Redfin has it right. GOOD GRIEF, GO FISHIN'!!! We in North Texas have more than enough water to fish in, load up the kids, and go make some memories that are worthwhile.

Ditto GJ. We have plenty of water to fish in the north Texas area. While I understand everyone's frustration with the fact that tax payer dollars were spent to stock the lake, I really have a hard time jumping on the bandwagon. What ever happend to the rights of property owners???? Be it yourself or some large corporation such as TXU, the rights of property owners are some of the most precious rights we as Americans have. Once we no longer have the right to do what we want, with what we own, we essentially have no rights at all.

I find myself sitting on both sides of the fence on this one. Let me first say, I do not KNOW who OWNS Squaw Creek. It is also unclear to me who issued the order to close Squaw Creek. I do remember lots of, as yet unfufilled, promises that TU Electric made to get Comanche Peak built.

For one thing, it is a total joke to think that it is possible to damage Comanche Peak with something that you can sneak into Squaw Creek in the back of a pickup unnoticed.

As a matter of fact, Comanche Peak, as a legitimate target is a joke itself. If terrorist had a device capable of damaging the reactor, there are built in failsafes that would shut down reaction with little to no fallout. Such a bomb would be far easier to take out a high rise in downtown Ft Worth or Dallas and cause much greater destruction. If Comanche Peak were to go 'off-line', the energy impact would also be nominal. It has shut down several times due to routine maintenance, etc.

Secondly, can everyone take a good look at who commited the acts of September 11? Can we all quit being politically correct and recognize the terrorist for who they are/were?? Not many people who fish Squaw Creek would fit that demographic. If that hurts your feelings, well too damn bad. Your hurt feelings are not going to change FACTS, and that is all I'm stating! This political correct crap is going to get us all killed.

The primary purpose of terrorism is to disrupt as many lives as possible. When we quit going to our favorite fishing hole because we’re afraid of terrorist attack, we make the terrorists attacks that much more effective.

If TXU owns Squaw Creek, then they have the right to say what does or does not happen on their property. But, if they received special exemptions and public funds to make this facility, they have an obligation to the general public as much as their stockholders.

Given my limited information, I could go either way. Or like daddy used to say, “after it’s all said and done. A lot more is said than done”.

We are not driving 160 miles a day 4 days a week to Lake Ray Roberts to fish our clients.Because -- Squaw is Closed. Granbury has also lost our gas,grocery,Hotel,Cafe business of our clients because of Squaw being closed. We expect that Squaw will be closed from now on. Except to the people that are chosen by TXU to fish there. We thought that it was only TXU employees that would be allowed but it has come to our attention that Others are being allowed in.

[This message has been edited by Mr.Whiskers (edited 06-06-2002).]

Back it up with some proof, not hear say.

Quit complaining about it, go to Proctor instead.

Not hear say straight from one that went in.

First of all, you all have it wrong. TXU supports fishermen all over. If they felt it was feasible to reopen the reservoir, they would try. They are not purposely singling out fishermen. If you are in the Nuclear Business, politics is the name of game because the plant is under the watchful eye of the Nuclear Regulatory Commission (government). If Comanche Peak was shut down, there will be alot more lives affected than those wanting to fish the lake. By the way, Oncore is the name for the newly formed Transmission and Distribution company. Comanche Peak is part of the generating division currently named TXU Energy.

I have worked for TXU for over 16 years. This september 11th incident has cramped the Squaw Creek fishermen's style. If you think it hasn't cramped TXU's style, you really don't know the whole game. The security changes ongoing at Nuclear Plants across the country is unbelievable. Every plant is implementing changes in response to September 11th. It will be years before all is done.

There has been alot of overly cautious actions due to the September 11th incident (such as closing Squaw Creek). I am a fisherman and have fished Squaw Creek before either of the plants were on line, when it was a deep cold lake with walleye in it. I have also caught catfish, hybrids, smallmouth, and huge largemouth bass. I do not want it closed either, but if that is what they have to do to help ensure the safety of the plant, even if its over cautious, I'm for it.

Be patient, I firmly believe that after all the dust is settled, there will be a compromise that will hopefully have us fishermen back on the water.

MY TWO CENTS,

Michael Acosta

We have talked with NRC and it is not them that have Squaw Lake Closed to public. If you are going to close it off to the people,Under the guise of sucurity, it should be shut to all people not just the ones that have friends in TXU. Dont let hundreds of children and parents in to fish.

I understand your frustration. That was a kid fish day that I understand was soley on the bank opposite the plant. A highly controlled event with no boats. As far as I know that was only one day for the good of the kids.

MWA

Mr. Acosta. to quote you "If you are in the Nuclear Business, politics is the name of game". We well understand this. If you would be so kind please tell me why none of the other 102 nuke plant waters are closed to public??? They did not want to open Squaw in the beginning.They had to to prove to the public that the water was safe to be around. and now that it is closed their politics is going to keep it closed. Since you have been with TXU for 16 years would you be so kind to let us know what your job is? We are mad as heck that a privileged few are allowed to fish and the everyday fisherman are not.

[This message has been edited by Mr.Whiskers (edited 06-10-2002).]

I do not want to get in a contest with you. TXU has to justify its security measures and I am not in the position to discuss this. As far as I know there are currently no priviledged TXU folks who are fishing the lake. It is off limits to us as well and there are plenty TXU folks who would like to get back on the water also. All of us out here have background/security checks just to work here and we are still not allowed to fish. I am a Consulting Electrical Engineer at the plant. Please direct any further questions through the appropriate channels, as I will no longer respond to this topic. There is more than meets the eye and I am not the appropriate person to answer your questions.

Good Luck,

Michael Acosta

Mad as heck because a bunch of kids were able to fish in a closed lake and you were not. God, how old are you?

You are probably right about one thing though. TXU probably did not want to ever open the lake to the public because they are held responsible. One person gets hurt or dies on the property, their families would sue the pants off TXU. It's the new generation. With all the other crap from the public that the nuclear industry has to deal with, I was surprised they even opened it.

TXU has closed several of its power plant lakes after people have drowned. I was afraid they were going to close Squaw the night a family of boaters got lost in the fog on the lake and were not found til the next morning. I guess they did not sue TXU.

Listen, I used to fish Squaw all summer long and caught catfish and bass like no other lake, and the closing has forced me to learn other lakes. That has actually been good because fishing Squaw was sometimes not even a challenge.

Squaw is a big mote and no one is allowed in the mote right now. Because the mote is there without boaters, TXU security can concentrate on defending only a small portion that has land access, and believe me, this has not been an inexpensive task.

TXU did not close the lake to piss off a bunch of anglers that made their living off of the lake. There are alot of conversations between the NRC and TXU that you and I will never know. Please do not stir people up about you talking to the NRC and them telling you everything. What kind of national security plan is that? Are you telling me that a terrorist, posing as an angry fisherman, can call the NRC and they will tell you all about the U.S. nuclear plant's security plans? I would be more angry about that than closing Squaw Creek Res.

I also work at CPSES and loved fishing on SCR. I also was truly disappointed when it closed. But forming into an angry mob against TXU to lower security so we can fish for a few "easy to catch fish" is the kind of things that terrorist organizations want us to do. Lets do the same thing at airports too! I don't like them searching me. We lower security and they kill innocent people. Nope, not good.

I would say that TXU and the NRC know alot more about security plans than anyone on this forum, and I am willing to stand behind their decisions. Some people have the tendencies to form a mob and stampede like a herd of cattle and do stupid things. Let's not make that mistake.

As some have mentioned, when we beat the living shit out of the terrorists, they will most likely open the lake. But until we do, the lake will most likely stay closed. Like it or not, you can thank Bin Laden and his band of radical assholes not TXU. Changing electric providers is your choice, but it will not change that fact.

My two cents worth.

they closed north lake a year are two ago because irving got tired of taken care of it so they just fenced the holle thing off peroid, now no one can get in. it may be a up keep thing as of now

I served this great country as a United States Marine, I am currently rated 30% diabled for my service connected disability. I have never ran away, covered my eyes, or been affraid of tomorrow's terrorists. We continue to be told "Get back on the planes, everything is fine".
The success of a terrorists depends on your willingness to be afraid, and change your lifestyle to sneaking around in the dark like rats.
It is un-imaginable that our Homeland security agencies Bow down in defeat and say that their situation is soo out of controll & uncontained that honest citizens (other than TXU employees)must be banned from tresspassing in or around Squaw Creek Lake.

Take a dog from the airport & let him sniff the boats & people coming in.

I am not aware of any boat attacks made by alqueda on any U.S.Lakes. I do know of four hijacked passenger jets. But we are being told come fly again and stay out of the water. Does this really make sense to the people making these rules. With licenced to carry civilians fishing closeby, any boat making a run at the peaks will likely fall short of their intentions.

I beleive that a few well armed Texans had we been in range could have stopped the attack on the USS Cole.

Check persons before allowing entry to the lake, don't throw your hands in the air and say you have been beaten. Never give in to terrorists desires. I am not affraid to fly or go near the water. I am not affraid to stop a terrorist act by whatever means are necessary. I will not stick my head in the sand and hope it goes away. I will stand and fight for the freedoms I have sworn to protect. Of course those persons with a set made of jello should quickly trade up for brass. Fix the problem without hiding from the boogy man under your bed, don't close the door on the lakes and lands god has given Americans because you are afraid.

James JAMMER

I'm sure someone else saw this and can verify it, but on the TPWD stocking page, they used to have Squaw Creek listed as "TXU Lake #1" and they were actively stocking it. It has now been removed from their page http://www.tpwd.state.tx.us/fishboat/fis...5&Submit=Go
But this was an issue that has come up before and that's the real issue to me. If they think it's an enormous security risk and don't think it should ever be open, then go in, shock the lake and move all the fish into Benbrook or Eagle Mountain. Don't stock it so all the privileged at TXU can have their little private paradise.

Here's an edit, somewhat. I knew I'd seen it, I as just off by one word "TXU Private Lake #1" is "TXU Contract Lake #1"
Luckily, I'm a freaking internet ninja, because I defy you to find it listed on any pages. I did some monkeying with google and found this
http://www.tpwd.state.tx.us/fishboat/fish/action/stock_bywater.php?WB_code=2009
They've edited the stocking pages for "Contract Lake #1" (it now says they've never ever stocked anything there)and the old Squaw Creek section as well. At one time it listed stockings in the year 2000. Now, it says they stopped stocking it in 1991. Huh? History changing, right before our eyes.
I guess back when this came up the first time, enough people got pissed and wrote enough angry emails that TPWD pulled the info. Do they still stock it? Maybe. I suspect that's why they changed the name from "private" to "contract" as TXU or Oncore or whoever pays them to have the lake stocked now.

Just enjoy the memories, because those SOBs will never let it out of their clutches.

Here. Sign it if you want the lake re-opened without yelling at TXU employees.
http://www.petitiononline.com/squaw/petition.html

Have you posted this anywhere else? If not, Im sure it could help.

to all of you who have a problem with us discussing sqauw creek on this forum:

DONT READ IT THE POST, KEEP YOUR SMART A$$ COMENTS TO YOURSELF. WE ARE FREE TO DISCUSS WHATEVER TOPICS THAT RELATE TO FISHING THAT WE WANT.

i dont remember reading in the forum rules that discussions about squaw creek are off limits. IF YOU DONT LIKE IT THEN STAY OUT.

might be a lame ? but who built the lake? TXU or TPWD or stae of Texas. Then ask them why you can't fish.

Just a thought on Memorial Day. What does the restricted acess to the near parking at DeCordova Dam and the relocation of bouys above the dam have to do with national security ?
I asked a BRA ranger this question and the answer was that is the way we want it.
Perhaps this not the place to voice this question but these changes were made because of 9/11 and published these were the reasons.

I have read through most of this thread and so far can't determine what government body has closed this lake and what their thinking about it was. You have a petition to send to someone but so far I don't even know that you know who has the power to open it.
I am not criticizing but trying to give an objective opinion. I wish the lake were open also. At least during the winter.

I can tell you that anything short of a massive raid by Israeli F-16s won't do squat to those two containment buildings.

Comanche Peak was under construction back in the early 80s when I was an engineering student at McLennan Community College in Waco. (Reactor 1 didn't come online till 91, and reactor 2 didn't come online till 93, and was the next to last reactor to go online in the US.) What was then Texas Power & Light provided every engineer major at MCC with a tour of the site, they even picked us up in a very nice bus at took us there and back.

I've seen with my on eyes the thickness of the walls, and the extraordinary robust construction of the the high strength steel rebar web that the concrete covers.

Our 'tour guide' stated that " the containment buildings could withstand a fully loaded 747 crashing into it while traveling at terminal velocity, while the building was being hit by both a hurricane and an earthquake."

Being a wise-n-himer I ask if it was designed to handle an attack by Israeli F-16s. Silence.

My engineering instructor was amused by my wise-crack. If you will recall in June of 1981 Sadam had his nuclear program taken out by a very bold and brilliant Israeli air strike, where the plane that 'hit' Sadam's nuclear facilities were F-16As that drop special bombs that were designed to penetrate the containment buildings. Building that I might add were of French design and construction, and which did not measure up to NRC specs.

In a further odd turn of events shortly after the tour a couple of test pilots from General Dynamics flew in an F-16A to the old James Connally Air Field at Texas State Technical Institute. My Dad was the Chairman of the Aviation Maintenance Program at TSTI, and my parents and I live in the old officers housing area of the TSTI campus. I hand the opportunity to talk to the two GD test pilots, along with several of my friend and many TSTI students. The test pilots had some info from their friend that were still in the US Navy. Had the Israeli air strike not gone exactly as planned the Iraqi containment building would not have been breached.

I am personally, and professionally convinced that there is very little likelihood of a terrorist attack succeeding at a nuclear facility, at least in terms of breaching the containment building.

The only possible way of having an attack succeed on such an installation is to clog the intake for the cooling water in order to get the 'pile' to overheat and meltdown. That said, such a tactic is doubtful as any tampering with intake flow would result in an immediately SCRAM of the reactors.

The best that a direct attack on the plant could do, in all likelihood, is to cause inconvenience, and expense. The truth is that terrorist are looking for targets that are under the radar of national defense establishment, and law enforcement. Furthermore, they are looking to terrorize to the maximum extent possible. That means running up the causality score. Which in turn means striking at a local that gives them (the terrorist) the most bang for the buck, effort, etc.. Which in turn again means striking at a target with a high population density, and/or a high profile for maximum shock value.

Nuclear containment buildings are a non-starter. There is simply too much risk of a botched op, or of a flat out failed op. To botch, or utterly fail such an op would heavily undermine the goal/s of the terrorist by making them look impotent.

There are very many other nuclear power generation facilities that have re-opend their cooling lakes to the public. TXU is just being intransigent. Mainly because they're a charlie-sierra outfit.


TFP

Hey TFP....

Bottom line then is that the closing of Squaq Creek is not about security......it's about a bunch of TXU fat-cats having their own private fishing hole stocked at taxpayer expense.