this might clear up the smallie/spot/mean mouth debate

Check this fish out that was caught by a buddy of mines fishing partner on Ray Roberts yesterday. I don't have permission to use the guy's name, so I won't. They brought it in believing it was a new lake record Spotted Bass. However, after being examined by TP&W biologist this morning it is believed to be a cross between a Spotted and a Smallmouth. They took fin samples and a few scales and will not know for certain until test results come back. The biologist said that it is rare but happens occasionally in northern states, but to his knowledge had never been documented in Texas. So to make a long story short, if it indeed comes back a hybrid it will not only be a lake record, but a state record for this species. The fish was released back into the lake this afternoon. Beautiful fish!

Pics?

wow, what a beautiful fish! what did it weigh??

Nvmnd

Looks like a smallie to me. It's a good one for sure

That is an awesome looking fish! I'd like to know what it weighed as well.

Post said 4.35 I'm curious to know the outcome of the testing I have personally caught 2 bigger than this one in the past 4 months and thought they were smallies. It's a post I saw on Facebook and I'm unsure of the angler that caught it. I emailed Texas parks and wildlife to see if I could get.more info.

I would have guessed smallmouth all the way. Gorgeous fish.

I'm with you mr. Franks just look forward to seeing what they say after the testing. Never thought that I threw a possible state record back more than once.

Caught this one last fall and was sure it was a smallmouth but coloration is similar to the one being tested. Regardless, they are fun to catch and really fight and jump like smallies!

When guys see that bronze color, how do they NOT know it's NOT a spot? Nevermind the markings. . .and I'm not saying I expect people to be able to identify a hybrid species, but one look and you can see that isn't a spot. Jesus.

Well this post most definitely WON'T clear up the debate but really cool fish.

I'd vote for meanmouth as well. Looks like the shape of a spot with the coloration more like that of a smallie and spot. Glad they did fin clips.

Thanks for posting.

Thanks for posting this, Ive caught a few on Texoma that look really close to that fish, just smaller. Really interested to know what the test results are Brad, keep us posted please!

My best smallmouth/spot/mean mouth from last year went 4.2lbs. Maybe the state can figure this debate out.

Tooth patch?

wow

I read that it was checked by TPWD and it was determined to be crossbreed, I saw the post on FB.

I disagree. Looks like a big ole healthy spot to me. Hybrid is very possible but that is not a smallmouth by any means. I see these guys come into weigh-in saying well we caught a couple smallies and they pull out the fish and it is a true spot, just because its over 3lbs doesn't mean its no a Texas Spot as we called them. But what do I know I didn't do a dissertation or anything on Micropterus dolomieu (smallmouth) and Micropterus punctulatus (spotted bass.

What would yall call this? Caught last Saturday.

I have caught 2 or 3 fish with the same color and shape from Ray Roberts in the past 2 years. I have caught smallmouth and spots previously and can identify them pretty readily. Not with those fish though.

The Zebra mussels have struck.

I've caught several out of Texoma, biggest being 4.18lbs. For a couple of years I thought it was a big funny looking spot I had caught but awhile back I realized it was a hybrid. Great catch, I have it on my phone but am having trouble uploading it in its current format.

[img]http://texasfishingforum.com/forums/pics...6fd08dbc45a_1.j[/img]




Here is the biggest one I have caught

Not a spot, and sure don't look like a largemouth, Look more like smallmouth.

Looks like cross to me btw Kentucky/smallie.

Definitely a small mouth

definitely not a smallmouth; some kind of hybrid.

These are smallmouth.

I recieved a.response from tp&w and they are still waiting on the test results from what I gather from the response I got.

Excellent. What did you send? Scale sample?


About 8 years ago in a Media T on Roberts back when slot, a buddy weighed in a Kentucky that was around 5 lbs, after much debate at the livewell tank it was not allowed and he sent pics off to TPWD, they said more than likely it was cross btw largemouth and Kentucky, but they would of needed scale samples and I believe at the time it would taken killing the fish for that.

I remember that fish. I saw it. 100% sure it was a largemouth.

I.didnt catch this fish another angler did and they came to certify it as a new lake record spot and decided it was cross in their opinion so the took scale and fin samples. That's about all the info I have so far other than if it is indeed a mean mouth that it will the a lake record for ray roberts and a state record.

found this on the internet....

Glad you could contribute

That's a good looking smallmouth.

The biggest things the original photo has going for it not being a pure smallie are:
1) faint horizontal banding
1.a) broken vertical bars (top to. Bottom)
2) horizontal rows of "stripes" on the belly
3) no mottled pigmentation

Brad, I think yours is a hybrid too, the horizontal banding can be seen in the tail, and the belly is too pure a white.

David that is some interesting points you have made, I know they look a lot different from the texoma smallmouth I catch and different than the spots on ray roberts. I have caught a few of what I would say are pure smallies in ray roberts and they are a really dark brown color not like these that are more of a gold/green coloration. I just look forward to the test results coming back, then we need to know how long mean mouth need to be if they are actually mean mouth. I'll see if I can dig.up some pictures of the darker brown ones and post them.

Agree David.

Smallies don't have the bottom 1/3 of a spot and this one sure does.

I can't wait to hear the verdict on this one.

I've had all three in a fish tank and they all have very drastic color changes,and even slight pattern changes.Water temp changing and food being present or not would make them change.im interested in seeing the results as well.to me it looks like a smallmouth.

Good Article on Mean Mouth - Cross between Smallmouth and Kentucky with pics

https://rhayse.wordpress.com/2013/12/01/mean-mouth-bass/

Sorry... but I have to

Seems like every thread about identifying spots or smallies only confuses the masses even more. I'm sure you can find evidence of many species cross breeding in our lakes. Once you get into this whole cross breeding being a different kind of fish there would need to be a whole new set of records for spotted bass/largemouth mix, Spoted bass/smallie mix, smallie/largemouth mix, smallie/largeouth mix cross bred with spot/smallie mix and on and on and on... and it can only be determined what you caught in a lab. Much like the human race, pure breeds will become very rare as time begins to pass in lakes like Grapevine, Ray Roberts, EM, Bridgeport, and Texoma. If it werent for the pure Florida strain stockings it would be even more prevalent.

Original pic IMO is a smallie, and one heck of a nice one at that. Congrats to the angler!

You guys need to get out of Texas more often. If my computer is not blocking any of the photos, I see 5 different fish posted and every one of them is a spot.

Caught this one on Stillhouse last weekend. Based on the ID above assume it's a spot. Never caught one there before.

I've caught hundreds of smallies out of the Devil's River and I would call the fish in these pics smallies also except for greenen's pic

Spot..........

My wife caught this one a few years back on Eagle Mountain. Meanmouth or Smallmouth??