Flathead Trail?

Do flatheads have trails they stick to? We have a trotline out and have been catching some nice ones (like the picture) on the same 4-5 hooks. All the other hooks have been a mix of channels and blues.

There is something about the area where those 4-5 hooks are set that is drawing fish, or that may be a migration route to there spawning area. There maybe some cover there, big rocks, holes, logs, ect. Are you using the same bait on every hook ?

Yes same bait (perch) on all hooks, catching fish on dang near every hook, but those 4-5 hooks are always flatheads...never really thought about it, was telling some stories and someone said "you found the trail"

You found the trail, Jeff. At least in my opinion. I've only been targeting flatheads for a couple of years but in that time I've spent hours and hours reading about and studying them. They are territorial creatures. Your own "research" would support the hypothesis that they follow certian set routes when in search of food. No doubt there are reasons for these routes... releating the access of food among other factors...

I had an older gentleman fish with me last year and he talked about setting snag lines back in the day along the flathead trails. He said his dad and uncles found them by tamping the lake bed with steel poles. He said you could feel the difference in the muddy bottom when you hit the trail with the pole. He said that if you missed the trail by 4 or 5 feet you'd come up empty. Set the line along the trail and you'd catch fish every time. The fish would follow the same trails year after year. I bet a good side imaging unit could help locate these trails if you knew what to look for.

AGREE

YellowCats are a different breed from Blues & Channels. They are very methodical & stick to patterns. Yet, they can be finnicky or cautious.

They do run the same paths, especially the ones over 30 pounds. They are also territorial or regional. I had two YellowCat teachers teach me what they had been taught, as well as what they learned.

When one is caught at its "apartment" (hole or area), eventually another will move in to take over the "lease".

As to paths, the big ones tend to run the same paths. If you catch one over 30#s, do not move the line beyond 10 feet & you will catch more.

On the river, they have their escape routes & return routes when the river rises & wehen it settles. Yellows have to be careful, because of their pliable moths & gills. They can drown or suffocate if the fast waters of a rising river clamps their mouth or gills shut, or opens them wide.

It is my understading that they generally just seek out areas protected from the current, such as deep pools, large rocks, timber, rather than moving all that far, Lynn. My research on this has mostly been done on the Brazos below PK, and I've found that they don't move all that far when the flow increases.
I'd seen they were not fans of strong current but I just thought it was a side effect of their lethargic nature. I didn't know that about their mouth and gills.

Someone posted a SI pic awhile back that showed trails

That is some good info on Trails. Never new this.
Thanks gret help in my learning to target Flats

This is interesting to me. I have heard all my life that flatheads follow regular trails, from old time catmen. I believe what they say because I also have experience situations like you have with the same hooks catching yellows while others did not. I do fish regular (places) at certain times of the year with a certain amount of "regular" luck. I am interested in what others have to say here?

MR noted:
+++++++++++++++++++++
It is my understading that they generally just seek out areas protected from the current, such as deep pools, large rocks, timber, rather than moving all that far, Lynn. My research on this has mostly been done on the Brazos below PK, and I've found that they don't move all that far when the flow increases.
I'd seen they were not fans of strong current but I just thought it was a side effect of their lethargic nature. I didn't know that about their mouth and gills.
+++++++++++++++++++++

I had two YellowCat teachers teach me everything they had been taught, plus learned in their experiences. I have taken all of that, then found even more, including the Catfish Calendar. I am always researching more & more on the Catfish Calendar. As others use the Calendar & help share what happens on their end, I compile even more to the scope of its significance to constantly get a bigger picture again & again.

On the YC days of my Catfish Calendar, these are the days that for some reason, the YellowCats switch into some sort of what I call a "roam/feed" pattern. Call it some sort of "shopping spree" or perhaps a "walkabout", but nevertheless, they get out of the "apartment" or little "cottage area" that they have claimed for "squatting".

You noted you were using the Brazos below PK as to your findings. I have used the Brazos, Navasota, and Trinity Rivers as to rivers for researching the Catfish Calendar. Currently Phase 2 is lake research at Lake Limestone out of the Running Brach fork down into the bottom of the lake at 3 main areas (in order to get a wide scope on different levels and surroundings).

Here are the comparisons of the 3 rivers:

Trinity River--- Yes, they run their escape route come time for high water (estimate of 3.5 to 5' higher at minimum).

Navasota River--- Yes, same as Trinity, but may not need to be quite so high, as the Navasota is shallow & spreads wide qwikly.

Brazos River--- I mainly fished at the first rockwall above TX 21 in Newt's hole (one of my YellowCat teachers). In this case, I was not able to determine the escape route or not (as to finding it or see it in action). The reason why being that there was a shelf that protected the Yellows as to where they "squatted" there. Of course, once the Brazos gets over about 5 feet high, you would not catch me anywhere in the water. I would rather fish the Trinity at 10 to 15 feet above, as it is much safer. The Brazos becomes extremely treacherous due to the ups & downs of holes & rocks. But the shelf there protected them from faster waters of up to 5 feet above normal level (at least). In the Brazos, are many pools and such protected by rocks and/or shelves. This can account for their lack of running an escape route. But once the water flow increases enough (or their senses indicate there is the need), they will switch into their "escape route". It is necessary, as due to their unique structure, in order to survive.

They may play lethargic, but if you have ever seen one move, they are like a rocket blasting off sideways (faster than trying to shoot upwards). They can move extremely qwik. One 57 pounder gave me a little extra data after being caught baxck in 2006 back at Running Branch Marina. If you have never seen one of these come flying out of the water, then I can assure you, it is something to behold. It is almost like riding a buckin' bronc, but just not being on its back, but holding on ever so tight to the 1/4 nylon rope as it takes you & the boat for a ride. If I would have only had pics, but I was holding on with both hands.

I forget which one explained to me the problem with the pliable mouths & gills of a YellowCat. I'm thinking it was Olen. Olen also taught me how to put a YellowCat to sleep. In April 1979, he taught his group up at the upper end of Lake Livingston as they caught a 30+ pounder. After putting it to sleep, he reached under with both arms, picked it up out of the water and laid it in the bottom of their boat. He said you could have heard a pin drop & all eyes were bugged out as they watched, as they could not believe it. He said it woke up about 15 minutes later & almost tore the bottom of the boat up.

A lot of people do not realize it, but you can get even more data from various methods such as rod-n-reels, throwlines, juglines, trotlines, limb lines, and so on. You need all of them to get a truly large picture of the whole. For instance, a Rod-n-Reeler will probably never discover that Yellows have a unique "nod" or that they run a figure "8", as they latch onto them in the heat of a battle. But with set lines, after they tire out some, if not riled up too much, you will experiences these, one or the other, or both. As I said, Yellows are very methodical or pattern-oriented. "Big 'Un", my 60 pound Op (65+) I fished for almost 2 years, taught me a lot, including the morning I caught it. At first it awoke & went into a semi-riled up mode of the figure "8". By knowing that pattern, I keyed in on it, and timed when to swoop the Net & sweep around scooping it up as I was circling around and bringing it into the boat. Just like clockwork. Never stopped or lost the timing. Of course I'm sure the adrenalin helped somewhat.

opus,

+++++++++++
Someone posted a SI pic awhile back that showed trails
+++++++++++

That would be really neat to see.

Jeff G,

Be sure you mark, or at least by memory, the spot you are in, because once found, it never ends. You may empty the neighborhood for awhile of the Yellows there, but the next year, another family will have moved in the area. Newt's hole on the Brazos River proved that to me & another of our group. Biggest Newt caught there in 1980 was a 35#. Biggest I caught was a 28# in 1981. And in 1982, Randy tied on to my stake (I had put mine in the same spot Newt had done his), and the biggest he got was a 22#.

I fished there in 1993 & it seems that the shelf got eroded & the Yellows had moved elsewhere. You could tell the current was different there as well. Sigh, the end of an era.

Lakes normally do not run into as many shifts and changes as Rivers do.

A spawning route might be different from the regular paths. Not really sure. One group that was down at RB back on July 4th, 2002 explained they had their trotlines set around the bridge at the north end of Lake Limestone. They would catch the Yellows heading to spawn travelling certain areas thru the section of the bridge. Usually they would come in with at least one really big one of their trip.

I would love to fish with you sometime, Lynn. You are a deep well of catfish knowledge. I've only been hunting yellow cats for going on two years now but I've been studying them pretty intensely since I started fishing for them as I believe they are an interesting enough species to be worthy of that kind of devotion.
I've learned way more about them from Jug fishing than I have R&R. In fact until I started jug fishing for them I couldn't even catch one the R&R.

so if u find one yella cat is there more in that same area

Generally, yes. But even if you catch the one that was there another will move in on the territory.

The "Trail" was good to us again...

I know the record holder on Lavon has some trails marked. He spent a lot of time looking for them. I need ot pic his brain some more and figure out how to find the trails. I really am not too sure you could find one using a graph but not sure, all depends on colorline.

Anyhow, if anyone has some pics of a graph showing this or more input on how to find the trails that would be much appreciated.

MR,
You know, the only reason I have any knowledge of catfish is from basically two things. One being that I would spend all night catching a few rinky dinks in my younger years. Second, is that others catching more & also larger ones, made me determined that I would excel, regardless if it took me the rest of my life.

From that, I learned to observe (& take written notes). Even Einstein could not remember everything. Once when asked what the speed of light was, he said he would have to look it up, as things like that clutter up the memory. And sometimes you find other information from sources you would not expect. When Ron shares something about his Crappie fishing & his finding, I ponder on it to see if it has Catfish implications. Oddly, some things definitely do.

I believe everybody who catfishes, has some sort of information which is important to everyone (as to catfishing), or least to one person. If you don't share, then we or that one person will never receive that juicy morsel of info we've been searching for.

I happen to not only like catfishin', but also research & finding interesting things. I like to study things & see what makes 'em tick. I am not afraid to take a bucket of water from the ocean & study it one bucket at a time. Seems overwhelming, but every journey begins with a step, then another & another.

I feel that by listening to all techniques, Rod-n-Reel, set lines, and such (yes, even some that are now illegal), many things can be learned. I realize no one way has all the answers. Would I like to catch Catfish by Rod-n-Reel? You betcha, as compared to some of those on the Forum here. Will it ever happen? Don't know. As to me & shad, they don't work for me. I'm hopin' one day, somebody will be the one that will instruct me to the point to where they will work. Meanwhile, I will pursue the catfish experience as best I can do from my relative position. From that point, I gladly share what I have observed. And I hope others do the same. Life is given in that we are teachers & learners. We must become both.

For instance, I had never thought of using a steel rod to tamp to determine YellowCat paths. I understand why a steel rod would be best. It is harder than wood. And the resonance could be not only felt, but possibly heard, in so that two methods as to findings could be much more helpful. As a sidenote to that, on the river, I used to use Loop stakes (3/8 Rebar about 30 to 36" long, twisted on one end to make a loop) to stick in the mud or clay on each side of my trotlines or on my throwlines. Even in tough clay, with a little effort, I could still stick it into the ground (bank). Usually just off the bank, underwater, I would leave just enough protrusion to find later. If the river rose, I could use my 12 foot gaff to grab my line, just off the shore aways, being careful not to yank the stake out & run the line while it was up. If the river was up & I planned to pull a trotline or throwlinwe, I would take my 12' gaff (10' of 1" Schedule 40 PVC pipe with a 30" piece of 3/8" rebar shapped like a check mark or "J" hook & is attached to the pipe by 3 hose clamps) and run it around where I thought the edge of the loop stake was. It would not only "feel" the metal to metal contact, but "hear" the metal to metal contact. Yes, you could hear the metallic sound. Plus the loop stakes are good for a temporary landing attachment for your boat.

Looks like Jeff G hit a good path.

Noted as being caught Yesterday. Perhaps when you ran the lines Saturday AM? Yes or No? As YC days were 28/29 (Thurs/Fri). The next YC days will be May 7th/8th (Sat/Sun).

MR,

Juglines are interesting, as they can be used as set lines or drifting lines, so they can be used in those modes of operation. Sounds like are keying in on the Yellows very well. And in 2 years, as well. My teachers taught me back in '79 & '80, so I've had a lot of time to research over the years, but life does not always allow to fish constantly (or at least in my case).

On the Trinity down in this area, I have heard of big Yellows eating rabbits as they come down to drink water. Now as to whether the rabbit was on the edge or just barely in the water, I could not say for sure. But either way, can you imagine one of these monsters just sucking down a rabbit in one big gulp? And the sheer speed & force of the lunge to catch the rabbit offguard?

MR,

Juglines are interesting, as they can be used as set lines or drifting lines, so they can be used in those modes of operation. Sounds like you are keying in on the Yellows very well. And in 2 years, as well. My teachers taught me back in '79 & '80, so I've had a lot of time to research over the years, but life does not always allow us to fish constantly (or at least in my case).

On the Trinity down in this area, I have heard of big Yellows eating rabbits as they come down to drink water. Now as to whether the rabbit was on the edge or just barely in the water, I could not say for sure. But either way, can you imagine one of these monsters just sucking down a rabbit in one big gulp? And the sheer speed & force of the lunge to catch the rabbit offguard?

Sounds like some day we may have to do that "research" trip together.

I believe yellow cat definitely follow paths. For many yrs, my uncle fished exclusively for opps on LL with trotlines. Result was almost always the same. Catch a good opp on a line and you'd catch a lot more within the same 4-5 hooks year after year. Areas where these lines were set did not have timber or rocks or other obstructions. The lines did not hang up even with a big fish on them. Several times, there would be two opps on the line next to each other. Best trip I remember was a 58# and 42# next to each other. After many experiments trying to determine how to intercept routes, his plan was to set a line down the middle of a cove or slightly across the middle of the cove. Lines running perpendicular to the center line of the cove never did very good. Also, he caught just as many opps on bare hooks as with bait. Lines weren't snag lines, just legal trotlines with 7/0 or 8/0 hooks. He finally got to the point, he would leave hooks at the intercept site (10) and take the other hooks off.

Ken,
Which lake are you using LL for?
Some use it for Lavon, some for Lewisville, and some might use it for Limestone. Just wondering.

I always note that the littler ones (say 30 pounders & down) can use the paths, but if you catch larger ones & it keeps occurring, then you found a path for sure. Littler ones tend to "stray" a little.

But if you keep catching a swarm like Jeff, then it is obvious that you found "a" path.

Lake Lewisville. Fished primarily in the Cottonwood area in the early 60s thru 70s.

In! I'm the same way once something takes ahold of my attention. I read everything I can find written on the subject. I talk to everybody who seems to know even the slightest about it. And I prusue it diligently.
I started out when I was about 5 years old bass fishing in ponds. I didn't have a dad so I was mostly self taught though I have learned a great deal from my father-in-law.
Back in the 90s I discovered saltwater fishing the TX bays and that was all that held my attention for a good long while. Just a little while back I discovered flatheads and the idea of a monstor apex preditor in my local waters captivated my mind. And then come to find out that preditor was one of the tastiest fishes in the water to boot... I was hooked.

Went through my watched post, and found this. Good interesting stuff !

Spiderman,

I pulled this thread up for you. We had an older thread that someone had posted a pic or illustration as to "hardened" trails due to Yellows constantly running them. As to using juglines to target Yellows, if they free float, they could drift over a Yellow's apartment or a trail, or one on a feeding run (I refer to it as a "roam-feed" circuit switched on). You might also breeze thru my past threads on My Catfish Calendar for more on Yellows. The one in 2010 has a 3 part story concerning the Catfish Calendar. Here are there links. ---
Previously ...
2010 <http://texasfishingforum.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/5176857/1>
2011 <http://texasfishingforum.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/5657988/1>
2012 <http://texasfishingforum.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/7059981/1>
2013 <http://texasfishingforum.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/8477517/1>
2014 <http://texasfishingforum.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/9620277/1>
2015 <http://texasfishingforum.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/10541276/1>

If'n I have any spare time, I will look to see if I jotted down the one on Catfish "hardened" trails or to about when it was. Maybe I saved the pic, which would also give me a time slot to look for.

Thanks for bringing up this old post.

The jug lines I'm using are weighted, I'm fishing specific places that would lead from deep brush piles to shallow water for night time feeding.

I'm picking locations based on side imaging. I have crappie fished the same lake for 12 years and felt at times that a flathead would either eat or make the crappie leave a brushpile that I had built & that had been a good producer. Then one day you would go to the brushpile & catch 2 or 3 crappie, even thou the weather was stable, and the lake was unchanged. The crappie would avoid it for a month but would eventually return.

As you can see, experience or consistant research pays off. Long term use of a specific area on a lake or river is a big super Plus. If not doing it yet, be sure & keep a log of conditions & catches- anything that helps or will help in review. Main thing is to jot & preserve these notes, either on 3x5 cards, then as soon as getting back, transfer data into a notebook. Or if you can keep notebook protected & dry, you can take it & jot it down after each run or catch (not leaving out specific details). And nowadays, it does not hurt to type info over onto your computer so you will have a second copy (and perhaps a more legible one) to preserve this precious data. Not many people understand how the mind & brain operate, but to write it down, creates a mental image that is stored in the subconscious. Even if you never reread your data, it is still locked in the subconscious.

I did a search in my email program, as U-6 (my 2006 Dell Tower) has data & pics going back to June 2006. I found a link, but when I pulled it up, it was this thread & noting April 2011. Opus noted that someone had previously posted it prior to this thread. I got on TFF in May 2009, so my guess it was from 5-2009 to April 2011 as to the window we are looking for. I forget exactly if the pic was a graph chart or illustration. Opus noted it was a scan pic (SI). It is possible that the TFF search engine might be able to sift it out of the archives. If I find spare time, I will try to find it. I glanced thru some possible saved pics in U-6 but did not find it (a copy).

good info lynn
thanks for sharing

Not a problem. Still hoping to dig back to find the scan or pic that was shared earlier than this thread.

Timely info thread, thank you Lynn for bringing up this thread and sharing your knowledge on the forum. Teach on sir, yours is one of the most informed threads in a while...

On a side note, are you gonna post 2016 calendar, soon? The reason I am curious about your calendar being the change in lake Tawakoni which I fish almost exclusively. Since the big flood Twok always has currents and I don't have much lucks from the bank. I am thinking about either getting a kayak or an aluminum boat to test your river catfish theories. Heck, I think the shad and blue catfish are behaving as if lake Tawakoni is just a big river, shad are everywhere, winds don't seem to matter to them...

BankAngler50,

My apologies, as I logged on to TFF, it just dawned on me that I had not posted the January 2016 Calendar, as well as the 2016 Calendar thread. Actually it was 13ankin_It who pulled it out of archives in October, which made it easy for me to retrieve for Spiderman.

OK, be a few minutes since I am up, I'll go ahead & start the 2016 thread, along with January calendar.

I trust aluminum flat bottoms. I had a friend who had one of the old Ted Williams (Sears) fiberglass flat bottom. It was much heavier & with too much weight in front, he & two others went (dove down) just like a submarine in Lake Somerville during the floods of Spring 1979. He also had another spare motor clipped by a rinky dink chain (he lost that one). We went diving for it the following week, but no luck finding it.

I don't think I could trust a kayak after seeing two on the Guadalupe ridings some stairway rapids flip. After that, the bottoms were top side & their paddles kept going. Somehow, they finally flipped back over Or got out. I'll never forget that. I like the stability of a flat bottom. My sister's V-style vinyl 12' Porta-Bote is great, holds a lot of weight, and with a 3.5 HP Johnson with only one person will run fairly fast (unless loaded down with gear & weights. But the bottom being flexible can be your worst nightmare. I know because I made a stupid error on Turkey Day 2011. I knew better, but obviously was not paying attention. I had just dropped two sets of juglines (4 or 5 set out in a row) in the center of the Running Branch fork. I set the ones just outside the fork, then the set just inside the fork. Normally ranges 24' to 28', lake was 10' low after the summer2011 drought & heat, so 14' & 18'. I stood up straight & rigid (not flexing) facing sideways. Big Mistake! The gear buckets shifted (including two with weights) due to the flexible bottom & slid causing the boat to rock or tilt hard & fast. I could not flex to adjust & finally fell backwards over the side with legs hanging inside. Always, but always remain flexible & aware, and facing forward or backwards, never sideways. The problem with only one person in a Porta-Bote, it is too flexible or awkward to be able to get back in it out on the water. With two people you can do it, but one alone just can't get back in.

I almost forgot. And even though a flat bottom is extremely stable, you do have to stay alert & always ready for a really big fish. I had my Dad's old 1963 Sears Elgin 12' aluminum flat bottom (very deep & sturdy compared to ones nowadays), rated for a 7.5 HP (not just a 5 HP). I had set up some special braces (on the boat (for the stress of the power to weight ratio) & was running a 1982 15 HP Sea King by Chrysler (short, stocky & only 48 pounds). I could run 20 to 25 MPH, and barely have any wake as the boat was only touching water at the back seat. On take off, she would raise up, then plane out & Zoom. And I could do a few stunts too, such as actually run the boat sideways going up or down the river (without flipping it). Once on the Brazos, my brother-in-law wanted to run it. I warned about the power to weight ratio, but his curiosity took over & he did a qwik turn. Luckily, he corrected & backed off the throttle, but we still got wet butts from water that swept in on the side in his turn maneuver. He slowed down & killed it. And said, OK, I'll let you take back over, as I don't want to swim back down to the bridge.

Anyways, I & Jimmy (my first father-in-law) were running lines on the Trinity below TX 21 (about 25 bends down which is about a good 20 to 30 minutes down river at 18 to 25 MPH) in August 1983 which was my first test year for the Catfish Calendar on the Trinity. We came up to a big stump about 8 or 10' from the bank, maybe about 15 to 18' deep. I had a 5 hook throwline. Jimmy was in the middle or front seat & grabbed the line & held it up enough so I could grab it on my left side. It was very foggy that morning. Visibility was bad. I grabbed the line & did not feel any tugs, so I was sitting in the middle & was working along the line very fast. Mistake! Regardless, you should always the unexpected. Then it happened, I woke her up. Sh was off & with me hanging on the line. I slid from the center to the edge & then down. I was caught by surprise. But luckily, I realized I did not need to ride it out. I let go, as my left arm was almost to its shoulder. Had I not let go when I did, I would have been in the water in the next second or two. And thus began the story of Big'Un, a 60+ pound Op. I finally caught her in July 1985. Several times I had her on the line, only to get off just before getting to her. I had guessed it was a big Yellow & used the calendar to target her on the YC days. And finally succeeded. And sure enough, I was correct.

Basically, I do not think I would have stayed out of the water in the first encounter, had I been in a kayak, canoe, a V-hull, semi-V, or even a fiberglass flat bottom. Perhaps not even one of the flimsy 12 foot flat bottoms. But the sturdy 12 foot I was in or a 14' aluminum flat bottom is a very stable boat with even a big cat trying to9 take you for a ride. A 40+ Op has amazing strength & knows how to dive & does it by lightning speed.

I have heard about the trails in lakes, they say they are like beaten cattle trails. When Buchanan went down we found some coming out of a rock bluff that had a big hole. Be careful if you set lines or run jugs out of your kayak. We use them to run trot lines and throw lines in the llano river for yellow cat but it's a lot different on a lake especially in winter. I've seen my buddy flip his yak setting out trot line weights, he let go and flipped him the other way. Be careful and good luck!

Best flathead trail is one that ends at a low water dam.

Thank you so much Lynn for sharing your experiences and insights. Also, thank you lambcotx for advice/warning on kayaking. Y'all are a good examples and the reason why I keep coming back to this forum. After reading your posts, aluminum boat is most likely route I'll take. Thanks again gentlemen.

I sure wish I could find another 12' like my Dad's 1963 Elgin he bought new at Sears. It had a deeper hull than most found today. Plus the 12 foot is easier to maneuver in amongst the stumps. However, out on the main lake I prefer my cousin's MonArk wide 14' flat bottom. Even though nice & sturdy, it is too low. So I built a raised portion up front & on the sides, to be able to handle an extra 6" or so on the sides, but about 6" to 8" or more on the front. But still when the wionds get about 10 to 15 MPH, I have to squat up (crouched so I can spring up when the water rolls in) instead of being directly on the seat to keep from getting my butt wet as waves roll over into the boat running trotlines on Limestone. We even put up an extra corral board section to the right so my Uncle would not get sprayed in at, plus that is where we set up all the electrical switches. But I set it up to detach if not needed. We have lights up overhead for running & lines, two bilge pumps, one bilge pump for 55 gallon fish tub, etc. I have a PVC roof frame (with 1/2" rebar inside to brace the 6 uprights & the two main length rails) on my cousin's 14'.

I bought my daughter & son-in-law a 10' flat bottom (not a deep or sturdy one). They took it to the Navasota River 2nd bridge here on TX 21. Kristina was used to the sturdy & stable 12' Elgin. So before they got to paddle out from the bank, they rolled it sideways, and fell out. That would have never happened in the 12' Elgin.