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Re: Mental evaluation for Gun Purchase
[Re: donothin]
#12634109
02/18/18 06:39 PM
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Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 29,841
Duck_Hunter
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 29,841 |
I think if people saw something and said something it would go a long way. For instance, let’s say this kid was acting irrationally and posting crazy s on the internet and someone reported them to the FBI. They would investigate and possibly prevent this sort of thing. People need to speak up and trust our law enforcement agencies to handle up. Someone DID speak up and report him, it didn't go where it should have obviously. I absolutely agree that they should have followed up on the tip. I think he already had the guns at the time of the tip. But what kind of tangible evidence would they had to have to remove his guns or prevent him from buying more. Terroristic threats when he commented publicly under his own name he was going to be a professional school shooter, for starters. He wasnt allowed to bring a backpack to school because the school was afraid he would bring a gun. He was expelled from school for fighting and behavior problems. The FBI admitted it screwed up. I take them at their word on that in this instance.
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Re: Mental evaluation for Gun Purchase
[Re: donothin]
#12634121
02/18/18 06:48 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 5,599
Mckinneycrappiecatcher
TFF Celebrity
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TFF Celebrity
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 5,599 |
This is a very tricky subject as the reality is that as soon as we make mental health exceptions that are more easily enforced it broadens the power of the government to limit the sale of weapons and restricts the liberties of individuals. However, chastise me if you want, but unless you have made a terroristic type threat and are placed on a watch list that logistically limits your rights, I find it unconstitutional for the government to limit the rights of those who have mental health issues if they havent formally committed a crime. I refuse to give up even an inch of constitutional rights in the name of safety, and I dont see a way to screen people for mental illness that doesnt come dangerously close to violating someones rights.
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Re: Mental evaluation for Gun Purchase
[Re: Scagnetti]
#12634137
02/18/18 07:00 PM
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,035
Spiderman
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
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Posts: 10,035 |
The United States has MORE mental health professionals, MORE sources to assist the mentally disabled, MORE protocols in place to identify people with mental health problems, spend MORE money on treating mental health issues, THAN ANY OTHER COUNTRY similar to us.
Yet, those other countries don't have any where near the number of mass shootings that the United States does.
So if you think mental health is the issue, have at it.
I think the problem starts with Health Care costs. Who is going to pay for these evaluations & treatments for the ones that really need them. They probably don't come from high income homes. Just like going to the Doctor with high Insurance deductibles. By the time you go the problem is allot worse than it could have been.
The Truth is six of the seven Dwarfs are not Happy!
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Re: Mental evaluation for Gun Purchase
[Re: Gixxer1k]
#12634140
02/18/18 07:03 PM
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Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 22,539
lconn4
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 22,539 |
I think if people saw something and said something it would go a long way. For instance, lets say this kid was acting irrationally and posting crazy s on the internet and someone reported them to the FBI. They would investigate and possibly prevent this sort of thing. People need to speak up and trust our law enforcement agencies to handle up. Yep and "snitches get stitches" should never be spoken again.
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Re: Mental evaluation for Gun Purchase
[Re: donothin]
#12634166
02/18/18 07:27 PM
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Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 15,816
921 Phoenix
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 15,816 |
I do not think their is a way to really evaluate someone at the time someone buys a gun. Who could have evaluated Hitler or Ted Bundy in their early days and never gotten either one of them stopped.
This will be real difficult to say the least. I really do wish their was a way it could be used to stop mass murder in general whether its a gun mass murder or a Ted Bundy or Hitler. We do need a way to stop these people and I am all in if we can come up with a way that doesn't destroy us as a country and our rights. You can not just look at someone or take a comment on any forum and say he or she is a nut. God forbid they come on here and read some of the comments on here. A lot of us may get a visit LOL
Their are people that are just evil and not necessarily mentally ill they are just pure evil and that's what this guy was, he drove himself evil with his constant thinking of evil thoughts till he acted. Their won't be a test to show this before hand. I do not believe everyone is mentally ill just because they do evil stuff which is why most people get deceived by these people, like a Hitler or Ted Bundy. We could come up with a long list of just evil people that could have passed a test because these people tent to be very smart. They are just pure evil.
I think the only way to stop these types is a loaded gun, look what it took to stop just Hitler. This guy had some of the same thoughts as got the German people to stand behind Hitler till it was to late.
Y'all are a lot smarter them me give us good thoughts on how to stop these people and I will stand and help, but I am not giving up my gun in case you are following a hitler and I need to defend myself.
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Re: Mental evaluation for Gun Purchase
[Re: JCG57]
#12634176
02/18/18 07:34 PM
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 54,456
RayBob
Super Freak
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Super Freak
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 54,456 |
Looks like living in places with long, cold, dark winters makes people cray cray. Wonder what the mental health spending is like in Scandinavian countries? Except for PR (which has no money to spend on infrastructure much less the cra cra) all the gold colored states have high gun totin' populations. So, if I'm to interpret this rightly, these gun totin' states are filled with mainly happy folks thus leading to generally happy and satisfied population not requiring the state to spend money for their mental issues. Interpreting statistics is a wildly variable art form and far from a science.
Advice? Wise men don't need it. Fools won't heed it.
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Re: Mental evaluation for Gun Purchase
[Re: 921 Phoenix]
#12634189
02/18/18 07:44 PM
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 26,650
senko9S
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 26,650 |
take away play stations and bring back parenting and morals would be a start...
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Re: Mental evaluation for Gun Purchase
[Re: donothin]
#12634192
02/18/18 07:47 PM
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 25,824
T Bird
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 25,824 |
Quote:Interpreting statistics is a wildly variable art form and far from a science. Except for #3 in picture.
Okie by birth, Texan by choice. USAF "Thunderbirds" Alumni 1985-1989
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Re: Mental evaluation for Gun Purchase
[Re: donothin]
#12634195
02/18/18 07:48 PM
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 54,456
RayBob
Super Freak
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Super Freak
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 54,456 |
Hope this stays civil so it doesn't end up in bunker. What should be used to evaluate a person's stability for purchasing firearms? It seems that most agree that should be considered. Can it be done without walking all over one's constitutional rights? No legitimate answer so far. Don't be frustrated !
Advice? Wise men don't need it. Fools won't heed it.
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Re: Mental evaluation for Gun Purchase
[Re: senko9S]
#12634198
02/18/18 07:49 PM
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 54,456
RayBob
Super Freak
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Super Freak
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 54,456 |
take away play stations and bring back parenting and morals would be a start... Does this include XBoxes too?
Advice? Wise men don't need it. Fools won't heed it.
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Re: Mental evaluation for Gun Purchase
[Re: Scagnetti]
#12634201
02/18/18 07:51 PM
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 38,935
chickenman
1:28
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1:28
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 38,935 |
Scags, you dont think it takes someone that is mentally ill to shoot up a school? No, not clinically mentally ill. Would you consider someone with PTSD mentally ill? PTSA = mental disorder Mental disorder is a mental illness That is how it is defined anyway.
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Re: Mental evaluation for Gun Purchase
[Re: donothin]
#12634202
02/18/18 07:52 PM
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 54,456
RayBob
Super Freak
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Super Freak
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 54,456 |
How about this:
If you are seeing or have seen a medical professional AND have been diagnosed with a mental disorder or are taking psychotropic drugs for the treatment of a mental disorder, as outlined by DMS coding you may not purchase or possess a firearm until cleared by 2 consenting mental health professionals.
As far as Constitutional Rights , well yes it can. Once one is deemed "healed" then they may exercise their rights under the 2A. Otherwise they are not fit to participate in 2A. Happens all the time. Felons lose rights. These mental ill would not be able to fully participate in militia activities.
As noted by others the US has lots of diagnostic resources.
Advice? Wise men don't need it. Fools won't heed it.
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Re: Mental evaluation for Gun Purchase
[Re: RayBob]
#12634206
02/18/18 07:55 PM
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 25,824
T Bird
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 25,824 |
take away play stations and bring back parenting and morals would be a start... Does this include XBoxes too? I would add Facebook, Snapchat, Instagram and all the others to the mix.
Okie by birth, Texan by choice. USAF "Thunderbirds" Alumni 1985-1989
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Re: Mental evaluation for Gun Purchase
[Re: T Bird]
#12634215
02/18/18 07:59 PM
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 54,456
RayBob
Super Freak
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Super Freak
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 54,456 |
take away play stations and bring back parenting and morals would be a start... Does this include XBoxes too? I would add Facebook, Snapchat, Instagram and all the others to the mix. What about TFF posting?
Advice? Wise men don't need it. Fools won't heed it.
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Re: Mental evaluation for Gun Purchase
[Re: RayBob]
#12634217
02/18/18 08:01 PM
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 26,650
senko9S
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 26,650 |
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