Coast Guard's take on lighting

I sent them an email and this is the response I got back. I also sent them a picture of a boat with LED lighting on the rub rails (still waiting to hear back)

USCGA response-

Nathan,

Marine Safety Alert 10-15 issued by the Coast Guard in November addressed after-market navigation lights (http://www.uscg.mil/hq/cg5/cg545/alerts/1015.pdf). After reading the Alert, if you still have questions I would have to refer you to the Coast Guard Office of Boating Safety or the nearest Coast Guard facility for a final determination.

Thank you for your service and interest in safe boating.

Perry R. Taylor, DIR-Vd
Branch Chief, Vessel Examination
and Recreational Boating Safety Visitation
U.S. Coast Guard Auxiliary

Thank you for doing that research and posting the link to the Safety Alert. It reviews some of the same concerns I have brought up on here. Now we've got a notice that the USCG is concerned about the unchecked addition of lighting that isn't compliant. (Note that even a light that could be compliant can become non-compliant when improperly installed.) Many people who do this may mean well, but they aren't always equipped or sufficiently informed to insure that what they install is compliant. I see a LOT of lighting that is probably not compliant. This is a new thing that wasn't an issue a decade ago. I for one hope the trend can be corrected or it will get ridiculous, it it already isn't.

This is the important part of the SECURITY ALERT-

Some manufacturers are producing and distributing navigation lights that do not meet the certification
requirements indicated above. These lights are typically less expensive, making them a tempting
choice for uninformed consumers. Use of lights that do not provide the proper chromaticity, luminous
intensity, or cut-off angles could result in the issuance of a notice of violation or potentially cause an
accident. Recreational boaters should ensure each purchased navigation light contains the following
information on the light or its packaging: [b][/b][u][/u]

I hate but I served in the CG for quite some time, so I feel like this is the only soap box I can stand on and feel like I am saying the right thing here, cause I sure cant fish worth a dam......haha every one be safe this holiday weekend and take a minute out of your weekend and remember what its really about!

BM1 United States Coast Guard 2003-2009 Semper Paratus!

"Coast Guard" ...... for the coast.....the oceans.....yep, got it......mean time, on Texas lakes, our game wardens have enough sense to worry about other things.....peace

Not correct sir.

If you check, for the waters in Texas enforced by our Texas game wardens, they all are governed by and must follow the Texas Water Safety Act.... a State law which itself references and uses the USCG regs.

Here on Texas reservoirs rivers and creeks, the USCG regs are the law.

Thanks for the update, you can't enough when it comes to safety.

a guy in our club put them on his boat and asked a game warden and he said it was OK with him. They could be easily seen.

I have never seen a coast guard patrol boat or auxiliary boat on Lake Fork. But on some lakes they are very active.

(Texoma, Hubbard)

Coast guard on Amistad

Some of you still argue the point read the red writing that is law regardless what a local GW says just like I been trying to tell yall this whole time and was only trying to tell yall those rub rail lights was not legal.

I have seen and been stopped by the Coast Guard on Falcon as well!~!!!

If thats the case then why are all boats CG regulated think about it if thats so then why wouldnt each states wildlife and fisheries department handle all of those regs on boat requirments were do you think all the boating rules come from the CG all over the US.

You guys do what you want..... I can read..... it's ambiguous, "could result"......USCG approved lights are a minimum standard...... quality LED lighting exceeds that standard......and one final thing for the jack wagons.....if you run into a boat that's lit up like a Christmas tree, you should not be allowed to operate a boat, EVER!

I've been a bass boat owner since I was 13......37 continuous years....never a ticket, never an accident....

Has anybody seen the new Nav lights on the Nitros? I look at the boats when I go to Bass Pro and I cannot see how their lights meet the standards; but surely they do.

they dont

You may have missed the thread where I discussed a special report made by the USCG. Their limited ability to inspect and oversee compliance by boat manufacturers has resulted in the manufacturers losing focus on abiding by the rules. Market demand for a cool pimped-out look has driven them to forget about the rulebook in some areas. In recent years, an unhealthy trend of poor adherence to regulations has been developing. The report discussed audit findings where numerous deficiencies were noted and correction notices were given to manufacturers. Unfortunately, the USCG must count on self-policing by manufacturers as they can't inspect every production plant. Just because a production plant built it doesn't mean it passes USCG muster, and they have a problem with this. The CG was clear that finding violations on in-production hulls was all too common. They are working on cooperative outreach efforts to make manufacturers more aware of regulations and bring attention to compliance and correction of bad designs. Compliance comes ahead of "cool" in the priority scheme.

That same USCG concern has bubbled down to the individual owner level as well. To that end, the CG has issued the following safety alert:

USCG Safety Alert

tell ya what, you spend the 50.00 on the rule book and let me read it. https://abyc.site-ym.com/store/ViewProduct.aspx?id=1445145

any org. that would implement rules that a fed. agency enforces does not have a right to charge for said rules or the fed. agency has no right to enforce said rules due to the restrictive nature of obtaining said rules.


as for the dam lights, go out and look at your dam pole lights and post a picture of the certification label on them, not one you stuck there.

man, you guys just don't get it sometimes, if my bow led's exceed the requirement as set by the cg yet they don't like the fact that I do not have a stinkin rating label on them then let them ticket me and I will meet them in court with video/pnotos/the rules as written and beat them over the head with their own stupidity.


I have been on and owned boats for over 50 yrs. and have yet to see ANY agency (leo/gw/cg) look at a dam nav light on or off the water and I have been inspected many many times and asked to be quite a few.


use the lights you want to use and quit trying to tell everyone esle wth to do with their stuff. JEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEZ


cheby/ford/dodge same chit.

my boat as it is, bow lights and I also have an led adjustable pole light for the stern, please don't try to tell me the bulb is illegal.






anchor lights

now tell me how I am not safer with this lighting than 2 skinny poles with 1157 bulbs in them.


the anchor lights can be seen at least 5 miles on a clear night and over 1/2 mile in fog, we tried it out with other boats observing me.

The USCG approval is with the packaging...

Oh, you don't have to pay for regs in book form. You can get them directly from the Federal Register:

http://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/ECFR?page=browse

USCG is very stern on the use of aftermarket lighting. There have been dozens of questions on the topic, and while the actual lights may meet the USCG standard, the locations may not. Our lights do meet the location standards and some we don't know how as they (bow lights) are required to have 270 degrees of vision in their described use.

The rub rail insert lights, additions of lights and LED light kits visible from the outside, which conflict with those colors required, are in violation. Some we know violate it in operation, and some do not violate it.

There is a label or usually a molded script in the lens or molded on the light body, which describes the regulation number that is met. Stern lights are required to be one meter above the bow light at rest, and this is a requirement for newer boats after about 1984 or 1985. The meter usually requires a 54" post on a bass boat.

If you have the rub rail lighting, then you can run it in conjunction with the bow lights legally, or so it was described to us. Though you can not run just the rub rail lighting. This is generally not major issue, unless you are in an accident during a low light condition that requires lighting, and yours is not legal.

BCB

Wow, do you read or just assume and post? ITS NOT THE BULBS IN QUESTION, ITS THE PLACEMENT OF THE BULBS!!

Guys, personally I think LED's mounted on the rub rails are a great idea. There are a lot of idiots on the water, I am all for anything that makes a boat stick out better at night. Honestly, I think agencies need to take another look at lighting when it comes to Inland waterways (small lakes). The question here is weather or not they are legal if mounted on your rub rails, and yes they can be if the proper angles exist. The thing is, if everyone in a bay area or ocean started tricking out there boats like we do on our local lakes, it would be very confusing to people who make a living on the ocean. I cant stress to you enough how much captains depend on lighting at night to know what another vessels intentions are.

Do the LED strips not hinder your vision at night a little while your running?

The all-around light must be at least one meter above the red/green sidelights. Any white light placed in the rubrail does not meet this requirement.

The all-around light is just that - one that can be viewed in all 360 degrees from the boat. Lighting placed in the left and right rubrail only does not meet this particular requirement, and is therefore a second reason why your lighting is not legal.

No other lighting can interfere with the ability to observe required lighting, including the red/green sidelights. I can't be sure of color in your photos. If you have white lights near the bow, those (or others) may emit bright glare making it difficult for others to see the red/green lighting. This interference would also be a violation.

The red/green lights must be visible through a 225 degree arc centered on the bow. I do not know if the placement of your red/green lights accomplishes this, but it is unlikely. It would have to be achieved only by the angle of the spot on the rubrail where they are placed. It is unlikely that any light (not just LED) with no blinder will spontaneously limit itself to a particular viewing angle when inserted into a rubrail.

as I posted above, please pay attn.


Re: Coast Guard's take on lighting [Re: nate king]
hopalong Online content
Super Freak

Registered: 09/06/08
Posts: 71157
Loc: formerly of guthrie oklahoma
my boat as it is, bow lights and I also have an led adjustable pole light for the stern, please don't try to tell me the bulb is illegal.


I do not have the rub rail lights on while running, strictly at anchor/trolling motor fishing.

please pay attn here, THE LIGHT HAS TO BE VISIBLE FOR 2 MILES AT THE STERN AND 1 MILE FOR THE BOW, yes it is the lights in question otherwise there would be no issue.

here ya go, tpwd requirements for lights. http://tpwd.texas.gov/fishboat/boat/safety/vessel_requirements/

Manually Driven Vessels when Paddled, Poled, Oared or Windblown

A sailing vessel of less than 20 meters (65.6 ft.), while underway shall exhibit sidelights and a sternlight which may be combined in one lantern carried at or near the top of the mast where it can best be seen.
A sailing vessel of less than 7 meters (23 ft.) shall, if practicable, exhibit the sidelights and a sternlight, or shall exhibit at least one bright light, lantern or flashlight from sunset to sunrise when not at dock.
All other manually driven vessels may exhibit sidelights and a sternlight, or shall exhibit at least one bright light, lantern, or flashlight from sunset to sunrise when not at dock. In vessels of less than 12 meters (39.4 feet), white lights shall be visible at a distance of at least two (2) miles. Colored lights shall be visible at a distance of at least one (1) mile. "Visible" when applied to lights, means visible on dark nights with clear atmosphere.

and as I stated above, I run an extended stern light that is well over 3' above my bow lights, all are led and all are visible for much more than the minimum requirement.


even on texoma the cg has never said a word to me about them, OKIE water patrol nor the Tx. water patrol, because they are above and beyond the minimum required.

doooood, you need help. now go read above about my extended pole and try to figure that out, hint, it is only used when running with the bow lights. key word being ANCHOR LIGHTS, get it, ANCHOR or in place/on trolling motor NOT RUNNING.

I will bet good money I run a more legal and safer boat that half of ya, want to get into the nit picky krap then lets go.

I was going by your photos showing your lights. You did not have any all-around light activated in those. I was reading the past with photos, and it did not have a description about the all-around pole light that I recall.

No light may interfere with a legally required light. If that was a white light up by the bow (near the red/green that may not have been on) it would be a violation. It would be so bright and close to the red/green to make them harder to see.

The all-around light is NEVER called an "anchor light" by the regulations. It must be on at all times, whether running or anchored. Go read the regs. I don't need help, you do.

see y'all next yr. when I need another laugh, and y'all think we in the OT are weird?

my boat as it is, bow lights and I also have an led adjustable pole light for the stern, please don't try to tell me the bulb is illegal.






anchor lights

that question was intended for people in general, not just for you, so get off your high hoarse, and in no way do i think you run those damn bright white lights while you are running, i was talking about people with the bright red and green ones on the front. Again just a general question for everyone, not just the all mighty hopalong

Please dont quote me NAV Rules that i have already posted on here several times. I passed my NAV RULES test, i dont need them red to me, i have the book. If you have a long pole light thats great! But your bow lights do not meet the degree angle required!

Hate to say it but if those white lights are so bright that one cant see your all around white anchor light then yes those are not legal either bud.

The USCG is very stern on the regulations that apply to recreational and commercial boats. They have no variance in opinion. All lights approved by the USCG will have a stamp, molded notation or mark on them that they are USCG approved and meet the regulations. We are not aware of any rub rail lights that meet the present standards and have been approved as required. There are some boat manufacturers which are placing lights where they do not meet USCG 270 degree guidelines, though the lights themselves are approved.

Public use Stern lights made prior to 1985 are allowed to be below one meter above the bow light legally, if they are still the original equipment. Which most officers are unaware of. Lights made after August of 1985 (memory?) must be above one meter above the bow light at a resting position. Which is where those 54" light posts came from. There is a lot more to meeting regulations, though this is a quick summary.

The Perko Stealth bow light we had built by Perko is an approved light. Many manufacturers now also use this light and it is a very nice part USA made. The question of legality has come from one officer (this was 1 mans opinon) out of East Texas (TP&W) before. The location and light are approved as installed and the boats have been reviewed by USCG staff. The USCG standards are way larger than one officer in one county of Texas or Arkansas sharing their opinion. Situations in these states involving 2 officers had been addressed with USCG. One involving the Stealth light and another involving Pontoon boat lighting. Both opinions are not within USCG regulatory requirements.

USCG standards are important that they are met with no conflicting coloring in lighting and use of approved light fixtures. The one accident that involves improper lighting place you in a position of liability. The bottom line is that many after market lights are not approved no matter what they appear like or how bright they are.

The USCG is also very aware of light that shines exterior of the boat which is cosmetic lighting. Some of the present interior light kits are a major concern for them and they have been discussed during their in plant inspections.

Eventually will become illegal to use once you leave ramp Im sure. All these non approved lights are dangerous and most have no idea why.

Good read here. I've always wondered why my white 360 light was so dang tall. I didn't realize there was a 3 meter rule there.

Nathan, I posted the Marine Alert back in November of 2015. Some appreciated it, some did not like it. You are wasting your time. Some of the people on the TFF know everything didn't you know that.

Those white lights on Hop's boat are for "at anchor"

Open mouth insert foot.

Have you even read the TX Reg as written? Find me someone that has been ticketed for led rubrail lights. If they meet visibility requirements (mine exceed this) I promise you I will beat a ticket in court.

Now here is a kicker for all of ya, my boat is an 82 champion. Figure that part out.

I have a dumb question , why the modified , additional lighting on a bass boat .

because when you launch for a tournament you normally are out before sunrise or right at sunrise, even at dusk for night tournaments. added visibility is a major good thing with the morons you find on the water. I have lost count of the boats I have almost hit at night due to them not having any lights on and anchored fishing, darwin will catch up to them eventually.
I want to be seen for as far as you can see me, I don't run on plane if I can't see at least 100 yds ahead of me, you would be amazed how much reflection I get on the buoys in the fork boatlanes when it is dark.

my anchor lights (led on exterior) let you see me from plenty far back, I can see about 50 yds when fishing in coves and stumps are much easier to avoid or fish.

mine are not just bling, they were installed for a purpose.