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Jan 23rd, 2013
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Learned something new about community property in Texas #12791334
06/14/18 03:25 AM
06/14/18 03:25 AM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 22,522
Lewisville
Uncle Zeek Online content OP
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Lewisville
So most everyone here probably knows the basics about community property: when you get married, everything you own becomes her stuff. grin

Ok, seriously, the rule is that there's a rebuttable presumption that all marital property is community property. You can show that property is NOT community property with clear & convincing evidence that it is separate property. Separate property is property that you a) owned before marriage, b) inherited during the marriage, or c) was given to you as a gift during the marriage. In general, most people tend to let their separate property get commingled with community property to the point where you can no longer prove that it is your separate property.

One way to prevent property from becoming community property is to have a written agreement before the marriage that certain property (like income from a rental house) will remain separate property after getting married.

So here's the new thing I didn't know about: a married couple can sign a contract agreeing to "partition" certain community property into separate property. Handy estate planning tool for folks on a 2nd (or later) marriage and/or who have children from a previous relationship. This is practical for long-term planning, because everyone dies eventually ... and if you have kids from a previous marriage, you might want to ensure that certain property goes to them no matter what.

(Yeah, I know, boring stuff, but some of this will be on the bar exam!)


"Decency is not news; it is buried in the obituaries --but it is a force stronger than crime" ~ Robert A. Heinlein, 1952

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Re: Learned something new about community property in Texas [Re: Uncle Zeek] #12791345
06/14/18 03:29 AM
06/14/18 03:29 AM
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Posts: 2,874
The Mound
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Settlement money from personal injury lawsuits (not including compensation for lost wages) is considered separate too.

Re: Learned something new about community property in Texas [Re: Uncle Zeek] #12791408
06/14/18 04:56 AM
06/14/18 04:56 AM
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Dallas, TX
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collincountytx Online content
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I don’t understand why anyone would want to get married more than once


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Re: Learned something new about community property in Texas [Re: Uncle Zeek] #12791489
06/14/18 11:51 AM
06/14/18 11:51 AM
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Posts: 6,579
Justin, TX
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Zeek you helped me a month or so ago with a property tax question and protesting. Went to the CAD in Denton yesterday and came away better than expected. Dropped my home property tax from $211K to $188K by simply looking at comps. Huge because I was only looking for $191K. Rental went from $140K to $130K.

Thanks again for your help, sorry this is off topic of your original post which was informative.


I Thes. 5:16-18
Re: Learned something new about community property in Texas [Re: Uncle Zeek] #12791565
06/14/18 01:14 PM
06/14/18 01:14 PM
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Wife and I covered all of that in the Pre-Nup.

Re: Learned something new about community property in Texas [Re: Roller22] #12791646
06/14/18 02:07 PM
06/14/18 02:07 PM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 22,522
Lewisville
Uncle Zeek Online content OP
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Originally Posted By: Roller22
Zeek you helped me a month or so ago with a property tax question and protesting. Went to the CAD in Denton yesterday and came away better than expected. Dropped my home property tax from $211K to $188K by simply looking at comps. Huge because I was only looking for $191K. Rental went from $140K to $130K.

Thanks again for your help, sorry this is off topic of your original post which was informative.


Oh, I don't mind pointing people to information on how to protest property taxes, or similar things. In a perfect world, everyone would protest their property taxes every year, everyone would take all possible deductions on their income taxes and MAIL the paper returns in, everyone would claim their fuel tax refund for boat fuel use, etc, etc.


"Decency is not news; it is buried in the obituaries --but it is a force stronger than crime" ~ Robert A. Heinlein, 1952

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Re: Learned something new about community property in Texas [Re: collincountytx] #12791688
06/14/18 02:26 PM
06/14/18 02:26 PM
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East Texas
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Originally Posted By: collincountytx
I don’t understand why anyone would want to get married more than once


Geeze, where were you when I got married for the fourth time? Although after two divorces, half of nothing is nothing so you don't really loose much... roflmao


G. Trigg
Gilmer, TX

Re: Learned something new about community property in Texas [Re: Uncle Zeek] #12792127
06/14/18 07:58 PM
06/14/18 07:58 PM
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Huntsville, AL
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Fishin' Nut Online content
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I think this is called a "QTIP". My MIL is on marriage #3. He is a very wealthy man. If he dies first, she gets a lump sum settlement and the remainder of his estate goes back to his two sons. If either of them contest the lump sum settlement and lose, they forfeit their portion of their inheritance and it reverts back to the MIL. The lump sum is not small change, so he had that put in there because his two sons would/could litigate my MIL into bankruptcy, if they chose to do so.




Kirk Long (Kikr) March 4, 1959 - June 19, 2009
I guess the Lord needed a fishing buddy more than me.
Re: Learned something new about community property in Texas [Re: GTrigg] #12792146
06/14/18 08:14 PM
06/14/18 08:14 PM
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 17,789
Dallas, TX
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Originally Posted By: GTrigg
Originally Posted By: collincountytx
I don’t understand why anyone would want to get married more than once


Geeze, where were you when I got married for the fourth time? Although after two divorces, half of nothing is nothing so you don't really loose much... roflmao


Bless you. Sounds like your sense of humor has survived intact


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Re: Learned something new about community property in Texas [Re: Fishin' Nut] #12792276
06/14/18 10:03 PM
06/14/18 10:03 PM
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Posts: 22,522
Lewisville
Uncle Zeek Online content OP
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Originally Posted By: Fishin' Nut
I think this is called a "QTIP". My MIL is on marriage #3. He is a very wealthy man. If he dies first, she gets a lump sum settlement and the remainder of his estate goes back to his two sons. If either of them contest the lump sum settlement and lose, they forfeit their portion of their inheritance and it reverts back to the MIL. The lump sum is not small change, so he had that put in there because his two sons would/could litigate my MIL into bankruptcy, if they chose to do so.


That sounds like a will provision rather than a property partition.


"Decency is not news; it is buried in the obituaries --but it is a force stronger than crime" ~ Robert A. Heinlein, 1952

zac@artimlegal.com
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Re: Learned something new about community property in Texas [Re: Uncle Zeek] #12792304
06/14/18 10:33 PM
06/14/18 10:33 PM
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Rockwall,Tx
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Originally Posted By: Uncle Zeek
So most everyone here probably knows the basics about community property: when you get married, everything you own becomes her stuff. grin

Ok, seriously, the rule is that there's a rebuttable presumption that all marital property is community property. You can show that property is NOT community property with clear & convincing evidence that it is separate property. Separate property is property that you a) owned before marriage, b) inherited during the marriage, or c) was given to you as a gift during the marriage. In general, most people tend to let their separate property get commingled with community property to the point where you can no longer prove that it is your separate property.

One way to prevent property from becoming community property is to have a written agreement before the marriage that certain property (like income from a rental house) will remain separate property after getting married.

So here's the new thing I didn't know about: a married couple can sign a contract agreeing to "partition" certain community property into separate property. Handy estate planning tool for folks on a 2nd (or later) marriage and/or who have children from a previous relationship. This is practical for long-term planning, because everyone dies eventually ... and if you have kids from a previous marriage, you might want to ensure that certain property goes to them no matter what.

(Yeah, I know, boring stuff, but some of this will be on the bar exam!)



Sounds like a prenuptial agreement.

Re: Learned something new about community property in Texas [Re: BThomas] #12792322
06/14/18 10:52 PM
06/14/18 10:52 PM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 22,522
Lewisville
Uncle Zeek Online content OP
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Originally Posted By: BThomas
Sounds like a prenuptial agreement.


Yeah, it's almost exactly like a prenup. The difference is that a prenup is an agreement made BEFORE marriage, that only becomes effective UPON marriage.

A partition is an agreement made DURING the marriage, that is effective immediately.


"Decency is not news; it is buried in the obituaries --but it is a force stronger than crime" ~ Robert A. Heinlein, 1952

zac@artimlegal.com
972-436-8974 office
972-746-0758 mobile

Re: Learned something new about community property in Texas [Re: Uncle Zeek] #12792339
06/14/18 11:14 PM
06/14/18 11:14 PM
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 1,532
San Angelo
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All I know is when i got divorced almost 5 years ago it cost me a little over $300k. Community property laws bite the big one.

Re: Learned something new about community property in Texas [Re: Uncle Zeek] #12792353
06/14/18 11:34 PM
06/14/18 11:34 PM
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Rockwall,Tx
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Originally Posted By: Uncle Zeek
Originally Posted By: BThomas
Sounds like a prenuptial agreement.


Yeah, it's almost exactly like a prenup. The difference is that a prenup is an agreement made BEFORE marriage, that only becomes effective UPON marriage.

A partition is an agreement made DURING the marriage, that is effective immediately.



A partition should be called a postnuptial. lol just kidding.

Re: Learned something new about community property in Texas [Re: Uncle Zeek] #12792355
06/14/18 11:37 PM
06/14/18 11:37 PM
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Rockwall,Tx
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At my age I am not getting a divorce.. She would get everything and I would never get to retire. She would get half of my pension, 401K, and the house. She would not get the boat though.

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