sounds like you've done your research. i'd be interested to know what you think after a few trips in the Native 12. also, i fished one time up Nails Creek with you and your "friend" ..... i doubt any of us could keep up with him. good luck and i hope to see you out there again sometime

john

I'm 54 and have lower back and hip joint issues. I used to fish out of a WS Tarpon 140 but found that sitting for long periods in that seat aggravated my back and hips. I have the Commander 140 now and rarely use the low seat. I paddle from the bench seat and stand a lot while fishing. Standing eases my back and hip pain.

The major drawback to the Commander is its about 80 pounds. It does have a skid plate so it can be dragged across short distances if you don't want to go through the extra effort of a kayak cart. It's always nice when there's a friend nearby to help lift the kayak into the truck. It's not that I can't handle the 80 pounds, but carrying such an awkward shape like an 80 pound kayak very far doesn't help my back.

An ideal kayak for me would have similar stability and deck design of the Commander, but weigh about half as much. That Native Ultimate 12 sounds nice at 49 pounds. The Pelican Catch 120 looks good too although I'd want to remove the foot pegs as they look like sure fly line grabbers.

Have both Ultimate 12 and Ultimate 12 FX. And a bad back/neck. Go with the Ultimate 12 FX. More expensive, but much better on the back. Bad back, get a trailer. Ultimate 12 FX, with seat in high position (not really that high, still very stable), the FX is much easier to get in and out of. I think the design is more stable than the Ultimate 12. Speed about the same. The "BIG" advantage of the FX is the seat. Two position up/down, slides back and forth to weight distribution with just two knobs, while you are seated. Good luck

When you are talking bad back, hips it's more about the weight of the kayak since you have to think about how you are transporting and if you can handle a heavy kayak in cases of having to drag or use a kayak cart to get to the water and back.
I've got the Commander120 and ran into the problem of having to get from the parking lot to the water which was about 60 yards. I apologize if you think 60 yards isn't that far, because you probably don't have serious back issues.
I take the seat completely out to load it on my roof rack. A trailer would be much, much better, but not possible in my case, since I don't have room for another trailer.
If you have serious back issues any added weight is a huge negative, and the Native Ultimate is probably you best bet as far as everything else considered.
You could also go with a sit inside kayak which a ten footer will weight in at around 38 pounds, but with less room for gear and maybe harder to get in and out of.
Those who have back issues will understand that even 20# or so can make a huge difference.

J-Moe,

I took my Meyers Sportspal S-15 out last night, sat in the middle section, stood about half the time, caught lots of fish. I used a stake-out pole and stayed in shallow water (< 9'). It is wide, so I use a 280 paddle. I'd say I get 2.5 mph just paddling casually. There are shorter models but all the same width: wide!

I only bring this up because I used to carry along a folding lawn chair and just straddled a thwart bar with it. Very comfortable. Very good for two big guys, or taking out kids. 705 lbs. capacity. Up to 5HP outboard rating for this one, less for others.

As I have mentioned a few times, if a canoe could hold water position as well as a kayak, or in certain situations too, I'd likely have never gone the kayak route at all.

Pretty cool. I'll try to get some pics soon.

Brad

Thanks for all the continued advise. I bought an Ultimate 12 used this weekend. I took it out last night.

The bad news is I was still uncomfortable in the low seat position and I broke my 8 weight rod, ugh. So I plan on getting the high seat installed, as well as, some fly rod holders.

Otherwise, I was extremely happy with the design, weight, speed and stability of the yak.

b737, I did look at the FX model but it would have cost me 500 dollars more than the used one I purchased. The seat will only cost me 120 to install. The used Yak also came with a spray skirt, anchor, anchor pole, 240 cm bending branches paddle and Garmin fish finder. I had a budget of $1000 and all of this including the new seat fit in that budget. The FX would have been close to $1500, after tax.

For the type of fishing I do in creeks, having to transport the kayak over land and the simplicity of using a fly rod and vest (rather than spinning gear and tackle boxes) make the yak a perfect choice for me. I really think the higher seat, adjusted properly will allow me to be more comfortable. I'm glad to hear the high seat made a difference b737.

Are you using fly rods because you don't want to carry a bulky tackle box? I usually take 2 spinning rods and no tackle box. I take a single-level tray and velcro it between my legs. See the white strips in the first photo. Four years and the velcro is still holding tight. Tackle tray is in the second photo, easy to reach and no sliding around. I never use the rod holders I bought, I lay the rods behind me or in front. The green rubbery shelf liner wrapped around the front thwart tube eliminates glare and keeps it from clinking when I lay my rod across it.

No, I just don't fish with spinning gear very often. I appreciate the pictures. These will give me good ideas on mounting fly rod holders, etc.

Another bad back kayaker here. I have Jackson and Native kayaks with the lawn chair style seat. One of the Jacksons has the old style gray seat, one has the new black seat with an air bladder for low back support.

All of them are comfortable, I think the new style Jackson seat is the best. Add the low back support and it's far and away the best for me.

Take a look at the Jackson Tripper 12. It's a hybrid, similar to the Native Ultimate. It's the same hull as the Jackson Kilroy and you'll find a lot more writeups on the Kilroy.

After my back surgery over a decade ago I sold my ocean kayak, just could take sitting for that long. I now SUP. No back pain and does wonders to strengthen the muscles that protect your spine. Just a thought.