NoobBass] #13492571 03/29/20 03:33 AM
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Originally Posted by NoobBass
Also, there is an on board charger hooked to both batteries. Obviously not in use while out on the lake.



Battey chargers can bleed rfi as well from the battery

Re: Clutter on Hummingbird Helix 7 (HELP) [Re: 44 Diesel] #13492580 03/29/20 03:43 AM
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Originally Posted by 44 Diesel
Does it go away when the trolling motor is off? Where is your transducer installed, pic if possible


No I don't believe so. Transducer is installed on back left of boat. I don't believe the motor is getting in the way because it's the same on both sides. I don't currently have a pic. Can bleed rfi? The reading on mine doesn't really give a hard bottom on DI. I forgot to take a picture.


Drew
Re: Clutter on Hummingbird Helix 7 (HELP) [Re: NoobBass] #13492599 03/29/20 03:56 AM
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Rfi usually appears as a hazy or cloudy screen when the trolling motor is on and disappear when the trolling motor is not running. I would take the transducer loose and hang it over the side away from the boat and see if it clears up.

Re: Clutter on Hummingbird Helix 7 (HELP) [Re: NoobBass] #13492782 03/29/20 01:30 PM
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Originally Posted by NoobBass
Originally Posted by 44 Diesel
First thing is to verify if the tm is wired to the cranking battery and if so put to on its own dedicated battery


I believe I have the TM wired to deep cycle battery and Cranking battery is dedicated to boat. I want to say fish finder is accidentally installed on TM batter (deep cycle). [Linked Image]

Image is a good example of what mine looks like on DI, maybe not quite as bad. Side imaging has a lot of clutter in the middle where the boat is.



The distinct horizontal lines are from recorded echoes from one of the Side Imaging pulses probably reflecting off a jackplate. Since that unit does not have Down Imaging, it gets Down Imaging views by blending the two SI pulses.

The lighter less distinct parts between the lines is caused by water density change due to temp, very muddy water, or algae that grows very fast as the water warms up.

What you see on DI should also be shown on SI since that is where the data comes from.

Last edited by Wayne P.; 03/29/20 01:32 PM.

Helix 12 CHIRP MEGA SI+ GPS G3N and G4N, 1198c SI, Helix 7 CHIRP MEGA SI GPS G3,
Helix 10 MEGA DI+ GPS G3N, SOLIX 12 SI and G3, MEGA 360, RC-1
Re: Clutter on Hummingbird Helix 7 (HELP) [Re: NoobBass] #13492848 03/29/20 02:13 PM
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Originally Posted by NoobBass
Originally Posted by 44 Diesel
Does it go away when the trolling motor is off? Where is your transducer installed, pic if possible


No I don't believe so. Transducer is installed on back left of boat. I don't believe the motor is getting in the way because it's the same on both sides. I don't currently have a pic. Can bleed rfi? The reading on mine doesn't really give a hard bottom on DI. I forgot to take a picture.

Who on earth did this installation? "might have 'accidentally' been installed on the TM battery"? While there may be other issues, transducers on the transom should never be put on the left side of the centerline. You may look at it and think it's the same, but it is not. Why? Because of the rotation of the propeller. Prop wash pushes to the left side of the centerline when the gear selector is in Forward. This prop wash is a disturbance in the water that typically contains air bubbles, all of which cause interference in sonar signaling.

If the screen clutter is present when the trolling motor is not running, I am very doubtful the TM has anything to do with the issue. When you test this, have you tried it when NOTHING else is running on the boat? That means no pumps, no sound system, no outboard - absolutely nothing else - ONLY the sonar unit. If you do that, and the clutter is still there, you most likely have:

1. Never made any adjustment in beam amplitude (sensitivity) for the sonar, and/or
2. You have a bad transducer location that is causing the trouble.

We can't help much more because you haven't included photos. Lacking knowledge to ever put the transducer on the port side of the prop makes me think the installer didn't understand the obstruction issues when mounting side-scan sonar transducers. Is this your first unit of this kind? Do you know how to operate (adjust) it? Such electronics is unlikely to ever perform very well without the user understand operation and adjusting settings accordingly.

We need to see multiple photos of the transducer installation..

Re: Clutter on Hummingbird Helix 7 (HELP) [Re: NoobBass] #13493305 03/29/20 10:12 PM
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[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]


Drew
Re: Clutter on Hummingbird Helix 7 (HELP) [Re: NoobBass] #13493358 03/29/20 11:09 PM
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From the looks of the pictures its mounted too low. Should be skimming the surface not submerged.

Re: Clutter on Hummingbird Helix 7 (HELP) [Re: NoobBass] #13493420 03/29/20 11:55 PM
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I suspect those two strakes on each side of the transducer are reading turbulence. With the compact si transducer the si creates a composite (computer generated) Di and that would be the reason you get it on your di as well

Last edited by 44 Diesel; 03/29/20 11:56 PM.
Re: Clutter on Hummingbird Helix 7 (HELP) [Re: tmd11111] #13493425 03/29/20 11:57 PM
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Originally Posted by tmd11111
From the looks of the pictures its mounted too low. Should be skimming the surface not submerged.

I agree, probably plowing through the water at any speed on plane, but I'm not sure that's a big deal for slow-speed (idle) operation. I don't expect that transducer installation to ever work very well because it's to the left of the engine and too low. With the transducer plowing, I doubt it will be very effective on plane. Doesn't the Humingbird installation guide show a profile-view illustration of how to position the transducer?

What he doesn't show is a side view with the engine DOWN in the trim position where it would normally be in use. With the engine down, the side-scan will likely not be able to see to the right much at all. Side-sonar signals will be very strong when they reflect off the outboard mid-section and could saturate the transducer crystals with return echo. This is prone to never work very well.

He hasn't said if he has adjusted the sensitivity on the unit. He may have to turn off side-scan for the right side if that can be done on a Helix.

Re: Clutter on Hummingbird Helix 7 (HELP) [Re: NoobBass] #13493532 03/30/20 01:22 AM
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There was distortion evenly on both sides. I don't believe the engine was an issue. I switched the connection to the other battery and am awaiting weather conditions to clear now on Tuesday to take it out. I have saved some settings from videos I have viewed on youtube to see if I can get a more clear picture and switch my color palettes to help. I will post updated results on Tuesday evening.

Thanks again,

Drew


Drew
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