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#11851381 - 09/27/16 12:06 AM Most Leverage
RipX21 Offline
Pro Angler

Registered: 01/28/03
Posts: 556
Loc: Paris Texas USA
BASS has just increased legal rod length in their tournaments to 10 feet. My question.

Which rod will have more leverage, a 6' or a 10' rod.

Skeet Reese says the 10' will have. What do you think and why.



Edited by RipX21 (09/27/16 12:07 AM)

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#11851533 - 09/27/16 08:08 AM Re: Most Leverage [Re: RipX21]
Donald Harper Offline
TFF Guru

Registered: 01/25/08
Posts: 13887
Loc: Justin, TX.
Leverage is about the distance from the rod tip to the water. Leverage decreases as that distance is shorten. This is my experience. Sitting in a back seat decreases leverage; standing increases that leverage. I agree with Mr. Reese; the longer the rod the greater the leverage.
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#11851543 - 09/27/16 08:13 AM Re: Most Leverage [Re: RipX21]
collincountytx Online   content
TFF Guru

Registered: 04/08/08
Posts: 13228
Loc: Dallas, TX
The ten foot rod has more leverage for the fish.
The fulcrum point is where your hand holds the rod--this is why saltwater Tuna and shark rods are typically 5'6" foot long.
Would you rather lift a suitcase by grabbing it's handle with your hand or with a ten foot pole through the handle?

A ten foot rod would be able to cast lures further, with more speed.
Particularly helpful with whippy ten foot rods to cast very light lures (think fly fishing or float 'n' fly techniques)

This is why crankbait rods are typically the longest standard bass fishing rods--you want to cast the lure a long distance and you don't want to rip the trebles out of the fish's mouth. Also why in close quarters, crankbait fish can come unbuttoned
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#11851559 - 09/27/16 08:20 AM Re: Most Leverage [Re: RipX21]
JIM SR. Online   sick
TFF Celebrity

Registered: 09/25/06
Posts: 6933
Loc: NRH/Fork ! GET THE NET
sounds like a marketing ploy,... loco

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#11851572 - 09/27/16 08:25 AM Re: Most Leverage [Re: RipX21]
Klinger N Ok Offline
Angler

Registered: 01/13/07
Posts: 309
Loc: Ponca City, Ok
A shorter rod will give you more leverage, a longer rod gives the fish more leverage.
When you're only dealing with a fish weighing a few pounds, the loss in leverage is usually not an issue.
Collincountytx hit the nail on the head.

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#11851578 - 09/27/16 08:27 AM Re: Most Leverage [Re: JIM SR.]
Mike_Soriano™ Offline
TFF Celebrity

Registered: 06/08/08
Posts: 5434
Loc: FORK
Originally Posted By: JIM SR.
sounds like a marketing ploy,... loco


Someone will get a top 5 with one and then every company in the business will have 10' rods. And the super expensive ones will be 9'10" or something to be fancy.
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#11851596 - 09/27/16 08:40 AM Re: Most Leverage [Re: RipX21]
Brad R Offline
Extreme Angler

Registered: 03/09/15
Posts: 1550
Loc: Texas
collincountytx is correct; Donald you and Skeet may need a refresher course in Physics.

Just grab a 6' and a 10' inflexible "test" pole and see which one can lift a 10 lbs. weight off the garage floor the easiest.

For offshore fishing, fishermen for this very reason use shorter rods with parabolic bends when they are fishing vertically to lift huge fish out of deep water; they use longer rods for fishing nearer the surface where they often need to "control" a fish that is running back and forth high up in the water column.

Another thing: a rod with more of a parabolic bend (the bend occurs nearer the hands) instead of a "fast" tip? When a rod bends farther up toward the hands (the fulcrum), it shortens the lifting point making the pulling leverage favor the fisherman over the fish.

There is no doubt that a fast tip sets the hook with more authority as the rod doesn't absorb as much bend as a moderate tip does. But, once the moderate tip bends a shorter rod making its lifting point much shorter, the leverage pulling a fish into the boat is heightened. The fight will be much easier.

Longer rods will, for the opposite reasons, increase throwing leverage and make for longer casts. No doubt about that. There are no 5'2" pitchers in baseball.

So, what is better for fishing heavier presentations punching through mats and heavy cover to yank big bass out? A 6' or 6'6" heavy or medium heavy rod with a moderate tip should actually perform better than a really long rod with a fast tip. Especially if the angler can perfect his hook set.

Brad

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#11851604 - 09/27/16 08:43 AM Re: Most Leverage [Re: RipX21]
Mike_Soriano™ Offline
TFF Celebrity

Registered: 06/08/08
Posts: 5434
Loc: FORK
I see these being more deep crankbait or swimbait lengths.
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#11851827 - 09/27/16 10:46 AM Re: Most Leverage [Re: RipX21]
Donald Harper Offline
TFF Guru

Registered: 01/25/08
Posts: 13887
Loc: Justin, TX.
Article mentions that the punching rod would have more leverage. The casting rods to me is a different story. Although there are many that like the shorter punching rods for close quarters.

http://www.bassfan.com/docktalk_article/16808/b-a-s-s-extends-rod-length-limit#.V-qTTdQrLMo
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#11851851 - 09/27/16 10:56 AM Re: Most Leverage [Re: Brad R]
HARD WORKN HAROLD Offline
Extreme Angler

Registered: 11/10/09
Posts: 1050
Loc: Williams Creek, Lake Fork
I was just about to say the same thing!
Originally Posted By: Brad R
collincountytx is correct; Donald you and Skeet may need a refresher course in Physics.

Just grab a 6' and a 10' inflexible "test" pole and see which one can lift a 10 lbs. weight off the garage floor the easiest.

For offshore fishing, fishermen for this very reason use shorter rods with parabolic bends when they are fishing vertically to lift huge fish out of deep water; they use longer rods for fishing nearer the surface where they often need to "control" a fish that is running back and forth high up in the water column.

Another thing: a rod with more of a parabolic bend (the bend occurs nearer the hands) instead of a "fast" tip? When a rod bends farther up toward the hands (the fulcrum), it shortens the lifting point making the pulling leverage favor the fisherman over the fish.

There is no doubt that a fast tip sets the hook with more authority as the rod doesn't absorb as much bend as a moderate tip does. But, once the moderate tip bends a shorter rod making its lifting point much shorter, the leverage pulling a fish into the boat is heightened. The fight will be much easier.

Longer rods will, for the opposite reasons, increase throwing leverage and make for longer casts. No doubt about that. There are no 5'2" pitchers in baseball.

So, what is better for fishing heavier presentations punching through mats and heavy cover to yank big bass out? A 6' or 6'6" heavy or medium heavy rod with a moderate tip should actually perform better than a really long rod with a fast tip. Especially if the angler can perfect his hook set.

Brad

bolt
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#11851912 - 09/27/16 11:30 AM Re: Most Leverage [Re: RipX21]
Donald Harper Offline
TFF Guru

Registered: 01/25/08
Posts: 13887
Loc: Justin, TX.
Yep. My bad on actually what leverage is and for lack of another word on gaining height/length to produce a better hook set from a sitting position. It is my thanking that a longer rod would help with that. Long rods are a trade off, your giving up leverage but gaining range of motion in things like casting, slack line pickup and hook setting speed, or moving bass longer distances with the same amount of rod angle manipulating.
_________________________
Each person you work with holds some promise to your future success.
www.eletewater.com - Staying Hydrated
www.lakeoviachic.com - Booking Mexico Trips
Shallow Water Mapping - Custom Spinner Baits - Jigs -Spooks
Pure Extracts - Minnow-Night Crawler-Crayfish-Craylic



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#11851957 - 09/27/16 11:57 AM Re: Most Leverage [Re: Mike_Soriano™]
JIM SR. Online   sick
TFF Celebrity

Registered: 09/25/06
Posts: 6933
Loc: NRH/Fork ! GET THE NET
Originally Posted By: Mike_Soriano™
Originally Posted By: JIM SR.
sounds like a marketing ploy,... loco


Someone will get a top 5 with one and then every company in the business will have 10' rods. And the super expensive ones will be 9'10" or something to be fancy.




Exactly, follow the money, manufactures can open up a whole new wonderful line of gotta have rods,.. noidea

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#11852063 - 09/27/16 01:07 PM Re: Most Leverage [Re: RipX21]
B.Hollingshead Online   content
Extreme Angler

Registered: 03/11/09
Posts: 1910
Loc: ft.worth
You can have a rod and push pole all in one combo. The 10ft will have more leverage.
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#11852106 - 09/27/16 01:28 PM Re: Most Leverage [Re: Mike_Soriano™]
Doug R. Offline
TFF Celebrity

Registered: 06/11/12
Posts: 8940
Loc: On the lam
Originally Posted By: Mike_Soriano™
Originally Posted By: JIM SR.
sounds like a marketing ploy,... loco


Someone will get a top 5 with one and then every company in the business will have 10' rods. And the super expensive ones will be 9'10" or something to be fancy.


9' 9" for marketing purposes lol
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#11852190 - 09/27/16 02:15 PM Re: Most Leverage [Re: Donald Harper]
Brad R Offline
Extreme Angler

Registered: 03/09/15
Posts: 1550
Loc: Texas
Originally Posted By: Donald Harper
Yep. My bad on actually what leverage is and for lack of another word on gaining height/length to produce a better hook set from a sitting position. It is my thanking that a longer rod would help with that. Long rods are a trade off, your giving up leverage but gaining range of motion in things like casting, slack line pickup and hook setting speed, or moving bass longer distances with the same amount of rod angle manipulating.


Donald, just a guess on my part that a 6'6" rod, heavy power rating, moderate action . . . would be the scientfic way to go for up close work, say, fishing out of a boat in gunk and mats and more. The 6'6" would provide the general leverage advantage over a longer rod, the heavy power would give it the big backbone to really over-power the fish and get them out fast, and the moderate action would further shorten the lever (the lifting point) to put the angler even more in command.

But, no, the trend is long.

I did find a good rod meeting these criteria: a St. Croix inshore rod.

If only a pro would give it a go.

If he'd match it with a spinning reel, a 4000 series, then he could flip out presentations that could penetrate with less weight, drop more vertically, likely pick up even more bass.

Set that drag tight!

Brad

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