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#2428857 - 07/05/08 09:19 PM
NEED HELP WITH MOTOR
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Angler
Registered: 05/20/08
Posts: 266
Loc: Lake Fork Area
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Me and my dad have done everything we know to do to get our motor running, this is the last resort before we take it to a boat machinic. It just quit running, we have taken the plugs and changed them, taken the carborators off and cleaned them. We can get it running every once in a while but once you idle it down it sounds like it runs out of gas. I am out of ideas, its not firing like it should and when it does crank it takes alot of cranking to get it to do that, any help would be greatly appreciated.
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#2428870 - 07/05/08 09:32 PM
Re: NEED HELP WITH MOTOR
[Re: sexyshad]
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Extreme Angler
Registered: 09/14/06
Posts: 2725
Loc: Lewisville, TX
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#2428871 - 07/05/08 09:39 PM
Re: NEED HELP WITH MOTOR
[Re: gclark]
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Angler
Registered: 05/20/08
Posts: 266
Loc: Lake Fork Area
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That could be it, never thought about that, any other things you guys think could be wrong with it would be great to know. We are trying to fix this ourselves but might not have a choice but to take it to a mechanic
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#2428887 - 07/05/08 10:02 PM
Re: NEED HELP WITH MOTOR
[Re: sexyshad]
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Pro Angler
Registered: 07/03/05
Posts: 553
Loc: galveston
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it would be nice to know what kind of motor we are talking about here? make sure all wire connections are clean and lubed. look for loose grounds. older motors use points, so that could be a problem.
_________________________
SLAY AND FILLET,i hate the CCA/STAR!
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#2428915 - 07/05/08 11:03 PM
Re: NEED HELP WITH MOTOR
[Re: iridered2003]
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Angler
Registered: 05/20/08
Posts: 266
Loc: Lake Fork Area
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#2429310 - 07/06/08 07:49 AM
Re: NEED HELP WITH MOTOR
[Re: sexyshad]
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Extreme Angler
Registered: 12/15/03
Posts: 2640
Loc: Arlington, TX
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if by "cleaned" carbs, you mean anything other than "disassembled, soaked overnight in carb cleaner, and reassembled with new kits", then you aren't done yet with the carbs. does the fuel line hold pressure? is the fuel tank vented? fresh fuel, free from water & debris? first, compression test. compression gauge around $25 at car parts store. need help with the procedure just ask. second, spark test. not a "spark plug" test. inline spark tester, couple bucks at car parts store. set the gap for 7/16", clip it to the engine block, attach the plug leads (one at a time) and look for a sharp blue spark while somebody turns the engine over with the key. report your results. from iboats: (Carburetor Adjustment - Single S/S Adjustable Needle Valve) (J. Reeves)
Initial setting is: Slow speed = seat gently, then open 1-1/2 turns.
Start engine and set the rpms to where it just stays running. In segments of 1/8 turns, start to turn the S/S needle valve in. Wait a few seconds for the engine to respond. As you turn the valve in, the rpms will increase. Lower the rpms again to where the engine will just stay running.
Eventually you'll hit the point where the engine wants to die out or it will spit back (sounds like a mild backfire). At that point, back out the valve 1/4 turn. Within that 1/4 turn, you'll find the smoothest slow speed setting.
Note: As a final double check setting of the slow speed valve(s), if the engine has more than one carburetor, do not attempt to gradually adjust all of the valves/carburetors at the same time. Do one at a time until you hit the above response (die out or spit back), then go on to the next valve/carburetor. It may be necessary to back out "all" of the slow speed adjustable needle valves 1/8 turn before doing this final adjustment due to the fact that one of the valves might be initially set ever so slightly lean.
When you have finished the above adjustment, you will have no reason to move them again unless the carburetor fouls/gums up from sitting, in which case you would be required to remove, clean, and rebuild the carburetor anyway.
_________________________
"The metric system never really caught on in the states. Unless you count the increasing popularity of the nine millimeter bullet." -- d. barry
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#2430978 - 07/06/08 08:15 PM
Re: NEED HELP WITH MOTOR
[Re: jtexas]
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Angler
Registered: 05/20/08
Posts: 266
Loc: Lake Fork Area
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what exactly will the compression test show?
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#2430997 - 07/06/08 08:27 PM
Re: NEED HELP WITH MOTOR
[Re: sexyshad]
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Extreme Angler
Registered: 04/22/07
Posts: 1831
Loc: Allen, TX
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Compression test will show that the cylinders are holding pressure for firing and turning the engine. All cylinders showing similar pressure means that the problem is cheap to repair. One cylinder more that 20% off from the rest means you have either a blown head gasket or a really expensive repair bill.
Compression checks are probably one of the most important things you can do in diagnosing just about all problems. I do one every 25 hours and record the numbers. If I start seening a significant drop in pressure I can get it to a mechanic before it gets too expensive to repair.
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#2432299 - 07/07/08 10:30 AM
Re: NEED HELP WITH MOTOR
[Re: Michial Thompson]
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Extreme Angler
Registered: 12/15/03
Posts: 2640
Loc: Arlington, TX
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Yup, a motor with bad compression won't run right no matter what else you do to it, and running it with bad compression can turn a repairable engine into an anchor. It's a quick & easy test, which makes it good practice to rule that out before going any further. Borderline compression (say, 10% to 15% or so difference from the highest cylinder) can sometimes be restored by cleaning carbon deposits out of the cylinders with a "decarb" procedure using Seafoam or other engine tuner.
If the ignition is generating enough juice to jump 7/16" outside the cylinder, that pretty much confirms that it's sparking just fine under compression.
Fuel delivery is harder to test for, so the idea is to rule out compression & spark first.
_________________________
"The metric system never really caught on in the states. Unless you count the increasing popularity of the nine millimeter bullet." -- d. barry
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#2432961 - 07/07/08 02:12 PM
Re: NEED HELP WITH MOTOR
[Re: jtexas]
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Angler
Registered: 05/20/08
Posts: 266
Loc: Lake Fork Area
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The spark plugs are firing. Someone had said something about the power pack, I know where it is and how to get it off but is there any way to test it?
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#2433040 - 07/07/08 02:36 PM
Re: NEED HELP WITH MOTOR
[Re: sexyshad]
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Extreme Angler
Registered: 12/15/03
Posts: 2640
Loc: Arlington, TX
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"spark plugs are firing" doesn't tell you anything. A spark plug that fires when held against the engine block can still fail under compression inside the cylinder.
If it passes the "spark test" described above, the powerpack is good.
_________________________
"The metric system never really caught on in the states. Unless you count the increasing popularity of the nine millimeter bullet." -- d. barry
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#2433196 - 07/07/08 03:25 PM
Re: NEED HELP WITH MOTOR
[Re: jtexas]
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Angler
Registered: 05/20/08
Posts: 266
Loc: Lake Fork Area
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What should the compression be on the motor if its good???
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#2433209 - 07/07/08 03:29 PM
Re: NEED HELP WITH MOTOR
[Re: sexyshad]
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Angler
Registered: 05/20/08
Posts: 266
Loc: Lake Fork Area
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I bought a compression guage and put it in the hole where the spark plug goes, turned the motor over and its hitting bettween 100 to 150, guessing bc it keeps bouncing back in forth between those 2 numbers. That is on both cylinders I guess thats what you call them.
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#2433812 - 07/07/08 06:55 PM
Re: NEED HELP WITH MOTOR
[Re: sexyshad]
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Angler
Registered: 05/20/08
Posts: 266
Loc: Lake Fork Area
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#2434219 - 07/07/08 09:10 PM
Re: NEED HELP WITH MOTOR
[Re: sexyshad]
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Extreme Angler
Registered: 12/15/03
Posts: 2640
Loc: Arlington, TX
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at work, we can be on-line full time & get right back to ya, but evenings, give us a little time to spend with the family!  just a little joke. you need to get a consistent result from each cylinder. bouncing back & forth between 100 & 150 just ain't right. 1. warm the engine up to operating temp. 2. remove spark plugs. 3. disable spark by pulling the emergency lanyard, or else ground the plug wires to the engine block. 4. screw the gauge into the plug hole. 5. turn the engine over with the key for a few seconds. repeat. note the reading on the gauge, reset it, and move on to the next hole. do it exactly the same every time. you're looking for compression to be about the same on both cylinders, within 5 or 7%. Difference between cylinders is more important than actual numbers, but upwards of 100 is ok.
_________________________
"The metric system never really caught on in the states. Unless you count the increasing popularity of the nine millimeter bullet." -- d. barry
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#2438112 - 07/08/08 08:49 PM
Re: NEED HELP WITH MOTOR
[Re: jtexas]
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Angler
Registered: 05/20/08
Posts: 266
Loc: Lake Fork Area
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On one of the carborators if you put your hand over it, it will crank everytime. Don't know exactly what this means but know something isn't right, I know its not sucking gas through unless you put your hand over it. Thanks for the advice.
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#2438695 - 07/09/08 06:16 AM
Re: NEED HELP WITH MOTOR
[Re: sexyshad]
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Extreme Angler
Registered: 12/15/03
Posts: 2640
Loc: Arlington, TX
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Covering the carb throat like that is the same as using old-school choke plates, before they replaced 'em with the primer/enrichener valves they have now.
It's telling you the idle circuit is too lean.
Could be the slow speed mixture screw is too far out, or air leaking past a gasket or o-ring, or a passage in the carb is still partially clogged.
Sorry I don't know that particular carb -- if it has an adjustable slow speed jet, screw it in until it seats, then back it out a turn and a half. If you've done that, try screwing it back in a bit.
When you cleaned the carbs you might have soaked 'em overnight in something like B-12, and replaced all the gaskets & o-rings but if not, soak 'em & reassemble with new kits. Might as well do the other one while you're at it.
Even if you did soak 'em, could still be some varnish or something in there. If your carbs have core plugs, they should be removed for better access to the passages -- replacement plugs should be in the kit. Shoot some aerosol carb cleaner through every hole you see.
_________________________
"The metric system never really caught on in the states. Unless you count the increasing popularity of the nine millimeter bullet." -- d. barry
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