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Jan 23rd, 2013
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Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish #12787896
06/11/18 04:48 PM
06/11/18 04:48 PM
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In the last 3 weeks I've heard of lots of dead fish on Rayburn during TxTT Championship, ABA weekend series and the tournament out of Monterrey. I know tpw has done studies on delayed mortality but at what point do they stop having events in the summer? I think they should be required to have a release boat instead of dumping at the ramp. Maybe even pay tpw to help with fish care. Can't be good for the fishery to be losing lots of big fish. Ultimately it's up the angler but it sure seems alot of guys just aren't making the extra effort.

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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12787905
06/11/18 04:54 PM
06/11/18 04:54 PM
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Houston, TX
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I think TPWD should just outlaw tournaments completely. Just kidding. However, I think having five fish stringer tournaments anywhere in Texas this time of year is STUPID. 3 fish max and a 2 lb penalty for a dead fish, instead of .50 lb.


"Things turn out best for those who make the best of the way things turn out" - Zachary Troy Schrah - a young man with vision far beyond his years.
Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: fouzman] #12787913
06/11/18 04:57 PM
06/11/18 04:57 PM
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Originally Posted By: fouzman
I think TPWD should just outlaw tournaments completely. Just kidding. However, I think having five fish stringer tournaments anywhere in Texas this time of year is STUPID. 3 fish max and a 2 lb penalty for a dead fish, instead of .50 lb.


I agree.... sometimes you got to protect guys from themselves. I believe alot go into an event with no hopes of winning so they really don't put extra effort into keeping them alive. Rayburn in awesome shape but can't be good to be losing 5-9lbers each week cause of neglect

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12787916
06/11/18 05:01 PM
06/11/18 05:01 PM
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Houston, TX
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No coincidence that 3 of the top 7 in this event had dead fish. 1/2 pound is nothing. A 2 pound penalty would have changed the outcome rewarding the guys who took care of their fish while knocking a few of the high finishers down a few notches.

http://www.texasbassonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Livingston-Indi.pdf


"Things turn out best for those who make the best of the way things turn out" - Zachary Troy Schrah - a young man with vision far beyond his years.
Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12787941
06/11/18 05:12 PM
06/11/18 05:12 PM
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I think tournament trails need to educate guys better on icing, chemical & most importantly fizzing a fish. 5 fish summer tournaments are fine. Maybe a 1-2 pound penalty would motivate guys to pay more attention.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12787958
06/11/18 05:20 PM
06/11/18 05:20 PM
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Sealy has a release boat. Big tournaments should be required to use it. Dumping at the ramp at 5pm can't be good

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12787973
06/11/18 05:32 PM
06/11/18 05:32 PM
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Bossier City, LA
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Yeah dead fish and summer heat sure seem to coincide regrettably. I have tried ice/additives/changing water/etc and sometimes 1 will just die. I do think some anglers basically "don't care" as like stated above the penalty isn't really a penalty. Had a friend weigh in 25+ off a local lake last weekend and all were dead. He didn't say what he had tried but damn he had a 8 and a 7...

A topic that I don't see discussed much is the actual livewell itself. Most have aluminum lids carpeted over that get super hot to the touch why not add some sort of insulation to the bottom that can cool things down? Or maybe add a drain line that feeds from the ice chest to the livewell that as the day goes on adds a little cooler water? We spend like $100K on some of these rigs but the overall livewell idea/operation hasn't changed much at all in years.

I like the idea of a live release boat. Or at least all the bigger tourneys should have the aerated/additive filled tubs for guys to keep the fish in while waiting and tents for shade. Good topic I'm curious what other ideas come along.


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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12787980
06/11/18 05:37 PM
06/11/18 05:37 PM
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ABA has a release boat and a employee exercising fish care at it. Maybe the damage is already done by the time the fish reaches him, but it's a good effort.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12787987
06/11/18 05:40 PM
06/11/18 05:40 PM
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Haslet, TX
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I know It sucks to see, but to put it in perspective 40 years ago 100% of the fish caught in a tourney died. We’ve came a long way


Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: fouzman] #12787991
06/11/18 05:41 PM
06/11/18 05:41 PM
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Originally Posted By: fouzman
No coincidence that 3 of the top 7 in this event had dead fish. 1/2 pound is nothing. A 2 pound penalty would have changed the outcome rewarding the guys who took care of their fish while knocking a few of the high finishers down a few notches.

http://www.texasbassonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Livingston-Indi.pdf


Is it coincidence if the mortality rate is worse for a four fish limit and only slightly better for two? I'm all for dropping the # to three in the heat as it would save fish but an additional penalty is unsupported given that particular data. Imo of course


"Its not an addiction...its a disease! and I LIKE it! keeps my sanity in this cruel world!"
Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Clark3] #12787994
06/11/18 05:43 PM
06/11/18 05:43 PM
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Originally Posted By: Clark3
I know It sucks to see, but to put it in perspective 40 years ago 100% of the fish caught in a tourney died. We’ve came a long way


Also agree with that. Could always be better but what we do now is fairly impressive.


"Its not an addiction...its a disease! and I LIKE it! keeps my sanity in this cruel world!"
Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: WackySenko] #12788001
06/11/18 05:46 PM
06/11/18 05:46 PM
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Originally Posted By: WackySenko
Originally Posted By: Clark3
I know It sucks to see, but to put it in perspective 40 years ago 100% of the fish caught in a tourney died. We’ve came a long way


Also agree with that. Could always be better but what we do now is fairly impressive.


+1 as well

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788020
06/11/18 05:56 PM
06/11/18 05:56 PM
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No matter what livewell you have, if you have an aerator pump running all day, plenty of ice, catch and release treatment, proper fizzing and or fin clips....your fish will be much better at weigh in compared to guys who don't

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788024
06/11/18 05:59 PM
06/11/18 05:59 PM
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I made these in about 15 min and for about $25. Stick them on the fish immediately as it goes into livewell. I check every 15 min and fizz accordingly within 30 min unless they instantly swell up

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788029
06/11/18 06:03 PM
06/11/18 06:03 PM
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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788034
06/11/18 06:06 PM
06/11/18 06:06 PM
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Frisco, TX
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As long as there are tournaments in the heat of summer with air temps at 100+ and surface temps in the mid to upper 80's, some fish are going to die, especially if they are caught deep and not fizzed. That all being said, I would still say there is more the anglers can do to help. I've fished my share of tournaments and have never lost a fish. Granted I fish very few of them in July and August but I have fished a few during those months.

When Squaw creek had their very first Fun and Sun charity event before the lake opened back up to the public, they gave a very informative seminar on fish care the night before the event and if memory serves me, there wasn't a single dead fish weighed in. It was basic stuff like adding the right amount of ice, a little H2O2 and obviously some Please Release Me. They actually had a huge load of ice brought in and required all teams to buy 3 or 4 bags to help with livewell temps. Maybe that's something to consider for these events on Rayburn.


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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788052
06/11/18 06:16 PM
06/11/18 06:16 PM
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I remember the old Bassnbucks on Rayburn in the summer giving out rejuvenade as you checked in before take off. I wish Rayburn had a lake/bass association that helped with this. I'd certainly donate if I knew it would save some 5-9lbers. I see very few teams with extra coolers. No way you can bring enough ice in most boat coolers

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788071
06/11/18 06:28 PM
06/11/18 06:28 PM
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nederland, TX
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I think a lot of people don't know what it takes and sometimes it just happens even if guys are trying. We had not sat that was dead within 10 minutes. We tried to stop it but whatever we did didn't help. It was just hooked in a part where it bled and I think the heat won't let it stop. That doesn't happen much for us, we are pretty good about keeping them alive. But I will be the first to admit I read every thread or article because I still haven't found that full proof remedy. Fizzing needs to be taught more for sure. We made our own clips like Latta did and use them a lot. Do y'all fizz thru the mouth or side? We do the mouth but I read where it's better thru the side. Lots of info out there and lots of wrong stuff. We even have the TPWD o2 system in the boat.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788077
06/11/18 06:31 PM
06/11/18 06:31 PM
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Originally Posted By: Jaret Latta
In the last 3 weeks I've heard of lots of dead fish on Rayburn during TxTT Championship, ABA weekend series and the tournament out of Monterrey. I know tpw has done studies on delayed mortality but at what point do they stop having events in the summer? I think they should be required to have a release boat instead of dumping at the ramp. Maybe even pay tpw to help with fish care. Can't be good for the fishery to be losing lots of big fish. Ultimately it's up the angler but it sure seems alot of guys just aren't making the extra effort.


I agree on the release boat. I wish we could figure out how to have one here too. Release boats make sense and if nothing else local chambers of commerce should build one and require any tournaments to buy a 50.00 permit per day and that help pay for the release boat and someone to run it. Usually only need it running for a couple hours.

I wanted to add that about 5 years ago I was talking with Denny Braur at the ramp and he said that he never adds ice just but he never ever uses his timers from May to October. He keeps the livewells running the whole time. I started doing this and I have not had a single fish die since. And they all swim away.
Another thing I started doing was using Rejuvinade about an hour before weigh in. It gives them some kick. I learned not to use it all day just right before I went in.
Weigh ins should also have a salt water dip to dip fish in right before release. It helps protect against fungus that forms from handling.

Last edited by 9094; 06/11/18 06:37 PM.
Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: fouzman] #12788105
06/11/18 06:55 PM
06/11/18 06:55 PM
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Originally Posted By: fouzman
I think TPWD should just outlaw tournaments completely. Just kidding. However, I think having five fish stringer tournaments anywhere in Texas this time of year is STUPID. 3 fish max and a 2 lb penalty for a dead fish, instead of .50 lb.

Agree with you Fouz. Also, I still believe all tournaments should pay a fee to access any lake or body of water they use. This would hopefully decrease the overall number of tournaments, esp on highly pressured lakes and the money would go back to the wildlife department to help keep the fishery healthy.



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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788108
06/11/18 06:57 PM
06/11/18 06:57 PM
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ABA has a tank with water to fill your bag after you weigh in. But some guys are to lazy. They walk right by it and then make the long walk to the release boat with the fish in the bag with no water. Then run into a buddy on the walk back and spend a couple minutes talking about the big ones they lost. If a tournament offers a tank to put fresh water in the bag use it. The guy running the release boat was working his tail off trying to save fish.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: horseplaydvm] #12788126
06/11/18 07:08 PM
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Originally Posted By: horseplaydvm
Originally Posted By: fouzman
I think TPWD should just outlaw tournaments completely. Just kidding. However, I think having five fish stringer tournaments anywhere in Texas this time of year is STUPID. 3 fish max and a 2 lb penalty for a dead fish, instead of .50 lb.

Agree with you Fouz. Also, I still believe all tournaments should pay a fee to access any lake or body of water they use. This would hopefully decrease the overall number of tournaments, esp on highly pressured lakes and the money would go back to the wildlife department to help keep the fishery healthy.


Pay a fee to access a public body of water already propped up by taxpayer money at the expense of the tournament organization who pays (sometimes) for the venue and will take it out of the payout of the same people who paid to put the fish in the lake in the first place?


"Its not an addiction...its a disease! and I LIKE it! keeps my sanity in this cruel world!"
Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788131
06/11/18 07:12 PM
06/11/18 07:12 PM
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It takes a team effort to keep fish alive. Think of it as a hospital environment. If a patient is brought into the hospital dehydrated, coughing up blood and has an arm and a leg cut off, you can’t expect the doctors and nurses to save them.

Obviously, it starts with livewell management. Every brand of boat has the same type livewell lid design. They have a 1/2” to 1” downward lip around the edges. This makes it very easy to insulate your lids. Go spend $20 at Home Depot and buy some foam board insulation. Cut it the same size as your lid and wedge it in 1/2” to 1” area under your lid. This will help with the sun beating down on your lids all day and warming up your livewell water. Next time you’re in Wal Mart, go to the pool section and buy you a $3 floating thermometer. Leave this in your livewell 24/7. Next, freeze 3-4 milk jugs or 2 liter Coke bottles. They last much longer then using ice cubes. On game day, fill your livewells before the sun comes up good and starts to heat the water. Do NOT fill them while you’re power poled down in 3’ water while you’re waiting for your boat number to be called. This will only start your day off with muddy water mixed with scoshe of engine oil/fuel/exhaust. Wait until you get to your first fishing spot and fill it with good, fresh water. You can put your treatment in there now or wait until you catch fish.

The deeper you catch fish, the cooler your livewell water needs to be. (This is where you’ll use that $3 thermometer you bought at Wal Mart.) Never does it need to be 75*, but just use common sense. If you’re catching fish in 3-5’ then as long as you keep your livewell at or below waterevee the lake surface temperature is, then you’ll be fine. If you’re catching fish in 25’ then you’ll need to work to keep your water 4-5* cooler than surface temperature. Once the first fish goes in the livewell, the aerator needs to be turned to auto. Once your 3rd fish is out in, you need to start using common sense. If the fish are bigger and it’s starting to warm up considerably, then you may consider running your aerator steady rather than on auto. Once you have 5 fish and the sun is beating down, you definitely need the aerator running all the time.

Keep an eye on the water quality! Fish not only release toxins when they stress, but they also puke up that mornings meal. You now have dead fish parts floating around in the water that you’re trying to keep them alive in. Because your aerator is running, you’ll always have a certain amount of bubbles but when those bubbles start to look foamy and are brown, it’s time to pump out about half that water and add in fresh water. Yes, this will pump out your cool water and replace it with warm water, but cold poisonous water is no good either. This is where you’ll put 1-2 of your frozen bottles in there to help get the temperature back down to where you want it. You’ll also need to add a little treatment back in because you’ve diluted what you had. It’s not uncommon to swap the water out 3-4 times per day if you have a limit of fish early and they are 15+ lbs. I’ll refer to common sense again...the earlier you catch your fish, the more likely you caught them during a morning feeding frenzy. This means they are more likely to throw up their meal than if you caught them 3-4 hours after they’ve fed.

Lastly, learn to fizz fish. You can practice fizzing on days you’re fun fishing. When you catch a 2 pounder, put it in the livewell. Check on it in about 15 minutes and see if it’s laying on its side. If so, then it will need to be fizzed. I won’t go into explaining how to fizz. Go to YouTube, and there are plenty of videos on fizzing them through the side and through the mouth. Fizzing through the mouth is much easier, but you can kill one dead if you hit the artery in the top of their mouth. It’s not common to hit it, but when you do, you pretty much know it immediately.

When you get to weigh in and it’s time to put your fish in the weigh bag and take them to the scales, consider several things. First off, in your weigh in bag, there will only be a few minutes worth of oxygen to sustain your fish. Do not stop and talk to your buddy as you’re walking to the tanks. Do NOT sit your weigh in bag down on the hot asphalt or concrete. When you get to the bump tanks, grab one of the rubber hoses that are hanging on the side of the tank but the bubble stone and put it IN your bag. That will aerate your water. It does no good to simply sit your bag in the water that’s in the bump tank. Use that air hose to help aerate your fish’s water.

Lastly, if you’re going to take pictures with your fish, use common sense (there are those words again). Grab your fish out of the bag and take the picture quickly. Don’t let the fish stay out of the water for more than 2030 seconds. Do NOT drop your fish on the hot asphalt and let flop around frying the little bit of slime that it has left on its scales!

Now it’s OUR job to take the fish from you and return them to the lake as healthy as possible. All we can do now is keep them in good quality water and monitor them. We can fizz them if they need fizzing (remember, you were supposed to have already done this). We will put fin clips on them if they need a little help swimming upright. Other than that, we aren’t miracle workers. You, the fishermen, have to bring us a patient that we can save.

Lastly, I’ll touch on release trailers versus release boats versus a true live release system like Cassels Boykin has at their pavilion. Remember what I said earlier about your livewell can become toxic? Guess what - a release tank on a trailer can also. There’s no way to swap out the water in a 1500 gallon tank sitting under a pavilion. With every fish you add to it, you’re potentially adding more poison to the water. I’m not a fan of release trailers. There is a family at Rayburn that owns a pontoon boat that is setup to release fish. It is a good setup because they can release the water and refill with fresh water. Of course, their services have to be paid for, so this deters some tournaments from using it. Finally, the release system at Cassels Boykins is hands down the best system for fish care. Water is pumped out of the lake from under the fishing pier (in the shade) up to a 2,000 tank that is buried in the ground. This is very important because being in ground not only prevents the water from being in the direct sunlight, but it also uses the ground temperature to cool the water some. There are 2 tanks (one 200 gallon tank and one 100 gallon tank) that can be filled out of the 2,000 gallon underground tank. The 200 gallon tank is where the healthy fish are kept and the 100 gallon tank is the “hospital tank”. The 200 gallon tank has a 12” pipe that drains it directly back into the lake. So when you get 50-60 fish in the tank, you simply open the valve and the water and fish are released back into the lake. It’s not uncommon for the fish to be released back into the lake within 10 minutes of you getting them out of your livewell. The 200 gallon tank is then refilled with fresh, cool water and the cycle starts all over. Any fish that are struggling are placed into the “hospital tank” where they can monitored, fizzed, fin clipped, etc. When they get healthy, they are transferred to the 200 gallon tank and they are released with the next batch down the 12” pipe. Every pavilion should have one of these systems for use during a tournament.



Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788164
06/11/18 07:40 PM
06/11/18 07:40 PM
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Imo side fizzing is easier and also is better on the fish. Randy Myers 2 years study says mortality rate is lower with side fizzing.
https://tpwd.texas.gov/newsmedia/releases/?req=20110202d

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: WackySenko] #12788178
06/11/18 07:50 PM
06/11/18 07:50 PM
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Originally Posted By: WackySenko
Originally Posted By: horseplaydvm
Originally Posted By: fouzman
I think TPWD should just outlaw tournaments completely. Just kidding. However, I think having five fish stringer tournaments anywhere in Texas this time of year is STUPID. 3 fish max and a 2 lb penalty for a dead fish, instead of .50 lb.

Agree with you Fouz. Also, I still believe all tournaments should pay a fee to access any lake or body of water they use. This would hopefully decrease the overall number of tournaments, esp on highly pressured lakes and the money would go back to the wildlife department to help keep the fishery healthy.


Pay a fee to access a public body of water already propped up by taxpayer money at the expense of the tournament organization who pays (sometimes) for the venue and will take it out of the payout of the same people who paid to put the fish in the lake in the first place?

Yes, tournaments orginizations are making money off of our public body of water. Not everybody fishes tournaments and the number of tournaments on popular lakes is out of control theses days. I’m not really referring to the small club or working mans tournaments.



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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: horseplaydvm] #12788199
06/11/18 08:02 PM
06/11/18 08:02 PM
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Originally Posted By: horseplaydvm
Originally Posted By: WackySenko
Originally Posted By: horseplaydvm
Originally Posted By: fouzman
I think TPWD should just outlaw tournaments completely. Just kidding. However, I think having five fish stringer tournaments anywhere in Texas this time of year is STUPID. 3 fish max and a 2 lb penalty for a dead fish, instead of .50 lb.

Agree with you Fouz. Also, I still believe all tournaments should pay a fee to access any lake or body of water they use. This would hopefully decrease the overall number of tournaments, esp on highly pressured lakes and the money would go back to the wildlife department to help keep the fishery healthy.


Pay a fee to access a public body of water already propped up by taxpayer money at the expense of the tournament organization who pays (sometimes) for the venue and will take it out of the payout of the same people who paid to put the fish in the lake in the first place?

Yes, tournaments orginizations are making money off of our public body of water. Not everybody fishes tournaments and the number of tournaments on popular lakes is out of control theses days. I’m not really referring to the small club or working mans tournaments.


Ehh fair enough I could see the angle of a non tournament guy. And an organization making money off a state resource


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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: fouzman] #12788205
06/11/18 08:08 PM
06/11/18 08:08 PM
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Originally Posted By: fouzman
No coincidence that 3 of the top 7 in this event had dead fish. 1/2 pound is nothing. A 2 pound penalty would have changed the outcome rewarding the guys who took care of their fish while knocking a few of the high finishers down a few notches.

http://www.texasbassonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Livingston-Indi.pdf


Sometimes, it has nothing to do with fish care...
I had two fish dead in my last tourney. One was the first fish I caught and it was bleeding out as I swung it into the boat. I told my wife that I was afraid it would be dead before it could be culled, I was right. Took less than 5 minutes and it was belly up.
Fourth fish was the same way, bleeding when it came in and dead within minutes. I doctored them the best I could before they went in the well but it didn't matter. Cost me 2 places with the weight penalty but it is what it is.
FTR, they were both caught in less than 4' of water on a flipping bait.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788272
06/11/18 09:03 PM
06/11/18 09:03 PM
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I think the penalty for a dead fish should be not being able to weigh it. The bad thing with that is, you’ll have guys tossing dead fish back and replacing with a live fish. Seen it happen. Fisherman get caught up in the “look at me” aspect and forget to take care of their fish. I will work tirelessly to make sure my fish stay healthy and comfortable. Got to protect our resource if we want to keep enjoying it.

Last edited by Josh Seale; 06/11/18 09:04 PM.

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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788281
06/11/18 09:10 PM
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Dead fish are a waste of the resource. And illegal.


Snowflakes and entitled brats will be the doom of America!


Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: ChuChu1] #12788336
06/11/18 09:46 PM
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Originally Posted By: ChuChu1
Dead fish are a waste of the resource. And illegal.


Only illegal if you throw them back or in the trash......then it is considered "wanton waste".

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Txduckhunter] #12788345
06/11/18 09:53 PM
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Originally Posted By: Txduckhunter
Originally Posted By: ChuChu1
Dead fish are a waste of the resource. And illegal.


Only illegal if you throw them back or in the trash......then it is considered "wanton waste".


It is the law that game fish must be kept in edible condition. That means alive or on ice.


Snowflakes and entitled brats will be the doom of America!


Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: ChuChu1] #12788373
06/11/18 10:16 PM
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Originally Posted By: ChuChu1
Originally Posted By: Txduckhunter
Originally Posted By: ChuChu1
Dead fish are a waste of the resource. And illegal.


Only illegal if you throw them back or in the trash......then it is considered "wanton waste".


It is the law that game fish must be kept in edible condition. That means alive or on ice.


But never enforced. Just go to the ramps after a tournament. At what point does a fish change possession? What if it dies 1 minute after they release into the lake? Shrug shoulders?

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788379
06/11/18 10:21 PM
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I believe it should be enforced. I also believe a resource document should be required as per the law to "hand off" the tournament bag of fish.


Snowflakes and entitled brats will be the doom of America!


Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788383
06/11/18 10:22 PM
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There have been some good comments in this thread, but the bottom line is: TP&W caters to bass tournaments. Period.


Snowflakes and entitled brats will be the doom of America!


Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: ChuChu1] #12788391
06/11/18 10:32 PM
06/11/18 10:32 PM
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Originally Posted By: ChuChu1
There have been some good comments in this thread, but the bottom line is: TP&W caters to bass tournaments. Period.

They may but I can't begin to count the number of times I've seen people keep fish for no reason then go sling them back in the lake after running around with them all day. No tournament or anything.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: ChuChu1] #12788393
06/11/18 10:33 PM
06/11/18 10:33 PM
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Originally Posted By: ChuChu1
There have been some good comments in this thread, but the bottom line is: TP&W caters to bass tournaments. Period.


For good reason. Do you realize the economic impact of tournaments?



Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788398
06/11/18 10:42 PM
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No, show me some numbers.


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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788401
06/11/18 10:44 PM
06/11/18 10:44 PM
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Not to mention the fish you don't see at the ramp the are dead or dying that get thrown back as a cull or to keep from getting penalized. I used to see it all the time, so I know it goes on, probably more now that ever. A guy has a 3 lbs floater that is still moving its gills but is upside down in the live well with no chance of survival and replaces it with a 2 3/4 fish to avoid a penalty. Also several trails that don't report dead fish, I've also seen that personally.

Maybe Yetti and the boat companies can team up and get a decent live well system. Of course the boat would weigh 500 lbs more, but the fish would have a better chance to survive.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788405
06/11/18 10:48 PM
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It's not the livewell if it's deep caught. It's proper fizzing first of all. Multiple factors go into fish care.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: ChuChu1] #12788412
06/11/18 10:52 PM
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Originally Posted By: ChuChu1
No, show me some numbers.


Entire PDF is 61 pages but here's just 1 page. McDonald's impact 8 million alone.



32 million spent on fishing and of that 23 million because of tournaments. Pretty substantial impact

Last edited by Jaret Latta; 06/11/18 10:53 PM.
Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788446
06/11/18 11:21 PM
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Yes but in reality you can't compare a McDonald's tournament to traditional tournaments. First, they bring in many more people than most any other type of tournament so of course their dollars brought in will be much higher. Secondly, it is a big bass tournament and most of the people will not have the fish in the livewell for more than an hour or two before weighing in.


Have more required weigh ins set throughout the day and require the contestant to limit the amount of time that the fish remain in the livewell. The tournament could keep tallys on the weight and still allow the contestant to cull weight from his total throughout the tournament. I'm sure the fishermen would not like having to leave their spot to weigh in, afraid someone else would be there when they returned but they would learn to deal with it or find another hobby.

The fact that there is money involved, there are many tournament fishermen who don't care about the mortality or the time spent learning to better take care of the fish. they are just there for some quick cash. I've seen posts in the past where the question was asked and there are many people here that do not find fishing a hobby that they are that interested in. The cash is what makes them interested in fishing. I saw some on here that surprised me say that they thought fun fishing was boring.

I would like to see some restrictions on tournaments to do more like have proper release boats to put the fish back in places on the lake that aren't as hot as the water in the weigh in area. I also wouldn't be against a study to find an acceptable mortality rate and hold the tournament director responsible for excessive waste of the fish. They would in turn have to ensure that their contestants knew and used proper care of the fish or they would not be allowed to enter the tournament.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788450
06/11/18 11:24 PM
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I take my fish home with me for the grease after a tournament.


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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788476
06/11/18 11:38 PM
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Originally Posted By: ChuChu1
I believe it should be enforced. I also believe a resource document should be required as per the law to "hand off" the tournament bag of fish.


Originally Posted By: ChuChu1
There have been some good comments in this thread, but the bottom line is: TP&W caters to bass tournaments. Period.


It is probably the most cared for/released game animal in the country. Next to wt deer it's the biggest economic (outdoor) force in the state they should cater to them. Wildlife resource document to weigh fish smh.


"Its not an addiction...its a disease! and I LIKE it! keeps my sanity in this cruel world!"
Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788478
06/11/18 11:38 PM
06/11/18 11:38 PM
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Fished a Tournament past Saturday , caught a nice keeper early , kept it all day with live well running , released at ramp , beautiful fish when I first caught it , when released looked like it just been in a bar fight .

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Chris G] #12788482
06/11/18 11:39 PM
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Originally Posted By: Chris G
As long as there are tournaments in the heat of summer with air temps at 100+ and surface temps in the mid to upper 80's, some fish are going to die, especially if they are caught deep and not fizzed. That all being said, I would still say there is more the anglers can do to help. I've fished my share of tournaments and have never lost a fish. Granted I fish very few of them in July and August but I have fished a few during those months.

When Squaw creek had their very first Fun and Sun charity event before the lake opened back up to the public, they gave a very informative seminar on fish care the night before the event and if memory serves me, there wasn't a single dead fish weighed in. It was basic stuff like adding the right amount of ice, a little H2O2 and obviously some Please Release Me. They actually had a huge load of ice brought in and required all teams to buy 3 or 4 bags to help with livewell temps. Maybe that's something to consider for these events on Rayburn.


Here is the info we were given for that event:


This was put together for an event I fished a few years back. The biologists at Sure Life put the fish care tips together for us. They are the folks that make Please Release Me etc. Their whole livelihood is fish care.

This proactive plan to keep your catch healthy was created by the folks at Sure Life and has been used in several summer time tournaments with great results. Keep in mind the water temp at Squaw Creek was over 90 degrees for most of the lake and I don't know of a single fish that was not released alive.



In an effort to provide the best possible live release during tournaments; we are encouraging you to be proactive in addressing livewell conditions ALL DAY LONG. Although the weigh in procedure is critical, your handling of the fish throughout the day is even more critical, since the fish are in YOUR POSSESSION for the majority of the time. Please study the following suggestions and give them your utmost consideration.

1. In order to properly condition a livewell, you need to know the approximate volume of your livewell. We highly recommend that you measure the dimensions of your livewell(s) ahead of time to determine gallon volume. Use the following formula to determine the water capacity of your square or rectangular livewell. Using a measuring device (tape or ruler), multiply length times width times height of water in livewell (all in feet) times the constant 7.5. The result will be in gallons.
2. Fill livewell(s) early (shortly after takeoff) from good water in main body of lake. Do not fill livewell(s) or exchange water in creeks or coves and especially NOT at take off site. HELPFUL TIP: If you have separate livewells, fill first livewell early and store bags of ice in second livewell. This will help keep the primary livewell cool. Afterwards, if you need the second livewell, it will be easier to cool down. This method will also conserve your ice.
3. IMPORTANT!!!! Treat livewell with CATCH & RELEASE early and re-circulate for a couple of minutes to thoroughly mix. For tournaments use the following chart to determine proper amount of CATCH & RELEASE to add to your livewell. MAKE SURE YOU DOSE LIVEWELL BEFORE YOU START FISHING!!!!

GALLONS OF WATER CAPFUL(S) OF CATCH & RELEASE FROM 10 OZ. BOTTLE
10-15 Gallons 2 ½ Capfuls Of CATCH & RELEASE
20 Gallons 3 –3 ½ Capfuls Of CATCH & RELEASE
25-30 Gallons 5 Capfuls Of CATCH & RELEASE
50 Gallons 7 Capfuls Of CATCH & RELEASE

4. CRITICAL!!!LIVEWELL TEMPERATURES. Please keep your livewell(s) as close as possible to 65 degrees Fahrenheit. DO NOT LET LIVEWELL TEMPERATURES EXCEED 75 degrees Fahrenheit at any time. Check your thermometer OFTEN to make sure temperatures are in target range.
5. Add 3% hydrogen peroxide to livewell once you catch your FIRST FISH. The 3% hydrogen peroxide will provide adequate dissolved oxygen levels even if you experience livewell failure. Pay attention to the dosage rates below and do not exceed our recommendations. Repeat this procedure when you start to operate second livewell upon introduction of fish.

GALLONS OF WATER 3% HYDROGEN PEROXIDE DOSAGE RATE
10-15 Gallons ½ Cupful (4 Fluid Ounces)
20 Gallons ¾ Cupful (6 Fluid Ounces)
25-30 Gallons 1 Cupful (8 Fluid Ounces)
50 Gallons 2 Cupfuls (16 Fluid Ounces)

6. If you catch a heavy load of fish, please exchange water in livewell at least once during the day and repeat cooling of water, dosing of CATCH & RELEASE and reapply hydrogen peroxide to livewell.
7. IMPORTANT!!!!!!!DO NOT. REPEAT. DO NOT PUMP IN FRESH WATER OR RECIRCULATE FRESH WATER THROUGHOUT THE DAY. This will defeat the purpose of cooling the water down and applications of water conditioners. DO NOT OPERATE LIVEWELLS ON TIMED AERATION. KEEP LIVEWELLS ON MANUAL RECIRCULATION CONSTANTLY.
8. DO NOT FILL WEIGH IN BAGS FROM WATER OVER THE SIDE OF BOAT AT WEIGH IN SITE!!!! Fill bags with water from treated and cooled livewells. Dip bags in livewells to fill with water or pump water from livewell through pump out pumps directly to bags as they hang off side of boat. To fill bags with water from lake at this point will totally defeat the purpose of all the work you have done in that livewell throughout the day.
9. TIPS FOR DEEP HOOKED OR WOUNDED (BLEEDING) BASS: Wet hands and try to remove hook using “through the gill method” working quickly. Do not keep bass out of water for more than 40 seconds. If having difficulty, then place bass in livewell water between procedures and allow it to breathe for a few moments and resume task of hook removal. If bass has swallowed the hook, then cut the line close as possible to hook eye and place bass in livewell. If bass is bleeding from body or gills, apply a pinch of CATCH & RELEASE directly to the wound. While we can’t guarantee that your bass will live, following these procedures will give them the best possible chance for survival.
10. TIPS FOR PROPERLY HANDLING FISH: Try to keep handling bass to a MINIMUM! Try not to let bass come in contact with carpet or let bass bounce around on carpet. This will cause extreme injury to the all-important slime coat or skin of the bass. If you do disrupt slime coating from this action, then this is a good time to rub some CATCH & RELEASE on abrasion. Be cautious not to break jaws of bass. Once broken, that bass will not be able to feed again. ALWAYS hold bass in vertical position or use TWO HANDS to support body. Holding bass with single hand by way of mouth in a horizontal position without proper support will dislocate or break jaw.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788487
06/11/18 11:43 PM
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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788516
06/12/18 12:16 AM
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I am not seeing that a release boat will help the fish. It would just mean you would not see the dead fish floating at the ramp.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: ChuChu1] #12788518
06/12/18 12:16 AM
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Originally Posted By: ChuChu1
Originally Posted By: Txduckhunter
Originally Posted By: ChuChu1
Dead fish are a waste of the resource. And illegal.


Only illegal if you throw them back or in the trash......then it is considered "wanton waste".


It is the law that game fish must be kept in edible condition. That means alive or on ice.


Actually a fish that is dead in a livewell for a few hours in water is fine to eat. Nothing illegal about it and I have never heard of GW writing a ticket while in the livewell. But they are cracking down at the ramp when the dead ones are dumped. Our GW wrote a bunch of warnings at our last event and said they would be tickets at the next one.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: BThomas] #12788520
06/12/18 12:17 AM
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Originally Posted By: BThomas
I am not seeing that a release boat will help the fish. It would just mean you would not see the dead fish floating at the ramp.


A good release boat never puts a sick fish back.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: WackySenko] #12788528
06/12/18 12:24 AM
06/12/18 12:24 AM
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Originally Posted By: WackySenko
Originally Posted By: ChuChu1
I believe it should be enforced. I also believe a resource document should be required as per the law to "hand off" the tournament bag of fish.


Originally Posted By: ChuChu1
There have been some good comments in this thread, but the bottom line is: TP&W caters to bass tournaments. Period.


It is probably the most cared for/released game animal in the country. Next to wt deer it's the biggest economic (outdoor) force in the state they should cater to them. Wildlife resource document to weigh fish smh.


But not at the expense of the rest of the fishery.

Wildlife resource document to weigh fish smh. It's the law smh.

Last edited by ChuChu1; 06/12/18 12:26 AM.

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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: ChuChu1] #12788653
06/12/18 02:00 AM
06/12/18 02:00 AM
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Originally Posted By: ChuChu1
Originally Posted By: WackySenko
Originally Posted By: ChuChu1
I believe it should be enforced. I also believe a resource document should be required as per the law to "hand off" the tournament bag of fish.


Originally Posted By: ChuChu1
There have been some good comments in this thread, but the bottom line is: TP&W caters to bass tournaments. Period.


It is probably the most cared for/released game animal in the country. Next to wt deer it's the biggest economic (outdoor) force in the state they should cater to them. Wildlife resource document to weigh fish smh.


But not at the expense of the rest of the fishery.

Wildlife resource document to weigh fish smh. It's the law smh.


Thats fair. I haven't fished an flw or or other big tourney in a while I may have unknowingly signed one in the past. Though your adamence toward requiring the document that is supposedly in place is misleading and my general sentiment remains.


"Its not an addiction...its a disease! and I LIKE it! keeps my sanity in this cruel world!"
Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788696
06/12/18 02:20 AM
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I honestly wish you'd just fillet them.....and I truly wish you couldn't even hold a tournament on any lake less than 3500 acres


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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788723
06/12/18 02:46 AM
06/12/18 02:46 AM
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3 fish limit june 1 thru august 31,2.0lb dead fish penalty all the time,people would learn some fish care!


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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788806
06/12/18 04:20 AM
06/12/18 04:20 AM
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Originally Posted By: Jaret Latta



So if a fish needs fizzing, will they still float with these weighted clips?

Is the purpose just to keep fish upright?


Have to admit, I never really had a need to keep fish alive in my live well. Only started tournament fishing a few years ago. I was pretty ignorant and did most of the things I wasn’t supposed to do.

I used to think pumping in freshwater would be more effective than recirculating same water all day. I rarely used my aerator.

I was lucky for a while, but thanks to posts like these, I’m doing the right things now.

I do lose a lot of fishing time worrying about the fish in my live well.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788817
06/12/18 04:39 AM
06/12/18 04:39 AM
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Hideaway, TX
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Just add some livewell vents, like VT-2 and be done with it. Best thing I ever did for fish care.


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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788910
06/12/18 11:51 AM
06/12/18 11:51 AM
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Austin, Tx/Nacogdoches, Tx
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Livewell vent won't help with deep caught fish. Which is the main issue on this thread regarding Rayburn. The fin clips keep the fish upright and mainly used for big fish. Some smaller fish show no signs of inflated bladder. The big ones, every time

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12788929
06/12/18 12:26 PM
06/12/18 12:26 PM
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Posts: 612
Newton, TX USA
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For all the derby haters....

You do realize that if not for Ray Scott and B.A.S.S., live wells, 5 fish limits, and aeration probably wouldn't exist.

Look at saltwater. They are just now starting to come around to live wells and live release. And that's only in tourneys. For the most part, if you catch and release keeper trout, flounder or reds, folks look at you like you have 3 heads.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12789098
06/12/18 02:26 PM
06/12/18 02:26 PM
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nederland, TX
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Originally Posted By: Jaret Latta
Livewell vent won't help with deep caught fish. Which is the main issue on this thread regarding Rayburn. The fin clips keep the fish upright and mainly used for big fish. Some smaller fish show no signs of inflated bladder. The big ones, every time

Yep. Anything 4 and up is automatic for wanting to float. 3 and down we never really have an issue with except on occasion. The weights are something everybody should have. There's only one tho g with the weights, it won't truly make them better but the weights can make you think they are because they are upright. They will still need to be fizzed

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Frank the Tank] #12789223
06/12/18 03:39 PM
06/12/18 03:39 PM
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Decatur
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Originally Posted By: Frank the Tank
Just add some livewell vents, like VT-2 and be done with it. Best thing I ever did for fish care.

I really like mine and they keep your fish healthy all day.


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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12789244
06/12/18 03:49 PM
06/12/18 03:49 PM
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Huntington, Tx
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There is a lot of good information here, hopefully the Basschamps Texas Shootout on Rayburn puts some emphasis on proper fish care.


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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12789271
06/12/18 04:04 PM
06/12/18 04:04 PM
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San Antonio, Texas
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I just don't fish tournaments in the Summer. It's not because I don't know how to take care of fish. I know how to fizz fish, have live well vents, add G Juice, aerators, everything. I just don't like keeping them in my live well all day long. I'd rather not risk it.

I've seen tournaments down here with lots of dead fish. Now, I'm sure it's not to the extent of Rayburn or those other East Tx lakes, but it still sucks nonetheless. I have a buddy who stays after weigh-in's and fizzes all the fish he can. The lack of fish care in the whole state is astonishing. I would like to see more 3 fish limits and more emphasis on fish care at tournaments.

Last edited by bigbass94; 06/12/18 04:04 PM.

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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: WackySenko] #12789273
06/12/18 04:06 PM
06/12/18 04:06 PM
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Ok, USA
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Originally Posted By: WackySenko

Ehh fair enough I could see the angle of a non tournament guy. And an organization making money off a state resource

I fish a few tournaments, mainly for fun with my son. But I have won some money too. Would like to protect our resources for his and future generations to enjoy as I have.



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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12789289
06/12/18 04:20 PM
06/12/18 04:20 PM
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Grand Prairie Tx
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Originally Posted By: Jaret Latta
Originally Posted By: fouzman
I think TPWD should just outlaw tournaments completely. Just kidding. However, I think having five fish stringer tournaments anywhere in Texas this time of year is STUPID. 3 fish max and a 2 lb penalty for a dead fish, instead of .50 lb.


Sometimes you've got to protect guys from themselves. I believe alot go into an event with no hopes of winning so they really don't put extra effort into keeping them alive. Rayburn in awesome shape but can't be good to be losing 5-9lbers each week cause of neglect


I Agree. Is it just plain old hard headedness??? Seems the mentality has become "Oh We just GOTTA have these tournaments ,regardless of what it does to the resource". Bottom line money is lost if they don't keep doing it. At least reduce them to 3 fish stringers & 2#dead fish penalty as mentioned earlier. These continued actions don't affect only the tournament anglers. It affects EVERYONE.
I think MOST tournament anglers are VERY supportive of conservation efforts, & would actually welcome better survival rate practices. THAT affects everyone also, positively.

Last edited by Curtbass; 06/12/18 04:32 PM.

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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12789361
06/12/18 05:09 PM
06/12/18 05:09 PM
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Katy, Texas US
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I am all for resource protection and taking care of the fish better... what lake has been adversely effected by summertime tournaments? Is someone gonna say Rayburn? Nah that don't work, and its probably the most pressured lake in Texas.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12789395
06/12/18 05:21 PM
06/12/18 05:21 PM
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Shouldn't each public body of water be independently managed (state and local) given that many variables affect the resources with the objective being to assist Mother Nature in maintaining a healthy, versus artificial, balance? While “catch and release”, as a management tool, may benefit one body, it may be detrimental to others. I believe (all theory, no science) that the tournament effects on the overall bass population are negligible but applaud all fish-care efforts for those not legally taken for the table. As a realist, perhaps any questionable fish could/should be fileted and donated to the local food bank?

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: wsimpson] #12789734
06/12/18 08:48 PM
06/12/18 08:48 PM
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Originally Posted By: wsimpson
Shouldn't each public body of water be independently managed (state and local) given that many variables affect the resources with the objective being to assist Mother Nature in maintaining a healthy, versus artificial, balance? While “catch and release”, as a management tool, may benefit one body, it may be detrimental to others. I believe (all theory, no science) that the tournament effects on the overall bass population are negligible but applaud all fish-care efforts for those not legally taken for the table. As a realist, perhaps any questionable fish could/should be fileted and donated to the local food bank?


Everything you said is correct. Each fishery is different and should be treated so. Staffing time is limited with the state agencies so the most popular fisheries get most of the research effort, leading to better management plans. The less popular places tend to get general regulations that can protect the population but maybe not maximize its potential.

Upping the penalty for dead fish is a really good thought... I will be considering this for the circuit I manage.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: RBO] #12789749
06/12/18 09:02 PM
06/12/18 09:02 PM
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Arlington
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Originally Posted By: RBO
For all the derby haters....

You do realize that if not for Ray Scott and B.A.S.S., live wells, 5 fish limits, and aeration probably wouldn't exist.

Look at saltwater. They are just now starting to come around to live wells and live release. And that's only in tourneys. For the most part, if you catch and release keeper trout, flounder or reds, folks look at you like you have 3 heads.




For non tournament fishermen about the only thing in the list that would matter is the 5 fish limit and I wouldn't even care about that one because I don't keep any.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Bobby Milam] #12789771
06/12/18 09:19 PM
06/12/18 09:19 PM
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Originally Posted By: Bobby Milam
Originally Posted By: RBO
For all the derby haters....

You do realize that if not for Ray Scott and B.A.S.S., live wells, 5 fish limits, and aeration probably wouldn't exist.

Look at saltwater. They are just now starting to come around to live wells and live release. And that's only in tourneys. For the most part, if you catch and release keeper trout, flounder or reds, folks look at you like you have 3 heads.




For non tournament fishermen about the only thing in the list that would matter is the 5 fish limit and I wouldn't even care about that one because I don't keep any.


How about rods, reels, baits, line, hooks, tungsten weights, the list goes on and on. If you believe that the drive and innovation would be the same for companies without "tournament fishermen" then you are lying to yourself...
And yes, I know, you could still catch fish without all that "fancy" stuff but you could also fish out of a wooden boat and use a paddle.......but you don't. Let's be real here..

The infighting between tourney guys and non-tourney guys will be the end of us all if we insist on taking sides.

Last edited by Txduckhunter; 06/12/18 09:22 PM.
Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Clark3] #12789835
06/12/18 10:14 PM
06/12/18 10:14 PM
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Originally Posted By: Clark3
I know It sucks to see, but to put it in perspective 40 years ago 100% of the fish caught in a tourney died. We’ve came a long way


Yeah, that is true but what was out tech capabilities 40 years ago? And were there the same number of tournaments, tournament fishermen?

Your argument premise is not well thought out. The bottom line is there is much more pressure on the resource. And we are not doing as well as can be done considering our technology and knowledge levels?

No, not even close.


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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12789841
06/12/18 10:21 PM
06/12/18 10:21 PM
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Diana Tx
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They should just weigh filets. That would end this argument

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Notaguide] #12789856
06/12/18 10:43 PM
06/12/18 10:43 PM
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Gonzales, Tx
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Originally Posted By: Notaguide
They should just weigh filets. That would end this argument


Nope, that would still end up with dead fish. But at least not wasted.


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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12789903
06/12/18 11:24 PM
06/12/18 11:24 PM
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Splendora, Tx
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I'm sure I'm gonna catch all kinds of hell for posting my comments, but I was in the Lake Livingston Tournament last Saturday. 8 fish died for whatever reason, and i brought all home for some nice filets! 2 were dead so long that i decided to give them to the critters in my backyard, the rest were ok.
The water temps ranged from 87-93, I had 4 fish that were released in great condition because (I) overfill my livewells allday long. Allways have! First fish onboard @ 6:30am, looked just as good @ 3:20pm. I have never understood all the B/S additives and ice unless you are growing a fish tank. Deep fish caught have awhole lot working against them, so weights on fins etc may help, but shallow fish don't need all the B/S that yall think they do. Just give them a fresh flow of water is all it takes. When coming in for weigh in put the livewell on recirc so they don't get shoreline hot water/silt. Been working just fine for me in southeast tx for as long as I have been fishing tournaments. Don't believe go try it this weekend!

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12790027
06/13/18 01:22 AM
06/13/18 01:22 AM
Joined: Jan 2007
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Austin, Tx/Nacogdoches, Tx
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I know catch and release certainly helps the fish. I try and do everything I can to keep them in good shape. Actually ordered a pure oxygen system today to try out.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: KingChamp202] #12790058
06/13/18 01:49 AM
06/13/18 01:49 AM
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Originally Posted By: KingChamp202
I'm sure I'm gonna catch all kinds of hell for posting my comments, but I was in the Lake Livingston Tournament last Saturday. 8 fish died for whatever reason, and i brought all home for some nice filets! 2 were dead so long that i decided to give them to the critters in my backyard, the rest were ok.
The water temps ranged from 87-93, I had 4 fish that were released in great condition because (I) overfill my livewells allday long. Allways have! First fish onboard @ 6:30am, looked just as good @ 3:20pm. I have never understood all the B/S additives and ice unless you are growing a fish tank. Deep fish caught have awhole lot working against them, so weights on fins etc may help, but shallow fish don't need all the B/S that yall think they do. Just give them a fresh flow of water is all it takes. When coming in for weigh in put the livewell on recirc so they don't get shoreline hot water/silt. Been working just fine for me in southeast tx for as long as I have been fishing tournaments. Don't believe go try it this weekend!
You had 4 fish that weighed how much? Theres a big difference in 4 swimmers vs 5 big fish. Or even 1 big fish. And for sure if the big fish were caught deep.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12790117
06/13/18 02:46 AM
06/13/18 02:46 AM
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Jarret I appreciate you bringing up the issues with the dead fish. I fished the ABA tourney and noticed the dead fish issues in the Weigh in line. The three people ahead of me all had multiple dead fish that were curled with white gills but were called alive by the guy checking the fish. I am sure he was doing this to avoid the high dead fish count that would have showed in the stats. All of my fish were alive and very healthy because for one I have read the tips from the live-well additive Company's and follow them. A couple of the lengthy posts here are the exact instructions to follow to weigh fish alive. 1. use please release me or something similar. 2. I use 1 liter bottles of frozen water added once an hour to keep water cooled. 3. NEVER turn off the aerator or oxygenator. 4. Fiz big deep caught fish. I keep the frozen bottled water in an arctic cooler to keep it frozen. Somtimes no matter what you do a fish will die, mainly if they swallow a big worm or a senko. But you should immediately take that fish out of the live-well and put it on Ice.

Also I find it funny when people argue with you on simple subjects and have no idea how much money you win in tourneys, or that you are one of the people on here that actually knows what they are talking about. So thanks again for a interesting and informative topic.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12790183
06/13/18 04:08 AM
06/13/18 04:08 AM
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Spring Branch, TX USA
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Just a thought but I think the weigh and release method of MLF is going to be pushed down to large tournaments and out to other tournaments as time goes on.
Maybe years from now but something like the Kayak guys do, catch get an accurate "verifiable" weight somehow and just put the fish back. Not sure of all the technical hurdles but who thought they'd be carrying an internet connected computer in the pockets and have multiple super-duper GPS units of today on their boats... not too long ago a flasher was high tech smile


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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12790252
06/13/18 11:01 AM
06/13/18 11:01 AM
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Posts: 69,831
Realville
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Meh...every year the same thread. Glad we got this one out of our system. Prolly should pin it to the top so 10 more don't pop up.

BTW...Summer begins Thursday, June 21. These are Spring tournaments.


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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12790297
06/13/18 12:18 PM
06/13/18 12:18 PM
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Posts: 236
Spring Branch, TX USA
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With over a thousand people moving to Texas a day (real statistic) and new lakes in Texas are Few and far between fishing pressures are going up and up tournament and non tournament fishing, especially at lakes near large metropolitan areas... So change will happen... Since the only thing in life that is sure bet is change


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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12790301
06/13/18 12:20 PM
06/13/18 12:20 PM
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Posts: 236
Spring Branch, TX USA
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With over a thousand people moving to Texas a day (real statistic) and new lakes in Texas are Few and far between fishing pressures are going up and up tournament and non tournament fishing, especially at lakes near large metropolitan areas... So change will happen... Since the only thing in life that is sure bet is change


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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: CADD] #12790336
06/13/18 01:03 PM
06/13/18 01:03 PM
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East Texas
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Originally Posted By: CADD
Just a thought but I think the weigh and release method of MLF is going to be pushed down to large tournaments and out to other tournaments as time goes on.
Maybe years from now but something like the Kayak guys do, catch get an accurate "verifiable" weight somehow and just put the fish back. Not sure of all the technical hurdles but who thought they'd be carrying an internet connected computer in the pockets and have multiple super-duper GPS units of today on their boats... not too long ago a flasher was high tech smile


I've put quite a bit of thought into having a MLF style of tournament. There are three major problems with this:

1) Where are you going to find 200+ judges that want to sit in a boat all day long and watch local amateurs fish?
2) The guys that sign up to judge are going to be your the text book potlickers that are doing nothing but hoping they draw the sticks and can find their fishing holes.
3) To actually get judges to sit in a boat all day, you'd have to pay them at least $100. Where is this money going to come from?

Local high school kids aren't the answer to judges. They have access to 10x more technology in their pocket than most of us know how to access on this computer we are typing this on. So you'd be giving your spot away to either them or their dads at home who sent their kiddos as a judge just for this reason.



Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12790338
06/13/18 01:04 PM
06/13/18 01:04 PM
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Hideaway, TX
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Frank the Tank Online content
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Originally Posted By: Jaret Latta
Livewell vent won't help with deep caught fish. Which is the main issue on this thread regarding Rayburn. The fin clips keep the fish upright and mainly used for big fish. Some smaller fish show no signs of inflated bladder. The big ones, every time


Yes sir, you are correct. Good point.


sinner..... saved by grace I don't deserve & proudly putting BEANS in chili since I can remember
Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Outlaw Outdoors] #12790606
06/13/18 05:14 PM
06/13/18 05:14 PM
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Spring Branch, TX USA
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No on board person for the reasons you pointed out. I'm thinking of something you carry on the boat and put fish in while being filmed that has anti cheat measures and logs the catch. While not foolproof something like this might work. It's not an easy nut to crack just a thought


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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12790609
06/13/18 05:16 PM
06/13/18 05:16 PM
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Highway 1
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People have been saying the MLF weigh in format is the wave of the future. Years later we are still waiting on that wave to even be a ripple.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12790614
06/13/18 05:20 PM
06/13/18 05:20 PM
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Katy, Texas US
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It will never happen for reasons stated above.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: BMCD] #12790709
06/13/18 06:38 PM
06/13/18 06:38 PM
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Spring Branch, TX USA
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Originally Posted By: BMCD
It will never happen for reasons stated above.


Never say never smile give it 20~30 years... technology changes and too damn many people\people fishing will make changes happen in this state... eek


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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12790833
06/13/18 08:28 PM
06/13/18 08:28 PM
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Tyler, TX, USA
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I am an animal lover if there ever was one. I have fed, neutered, and spayed probably 20 neighborhood animals and strays since we moved into our house. I even run water into the ditch in front of my house when it starts to dry up so the nearly grown tadpoles can turn into frogs before dying.

I work really hard to keep all my fish alive. I have probably weighed in one dead one in the last ten years. I run my aerator constantly, use ice, use Please Release Me, and check on and work with my fish constantly. Last month I stopped fishing in my club tournament to run miles to a marina to buy more ice and my fish were feisty when I released them after weigh-in as when I caught them.

I do most of my summertime fishing at night. It drives me crazy to see tournament anglers and even tournament directors allow fish to be held out of the water for long periods of time. It makes me want to ask them how long they can hold their own breaths.

That said...they are fish. It kills me for anything in my possession or around me to die, but I'm not going to wear black for a week and hold a funeral if a fish dies.

Why do we stock fish in lakes? Is it so they can have a safe space and live forever, or is it so people can use the resource and catch them?

We should all do everything we can to care for our fish, but more regulations and government involvement are the last thing we need.

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Razorback] #12790871
06/13/18 08:52 PM
06/13/18 08:52 PM
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Posts: 236
Spring Branch, TX USA
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Spring Branch, TX USA
Originally Posted By: Razorback
I am an animal lover if there ever was one. I have fed, neutered, and spayed probably 20 neighborhood animals and strays since we moved into our house. I even run water into the ditch in front of my house when it starts to dry up so the nearly grown tadpoles can turn into frogs before dying.

I work really hard to keep all my fish alive. I have probably weighed in one dead one in the last ten years. I run my aerator constantly, use ice, use Please Release Me, and check on and work with my fish constantly. Last month I stopped fishing in my club tournament to run miles to a marina to buy more ice and my fish were feisty when I released them after weigh-in as when I caught them.

I do most of my summertime fishing at night. It drives me crazy to see tournament anglers and even tournament directors allow fish to be held out of the water for long periods of time. It makes me want to ask them how long they can hold their own breaths.

That said...they are fish. It kills me for anything in my possession or around me to die, but I'm not going to wear black for a week and hold a funeral if a fish dies.

Why do we stock fish in lakes? Is it so they can have a safe space and live forever, or is it so people can use the resource and catch them?

We should all do everything we can to care for our fish, but more regulations and government involvement are the last thing we need.


You are the exception, not the average guy... and of course, there is the opposite of you that only cares about the chance at some money, bragging rights etc. and doesn't care about a few dead fish... You know like the kayak guy that cuts the tail off a fish and cheats eeks


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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: WackySenko] #12790915
06/13/18 09:24 PM
06/13/18 09:24 PM
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 1
Texas
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bump


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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Neches] #12791125
06/14/18 12:25 AM
06/14/18 12:25 AM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,187
Splendora, Tx
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Splendora, Tx
Ive had 20 plus pd stringers same conditions, same results on Livingston. All released healthy! Oxygenation is key. Ive fished clubs for years, same guys bring in 3dead and 2 barely living treating and cooling there livewells. Dunno maybe its the livewell design, mine is oldschool massive with a divider, Vs the new segregated. Not trying to start a argument but open ppls eyes to not treat the fish like they are in a fish tank. I had tanks in the past and the ingredients are the same as the additives that so many boast about. Think im kidding read the ingredients of tank set up chemicals!

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: KingChamp202] #12791179
06/14/18 01:15 AM
06/14/18 01:15 AM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 9,196
Southlake, Texas
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This may have been said already, I have lost most all of my fish because they were hooked deep or the hooks got into the gills, rarely have I lost a fish in any other way, I caught one in a tourney a couple weeks ago, already had a limit, culled one and threw a perfectly healthy bass in the live well, 20 minutes later it was dead, all the others were perfectly fine, sometimes no matter what you do a bass will die.


Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12791272
06/14/18 02:34 AM
06/14/18 02:34 AM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 8,248
Austin, Tx/Nacogdoches, Tx
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Catch and release is a great product. It has always helped my fish especially if bleeding. Dab a little on the spot and they last all day

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12791561
06/14/18 01:11 PM
06/14/18 01:11 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 9,196
Southlake, Texas
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Originally Posted By: Jaret Latta
Catch and release is a great product. It has always helped my fish especially if bleeding. Dab a little on the spot and they last all day


Absolutely, I use it quite a bit, especially in the hotter months.


Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: Jaret Latta] #12791922
06/14/18 05:15 PM
06/14/18 05:15 PM
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 258
Flower Mound, TX
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tin man 55 Offline
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Flower Mound, TX
never seen anything like this, but would it be possible to drop a hose down 10' into the water to pull cooler water into the live well. it would have to be retractable (somehow). maybe even a separate pump with a hose attached just for the summer months???

how deep would you have to go to get cool enough water for the fish?


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Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: fouzman] #12792034
06/14/18 06:47 PM
06/14/18 06:47 PM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 48,100
Houston, TX
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Houston, TX
Originally Posted By: fouzman
No coincidence that 3 of the top 7 in this event had dead fish. 1/2 pound is nothing. A 2 pound penalty would have changed the outcome rewarding the guys who took care of their fish while knocking a few of the high finishers down a few notches.

http://www.texasbassonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Livingston-Indi.pdf


I would like to note that over 155 fish were caught and weighed in this tournament. Only eight died. That's pretty impressive for over all fish care in a summer tournament. I only singled out that event to point out that dead fish penalties aren't punitive enough, IMO.


"Things turn out best for those who make the best of the way things turn out" - Zachary Troy Schrah - a young man with vision far beyond his years.
Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: fouzman] #12792052
06/14/18 06:59 PM
06/14/18 06:59 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 4,540
nederland, TX
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Originally Posted By: fouzman
Originally Posted By: fouzman
No coincidence that 3 of the top 7 in this event had dead fish. 1/2 pound is nothing. A 2 pound penalty would have changed the outcome rewarding the guys who took care of their fish while knocking a few of the high finishers down a few notches.

http://www.texasbassonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Livingston-Indi.pdf


I would like to note that over 155 fish were caught and weighed in this tournament. Only eight died. That's pretty impressive for over all fish care in a summer tournament. I only singled out that event to point out that dead fish penalties aren't punitive enough, IMO.

I think the issue most are seeing isn't the ones weighed in dead, it's the post mortality a day or so later. I like the penalty idea though. When it start hurting the pockets it will atleast solve some of it

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: fouzman] #12792075
06/14/18 07:15 PM
06/14/18 07:15 PM
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East Texas
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East Texas
Originally Posted By: fouzman
Originally Posted By: fouzman
No coincidence that 3 of the top 7 in this event had dead fish. 1/2 pound is nothing. A 2 pound penalty would have changed the outcome rewarding the guys who took care of their fish while knocking a few of the high finishers down a few notches.

http://www.texasbassonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Livingston-Indi.pdf


I would like to note that over 155 fish were caught and weighed in this tournament. Only eight died. That's pretty impressive for over all fish care in a summer tournament. I only singled out that event to point out that dead fish penalties aren't punitive enough, IMO.


It helps that the vast majority of all fish caught in Livingston are in less than 5'. It is much easier to keep them alive all day than a fish caught in 25'.



Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: tin man 55] #12792180
06/14/18 08:43 PM
06/14/18 08:43 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
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Austin, Tx/Nacogdoches, Tx
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Originally Posted By: tin man 55
never seen anything like this, but would it be possible to drop a hose down 10' into the water to pull cooler water into the live well. it would have to be retractable (somehow). maybe even a separate pump with a hose attached just for the summer months???

how deep would you have to go to get cool enough water for the fish?




Easier to bring ice

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: tin man 55] #12792234
06/14/18 09:29 PM
06/14/18 09:29 PM
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 25,210
Hideaway, TX
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Originally Posted By: tin man 55
never seen anything like this, but would it be possible to drop a hose down 10' into the water to pull cooler water into the live well. it would have to be retractable (somehow). maybe even a separate pump with a hose attached just for the summer months???

how deep would you have to go to get cool enough water for the fish?




Interesting idea ^^^^^^^

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: tin man 55] #12792268
06/14/18 09:56 PM
06/14/18 09:56 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 4,540
nederland, TX
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Originally Posted By: tin man 55
never seen anything like this, but would it be possible to drop a hose down 10' into the water to pull cooler water into the live well. it would have to be retractable (somehow). maybe even a separate pump with a hose attached just for the summer months???

how deep would you have to go to get cool enough water for the fish?



It would get better water but without throwing a pump over or a having an extra with a hose I don't think it's feasible. It's not a bad idea though. If you were to pump in water from 10' down it would certainly be better than surface water

Re: Summer Tournaments and Dead Fish [Re: the skipper] #12792316
06/14/18 10:40 PM
06/14/18 10:40 PM
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 12,819
Plano, Tx
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Plano, Tx
Originally Posted By: the skipper
Originally Posted By: fouzman
Originally Posted By: fouzman
No coincidence that 3 of the top 7 in this event had dead fish. 1/2 pound is nothing. A 2 pound penalty would have changed the outcome rewarding the guys who took care of their fish while knocking a few of the high finishers down a few notches.

http://www.texasbassonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Livingston-Indi.pdf


I would like to note that over 155 fish were caught and weighed in this tournament. Only eight died. That's pretty impressive for over all fish care in a summer tournament. I only singled out that event to point out that dead fish penalties aren't punitive enough, IMO.

I think the issue most are seeing isn't the ones weighed in dead, it's the post mortality a day or so later. I like the penalty idea though. When it start hurting the pockets it will atleast solve some of it


A 2lb penalty will also help with delayed mortality. Simply because all fish will be cared for better. cheers I like the idea personally, plus the 3 fish stringer. Not a fan of the July/August tournaments.

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