Slots/other new regs? Beating a dead horse here....but why not

There has been more and more talk of new regulations coming. Tpwd implemented slot limits on a few lakes already Lewisville, Waco, and Palestine??. These slots have been in place a few years, correct? Somebody help me out on time frame, should have done more research before starting thread....

Is anyone seeing an improvement from the slots? If slots are going to work, more time will be needed to tell for sure I would think. Do you think slots will ever help? What other regs do you think could improve the fisheries that need help? Do lakes that are already great even need more regs to maintain what is there?

I know none of us have the for sure answer, but it's going to be a learning curve for tpwd to figure everything out and they already ask for input from fisherman. I know a lot of y'all don't want regs at all, if that's what you think then post it. That's what this place is for, discussions.....

I'm not a fan of slot limits after the fiasco in bass fishing. I do think a size limit on large catfish of one fish per day over 30" would be acceptable. That would put Texas in line with other states. A minimum length of 14" statewide and possession base on lake surveys.

Possession based on surveys would be a great. Texas is too big to have state wide regulations on anything. Hunting regs should tell tpwd that.

Im not hard core on either side of the debate. I am againt complete CPR as well as the "if its brown its down" version of fishing.

I have caught kept cleaned and eaten a large number of catfish over 20 lbs. I probably wont again. I wish we could just all act responsible and be good stewards. To me a good steward is not someone who throws back all fish over 10 lbs, it not taking more than you will use or the ecosystem will support. I think it is pretty clear that our lakes are keeping up with what we are demanding currently. I will not support regulation to create "trophy" catfish fisheries. I do not want to see catfishing turn into what bass fishing is.

I wonder if a tag system would work for catfish, similar to the red drum tag. 1 a year over a certain size.

I would be in favor of that for a limited number of years. But I still favor 1 per day over 30". And my reasoning is the other states have been successful in maintaining the resource.

TWPD can do what they want but I have my own self imposed slot. Minimum 14" and 9 lb max. Anything larger or smaller is just too much work to clean. Small ones don't make a good filet and big ones are just a PIA to cut through the rib bones with my electric knife. My only exception is a flathead. I will keep a 15-20 pounder because it is the best eating fish there is.

Bass slot limits don't work because bass anglers do not harvest fish under the slot. Catfish slots can work, but you need enough fishing activity to clear out the unders. This is why Tawakoni should have been a trial lake. With all that said, I can't see them adding the slot limit to any lake other than Tawakoni in the near future.

With all that said I think you have to understand what their concern is...which is declining number of fishing licence being sold in urban areas. Kids from the urban/suburban areas do not fish, and more of the state is becoming urban. Their plan is to rapidly expand their put and take community fishing program...mostly through the stocking of blue/channel hybrids.

One of the things I think they are missing is not only the community ponds but also the urban lakes. Lake Arlington needs to be stocked with blue catfish...as does Joe Pool.

I agree cat fisherman shouldn't act like bass guys and chastise each other for keeping fish to eat. I see how crazy the bass world is and that's not what I wish for catfish. But if catfish would get half the respect, time, and research as bass would that be bad?

I am a trophy chaser, I know that doesn't make me the most popular, but it's what I like to do. At the same time I want everyone that wants a limit for the freezer, to be able to go get that limit.

No lake can be strictly trophy without supplementing food which changes it to a fish farm in my eyes. There has to be a healthy population to have trophy fish, with that comes good numbers of "eaters" for everybody. I do like the tag idea and the 1 over 30" a day for the guy that doesn't get to catch trophy fish. If you catch the biggest cat you've ever seen, no law should force you release it.

Some lakes need to drop the minimum length limit and up possession limit to 50, then encourage people get their limits.

Seems like most of us agree we do not want cat fishing to become like bass fishing. I like the idea of managing a given lake for the carrying capacity of the lake as far as numbers of fish go. I also like the idea of a simple 1 fish over X length per day. Not sure off the top of my head what that length should be but the suggested 30" sounds about right. I do not like slot limits, the purpose of them is to get more fish to reach a certain size for Trophy purposes. I do not think we should artificially manipulate the size or numbers of fish by introducing non-native fish/genetics or breeding/feeding programs. I believe it should be native fish in as close to the native environment as we can maintain.

I other words I don't think we should manage for either maximum numbers of trophies or eaters. I think the fishery should be managed to maintain a healthy natural cat fish population. And size and bag limits should be set accordingly and adjusted up or down as needed to keep up with it.

It's Richland Chambers with the slot. Not Palestine.

I fish RC pretty regular. I will tell you my observations and what I THINK. Want to make it clear that I have no scientific data to back up my hunch on what the slot limit has accomplished thus far. Since the slot was imposed I personally have not seen a higher number of "Trophy Fish" being caught. However, it does seem that we land a few more slot fish every year so that may indicate more trophy fish are on the way in a few years. To me the biggest difference since the slot was put into place is the total population of blue catfish in the lake. I have not seen the creel survey but I believe the population of blues has increased dramatically. You can go to any point or hump in the lake right now and catch eater blues until you get sick of catching them. They are everywhere. Little doubt in my mind that leaving the big highly reproductive females in the lake has caused a dramatic increase in total blue catfish numbers. I still think it will be years before any firm conclusions can be made on exactly what impact the slot limit will ultimately have. My guess is that at some point TP&W will have to increase the bag limit on blues on RC.

Thanks for clearing that up.....I wasn't sure.

Personally I think more research should be done before the gooberment imposes more nanny state rules. If the fish numbers are not dwindling, leave it alone.

Looking at the lake survey, it looks like the mid sized catfish are actually getting a little bigger and more of them.

Looking at the lake survey, it looks like the mid sized catfish are actually getting a little bigger and more of them. [/quiet]

Could be good news. Smaller fish being taken below the slot might be what's helping.

Back in fall I was catching lots of skinny slots on Lewisville. Some of them probably would have been harvested if it wasn't for the slot limit because most of them where more than 10 to 12#. Hopefully they will fatten up soon.

I agree.

Folks have been Catching, keeping. Releasing, small-Big Cats for years.
I, myself. Have been in the boat. For over 44 years. Seen it all.
I cannot remember. How many Blues over 30lbs. I cannot attempt;
to remember how many yellows. Over 50 lbs. I have seen caught, cleaned and
used for a good Community Fish-Fry.
Family-Reunions, Church Socials.
All caught, with Fellowship, Stewardship of the Land, and resources.
Involved.
In my time. Of 44 years. In a boat. Have also, seen lots of. Big Cats-
Released.
To each his own.
To begin placing, voices of Individual Desires. Upon the TPWD.
Will only turn. The State of Texas; Lakes Rivers and Streams. Into- another Polital-Agenda. For those with Money, and personal interest. At the
core of their Forum.
Mother-nature, along with commen sense. Will manage our Catfish.
God-Bless.

TPWD has a lot more catfish info than you think. For example, when brood catfish grow large they do MAINTENANCE FEEDING, i.e. feeding just enough food so the brood catfish don't loose weight, but they don't grow any larger. They also know that blue catfish can eat a third of their body weight and can grow a third of their body length in one winter. Hence they know catfish growth rates are directly in proportion to the availability of food in the lake.

They should know that in slot and one over limits lakes like RC and LL, soon or later fish population will just keep multiply but don't grow bigger...

A 10lbs female blue catfish can lay more than 20k of eggs per season, so if a lake has 100 10lbs females, 50 20lb females, 25 40lb females, 20 50lbs females, that's 8 million eggs per season... FISH WILL NOT HAVE ENOUGH FOOD TO EAT SO THEY STOP GROWING,... POPULATION WILL ALSO PLATEAU OUT AT SOME POINT BECAUSE THE HUNGRY CATFISH WILL CANIBALIZE ON EGGS AND FINGERLING and even fully grown blue catfish. Population will decline until it bottom out at some point before it grows back up again. The cycle will keep repeating itself... What a waist of lake resources and taxes money.

There won't be enough fishermen to catch the small catfish because in an overpopulate catfish lake they will waste a lot of times weeding through the small skinny fish as well as the slot fish... that gets old quickly... as if going through the yellow bass is not enough already. lmao

And what percentage of that amount of eggs will survive?? Don't think we really have to worry about over population. If it does I am sure the regs will be modified just like on other lakes in effect right now. Another thing to take into account is this isn't your granddaddys type of fishing!!! As the popularity of blue cats gains there are a whole lot more people fishing for them than twenty plus years ago. Also there will still be people keeping what they want, just as they are right now on Lewisville even though there is a slot. Of course we will also lose a certain percentage due to stress and people who don't know how to properly care for a fish that is going to be released. That's where education instead of bickering will help our fisheries!!!
Take a kid fishing!!!!

Well said Tom. Even with the slot on Waco im curious how many fish 30-45" get harvested each year because people don't know or don't care. Im sure there is a lot that don't know Waco is a slot. Only place to see that it is if you look at the fine print in the book, and I know there is a lot of people that don't do that. I know its the fisherman's responsibility to know all the laws but I don't think a few signs around the ramps would hurt anything.

I will believe your preaching about slot a lot more if slotted lakes can support more guide businesses, because that is one measure of a good quality trophy fishery, big catfish fishery.

Most people who want to harvest catfish go to non slot lakes, they dont like to go to slotted lakes because they don't want to waste their times and baits on yellow bass and slot fish.

I personally like to eat Twok catfish, Twok catfish grow at faster rates which means they're bigger fatter and have less time to accumulate mercury and or other heavy metals. I would not eat LL catfish, so anglers like me won't fish LL.

If millions of eggs are laid by slot catfish, those big catfish will defend their eggs more successful than the smaller cats, so millions of those eggs will survive to overpopulate the lake. Like I said earlier, the over population of will canibalize on their own eggs and fingerling and bring population down, the cycle repeats every few years. It's a waste of Lake resources and taxes money.

You started the thread asking questions and now your saying I am preaching. Twok is the catfish capital of Texas with more fish per acre than most anywhere else so it's a pretty easy lake to catch fish. Poor little ol Lewisville ain't ever even been stocked officially as far as I know. Please keep on fishing Twok so there is less traffic over here!!!! Lol

Lol, and you keep fishing LL, so less traffic at old Twok, haha... just kidding.

True that I asked those 3 Qs, but don't you see there is a pattern, lol. What I am trying to say is slot is actually works against guiding interest and thus it is a lose - lose proposition. If I were a guide I would focus on blue catfish growth rates, and looks for regs to close loophole that allows abuses such as harvesting a boat full of 25+lb catfish. At the same time keep a healthy flow of harvest rates to maintain faster growth rates in lake like Twok.

A good combination of quality fish fillet and trophy hunting is good bissness, I would be looking for 2-3 fish over 34" 25 bag limits. Less crowded better fishing means bigger fish, hence 34" is better fish in the lake than the 30"

We will see what the new regs are shortly. I wouldn't be opposed with a one fish per day over 30" etc. I will trust our biologists on what is the best course as long as the politicians stay out of it instead of what they did with noodling without any biologists input

Bull! Fayette is a perfect example of you being WRONG! The catfish population in Lake Fayette averages about 8 to 10 pounds now. So if your theory was correct we should be catching hundreds no, millions of small fish. But there are no small fish even though the adults spawn just fine. But there are very few that survive due to over population of bass. And that comes from the biologists.
Go back to the bank, let TP&W be the biologists.

Is it a slot lake?

I'm not on board with the size of catfish going hand and hand with how much food they have. I know of several lakes that are completely loaded with bait and produce average size blues at best.

I drive the wrong direction to get bait at one lake then turn around and go to another lake to fish. I've done it for years now. There are blues in both lakes, one bait is easy all year even from the bank. I'm talking one throw with a net maybe two and you have a gallon bag full of big gizzards. The lake I fish you'll throw for an hour or two and might get enough hooker size gizzards and threads to fish. The records are 30+ lbs different on flats and blues. Had several days with multiple fish over 20lbs and up to 65 on the lake with less bait. The lake loaded with bait kicks out some over 20 every now and then.

Yes I understand environment, water conditions, and genetics play a role, but just saying pumping food into them will make giants isn't correct. There's more to it.

No. I suggest you read and analyze the lake surveys. They tell the true story of a lakes health.

so what were you talking about?

baits in catfish stomach is what makes the fish grow, so fish in the lakes doesn't always produce big cats, true, but first baits have to be in the lake... next lake must provide plenty of structures and bait fish movements have predictable patterns that allows easy access for blue catfish to ambushed or hunt for those baits, that's just me thinking out loud.

The biggest part of the problem is the amounts of fish which causes a stunted issue. They've bumped the limit to 50 and removed the length limit. IF, and that's a big if, the population is controlled then a one over 30" a day rule I think would help swing the balance for bigger fish.

Don't think it will ever happen though. Fisherman alone won't remove enough fish to reverse the stunted effect the lake is seeing. Perfect example of how most regs won't work "state wide" in Texas. They should be based on surveys and population of the lakes.

At the end of the day they are trying to improve OUR fisheries. It will take time, lots of research, and a big part is input from regular guys like us.

I don't believe we will see a statewide reg. hopefully we will see come September

I'm thinking about money, research need money, What I'm afraid is TPWD is trying to please a certain group for PR... just hope that's not case, real science has its place in this and we would truly get the biologists know how that our taxes dollars pay them to do their jobs.

Just a side note, I agree with you fishermen alone won't be enough reverse overpopulate lake. Virginia is spending millions of NOAAs money researching ways to reduce blue catfish population density in Chesapeake Bay tributaries. They allow commercial Catfishing below the fall line, but they only catch 8lb blue catfish, so no effect on population...