I wasnt originaly going to do a write up and post this, but due to a recent write up by Tommy Law on his website about a comment I made about my trip with him to someone who was looking for a guide down there has convinced me to do it.

Im not doing this to bad mouth him, just dont want someone else to have the same kind of experience that my father and I had.

We went out with Tommy Law in mid July on a full day guide trip. This was my first time on the lake, but my dad had fished it several times before.

Both my dad and I have been out with a guide before. Last summer we went out with Guide Jimmy Everett on Lake Fork. And, while we didnt catch big fish and my brother actually zeroed, we had a great time and Jimmy worked his butt off to try and get us on the fish. I wrote a very favorable report on Jimmy even though we didnt catch the fish, so catching fish has nothing to do with this write up.

The best way I could describe Tommy Law's guide style is that it is like being a backseater to a rude tournament fisherman who wants all the biggest fish himself. Tommy is what I call a front decker. He front decks you, period. It is like he is out there fishing for himself. In his blog on his website he replied to my saying this and said it was only when we were fishing C-rigs on a hump. That is not true. Flipping soft plastics in the trees, and working a shoreline is where it was the worst. He flipped every single tree first and when he would miss a good strike, he wouldnt let one of use throw back into that tree, he himself would try three or four times in a row. I even made a comment about this on the water saying that my dad should get up there and try and flip some of those trees first so maybe he could get one of those good bites. Either he didnt hear me or ignored the comment. When we were fishing a shorline, he would position the boat where he could throw at the shoreline and me and my dad had to either fish beside or behind the boat. I finally started throwing over his line towards shore. Lines were tangled several times because of this but he never got the point.
At one point we were fishing a road bed and he found a rockpile on the road he was looking for and threw a marker on it. And, of course, positioned the boat where only he could throw near the floating marker 90% of the time.

Whats funny about this front decking business is that after the day was done and we were eating dinner, his wife mentioned out of the blue that he does this to her when they go fishing and she has to try and sneak a cast to the good spot or tree while he isnt paying attention.

Another issue was all his talk of all his great fishing spots that always hold huge fish. He said he could not take us to these spots as they were reserved for tournament fisherman who pay him 10% of their winnings. Mr Law also replied to this bit on his site saying we only could not go to these spots because it was windy. Not true. We fished the lake from up north all the way down south. So, we were able to fish all over. It was windy that day. But not so it would prevent you from fishing anywhere. And, he stated, OVER AND OVER again that we couldnt go because of his tournament anglerswho fish it during tournaments(this was on a tuesday). It had nothing to do with wind. If you have just fished a whole day after paying that much money and the biggest fish you catch is 2-lbs, you dont want to listen to the guy tell you stories of all these great places he didnt take us because they are reserved for his tournament anglers who pay him 10%.

Both my dad and I have fished for a long time and understand that some days you just dont catch them. Our bad opinion of our guide trip with Tommy Law had nothing to do with the fish we caught(despite his comment to such on his site), it has to do with the way he fished with us.

The guide trip with Tommy Law was the most aggravating day of fishing my dad and I have ever had which isnt something you should say when paying several hundred dollars to fish a guide trip on Falcon lake.

Tommy did offer to pay for our dinner and like my dad said, might as well try to get something out of such a terrible day. During the dinner with Tommy and his wife is when he got into all the great places he didnt take us and his wife mentioned that he front decks her as well. She mentioned a single tree they fished where he kept pulling out these huge bass and he wouldnt let her up front to fish it because he wanted to see how many big bass he could pull out in a row. I know how she felt. But, at least she didnt pay a bunch of money for the experience.

I dont like bad mouthing anyone. Which is why I did not do a write up after my return from my trip to Falcon lake even though I promised to write one when posting about my impending trip before I left. But, given Tommy Law's post on his website about my comments, I felt I needed to go ahead and tell about or day with him. He did offer us half off a second trip with him but honestly, we threw that card in the garbage before we left the resteraunt. Why on earth would we want to do that again?

When I initially posted the comment on a TFFers post of looking for a Falcon guide, I simply said to avoid Tommy Law. Then, TFF member "The Hag", replied asking why he should be avoided and he's known Tommy for 40 years. I then replied and described our day briefly. "The Hag" then replied stating that "that sounds like the Tommy Law he knows, and he's sorry we had a bad time with him. So, apparently between this comment and the one from his wife, this wasnt a out of the ordinary style with him. Dont get me wrong, he was a nice guy and wasnt rude or anything, just the way he guides and is out there fishing just did not go over well with my dad and I.

Anyways, aside from that horrible day out with him, we had a great time fishing Falcon the day before and the two days after the trip catching a good number of fish every day with the biggest one being 6 1/2 lbs out of my dads boat.

WOW..........now that sucks!!!! This guy sounds like a real winner, surprise he is still in business after doin all that!!!!!

well, i guess when i go charlie will get my business for sure. raidergrad from the forum just fished with charlie this weekend and they killed them. i will let him tell that story when he gets back. sorry to hear about this. i had a guide at fork do this to me once and bet another guide that morning who would catch a bigger sack. my cousin and i both blanked and watched him catch a 20lb sack. sometimes they are not there for the customer. it will make you sick to spend that much money to watch him catch fish. he gave me a bad taste for him and the lake. i havent been back since.

Judge- Ive heard great things about Charlie and am sure youll have a great time. On all the posts asking about a Lake Falcon guide on here its either Charlie Haralson or Robert Amaya that are recommended. I sure wish I had looked at that before we went. Live and learn. Hope you have a great time!

Man, I hate that for you. I have never had a bad guided trip, and I hope this is not common. However, this may be a lesson to guides about what clients expect. Things like this hurt an allready difficult business.

I had a similar experience with a guide on Sam Rayburn. He front ended us all day long also. I have been with several guides on Fork and all of them have been good. I even had to tell a couple of them to go ahead and fish also, I don't mind.

I feel like i've read this before.... maybe?

Justin, you probably read my reply on the thread someone posted on looking for a Falcon guide. The one I described above which is what Tommy Law replied to on his blog on his site.

One of my most miserable days on the water was with a guide. He did a happy dance on the front deck when we caught one 12 inch fish. It meant he did not have to offer a discounted return trip.

Some guides are real good and others may have different agendas. It pays to get several referrals and even then sometimes it just does'nt work out. Its a tough job with some real challenges. Thanks for sharing your experience and may the next time be loaded with lunkers.

Ya, I read your other post where EVERYBODY recommended Charlie. Shortly after that I contacted charlie and he was VERY VERY helpful even though I told him I wasnt sure if I was even coming to the area and if I did I wasnt sure if I would use a guide, but he still helped me out a ton! You know when 14 out of 15 people recommend someone they have to be good, lol!

Samething happened to me with a guide on Ray Roberts. I got a guide for a birthday present from my folks in 2001. It was THE SUCK. I havent been on one since.

I'll certainly file this under the "guides not to use" section. I've never used a guide service, but am thinking very seriously about doing it on a lake that I have not had much success on. That said, maybe my question should be answered by one of the guides on this forum, but here it is:

Why should a guide even wet a line on a trip? You're paying him to put you on fish, or teach you a thing or two about the lake. You're not paying him to fish.....Just my thoughts.....

A good guide will ask you if you mind if they fish. I never mind if they do and always get outfished by them. And that doent bother me either, I feel you can learn alot by watching a successful angler.

I think it is good for the guide to fish. He can throw other baits and it helps to establish a pattern. His main priority is having his clients have a good time and catch fish. Sometimes the skill level of the clients can vary. If someone can catch a fish in the boat it helps to bring up confidence and keeps everyone fishing harder.

Nathan at Fork, I had that same experience only with a diffrent guide at lake Ivie back in the early 90's... he would run to the front of the boat and have 10 cast in before we even got out of the seat...haha....he even went and told my Buddie and I he didnt want to catch us fishing his spots during tournaments....Heck we wouldn't because we didnt catch any fish...( we actually avoided those spots)...That was my first guide trip, I started doing major research and found a great guide at Ivie (even though I dont think he is there any more). So I feel your disappointment in that Guide....Just remember not all guides are that way.......

I thought about using a guide once.

KingwoodRanger as you know fish move from day to day, some clients don't have the experience fishing to know if they are getting bites or not, Some, we have to teach "How to feel a bite, how to set the hook" By catching a couple it does help the client to know we are on fish. Really the only way to show a client that the fish are there is to fish. I don't try to out fish my clients at all, but when I do get a bite, and I can shake it off, then I'll tell them to cast over next to that bush or this log, I've already located that fish, they do catch alot that way....... Yes a guide does need to fish as well, but not to the point they take the trip away from their client, or to out fish their clients. My job on the water is to insure you have a good time, and enjoy your day on the water. But some clients want to just locate fish for a tournament, or learn something about how to fish this bait or that bait, to them catching fish is just a bonus. So talk with your guide ahead of time, he'll do what you want in most cases, or tell you to find somebody else that will. Have a good day

What I meant by my comment about Tommy Law in the other post is that he is a very competitive guy. I fished against him out here in West Texas for many, many years. He loves to fish and loves to win, just like I do. Sometimes it's hard for us to get out of that competitive nature. That's all I meant by that post. Tommy Law and I still are and will be good friends.

My wife & I fished with Tom Redington this summer. He fished only to establish the bite. Immediately upon identifying a pattern, he would go into action, changing our baits, to put us on those fish. After, and only after, we were on that pattern, he was switching up his approach to test other bites. His fishing never took precedence over our fishing. In fact, I found it a little uncomfortable with him doing all the work, but he insisted that we were the client and it was his responsibility to take care of everything. This is why I say.....Tom is one class act that I will be fishing with again for many years to come.

I have never heard anything good about Tommy Law, But I have gone with Charlie Haralson several times and he was awesome. Call Charlie next time Nathan and let the front decker stay at home!!

For those of us who still have the competative gene,It is very upsetting for when someone catches more and bigger fish than you. Especially if you are paying someone for the service and they may not get to fish very often or new to fishing. I am a guide as well and personally see this act as poor customer service to say the least, but that is my personality and reputation. I am sure that Tommy Law has his reasons for the way he runs his buisness and it seems to be working by the length of his guide service. Research as much as you can to find the guide that best suites you and your needs, sometimes there are conflicts of interests and personality clashes. Thats life and we live to fish another day with a lesson learned.

I have fished with a lot of guides through the years and have had a good time with almost every one. I have always wanted my guide to fish and fish hard so I could watch and learn but there is also a fine line that must be followed where you feel like the guide is fishing WITH you and not AGAINST you.

Not to hijack the thread but this relieves me to no end! I hired a guide for the first time in my life and my wife and I went fishing together (sorta a 50th b-day thing)and my experience was identical to the original poster's. I was really disappointed and felt like I had paid a lot of money to intrude on someone elses fishing trip. My wife is not experienced and I can relate to what some of the guides who have responded on this thread have said about the trouble of inexperienced clients, but that what makes you a professional guide, helping. I would have expected the guide to fish some to show and teach and locate fish, but my outing was a lost competition with the guide and the front of the boat whould hogged evey spot, dock, rockpile, weedline (you get the picture).

I doubt I will ever get my wife to go again.

Agreed, Agreed, Agreed.......but.......The actions of this guide do not appear in any way, shape, or form to be in the best interest of his client. I personally think a guide should ask his client what he expects to get out of the trip before they hit the water. Learn to patterns, learn to read electronics, find and catch fish off deep structure, etc. For instance.....I've never had any luck on Rayburn punching Jigs through the grass. Were I to consider hiring a guide on Rayburn, I would probably want to schedule a trip around a time frame where that might be a prevailing pattern...Then if for some reason pattern didn't work that day, we (the guide and I) would agree on what else we would do...Make sense?

This is a prime example of how NOT to handle customer service in your business! You dont take shots at people like this no matter what! I was skeptical about what Nathan was posting until I read the stuff below, Mr Laws true colors came out the minute he typed this stuff and posted it on his site. It smells of arrogance and total disregard for clients. I will NEVER use this guide service, and if I was on the internet looking for a guide and saw these comments on a guides site I would instantly cross him off the list!
From Mr Laws site http://tommylawfishing.com/news.php


Can't Please Nathan
Sep 22,2008, 11:19 am Tommy
It finally happened I had a unpleased customer out of 48 trips this year. I did not know this until he posted a comment on the net two months after his trip. I do remember the day very well and it was slow that day. Those of us that know fishing knows that it can get tough every once and a while, but that is fishing. He posted that he fished with me in Aug but really he fished with me on July 16th 2008. We did catch some fish we just did not get the double digit fish that everyone expects like the one in the picture. Nathan also stated that I front ended them all day and they couldn't hardly have a chance to catch a fish, of course we were C rigging open water humps. I did say that I had some good spots out in the lake that were holding some good fish but it was real windy that day and they were unfishable. I agree that for my standards that we had a bad day and I did buy their supper and give them a offer to come back for half price if they wanted. I always offer a retrip for half price if I think the fishing for some reason if sub par and out of 48 trips I have only had to do this three times this year. I take 47 pleaesd customers out of 48 every year for now on. Nobody in this world can catch them every day and if you are very much of a fisherman you should know that. Unfortunally Nathan does not understand that.


Is that BRUTAL or what? Great customer service attitude!