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 led nav lights warning police lake austin
#10162791
07/25/14 01:47 AM
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Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 79
josez
OP
Outdoorsman
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OP
Outdoorsman
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 79 |
if you are fishing at night in lake Austin, be careful they are ticketing people for have nav lights. they say they must be coast guard approved navigation lights. you have been warned.
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Re: led nav lights warning police lake austin
[Re: josez]
#10163379
07/25/14 12:02 PM
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,957
Bob Landry
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,957 |
LED lighting is not illegal for Nav lights. All of the manufacturers of Nav lights sell them. I would guess that the tickets are being given for issues involving placement and visibility. Nav lights have to be visible for a specific distance and also for a designated degree of visibility from the front and sides. The regulations regarding brilliance and placement also vary according to the type and length of the boat. Anyone on the water at night would do well to read up on the regulations.
Also, if you are stationary , as in anchored or drift fishing, it is illegal to have the red/green lights on as this would indicate to another boater that you are under way and moving in a certain direction. Under those conditions, you would only use the 360 degree white light.
Last edited by Bob Landry; 07/25/14 12:14 PM.
2015 Seaark 1872 MV CC Etec-90
Two Helix 12 CHIRP SI's, , MinnKota Riptide ST80/i-pilot Link, Bob's Hydraulic
2020 Robalo R200 CC, Yamaha 150
Bitter Gun Owner
Bitter Clinger
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Re: led nav lights warning police lake austin
[Re: josez]
#10163731
07/25/14 02:19 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 16,550
forkduc
TFF Guru
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TFF Guru
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 16,550 |
You should move this to off topic.
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Re: led nav lights warning police lake austin
[Re: josez]
#10164839
07/25/14 08:22 PM
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,711
Lou r Pitcher
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,711 |
Why? Texas lake waters; General Equipment Item.
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Re: led nav lights warning police lake austin
[Re: josez]
#10167724
07/27/14 01:30 AM
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 4,584
lamoon78
TFF Team Angler
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TFF Team Angler
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 4,584 |
The rub rail style lights are not approved lighting these are the ones he is talking about. The issue is not being visible the issue is they are not visible at the right degrees as stated by law. I have been saying this for awhile now. They have to be seen at certain angles when approaching a vessel or they are not legal and rub rail lighting by no means meet these requirments.
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Re: led nav lights warning police lake austin
[Re: josez]
#10167776
07/27/14 01:49 AM
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,711
Lou r Pitcher
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,711 |
The certification/approval and testing process seems to be more involved than just 'seeing colored lights at the right angles...and is even more involved than meeting min. distance of visibility/luminosity, chromaticity/color space coefficients and spectral content criteria.
Rub rail area NAV lighting utilizing LEDs can get USCG approved laboratory certifications and is being manufactured into some boat designs, but it is per the boat builders, engineers and the marine lighting fixture manufacturers choosing to 1st go through the USCG mandated design and lab approval processes for both the fixture and the boat.
Thanks for posting link Joe.
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Re: led nav lights warning police lake austin
[Re: josez]
#10167913
07/27/14 03:03 AM
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 50,165
TreeBass
Lt. Dan
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Lt. Dan
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 50,165 |
Good read, thanks for posting
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Re: led nav lights warning police lake austin
[Re: josez]
#10168257
07/27/14 12:50 PM
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 4,584
lamoon78
TFF Team Angler
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TFF Team Angler
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 4,584 |
The lights you see on the new Rangers are a legal light. The rub rail light strips I dont see ever being a coast guard approved light.
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Re: led nav lights warning police lake austin
[Re: josez]
#10168544
07/27/14 04:01 PM
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,957
Bob Landry
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,957 |
There is no mandatory design parameters for navigation lights, other than they be able to produce a specific distance of visibility within a specified angle range. I think the major manufacturers of marine lighting have pretty much got that figured out. There are several different types and configurations that allow mounting in various locations and it is the responsibility of the boat builder to insure correct placement of the lights. Brightness is easily measured in lumens, and the law is very specific as to the degree of visibility required by looking at the boat from any angle. If you go to any boating store, West Marine, Cabelas, Bass Pro, or whatever and buy lights off the shelf and they are marked as navigation lights, they are going to be in compliance with Coast Guard regulations. The responsibility to make sure they are properly positioned lies with the boat owner or the person doing the installation.
I can understand why a string of LEDs on the rub rails do not qualify as navigation lights, nor should they qualify as such. The purpose of nav lights is not to make you look cool running down the lake at night. It is to let other boaters know if you are under way, stationary, which direction you are moving and who has the right of way.
2015 Seaark 1872 MV CC Etec-90
Two Helix 12 CHIRP SI's, , MinnKota Riptide ST80/i-pilot Link, Bob's Hydraulic
2020 Robalo R200 CC, Yamaha 150
Bitter Gun Owner
Bitter Clinger
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Re: led nav lights warning police lake austin
[Re: josez]
#10168619
07/27/14 05:03 PM
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 4,584
lamoon78
TFF Team Angler
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TFF Team Angler
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 4,584 |
Bob your right but the lights people dont understand why they are not approved is the string of rub rail lights these are the lights that IMHO will never be legal. Im up to par on regulations I am a captain on commercial vessels and carry a USCG master of towing vessels endorcement. For some reason these guys running these rub rail lights dont understand the problem with them its all about the degree at which approaching vessels can see them and these rub rail lights do not meet that requirement. All I can say is they better not be involved in a collision at dark with these or they will see what can happen by not running approved lights.
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Re: led nav lights warning police lake austin
[Re: josez]
#10169151
07/27/14 10:04 PM
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,957
Bob Landry
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,957 |
I'm wondering if they are removing the approved lights and running just the leds or using both. I would think those would be, or even should be illegal simply because of the confusion they create when combined with shore/dock lights on heavily populated lakes.
2015 Seaark 1872 MV CC Etec-90
Two Helix 12 CHIRP SI's, , MinnKota Riptide ST80/i-pilot Link, Bob's Hydraulic
2020 Robalo R200 CC, Yamaha 150
Bitter Gun Owner
Bitter Clinger
Armed Infidel
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Re: led nav lights warning police lake austin
[Re: josez]
#10169300
07/27/14 11:21 PM
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Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 6,713
44 Diesel
TFF Celebrity
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TFF Celebrity
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 6,713 |
I don't believe the issue is so much with red and green navigation lights if properly installed. I think the biggest problem is boats running big motor with the long strip of lights running down the side and stern of. Below is a link that a fellow tff member shared a email with the coast guard rep http://texasfishingforum.com/forums/ubbt...s_-_USCG#UNREAD
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Re: led nav lights warning police lake austin
[Re: Bob Landry]
#10169372
07/27/14 11:50 PM
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,711
Lou r Pitcher
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,711 |
There is no mandatory design parameters for navigation lights, other than they be able to produce a specific distance of visibility within a specified angle range. You don't seem to be familiar with specific USCG Navigational Lighting Design regs. There certainly are other requirments you may be unaware of for manufacturing and designing USCG Approved Navigational lighting that must be met by both the makers and the boat designers. For example: ------- Color specification of lights. (a) The chromaticity of all navigation lights shall conform to the following standards, which lie within the boundaries of the area of the diagram specified for each color by the International Commission on Illumination (CIE), in the Colors of Light Signals, which is incorporated by reference. It is Publication CIE No. 2.2. (TC-1.6), 1975, and is available from the Illumination Engineering Society, 345 East 47th Street, New York, NY 10017 and is available for inspection at the Coast Guard Headquarters. Contact Commandant (CG-43), Attn: Office of Civil Engineering, U.S. Coast Guard Stop 7714, 2703 Martin Luther King Jr. Avenue SE., Washington, DC 20593-7714. It is also available for inspection at the National Archives and Records Administration (NARA). For information on the availability of this material at NARA, call 202-741-6030, or go to: http://www.archives.gov/federal_register/code_of_federal_regulations/ibr_locations.html. This incorporation by reference was approved by the Director of the Federal Register. (b) The boundaries of the area for each color are given by indicating the corner co-ordinates, which are as follows: (1) White: x 0.525 0.525 0.452 0.310 0.310 0.443 y 0.382 0.440 0.440 0.348 0.283 0.382 (2) Green: x 0.028 0.009 0.300 0.203 y 0.385 0.723 0.511 0.356 (3) Red: x 0.680 0.660 0.735 0.721 y 0.320 0.320 0.265 0.259 Do it your-self home NAV Light Led installers seem to all want to discuss that their lights meet the min. distances and are easily visible at least covering a boats nav light sketche's angles. What they do not seem to have a clue about that is perhaps most dangerous about their installations is understanding the angles that their home installed lights must NOT BE VISABLE(so as to not confuse other vessels). They don't typically even have the regulations nor seem qualified to read/understand the cut-off specifications if they bothered to obtain them. And if they knew and somehow could understand the required light measurements, they do not have the equipment to measure their own installs to locate where they would need to be or not be mounted.
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Re: led nav lights warning police lake austin
[Re: Bob Landry]
#10169487
07/28/14 12:21 AM
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,711
Lou r Pitcher
Extreme Angler
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Extreme Angler
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,711 |
Brightness is easily measured in lumens Here is a small portion of the written requirements that most posters "think" they fully understand about their added lights with 2 mile visability... Intensity of lights.
(a) The minimum luminous intensity of lights will be calculated by using the formula:
I=3.43 10 6power T D 2power K -1Dpower
Where
I: Luminous intensity in candelas under service conditions,
T: Threshold factor 2 10 -7power lux,
D: Range of visibility (luminous range) of the light in nautical miles,
K: Atmospheric transmissivity. For prescribed lights the value of K will be 0.8, corresponding to a meteorological visibility of approximately 13 nautical miles.
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