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Llano Bug Help
#12634364
02/18/18 10:38 PM
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Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 205
MassAction
OP
Outdoorsman
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OP
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Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 205 |
I'm headed to the hill country and wanted to add some Llano Bugs to my box. There are a couple of YouTube videos that show a step by step, but each one has comments from Kevin Hutchinson, the man himself, describing one particular step in the process that I can't conceptualize and translate into tying the pattern. After you have formed the body and have folded the foam over and are ready to tie in the deer hair and rubber legs (they should be tied in before you fold the foam over to form the head) it is critical to flatten a "pad" between the body and the eye of the hook. This will allow the legs to be tied in with a gap in the middle of them, keeping them from fouling on the hook. This also gives you a nice flat spot to tie in your deer hair. This is a mistake that I have seen in every YouTube version of my fly. Specifically, I can't figure out this flattened pad or how to tie in the rubber legs. If anyone can shed some light on this with pictures or a better description I'd really appreciate it. It's probably not a huge deal, but I figure if I'm going to take the time to tie these up, I'd rather do it right.
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12634416
02/18/18 11:37 PM
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 305
kaboboom
Angler
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Angler
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 305 |
Watched the vid. He ties in the hair, folds it back, cinches it down, then the ties in the rubber legs. Seems pretty straight forward, but I can see how it could be done differently like the text where you criss-cross the legs over the tied in hair before the fold and that could (I guess) make them less likely to wrap the hook since they'd be extended off the foam rather than underneath it. Never made any, but have the stuff, so I'll give it a try both ways.
Last edited by kaboboom; 02/18/18 11:39 PM.
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12634426
02/18/18 11:46 PM
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Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 8,475
Smurfs
TFF Celebrity
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Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 8,475 |
send Pearow a PM, he will help
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12634445
02/19/18 12:04 AM
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Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 205
MassAction
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OP
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Thanks guys, a more careful google search yielded a result, basically the tie in point for the rubber legs should compress the foam completely and then be dubbed over again to form a thorax. I probably wasn't clear in my first post but the YouTube vid I posted was wrong and skips this step which Kevin says is important to keep the hook from fouling and help the fly ride higher. This is the best step by step I've found on the fly. I'll try tying a couple again tonight and will post the results. http://theflyriverturtle.blogspot.com/2013/11/llano-bug.html
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12634481
02/19/18 12:34 AM
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 305
kaboboom
Angler
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Angler
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 305 |
Tried it similar...tied in the legs before the hair...nothing that wide and separated (and criss-crossed) but I'm doing a size 10.Now the front legs come out at the base of the "head, and the back legs from under the top wing/fold. Look forward to yours....please say what size/style hook. Thanks.
Last edited by kaboboom; 02/19/18 12:38 AM.
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12634865
02/19/18 05:33 AM
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Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 205
MassAction
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OP
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I thought this would be a simple tie, but as is often the case, sometimes the simplest things can be the most difficult. Tied these on a size 8 Gamakatsu SL-45. Kevin recommends a TMC 200r which is curved, but I had to work with what I had on hand. First attempt, way over dubbed the "thorax." The deer hair spun on me (funny how that happens when you don't want it to). My proportions with the foam are terrible. I was happy with the way the legs tied in. Second attempt, proportions and dubbing were way better. Can actually tell it's supposed to be a thorax. Wing was way too sparse and the legs went haywire on me. Just realized I should be tying in the foam to the bend of the hook and pulling the foam tight from there rather than folding it over. Good learning experience so far. I will gladly accept all tips and criticisms. One way or another I'll get this pattern down.
Last edited by MassAction; 02/19/18 06:26 AM.
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12634926
02/19/18 11:09 AM
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 305
kaboboom
Angler
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Angler
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 305 |
Links and pics are such a problem for me here or I'd paste stuff
Found a site that had the creator's name and picture, so looks authentic. He does seem to fold the foam loosely (not pull it tight) and the TMC 200R size 6 is curved and 3X long to give him room. Not sure about dubbing with antron...I do it for Gary LaFontaine's Sparkle caddis patterns, but it's tricky to prep and you need sticky dubbing wax, so the cactus chenille from your first vid seems like a good substitute. I tied one on a longer hook (mustad 79560 sz 8) probably 4X and it looks more like the fly I viewed on that site. I can tell you want to duplicate the original, but for me, this is a foam/rubberlegs style that should be fast and easy, and substitutions allowed. An example: the deer hair wing is out of the water, so it's bugginess is for the fisherman...not the fish. If the only deer hair you have spins too readily, and that's a problem, substitute elk or calf's tail. You'd still be honoring the inventor by using his techniques and style, in my opinion.And what you've already made will certainly float and catch fish. Good work.
Last edited by kaboboom; 02/19/18 11:22 AM.
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12635360
02/19/18 04:51 PM
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Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 61
joabsher
Outdoorsman
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Outdoorsman
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 61 |
The Llano Bug is one of my favorite flies, I tie them up all the time. The biggest bass I've caught on my 2wt was on one of these flies so it holds a special place in my mind. Here are a couple suggestions I have. 1. Get a longer shank hook. You can get away with a shorter one, but when you're learning it helps so much to figure out proportions better with something closer to a TMC 200R. 2. Cut your foam thinner. It makes it a lot easier to work with and flatten for the tie in spot for the hair. 3. Use Antron Dubbing for the thorax. It does a much better job than chenille of repelling water, so the fly will float higher and longer with it. I really don't think its tough to work with. 4. Use a hair stacker for the deer hair wing. I also like to use elk hair. I'm sure there are other tips, and these are just suggestions. I tie these guys pretty small too, usually size 10, which is what I caught that big bass on. Post more pics as you're working on it and let me know if you have any other questions or anything. I'm going to be tying a bunch of these tonight. http://texasfishingforum.com/forums/pics...hreadutc140yell - this pic wouldn't imbed for whatever reason but it's a good one.
Early on I decided that fishing would be my way of looking at the world. First it taught me to look at rivers. Lately is has been teaching me how to look at people, myself included. - Thomas McGuane
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12635391
02/19/18 05:05 PM
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Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 61
joabsher
Outdoorsman
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Outdoorsman
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Early on I decided that fishing would be my way of looking at the world. First it taught me to look at rivers. Lately is has been teaching me how to look at people, myself included. - Thomas McGuane
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: joabsher]
#12635405
02/19/18 05:12 PM
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 305
kaboboom
Angler
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Angler
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 305 |
My bad on the antron dubbing. The stuff I use comes as a cord, has to be chopped...different product. This is a difficult tie...making the bulb. Sparkle emerger
Last edited by kaboboom; 02/19/18 05:23 PM.
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12635635
02/19/18 06:41 PM
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Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 61
joabsher
Outdoorsman
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Outdoorsman
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Posts: 61 |
Early on I decided that fishing would be my way of looking at the world. First it taught me to look at rivers. Lately is has been teaching me how to look at people, myself included. - Thomas McGuane
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12636590
02/20/18 02:25 AM
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Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 61
joabsher
Outdoorsman
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Outdoorsman
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Posts: 61 |
First one of the night.
Early on I decided that fishing would be my way of looking at the world. First it taught me to look at rivers. Lately is has been teaching me how to look at people, myself included. - Thomas McGuane
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12636769
02/20/18 03:53 AM
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Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 205
MassAction
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OP
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Big thanks for all the help and hints guys. I sat back down at the vice after reading through this and things are getting much better. Still not perfect, but definitely getting closer. Used a longer shank hook and thinner foam and it definitely helped quite a bit. I like the underside profile much better. The deer hair is still spinning on me. I need to pick up some elk and antron dubbing to make it a bit more full, but the finished product is looking far better than what I did yesterday. Kaboom, I definitely understand the personal take on a fly and using what works, but I'm a bit of a type A personality (as I imagine most fly tiers and fisherman are) so I'd like to get it as close to the original as I can before subbing things out. I've already taken my initial attempts out and had some solid success with the bluegill, so even if they're not beautiful works of art, I'll be fishing them hard regardless. Thanks again for all your help guys!
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12636882
02/20/18 10:27 AM
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 305
kaboboom
Angler
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Angler
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 305 |
Deer hair patches can be put in two categories depending on where they are taken from the deer. Some are best for spinning...more hollow fibers, and others are for wings because they don't spin as much. I was taught how to tell the difference before buying but I don't remember. I think it's about the length of the tips before they lose their color. I see both you guys are dubbing twice...I haven't been...still using chenille. But I'm having problems getting the forward legs to point forward, and joabsher does that nicely here. I need to spend more effort on the underside of the head with this in mind. Great stuff.
Although not aligned with the original, I like this right now as a foam spider upgrade...sz 10/12 with half the legs, but I'm not targeting bass...yet. I'll still tie some larger like these...those should work well as a top floating fly trailing an unweight fly/jig for crappie. Thanks for sharing.
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12637338
02/20/18 04:30 PM
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Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 61
joabsher
Outdoorsman
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Outdoorsman
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 61 |
I learned how to work with deer hair tying clousers. Being able to keep the clump where you are tying in contained was tough at first, but that practice carried over for tying in the wing of the Llano Bug. I think the amount of hair you are using is good but maybe shorten it up a bit and hold onto all that hair with your left hand while you're tying with your right to keep it all in place. Also, cut the hair to length before tying it in so you don't have to worry about cutting off the butt ends.
As for the legs, I have always had trouble getting them to do what I want them to on any fly. I have learned that thread tension is really important, like when working with deer hair. If you're pulling down really hard on the rubber leg, it'll really crease it and cause it to make a 'V'. But if you apply less tension when tying it in it will lay flatter and point in the direction you are laying it, if that makes sense. The picture posted by MassAction above with the side shot of the legs tied in is a good reference pic.
Early on I decided that fishing would be my way of looking at the world. First it taught me to look at rivers. Lately is has been teaching me how to look at people, myself included. - Thomas McGuane
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12640571
02/22/18 04:41 AM
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Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 387
Mitt78
Angler
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Angler
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 387 |
MassAction, I'm not sure what kind of legs you're tying on the fly but this is the style that Kevin uses (or used to). https://www.caddisflyshop.com/round-rubber.htmlCut two segments of two to length but do not separate them. Once you have them tied in like the ones shown in the picture on your second post you can pull the segments apart. This is easier than dealing with 4 legs at once. A little history of the Llano Bug. Back in the early 2000's Kevin used to tie at round table at Austin Outfitters. I was a young fly tier and used to go when I could. One time I was there he showed us how to tie the fly in the picture below. A few weeks later he showed up with what is now known as the Llano Bug. I have always thought that this was what eventually lead to the creation of the Llano Bug. Sorry for the bad picture but my vise isn't set up right now due to a little one putting everything she finds in her mouth.
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12641118
02/22/18 04:06 PM
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Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 61
joabsher
Outdoorsman
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Outdoorsman
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Posts: 61 |
Thanks for sharing Mitt, I really like that prototype too.
Early on I decided that fishing would be my way of looking at the world. First it taught me to look at rivers. Lately is has been teaching me how to look at people, myself included. - Thomas McGuane
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12645192
02/24/18 07:58 PM
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Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 205
MassAction
OP
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OP
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Posts: 205 |
Mitt, thanks for that story. I met Kevin a few times at fly shop events in Austin. I never got the chance to fish with him while I was there, but Fly Fishing the Texas Hill Country kept me sane through law school and reignited my love of fly fishing and exploring the incredible waters Texas has to provide. I didn't have time to tie flies in law school, but now that I'm out the Llano bug was one of my motivations to learn how to tie. Given how important Kevin's book was to me I wanted to be sure I got it done right. I appreciate all the help guys. I sat down at the vice this week and kept plugging away. It's looking a lot better. I'm slowly getting the hang of it, and once I get all the right materials I think things will start looking much better.
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12645374
02/24/18 10:28 PM
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,728
mickfly
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
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I've known Kevin for a long while and interacted with him several times about the Llano Bug. He's a great (and rapid) fly tyer, so I could tell he took pride in that fly and wanted it tied right by whomever tied it. Several years ago, he showed up at the GRTU Troutfest with a big bag with my name on it. Without asking, he'd actually taken the time to tie the Llano Bug for me a step at a time. So I got one fly tied as far as Step One. Another tied as far as Step Two, etc. Somewhere in my tying bins I have this bag and about 8 or ten Llano Bugs in various stages of completion. Someday I'll take the time to photograph each one of those stages and will post them to this forum.
Mickfly Fish Friendly -- Life's too short to do it any other way
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: mickfly]
#12650792
02/28/18 05:31 AM
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Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 205
MassAction
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OP
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Its amazing hearing how generous people are in the fly fishing world. I would love to see those flies if you have Tim Mickfly. I cant think of a better way to learn.
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12653715
03/01/18 07:58 PM
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,728
mickfly
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
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Well, I tracked them down this morning, which is the first step. Why dont you PM me so we can discuss offline.
Mickfly Fish Friendly -- Life's too short to do it any other way
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12762840
05/20/18 10:41 PM
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Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 205
MassAction
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OP
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Just to bring this full circle, I think I finally got this pattern figured out. I went out to Austin about a month ago and took a few Llano bugs down to Barton Creek. They worked really well, no giants, but some solid Guadalupe bass (including the most beautifully marked one I've ever caught) and redbreast sunfish gave me the seal of approval. Thanks again for all the help I've received on this forum.
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12763226
05/21/18 03:41 AM
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Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 1,067
McKinneyLonghorn
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
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Posts: 1,067 |
Nice fish. I fished Brushy Creek in late April and caught my first Guadalupe bass on a yellow Llano Bug. It seems to be just about the perfect foam hopper pattern for Texas fish. Also caught a really nice bluegill on the Llano Bug's cousin, the Llanolope.
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12775805
05/31/18 08:47 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,131
hook-line&sinker
TFF Guru
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Llano bugs do work well..
>)));> Wishin' I was Fishin' <;(((<
“Personnel is the most vital and important aspect of any industry. If you’re just going to grind them up, it’s not going to end well for anybody.” SCOTT REINARDY
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12779196
06/04/18 10:52 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,131
hook-line&sinker
TFF Guru
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>)));> Wishin' I was Fishin' <;(((<
“Personnel is the most vital and important aspect of any industry. If you’re just going to grind them up, it’s not going to end well for anybody.” SCOTT REINARDY
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12780011
06/04/18 09:19 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,131
hook-line&sinker
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
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Posts: 10,131 |
>)));> Wishin' I was Fishin' <;(((<
“Personnel is the most vital and important aspect of any industry. If you’re just going to grind them up, it’s not going to end well for anybody.” SCOTT REINARDY
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12785564
06/09/18 02:24 AM
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 2,867
cob
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
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I fished a drift trip with Kevin yesterday. First time to fish a Llano bug. Impressive. Threw it from 0800-1400 hrs in sun and heat. Never had that many strikes and chases on a top water. Caught LM, Guadeloupe; 4 types of sun fish and a channel cat. Most buggy looking fly I have seen.
Some people go to church and think about fishing. Some go fishing and think about God.
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12786397
06/10/18 02:40 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,131
hook-line&sinker
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
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Posts: 10,131 |
Same here! Fun fly to tie and can be modified a million different ways! Just in case you can't see the embedded video click here
>)));> Wishin' I was Fishin' <;(((<
“Personnel is the most vital and important aspect of any industry. If you’re just going to grind them up, it’s not going to end well for anybody.” SCOTT REINARDY
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12787921
06/11/18 05:04 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,131
hook-line&sinker
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,131 |
>)));> Wishin' I was Fishin' <;(((<
“Personnel is the most vital and important aspect of any industry. If you’re just going to grind them up, it’s not going to end well for anybody.” SCOTT REINARDY
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12802531
06/23/18 02:42 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,131
hook-line&sinker
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
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Posts: 10,131 |
>)));> Wishin' I was Fishin' <;(((<
“Personnel is the most vital and important aspect of any industry. If you’re just going to grind them up, it’s not going to end well for anybody.” SCOTT REINARDY
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12805648
06/26/18 03:49 AM
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Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 1,067
McKinneyLonghorn
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 1,067 |
Fished the Paluxy on Saturday. The water was low and the flow was nearly non-existent, but the fish were really, really hungry. Between the two of us we ended up catching about three dozen fish in five hours, mainly smaller spotted bass and sunfish, with a few nice largemouth mixed in. I caught all my fish except one on foam topwater flies: a Llanolope, Llano Bug and Moorish Hopper. Here is a video of some of the fish.
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12806883
06/27/18 02:24 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,131
hook-line&sinker
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
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Posts: 10,131 |
>)));> Wishin' I was Fishin' <;(((<
“Personnel is the most vital and important aspect of any industry. If you’re just going to grind them up, it’s not going to end well for anybody.” SCOTT REINARDY
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12861351
08/11/18 11:30 PM
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Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 387
Mitt78
Angler
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Angler
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 387 |
I opened up my fly box and found that I only had one Llano bug in there. I know scary right? So I got out my gear and tied up a few. All different color combos and one in the quick easy yarn way.
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: Mitt78]
#12861503
08/12/18 02:22 AM
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Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 1,067
McKinneyLonghorn
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
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Looks good. My most successful colors are yellow body with brown foam and yellow body with yellow foam. Of course, those are also the colors I fish the most, so other colors might work just as well. I just fish those two because that is what I have the most confidence in.
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: McKinneyLonghorn]
#12861515
08/12/18 02:41 AM
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Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 387
Mitt78
Angler
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Angler
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Posts: 387 |
Looks good. My most successful colors are yellow body with brown foam and yellow body with yellow foam. Of course, those are also the colors I fish the most, so other colors might work just as well. I just fish those two because that is what I have the most confidence in. You can't go wrong with the traditional all yellow. I can't say as I have fished or tied a brown foam yellow body as of yet but a brown foam and olive body works well. I am kind of curious how the others will do.
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Re: Llano Bug Help
[Re: MassAction]
#12867888
08/17/18 10:38 PM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 225
YAKnIT
Outdoorsman
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Outdoorsman
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 225 |
I've tied some with yellow foam,rust colored dubbing, and rubber legs in an orange pattern. It's worked better than any other color. Sunfish can't leave it alone and you pick up some small bass here and there.
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