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Max Online: 36273 @ 01/23/13 02:34 PM
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#12142821 - 03/15/17 07:40 PM Interesting factoid on Old Town's Predator PDL
Brad R Offline
Extreme Angler

Registered: 03/09/15
Posts: 1230
Loc: Texas
Jim mentioned something to me regarding the 2017 Predator PDL, that Old Town is owned by or under the same corporate umbrella as Minn Kota.

Well, the actual kayak itself has been out and winning awards for several years now, very muscular lines and well appointed for fishing. 36" wide and a bit over 13 feet, 13-2 as I recall. And, 115 lbs. but I don't recall whether that is with or without the drive which is heavier than the Propel's. It also has the traditional rudder that lifts up and drops down more vertically than some others.

I mention all of this because this kayak is getting good reviews. Normally, I'd want to wait a model year or two to see how things work out. One other new pedaler came to the market with drive problems right out of the crate. But, here's the thing: if those engineers at Minn Kota who have been dealing with underwater props and various elements, gears, etc., if they were involved in the development of this new drive (I believe they were), then instead of a "new" drive, well it is still new but based on the experience of just the sort of engineers you'd want to have the best design.

A big kayak, for sure, so this one would dial up as a competitor for the big Hobie PAs, the Propel 13 and the other new giant Native and a few others.

Having Minn Kota involved would alleviate some of my "first year" fears.

Dang! That is one good looking kayak!

Website here:

Predator PDL

Brad

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#12143221 - 03/16/17 05:06 AM Re: Interesting factoid on Old Town's Predator PDL [Re: Brad R]
christian myrick Online   content
TFF Team Angler

Registered: 08/03/11
Posts: 3077
Loc: little elm
New kayakers should always learn to paddle first imo. Learn to control your kayak. Its a saftey issue. Moving parts break and wear out no matter who builds them. Peadle yaks are cool and have a place in this sport but its my belief everyone should know how to swing a paddle and control the boat before you ever complicate things with trolling motors or pedals.
_________________________

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#12143269 - 03/16/17 06:21 AM Re: Interesting factoid on Old Town's Predator PDL [Re: Brad R]
Brad R Offline
Extreme Angler

Registered: 03/09/15
Posts: 1230
Loc: Texas
No doubt about it, Christian!

And, it is one of our great advantages . . . that if we later move to a pedal kayak, we always carry along a paddle so we have a second form of propulsion to "get home."

You won't see us in a $60,000 bass boat being towed back to the marina, that is for sure!

For really serious anglers with more than one kayak, I think you need a couple of different ones to cover all bases. One should likely be a paddle only kayak with no mechanicals, so essentially no issues.

And, then there are just the intrinsic differences that relate to going out, say, BTB, or fishing rivers versus lakes and more.

And, I like both propulsion forms: a really good paddler is just so invigorating; pedaling has its qualities, too.

Though I don't want to be under power, personally, I certainly see the options are getting better and better and I'd still prefer getting out and fishing a kayak over many other alternatives. So, there is a third form of propulsion for those who want, maybe even need it.

Brad


Edited by Brad R (03/16/17 06:24 AM)

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#12144636 - 03/16/17 08:08 PM Re: Interesting factoid on Old Town's Predator PDL [Re: Brad R]
Warhawk Online   content
Outdoorsman

Registered: 04/01/06
Posts: 240
Loc: Hot Springs, AR
I think it was one of the YouTube reviews I watched where they mentioned that Old Town falls in the Johnson Outdoors group, as does Minn Kota and several other brands. I haven't seen anything but positive reviews on the PDL. But nothing will prove the design like a year or two of use and abuse in the real world.

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#12144802 - 03/16/17 09:28 PM Re: Interesting factoid on Old Town's Predator PDL [Re: Brad R]
Brad R Offline
Extreme Angler

Registered: 03/09/15
Posts: 1230
Loc: Texas
Warhawk, same here on the reviews: all positive that I have seen.

If, IF IF IF, (that's a lot of ifs) the drive is bug free, in my opinion it exceeds the "value" of a Native Propel 13 in many ways.

My list:

It seems to have heavier gauge plastic and I saw some shots of the inside and they have formed vertical supports between the top and bottom skins in the "bilge" for added structural strength.

The Predator is just a more handsome vessel with a really muscular look, at least I think most people would consider it so. It has great lines, looks great on and off the water.

It has a much better rudder system. And, because of this, it turns very tightly, likely holds water better with that rudder down.

At 36" width, it appears to be more stable for standing and other general considerations.

Its seat is significantly higher which is great for fishing.

It has a better quality front hatch with a locking device.

It has one way scupper plugs that let water out, not in.

It has a large tank well area.

It has built in under-seat storage and side storage pockets.

And, it has a dry storage area built into the drive unit.

It has a dedicated area to hold a paddle.

It appears to have a higher top end speed at around 5.5 mph.

Just a guess that this Predator PDL will really absorb some market share, taking a lot away from the Propels, some away from the various Hobies, too.

Brad

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#12144844 - 03/16/17 09:51 PM Re: Interesting factoid on Old Town's Predator PDL [Re: Brad R]
Warhawk Online   content
Outdoorsman

Registered: 04/01/06
Posts: 240
Loc: Hot Springs, AR
Also, the PDL having a higher seat gives you a better pedaling position. That could be very important for those of us in the bad back club.

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#12145087 - 03/17/17 06:44 AM Re: Interesting factoid on Old Town's Predator PDL [Re: Brad R]
Brad R Offline
Extreme Angler

Registered: 03/09/15
Posts: 1230
Loc: Texas
Warhawk, As you and I have talked about the different attributes, this is a big one for a lot of us who don't really want to sit down too low. It makes standing harder, some casting motions difficult, too. I like a high seat and it takes a wider kayak to pull it off. On my Cuda LT, the vessel is immeasurably more stable in the low seat position than it is in the high one. I'd never guessed it'd be that obvious of a difference.

The seat in the Predator PDL is one of the highest on the market . . . so the 36" is a good thing.

Native sort of took the lead as regards fishing from a kayak for several years. The reverse pedaling is a very big deal.

All kayaks have some issues, none will ever be perfect. Native monitors and actually responds to on-line comments. It also does a very good job servicing warranty claims. But, it isn't particularly responsive to then jumping back into the laboratory and making upgrades. So, the stem of its drive unit is still prone to cracking, the rudder has been a shortcoming for years now (one of the seemingly easiest of all fixes), the seat support area plastic required a fix and I believe they have done that along with an early modification to the drive to keep water out of its interior.

So, from the list, Native seems to jump on what I would call existential issues, yet it seems slow and unconcerned about others. Why? Well, if you are selling pedaling kayaks, you'll be out of business very fast if the drive doesn't work well . . . but you can more easily get away with a rudder that slightly under-performs.

In the meantime, here comes the competition and this Predator PDL, for one, appears to have put a fist higher on the bat handle now.

*** Just heard back from a YouTuber regarding servicing the PDL drive, how to go about it, how often, how easy . . . that sort of thing. He said that the units were designed to pedal for great distances without any service but when they needed service, it was recommended the units "be sent in." I guess he might have meant taken in to a retailer who'd also be trained to do it. Hmm? We'll see how this goes over.

Brad

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#12145244 - 03/17/17 08:48 AM Re: Interesting factoid on Old Town's Predator PDL [Re: Brad R]
Neumie Offline
TFF Team Angler

Registered: 07/25/06
Posts: 3085
Loc: SA, Hallettsville, Rockport
Johnson Outdoors (spun off from SC Johnson in 1970's) has many companies under its umbrella which are familiar to kayakers and why MinnKota and Humminbird are associated with Ocean Kayak and Old Town.

MinnKota (1970)
Eureka! (1973)
Old Town Canoes (1974)
Ocean Kayak (1997)
Carlisle Paddles (sometime around here)
Necky Kayaks (1998)
Extrasport (1999)
Humminbird (2004)
Lendal Paddles (2006)
LakeMaster (2011)
JetBoil (2012)
_________________________
"Water is life's matter and matrix, mother and medium. There is no life without water." -Albert Szent-Gyorgyi

"No man ever steps in the same river twice, for it's not the same river and he's not the same man." - Heraclitus

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#12145613 - 03/17/17 12:30 PM Re: Interesting factoid on Old Town's Predator PDL [Re: Brad R]
Dan90210 ☮ Online   content
Woman of the year 2015

Registered: 11/18/09
Posts: 24923
Loc: Denton County
I am really interested in this yak.

5.5 mph!?

If I am not mistaken, that would be about 1-1.5 mph faster than a PA.

Is that about right? I might have to get this. Anyone know where I can see one locally?
_________________________
Originally Posted By: junbengreat
Pulled a gun on his dryer and they caught a bunch of fish.

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#12145896 - 03/17/17 04:04 PM Re: Interesting factoid on Old Town's Predator PDL [Re: Brad R]
The Black Hammer Online   content
Pro Angler

Registered: 04/11/08
Posts: 918
Loc: Grand Prairie
i just replaced my Slayer Propel 13 with a PDL. It turns on a dime, and the way the rudder is designed, you will not be snapping cables. Also I've already seen a few guys break their props on the PDL. Then I saw how cheap the replacement prop is. Here is the basic price break down of the 2 kayaks.

Slayer Propel 13 - $2599
Underseat Storage - $79
Battery Bag - $39
Native Back seat storage - $69
Native Prop - $29
Native side rail storage - $39
BerleyPro Rudder - $249

Old Town PDL - $2799
Underseat Storage - included
Battery Bag - included
Back Seat Storage - Included
Side Storage - Included
Over Designed Rudder - Included
Replacement Prop - $4.50!!!

Yes, that is not a typo. The replacement prop for the PDL is only $4.50!!!!

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#12145933 - 03/17/17 04:37 PM Re: Interesting factoid on Old Town's Predator PDL [Re: Brad R]
Warhawk Online   content
Outdoorsman

Registered: 04/01/06
Posts: 240
Loc: Hot Springs, AR
I stopped by H24 Outdoors in Conway, AR today. They sell several brands, including Old Town and had a Predator PDL in the showroom. Turns out that the owner is an avid kayak fisherman and owns a PDL himself. He confirmed the 5.5 mph speed and said it's faster than the Predator MK with the Amin Kota electric motor!

He also sells VIBE kayaks, I had never seen one before. They have a very nice 13 footer, the Sea Ghost for $899. And smaller versions for even less.

The owner previously had a Jackson Kilroy, virtually the same kayak as mine and was able to make some comparisons to the PDL and avibe kayaks for me.

Jim

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#12148488 - 03/19/17 09:19 PM Re: Interesting factoid on Old Town's Predator PDL [Re: Brad R]
Dan90210 ☮ Online   content
Woman of the year 2015

Registered: 11/18/09
Posts: 24923
Loc: Denton County
So where can a bruh see one of these locally?

Moreover try one?
_________________________
Originally Posted By: junbengreat
Pulled a gun on his dryer and they caught a bunch of fish.

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#12148658 - 03/19/17 10:56 PM Re: Interesting factoid on Old Town's Predator PDL [Re: Brad R]
The Black Hammer Online   content
Pro Angler

Registered: 04/11/08
Posts: 918
Loc: Grand Prairie
Mariner Sails in Dallas has them in stock.

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#12153750 - 03/22/17 07:44 PM Re: Interesting factoid on Old Town's Predator PDL [Re: Brad R]
Sabot Offline
Extreme Angler

Registered: 10/04/05
Posts: 1532
Loc: Pflugerville, TX
I am blown away with the quality of materials and craftsmanship that goes into the Predator lineup. They even molded in threaded screws. I can't give enough praise for the lineup. I just purchased a used XL with the Minn Kota 45lb trolling motor. Awesome! I sold my MX and Jackson to get enough money. I kept my Tarpon 120 tho. The cuda is faster than it but I like it's simplicity and its smaller. I would have loved to go with the paddle but a guy sold me the XL for 2100 including gear... I just couldn't pass it up. Hardly been used, looks factory new. I love having the trolling motor, for it greatly increases my range. I like to fish before work, paddling I just couldn't go far. I like having the deep cycle for it handles the 45lb thrust motor just fine for all day fishing.

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